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  1. #26

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    RE: First sheet winger.... PROJECT ACE-HEAVEN

    Hey,

    Where can I get some of that nitro/castor inscense?  I would sure be nice to get the smell without everything in sight being covered by a layer of slime.

  2. #27
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    RE: First sheet winger.... PROJECT ACE-HEAVEN

    HUH? Just think...WITH the slime you can take the scent with you!
    \"A guy told me the other day I must be very smart,......I told him \"No!, I\'\'m REALLY dumb, But learning from my mistakes!!\"\"

  3. #28

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    RE: First sheet winger.... PROJECT ACE-HEAVEN

    Great lookin plane Todd, but I think your field might be a little soggy for a while! You better send it my way and I can maiden it for you.


  4. #29
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    RE: First sheet winger.... PROJECT ACE-HEAVEN

    Ok, Well its "Done"....As always there was a rapid weight gain at the end and as we sit its 18.1 Oz. I could maybe drop a few grams here and there but not much probably. I does have a 400 mah nicad which surely isn' t the lightest battery option and Wing loading works out to just below 17Oz/SqFt. I ended up making the elevator bigger as it just didn't seem large enough. I need to find some tall grass for some glide tests. And burn a few bladders through the engine as I still havent lit it yet. Todd
    \"A guy told me the other day I must be very smart,......I told him \"No!, I\'\'m REALLY dumb, But learning from my mistakes!!\"\"

  5. #30
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    RE: First sheet winger.... PROJECT ACE-HEAVEN

    It looks super Todd, you done good. Those markings really bring it to life. ..[:-]

    Good luck with it.
    WHO GUNNA FEED MAW KEEEIDS..???

  6. #31
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    RE: First sheet winger.... PROJECT ACE-HEAVEN

    ..Hoping it will actually fly. I couldn't resist though and just went out to the garage and burned about 2 Oz of fuel with the Fora..Which seemed like about 2 minutes of runtime per Oz at most. It screamed...tached it at 30,500 rich on 9% nitro high castor with a 5x3ish combat prop. I think I need bigger bladder tubing as my bladder got long real quick with 1 Oz, and I think more pressure might make it atomize and needle sweeter. Seems to run a bit warm, but I think more nitro will cool it if its moving this much fuel anyway. I do think this thing has enough oomph to pull the plane as long as the airframe will fly. What size bladders are you guys running on these engines?,Nitro content?(George told me to break in on 10 or 15), And what kind of runtime per Oz. should I expect? Todd
    \"A guy told me the other day I must be very smart,......I told him \"No!, I\'\'m REALLY dumb, But learning from my mistakes!!\"\"

  7. #32
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    RE: First sheet winger.... PROJECT ACE-HEAVEN

    I've been using a thin wall tubing, about 3/16" in diameter. I want the lowest pressure and the least pressure drop from start to finish. This is why I think this size tubing is the most consistent with 1/2As. Never over-inflate, I usually go with 7/8 oz or so. Also, make sure the bladder is a loose fit in the fuel cell, so you don't get false high pressures when it is full.
    I've also used 1/8" tubing, but think it's not quite as good a choice.
    WHO GUNNA FEED MAW KEEEIDS..???

  8. #33
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    RE: First sheet winger.... PROJECT ACE-HEAVEN

    LEARNING CURVE!! So, I finally got a chance to try to fly this thing today. Its definitely not as easy as CP makes it look!

    I figured out my next plane needs to focus more around dealing with starting and running with a bladder, And being more functional overall even at the sacrifice of looks. Truth being told, I honestly think it was really close to taking off, But was a little short on thrust upon launch to make it happen. That combines with a bit too much elevator from me probably spelt its demise. A shorter nose would have likely been stronger as well.

    In retrospect I should have used a meatier prop for the maiden. Still, it was a blast. I just love running this engine! So I sit here with my "Missisippi Mud" contemplating my next airframe. Maybe fate is telling me to get the "Greased Pig" plans out...even though I fear my building might not do it justice. I put a Profi and the new 2011 Fora 1CC on my x-mas list so I need to get this stuff straight Special thanks to my pit crew and launcher Tim (Exocet-RCU). Hope fully the next one won't take me a year plus to try to fly!! Todd
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    \"A guy told me the other day I must be very smart,......I told him \"No!, I\'\'m REALLY dumb, But learning from my mistakes!!\"\"

  9. #34
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    RE: First sheet winger.... PROJECT ACE-HEAVEN

    Todd, my first attempt at this Corsair didn't fly either. There is just too much side area forward of the CG for it to know which end is the front.
    I would just cobble yours back together with the wing much further forward and at least prove it out and get some stick time. Just a down and dirty, solid repair, making sure that the engine and firewall and wing are locked together good as a unit.
    This advice assumes that the plane isn't already too heavy for an additional ounce worth of repair material.
    If the CG and control throws are set right and your engine is ready to be flown, it IS as easy as I make it look.
    Make sure that the engine will burn through a full 3/4 oz worth of fuel [on the ground] with no signs of going too lean. If you have to periodically reach in to richen it as the tank runs out, then the engine isn't ready to fly yet.
    Anything around 32,000 should be a good launch rpm with a 4.2x4 prop.

    In the photo: the trailing edge of the wing used to be well under the dorsal fin and you can see the wing got moved forward by a couple of inches at least to where it is now.

    For a "Cyclon / Fora trainer", I recommend a 28 inch span delta with 1/8" kite tube spars. It's kind of big sized for a .049 but very easy to fly and it is a great way to get a plane together in a hurry that will give you stick time with your engine and will be plenty of fun to fly.
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    WHO GUNNA FEED MAW KEEEIDS..???

  10. #35
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    RE: First sheet winger.... PROJECT ACE-HEAVEN

    Thanks for the advice CP! I think as far as the pieces I have left I am gonna save and repair the wing and scrap the fuse. Just too many issues (vert stab too small, fuse too long, already broken from test glide plus broke in half, funny shaped elevators, poorly engineered in the first place, yadda yadda. As well as it being beyond your 1 OZ repair weight I fear(it was 18.5OZdry before)

    I feel like I need something that is less cowled in so I can deal with the engine and fuel lines easier as well. I kept having to shut down to adjust mixture without nipping fingers with the current needle position. It would have been hard to run it today without a buddy. From my peek inside after cleaning out the mud, it looks as if the engine is broken in and feels good. Once it was set it seemed like it would burn through 1OZ cleanly...using the large black bladder tubing from TT, I think I prefer it over the small latex tube. I will save the wing to possibly use on a later project. I have been thinking of a delta like you suggest, a box plane like the dominator 200 (like a mini viper) Or just building a shorter fuselage for my current wing..which is what I'm leaning towards at this point. What do you think of something with a sheet wing that resembles the shape of a Shrike? , or basically a shrike shaped fuse setup for my current wing? I'm sure there will be plenty of chances to make something look like a real plane once I get the hang of this.

    I almost wish there were kits for something that would fit the bill as I really "Want to go fast"..But I don't think it will be that much work to get back on track. I forgot my earplugs today and that sure gave me some ear ringing...even though I have poor hearing already. That will surely be on my car loading "short list" from now on. Again, thanks for the help...my "motivational hormones" are kicking now after a year of too much house restoration and getting the trans parts repair business going, so hopefully I can get back on schedule for a sucessful flight before the negative temps hit, or at least learn to fly without needing to feel my fingers![8D] Todd
    \"A guy told me the other day I must be very smart,......I told him \"No!, I\'\'m REALLY dumb, But learning from my mistakes!!\"\"

  11. #36
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    RE: First sheet winger.... PROJECT ACE-HEAVEN

    Yep, it looks like the wing is reusable...maybe the tail group too..?
    That plane was too heavy.
    My first Corsair attempt was too heavy with the camo paint over fiberglass. I stripped it off when I moved the wing forward...then used monokote
    These planes need to weigh no more than 14-15 ozs with 150 sq inch wings...period.
    You can go lighter, but for pure level speed after a dive, this "formula" works A-OK.
    Fancy planes are hard to build light. A simple box fuselage with 1/8" medium balsa sides, 1/64" ply doublers up front, 1/4" balsa sub-firewall and 5/32" or 3/16" plywood firewall is what has become my "standard" recipe. Make sure the 1/64" ply is carefully sanded on both sides..that stuff repels being glued.

    The delta is pretty easy to throw together, just base the framework on 2 parallel tubular spars that rest on spacer [jig] blocks as you slide the ribs onto the spars. You can basically dry assemble much of the frame before any gluing. The center ribs become your fuselage and anchor the firewall. It's fun to draw up a sideview to suit your equipment needs. I think having the elevon servos mounted out in the wing panels is the way to go and it frees up space in your fuselage to slide the battery for your final CG.
    So, you need two 1/8" thick center ribs, a pair of 1/4" thick midspan ribs and the wing tips are just flat stock to tie the rear spar together with the balsa trailing edge. The leading edges should be hard balsa sticks [3/8x3/8] or 3/16" poplar dowels or 1/8"kite tubing I make corner joiners out of 1/8" plywood and carpet thread to lash the kite tubes to the plywood plates for extra bracing. They don't need to be bigger than postage stamps.
    Old Diamond Dust and Screamin Demon buuild threads should show the basics.
    Always make the fuel cell a loose fit for the bladder..it can't be allowed to be squeezed by the compartment or your needle setting will go too lean after the plane is flying. I generally never try for more than 3/4 of an oz in the bladders I use or they develope weak spots that cause lean runs. Lean runs cost money, using 25% oil is cheap insurance...but gooey.
    WHO GUNNA FEED MAW KEEEIDS..???

  12. #37

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    RE: First sheet winger.... PROJECT ACE-HEAVEN

    Max Power, sorry she didn't fly so well. Was a real fine looker. Don't be so critical of your building skills. I usually choose simpler, boxier designs due to my limited patience and attention deficit when it comes to carving and molding. You showed lots of creativity with this one.
    Tee Bee

  13. #38
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    RE: First sheet winger.... PROJECT ACE-HEAVEN

    ..... How time flies looking back at when this started. Funny, I decided the other day to grab the wing out of above a ceiling tile and get back to work and build another fuselage and found the start of a fuse taped to it when I pulled it down![ I must've had a few beers that night and let it slip through the memory banks...Where am I again? lol]

    I'm back on it re-using the old wing and probably tail. I'm trying to decide whether I need more v-stab? I'm doing a low-wing design this time that is a fair amount shorter and with a lot less nose sticking out the front so I'm thinking that will be a lot more reasonable. I'm kinda just planning a plain balsa top and blunt nose instead of the fiberglass to speed progress as I'm anxious to get it done and go fly.

    I also learned last time to make the bladder easier to deal with as the last model was pretty cowled in. I've got plenty of wing balsa in the box to do more scalish looking planes later. The wing is permanently affixed as I just didn't feel like it needed to come off as long as everything is accessable? I snapped this pic and decided that I'd better put the bags of lead shot back on and let the glue cure a bit more overnight while I ponder some decisions. Todd
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    \"A guy told me the other day I must be very smart,......I told him \"No!, I\'\'m REALLY dumb, But learning from my mistakes!!\"\"

  14. #39
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    RE: First sheet winger.... PROJECT ACE-HEAVEN

    That looks like a winner and better yet it looks almost done! It'll be plenty fast.
    The fuselage looks roomy enough to get all your gear loaded to acheive your CG.
    Make sure to use the tallest nylon control horn for the elevator and limit the travel by using either the inner hole on the servo arm or the next one out on the arm.
    A 2-56 push rod that has 1 or 2 guides made from balsa scrap will give you peace of mind for outside and inside loops.
    Judging from looks, I think you got the wing placed just right on this one.
    Low wingers with a high thrust line aren't as easy to hand launch though. You would have made it easier with a high wing.

    [edit to add]...with the engine mounted right side up, you have the prop shaft pretty close to the wing already. It's the inverted install with the prop mounted way above the wing that is a real bear to hand launch.
    Mount your motor as low as you can to get the thrust line close to the wing
    The low wing is ackward to grip for overhand launches and the high thrust line makes the model want to dip [dive] for the ground until it builds some speed after launch. I've tried tossing the plane upward..but had that idea backfire. I guess the best thing is to make sure that you are ready with a quick shot of back stick if the model lunges for the dirt after a level launch. If the model makes a gentle swoop to the ground, then it'll start flying once it gets 20 feet out with as much power as you've got there. Something like 24 ozs of thrust IIRC.
    Can't wait to see this one flying and giving you a smile that you won't be able to wipe off your face all summer.
    WHO GUNNA FEED MAW KEEEIDS..???

  15. #40
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    RE: First sheet winger.... PROJECT ACE-HEAVEN

    Thanks CP! So would I be better off mounting the engine sideways with the crankshaft more vertically centered on the nose or even below center?? I haven't mounted it yet and I was thinking about mounting sideways with a notch for the exhaust like I have seen on some or your SWR's. Any input on whether the vert fin is adequate? Where do you guys hold your hands when you launch....I'm right handed but if hand launching usually let my Tx hang on the strap with my left hand reaching over the top to the right stick and swap to right hand as soon as the plane is stable. Is this the common practice?, Or is there a better way? Todd
    \"A guy told me the other day I must be very smart,......I told him \"No!, I\'\'m REALLY dumb, But learning from my mistakes!!\"\"

  16. #41
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    RE: First sheet winger.... PROJECT ACE-HEAVEN

    I'd mount the engine vertical and get the thrust line as centered on the airfoil as you can get it.. I usually cut out a circle of plywood just a wee bit larger than the backplate and use #2 sockethead sheetmetal screws at a slight angle to pin the engine to the plywood pad.
    I hold low wingers at the fuselage just behind the wing and just give them a level push. I launch left handed and keep my right thumb on the joy stick.
    The fin looks about right. If it isn't big enough the model will tend to flat spin at launch.
    WHO GUNNA FEED MAW KEEEIDS..???

  17. #42
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    RE: First sheet winger.... PROJECT ACE-HEAVEN

    Ok, theres been a few cut periods of indesicion and start over since the last post, But I'm filling cracks and getting ready to make the glass top. I took down the height of the fuse a fair amount and got the engine mounted a lot lower a suggested.(I'll pull the tape off next pic)I gave it a bit more fin as well. I'm trying to decide whether the top will come off as one piece or if the front partition will be seperately removeable. feels pretty good in my hands and I'm expecting this one to come out at around 16.5-17 oz hopefully? I've placed around weight inside and the grip for launch feels doable. Hopefully the excess thrust will help out![8D] Any suggestions? Todd
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    \"A guy told me the other day I must be very smart,......I told him \"No!, I\'\'m REALLY dumb, But learning from my mistakes!!\"\"

  18. #43

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    RE: First sheet winger.... PROJECT ACE-HEAVEN

    Only one suggestion, Todd - Wait until I get home to maiden it. I gotta see that one go.

    Tim

  19. #44
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    RE: First sheet winger.... PROJECT ACE-HEAVEN

    Thanks Tim. Well, I had a little "Meltdown" finishing this plane....Literally I forgot that last time I did a fuselage top like this I painted it with elmers wood glue before I layed on polyester resin. Forgetting to do that this time I had to watch the fuse plug turn to pink bubbles before my eyes[&o] BUT in standing with my "design on the fly" techniques" I pressed on! I'm finishing up details and am excited to try it. I was gonna steal the canopy from my skydrill kit, but I think I'll hit hub hobby and get the 6" SIG as I think the 5" looks a bit small. I need to line/smooth the bladder compartment also as it kind of got forgotten lol. I'm also deciding on whether to just deflect the exhaust or make a mini-pipe? I'm trying a new spray clear laquer that has tested well so far with raw fuel, but I'm gonna give the plane a week or so to harden well and maybe wax it or something before I soak it with fuel...But I like using this acrylic art paint...it actually sands great and there is a ton of nice colors for .69cents a bottle that spray through the airbrush and clean up easy. I used this paint/clear combo on a lot of glow helis but they have a lot less fuel exposure than 1/2a

    I'm anxious to break out a KIT and build something when this is done. I really haven't "matured" as a scratch builder yet. I need to develop the draw it out and cut out parts dicipline , and even write out the steps I should follow. I try too much to just "Go for it!" I IS fun though! I'm feeling like this guy should fly pretty well. My next thought I keep having is how the skydrill will deal with my other Fora 1CC Seems doable to me? maybe on a 5.7x3? There is only one man around here who would know and I have a feeling he'd tell me to get off my butt and build it!! Todd
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    \"A guy told me the other day I must be very smart,......I told him \"No!, I\'\'m REALLY dumb, But learning from my mistakes!!\"\"


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