D Bronk

I`ve got an 0.061" BIG MIG here NIB also . I`ll check that one over, as well..If nothing else, the effort is worth the PEACE of MIND.With the amount of crud that I found in the 0.074".TAKING that crap out ,HAD to add ,to the engines, life expectancy..I bet it would have ran,Ok like that ,and eventually blown the junk out;but at the cost ,of how much unnessecary WEAR and TEAR?, probably scratching off the coatings on the way out too.If I hadn`t taken the back plate off, I wouldn`t have known, and would have just started it.I would have never known.

combatpigg

My Feedback: (3)

If you look at the finished and unfinished surfaces through magnification, it's no wonder how junk can cling to all the nooks and crannys. I wonder if companies like NELSON, JETT, CYCLON, YS, etc. take this extra step before final assembly? From past experience I can emphatically say that COX never did! You could almost build an .010 from the junk found in an .049 .

D Bronk

LOL that`s funny C.P. I`ve been messing with this engine for a couple hours this morn and I can`t even get a pop out of her.Got to go for another stroll, to the neighbours,my Reversible drill is there.[:@].I`m suspecting it`s flooded ..I`ll pull the head put my thumb on top of the cylinder with the fuel line disconected and .I`ll get it to, pump it`s self out. [>:]At this rate ,I won`t be taxiing anything..Thanks for the suggestion yesterday C.P.

combatpigg

My Feedback: (3)

Dave, normally you should only have to make sure that the glow plug is getting heated up to a bright orange, and watch fuel get pulled through the clear plastic line as you electric start it. A quick finger over the exhaust outlet while pumping will force fuel through the line up to the carb. Otherwise either the needle isn't opened far enough or there is a problem in the tank. Make sure the back plate is tightened too. One more thing, tie the throttle open, it is with the arm held to the rear.

build light

And too with all that junk you had, make sure the spraybar is clear and not clogged.
Actually I don't think it is your problem as you made no mention of no fuel going thru the line.
Still...

D Bronk

Well Good news, Bad news,Good NEWS,and more, Good News..

..GOOD News first.. I got her going.I know where I went wrong, I should have used a bit less Castor when assembling the engine.I really lubed it up ,and actually poured some oil ,into the crankcase, before putting the Backplate on.The engine, was just not willing, to fire with that much oil in it.I ended up pulling the head, and basically, filling the engine with alcohol, flushing, and pumping it out ,by spinning the engine with the reversible drill.Once I felt that the oil was getting close to being cleared out(there was still oil in the crankcase, it was never turned without lube)I then switched to flushing with fuel..I left the head off, this whole time ,and just corked the cylinder with my thumb,for a bit of compression.MY glow driver died on me,again, and I ended up having to make ,a power source, to drive the glow plug..IT was a very crude setup, but it was all that I had, to get this engine to run today.The main thing was, the setup Worked..

BAD NEWS[&o]It`s starting to get dark here and realistically I won`t have enough daylight to mess around with this outside today

Good News, tomorow, looks like I`ll have the engine mounted in the fuse and ?????

MORE Good NEWS This engine sounds like, it will be a very strong power plant.I`ll make a short video later..DAVE B.

D Bronk

Movie starting at the point of, 6 oz. fuel ran through.and in the end checking out the throttle



http://media.putfile.com/the-norvel-runs

Bipe Flyer

Sounds good. You're pretty brave using that starter.

D Bronk

pleas read the screen shot below , my computer froze as I was trying to post.THEN add this to it:





.The piston , was midpoint TDC stroke when you hear it Squeek.I then had to tap the prop ,to knock it back through the cycle.

Bipe Flyer

I think I know what your next project will be. A 1/2A starter!

D Bronk

A couple pics: 1`st one is my Bannister mounted test stand,with built on ,power supply, and ,fuel cell..2nd+3rd pics my 1/2A starters1 is Ac powered the other is DC powered.What`s a matter with these?? NO Good???

Bipe Flyer

The only real problem is that a standard starter will snap the conrod if there is a hydraulic lock. 1/2A starters are much faster and have less torque than a standard starter. Here are pictures of 3 different brands. A Miller, a Sullivan Hornet and a Norvel. I like the Miller the best. These starters use a direct drive Mabuchi 540 motor, so a lot of people make their own.

I've also attached a picture of a little .010/.020 starter I made that is housed in a Fuji film canister. BTW, Fuji film canister is a layman's term for 1oz fuel tank.

ptulmer

My Feedback: (5)

Bipe, you're not one of those "machinist" fellers are you? How 'bout some detail on the homebrew starter's cone?

D Bronk

I think I have some, Hot Rod MABUCHI 540 motors..I`ll have to get some more info ,about the building of these little starters.That might Make a good thread Andrew..I was kidding ,about those starters I posted .I knew there`s a Big chance, of twisting ,and breaking ,the internals of these engines .I was very carefull to avoid the possibility of damage,when useing the drill.I`m going to take the fuse and engine and run some more fuel through the engine, by taxiing around a bit .I`ve got a few things, that has to be done ,first though..

Bipe Flyer

I have a small hobby lathe. I made an aluminum cup that holds a piece of silicone exhaust tubing that Norvel used to sell. The tubing is held in with a dab of silicone and it is attached to an electric prop adapter. I could have made it so that it attached directly to the motor shaft with set screws, but I already had the prop adapter, so I used it.

Bipe Flyer

Dave, you'll want a motor that runs on 12V if you intend to use your field box battery. Most rc car motors run on 7.2V to 8.4V, so you could go cordless with a car battery pack. Some guys have salvaged the motors from old dustbusters.

The motor I used for my little starter is no longer available on the US Radio Shack website but, strangely enough, it is still available in Canada even though Radio Shack became "The Source" here. http://www.thesourcecc.com/estore/Pr...roduct=2730255

Check out these threads for home made starters.
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=2011857
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=2683915

D Bronk

WELL ,do these engines need to be cleaned ,of varnish like the COX engines.The Crown on this piston, is becoming Quite Brown, with varnish.I would say, because of break in, and, running a bit, FAT on the needle.

combatpigg

My Feedback: (3)

Dave, as cold as it gets where you live, I figured you would be telling US how to treat the engines. I don't do anything to them, just make sure they are wet before fire up. I think the fuel should be run out of them at the end of the day. I've never seen a big build up of rust or varnish in any NORVELS

D Bronk

Here`s a couple shots, of the 0.074" ,piston Crown. This is what it looks like, at about, 7 oz. of fuel since, Brand new.If your engines are sparkling clean ,I`ll tear this one down, again ,and Tidy it up.I won`t have to run this engine, between peaked out ,and ,blurbeling Rich ,running anymore..

1 thing about this cold weather starting, is ,that the heat gun needs to be handy ,to warm up the cylinder ,or it won`t ,flip over easily.

combatpigg

My Feedback: (3)

Outside of COX engines, with the spinning piston, I don't think it is a good idea to tear down engines unless it is for repair work, or initial cleaning of a new engine, or maybe some hot rod work. There are microscopic wear patterns between the piston and liner that get disrupted. It is normal for the top of the piston to get blackened, and there isn't anything to be gained by cleaning it.

D Bronk

Ok CP ,I`ll leave it alone.I want to put it in the air...

burtcs

D bronk: I've been following this thread with some interest. It was like dejavu all over again when I re-read it. I feel your pain. The top of my piston is black too. I got some posts over on the Norvel Engine FAQ. Good luck...

Regards - Steve B.

Bipe Flyer

What fuel are you using, Dave? It looks darker than mine, which have a lot more time on them, but if you're using synthetic oil it may be burning. If it runs fine though, I wouldn't do anything to it.

D Bronk

BIPER, it`s more like ,what fuel ,Haven`t I used. I`ve used :SIG 25%,SIG 35% ,The oil ratio is 20%@ 50%SYN.and, 50% CASTOR ,for that brand.And ,also have been Useing MORGANs`OMEGA 15% nitro ,with ,17% oil @30%castor,70% synthetic...And I have been blending them as well..The Higest rpms seem to be from, straight Omega,I`m thinking because less castor=less viscosity/resistance(I only ran, a Few C.Cs` through).THE Omega fuel ,was the lowest oil content used..When I did the original break in ,after the tear down and clean up,I lubed everything up with straight Castor oil.It was excessive.It was really, pukeing out ,the oil at first .The last time I ran the engine it had cleaned up(exhaust oil) pretty well..I`ve been watching the the piston Crown since the First run ,and the crown has gradually darkened, to the point, it is at now.THat`s why, I thought the CYL.+ piston would need, periodical Cleaning, like, the Cox engines..

qoute from C.P. " Outside of COX engines, with the spinning piston, I don't think it is a good idea to tear down engines unless it is for repair work, or initial cleaning of a new engine, or maybe some hot rod work. There are microscopic wear patterns between the piston and liner that get disrupted. It is normal for the top of the piston to get blackened, and there isn't anything to be gained by cleaning it. "

Not to cause argument.I was just,thinking this over ,last night.If the Cylinder/sleeve,is R/R`d,and, is reinstalled,in the same position, that the engine was, originally "BROKE IN",at,,,And, the same thing, with the Piston,and Rod being ,R/R`d ,off/on, the Crank pin.Don`t you think,that, the microscopic wear patterns,would remain Undisturbed.I suppose there`s room, for a few thousandths`of an inch, Error,between the Crankcase, the Cylinder ,and the cylinder screws,but not really, with the Con.rod ,to the Crank pin .I`m thinking, if the BLOCK, and Cylinder, are Marked/scratched, to ensure, correct alignment,you could keep parts ,running, in their ,original "GROOVES".I am aware that engines, do, take a "set",once broken in.

My main concern is, that, "Down the Road ",The Carbon on the Piston Crown ,will accumulate,and,only get worse ,eventually leading up to "HOT SPOTS",causeing pre-ignition.I guess the good thing, about the Carbon ,would be,that,I wouldn`t need to buy, Glow Plugs, anymore ...SO,,, with my thoughts, on the Table, what`s everyone elses` thoughts` on the subject.What`s worse? Cleaning the engine now,or,Doing nothing now,and hoping for the best..I know that these engines ,are to be run, slightly, on the "Rich" side,so,I can`t see the piston Crown improving..

I`m not writing , so that ,I get the response, that I ,"WANT" to Hear .Just want, everybody elses, opinions is all..And C.P.s` too .

Bipe Flyer

Glow engines don't run as hot as gasoline. I'm pretty sure that they don't get hot enough to make carbon glow.