vasek

My Feedback: (4)

hi all,

i "stumbled" on this forum by accident, but i found these... well... "size challenged" (dont want to offend anyone by using the word "small") very VERY cute

is there a MINI-CAOS plan? i would love to build one


Vasek

ProBroJoe

Vasek, welcome to the forum.

The closet to a Kaos that I've seen around here is ptulmer's Kao-Tic. I don't know if he's planning on releasing a full set of plans, but there's a thread about it here: http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_3977508/tm.htm

You could always take pt's DNU! plans, turn the fuselage over, change the tail surfaces to the Kaos design, and add an Ace tapered foam wing (or pt's built-up version) - Viola! - a Kaos.

Hope this helps,
-Joe

ptulmer

My Feedback: (5)

Vasek, the plans are mostly complete and based loosely on the DNU, which is a proven flier. PM me your email address and I can send you a picture of the plans so far. If you can work from it, I can send you a PDF of the plans. I'll finishing detailing the plan in a couple of weeks or so.

ps, I left my memory stick at home, so it would be later this afternoon.

Andrew

[link=http://www.rcmmagazine.com]RCM Magazine[/link] has a mini-Chaos plan set: Plan #607A for $7.00 USD . Although the magazine is no longer being published, the plans service is still operational.

vasek

My Feedback: (4)

thanks to all 4 a warm welcome!

PT sent you PM.

i'll keep an eye on those cute "little buggers"... now i know why i kept all those little balsa scraps!!!!![sm=lol.gif] i guess i'll get busy...



V.

KidEpoxy

Wait til you see how these lil guys just sip the fuel
terrific Fly/$ numbers for build & sticktime, not so much with the radio equip, but not too bad

what we need is 1/2A with $9 servos

vasek

My Feedback: (4)

Amen to that!

speaking of servos, how many functions are "standard" for these "migets"[X(]

one would assume weight is a BIG factor in this decision...

1) elevator is mandatory, right? dah... (just answerd myself)

2) ailerons are a must, i guess

3) throttle management would be nice (?)

4) rudder would be pushing it (?) [X(]

5) i assume mini retracts are out of the question... [:@]


so what it's gona be in my KidKaos? [sm=lol.gif] i need help with that [8D]

BMatthews

Welcome to our world Vasek.

Forget the landing gear unless you don't mind haveing HUGE wheels by comparison or fly off pavement. It's just as easy to handlaunch these little ones and belly land.

By far the hot setup to try this out is a DNU built as a shoulder wing. That allows easy gripping for launching. Concentrate on keeping it super light. When you've flown a super light and responsive small model you'll know what true hapiness really is. They turn on a dime and loose very little speed and it's fun to try and thermal with them after the engine cuts out.

ptulmer

My Feedback: (5)

Vasek, unlike the one pictured above, mine is small. (a minimalist version) Full 4-channel operation is possible, but I'm sticking to aileron/elevator. Throttle management is strictly optional! If you are a good builder and can make it fly straight, 2-channel is the way to go. The increase in performance is well worth the loss of throttle and rudder. Two things I rarely use when I do have them!
That said, if you want full-house operation with gear, the RCM version with something along the lines of a Norvel .074 would be the superior aircraft.
I got your PM and will email you the pdf this afternoon.

Andrew

Vasek --

Build Patrick's DNU first and get your feet wet with 1/2A -- it builds fast and is inexpensive. If you want a low wing, I took PT's plan layout, flipped the fuselage over and changed the rudder/stab shape, but it retained the DNU wing. The start of the build thread is [link=http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_3984491/anchors_3989477/mpage_1/key_/anchor/tm.htm#3989477]here[/link]. Due to some family problems, I've just now gotten back to work on it.

vasek

My Feedback: (4)

thanks again 4 all replies[sm=thumbup.gif]

after reading the posts, here is my strategy:

1- build & fly the DNU first (don't know what it is yet, will do a search ) (if someone can post a link to a "plan file" of it> pls)

2- build /fly the DasNotUgly (stick) (looks very cool!!!) (got the PDF file)

3- build / fly the mini-Caos (will get plan file from PT)

My strategy is crystal clear, the engine choice for each plane is still a mystery to me[sm=spinnyeyes.gif]

up untill today my engine choices were based on .45, .60, .90, .1.20..... so can someone explain the mini sizes & their usage?

& the tank is integrated in the engine mount? (guessing)>>> so do i use same size/ type engine for all 3 planes?

vasek

My Feedback: (4)

oh, one more question:

where do one gets the small horns & push rods?

Tim Wiltse-RCU

vasek,

Welcome to the group!!! DNU=DasNotUgly!!!! Another super great little plane that again is cheap, fast to build and really fun is the LS150. I think there was about a dozen of them built a couple of years ago by guys here myself included. It is an ACE Little Stick blown up 150% with a couple little changes. It would be killer with 4 channels and a Norvel .049/.061.
As for engines there is many choices. Cox is selling their .049 Sure Start engine for $7.00 ..that's not a mistake..that's $7.00. Really a fine little engine and you can't beat the price with a stick. it will turn a 6x3 around 15,000rpm. Norvel has a couple .049's and .061 sized engines. Both with or without throttles. The .049 line was dropped last year or so but you can still find them around a Hobby Shops. Like anything else how deep are your pockets? There is the Cyclon 1/2a engine that will run up around 40,000rpm for $190.00US or the G&Z from Bill Huges that will run in the mid 30,000rpm range for around $90.00US. If you want to go alittle bigger the Norvel .074 is a strong little engine real light with the power of a .10 sized engine. There is a couple other makers out there AP is another.
For small control horns and such look around the shop as most will have a package of Goldberg 1/2a horns. For control rods mostly I use a piece of small music wire. Carbon rod would also work well.

LAter,
Tim

combatpigg

My Feedback: (3)

As usual, the easy way to go is not the best way to go when it comes to 1/2A sized control linkage. The Sullivan NYRODS for 2-56 threaded hardware works, but clumsy to work with and temperature extremes will make the plastic expand and contract, which throws off fine trim adjustments. I used this stuff for years, and it worked OK. 2-56 control rods available through Tower Hobbies are definately strong enough to do any 1/2A job, but they need to be supported every 8 inches or so to prevent buckling. They are pretty heavy, too.......especially if used for a long run, like back to the elevator or rudder. For those connections, I like to use .055" music wire and 1/16" ply control horns that are home made. To install a ply control horn, just cut a slit in the control surface flap, and insert the ply full depth with a little glue on it. I have never had one of these fail, and they sure look cleaner than those nylon clamp on control horns do. You need a numbered drill index [available through Harbor Freight] and it doesn't hurt to have calipers to measure small things with, these tools go hand in hand. Now you can make your own precision linkages that are light weight and slop free. The .055" wire looks very neat in the final installation, because all you need to do to exit the fuselage is poke a same size hole as the wire and it turns out looking very clean. To make adjustments in the control wire length, have a "V" bent into the wire some place where you can get to it after the plane is built, and use pliers to make adjustments.

Tim Wiltse-RCU

vasek,

Here are a couple of pictures of a LS150....the one in bare bones is Jboy's he took alittle off the bottom and sides of the fuse and it looks better than mine. Again after you get the parts cut out it would take you all of 2 nights to get it together.

Later,
Tim

P.S. The LS in LS150 stands for Lynn S. He was a member of this forum and he came up with the idea for the plane. He passed of a heart attack a couple of years ago so rest assured he will be the wind beneathe your wings if you built one(not to sound corny or anything).

vasek

My Feedback: (4)

few more questions guys,

i get it now with the DNU thing, i have the plans for the DNU converted to low wing... i think i should build first the shoulder-wing DNU
where can i get a plan file?

secondo, i looked in the LHS for engines they have:

1- Pee Wee 0.33 cm3

2- Babe Bee 0.8 cm3

3- Black Widow 0.8 cm3

sorry about the metric thing, i am in Europe for a bit & i don't know the US equivalent but i am sure you guys will know the sizes by the names, right?

they are also bit more expensive here & i would have to order one

so which one should i order?

thanks for helping,
Vasek

ptulmer

My Feedback: (5)

Blackwidow, or if you can order from Cox, use a Surestart with external tank.

My site is www.ulmer-rc.com

Sneasle

yup, either the black widow or surestart woudl be your best bet. sure starts are cheap, might as well get a few at the same time.

ptulmer's website has the high wing DNU plans. if you should have any questions, check my HOB p-51 and DNU build threads and you should find all the answers there.

Tim Wiltse-RCU

vasek,

Order a few Cox Sure Start .049's (.8cm).They are the same as the Babe Bee and Black widow just without tanks attached to them. Use a seperate tank anyways as the stock BB/BW tanks are only good fora couple minutes of run time. Again the Cox "Sure Start" engines are only $7.00 from www.coxmodels.com

LAter,
Tim

Remby

My Feedback: (3)

Hello there..

Whatever 1/2a engine you try, make sure to bench run it to get used to how it goes. Sometimes tricky to get used to, a little time on setting the needle on the bench will help a lot later.

The bay is also good for engine needs.

Pictures of what you are doing is a must!

BMatthews

The Sure Start with no tank also will have the advantage of being able to fly inverted for extended times. The Baby Bee or Black Widow with the tanks included will cut out if the model goes inverted for more than a couple of seconds.

Other options are the Norvel 0.8cc and 1cc. If you're in Europe and don't mind using diesel fuel there or when you return to Quebec then there's also the PAW 1cc diesel.

Of all of these so far the Norvel is the only one with the option of an RC carb for throttle control.

Oh, almost forgot the thread running right now that is advising that small CS brand engines are now available.

There may be some other options in Europe. What country are you in?

Bipe Flyer

Personally, I like a Norvel .061 (1cc) or .074 (1.2cc) in a 4 channel (rudder/elevator/aileron/throttle) plane with wheels. I fly off of grass with 1.25" to 1.5" wheels. The small planes tend to ride on top of the grass, rather than pressing right down to the ground beneath.

PAW makes throttled versions of their .55cc and 1cc engines. There's also AP and Thunder Tiger - neither of which are real powerhouses, but they aren't very expensive and are throttled.

vasek

My Feedback: (4)

thanks again for everyone helping me out... this forum is really a friendly place >>> goes to show SIZE doesn't matter [sm=lol.gif]

Bruce,
i am in the Czech Republic (Prag) & it seems small glow engines are not so popular here.... even big gas engines made here like the ZDZ can be bought cheaper in the US than right here where they make them! [:@] go figure! but hey, it beats the old communist regime by a mile... or two... there's still a little bit of road left ahead that's all

So i just might order some engines & parts in the US and ship it here (if they're willing) because i won't be going back to Canada for a while

Tim posted a link to http://www.coxmodels.com/ & i saw some stuff i like.

i still need advice on the servo size, tank size & battery

on the COX site they have the Sure Start $7, COX miniservo $12 , 6 cell 220 mAh $7 (would all this stuff be a wise choise? anything else i should order there?) i could get one Tee Dee .9 just to check it out

oh oH, one more question: is regular iron-on covering OK or do i have to find something lighter(?)

cheers,
Vasek

BMatthews

If you have trouble getting them I'm sure one of the "locals" here would be willing to accept a shipment and then post it over to you. I would but then the engines would have to cross an extra border along with the trouble that causes.

The regular iron on is OK and I've used my share of it over the years even on the small stuff but it IS heavy by comparison to the lighter parkflyer options avaialbe these days. Now if you can get the old style Solarfilm where you are now that's a different matter. It's soft as sandwich wrap but it is lighter than Monokote or similar coverings.

Bipe Flyer

Hmmm... aren't the Cyclon/Fora engines made in the Czech Republic?