dbacque

My Feedback: (3)

Mark,

I still think you should contact them about the use of your plans. We all appreciate your work and want to keep it coming. Heck, I'm close to writing them myself!

You can bet there'll be pictures here when I get to build it. There are a couple of large projects ahead of it so it'll be a while.

Dave

combatpigg

My Feedback: (3)

I think these SCABS are taking quite a gamble that no one is ever gonna take action against them. They must also have pretty good fire insurance.

Tim Wiltse-RCU

I had emailed Lazer Jerks the first day this thread started. Just this morning I got a reply.....

Yes, we are aware of the discussion on the chat
forums. The major part of the discussion is the fact
the designers feel like we don’t have permission. And
permission wasn’t something we thought we needed
whenever a customer who already had a set of plans
approached us and all he wanted was for us to produce
the parts on the plans. Which is fine. And to save him
the purchase price of the cut file, Lazer Works
retains that file, which is then available for other
customers to utilize.

We are not selling his plans or his short kits. It is
just a job we have done in the past that we have
listed on our website.

Regards,
Eddie Taylor,
Lazer Works



They really don't see that they are going anything wrong...what a shame.

Later,
Tim

rainedave

My Feedback: (1)

Oh, they are well aware that they are doing something unethical and disrespectful. That is why they go to such lengths to "explain" that the cut files just happen to be on hand from a previous job/client, "It is just a job we have done in the past that we have listed on our website."

ptulmer

My Feedback: (5)

What they are doing is illegal.

http://www.copyright.gov/circs/circ1.html

The very first section says it all. If you guys ever find someone doing this with my files, let me know. I WILL do something about it. If you want to read the "fair use" section, it will help you understand what CAN be done with your copyrighted material. It's here: http://www.copyright.gov/fls/fl102.html

efish

My Feedback: (5)

Hi guys, I don't have much knowledge of intellectual property law, but I think PT is right - it is an infringement. Unfortunately, its a civil action which means the authorities won't lift a finger to help and the plaintiff will have to initiate and fund the enforcement action.

Even if you win, cost recovery is not garunateed and unlikely to be 100%.

Sad, cuz its just this kind of thing that discourages innovation. Not sure how many of you fly IFOs, but I do. A while back, a local company put out a copy at less than half the price of the original calling it a "Kite". Well, now almost no one knows what an IFO is but thanks to inaccurate media coverage, everyone, including non-flyers, have seen or heard of a "Kite". Really silly, but in a forum discussion recently, the local flyers defended the copy on the basis that it was different because had lights pre-installed!??!!

combatpigg

My Feedback: (3)

Don't get the legal system involved with it, leave them out.

MarkD

Does anyone else here remember aprroximately when the "short kits" first were listed on the LW site?

Thanks,



Mark

dbacque

My Feedback: (3)

I found the Sykosis and Mini-Pacer on their site in late March.

Dave

hogflyer

Aw, come on CP, where is your heart felt sympathy for attorneys who have 2 kids going to Harvard or Yale, and need to buy each of them a new BMW 7 Series since they old one's are almost a year old, and they can't be seen driving out of date cars. They also have the 2 Mercedes, SUV, vacation homes and boats to pay for along with the country club to pay for.

Dewey, Cheatham and Howe, Attorneys at Law are always looking for work.

combatpigg

My Feedback: (3)

Usually when someone steals from you, you never find out who the thief is, where they work or where they live. I know what I would do if it were my work that got stolen.

BMatthews

Ya know, it wouldn't be so bad if they weren't supplying plans at all. At least then it would only be parts and that would leave the folks to go to the original plan source. They could fix this by just providing links to the sources of the plans from their web site and drop ANY reproduction of any plans.

mgnostic

At the risk of drawing back a stump, having my tongue cut out and having flaming hot coals poured down my throat I want to say something nice about Lazerworks. I know Eddie Taylor and have been doing business with him for about 15 years. I have built two of his laser cut models but the point is I had to come up with my own plans even though he had the cut files (I bought one from the regrettably defunct RCM and one came from MAN). From my own limited point of view I purchased the plans and thus the right to build the model, all he did was cut out the parts for me. I had a conversation with Eddie about this one day a couple of years ago and my belief is that he is not looking to rip anybody off. As far as I know those few plans that he supplies are either purchased from a licensed plan service, substantially modified in some way (modernized), or are no longer available from any plans service. Mark, as the injured party my suggestion to you is to simply call Eddie directly and ask him to stop.

treedog

Put a lien on there property pt that'll stop em fast or would this be covered under the mail fraud laws oe using the us mail in furtherance of a crime ?

MarkD

I contacted L.W. by email yesterday.

To their credit, I recieved a very prompt reply from them.

All the short kits made from my drawings and all references to them have been removed from the website.




MarkD

ptulmer

My Feedback: (5)

Good! This fella doesn't seem to realize that with a little effort, he could have a much better relationship with people who actually design the airplanes he wants to sell parts for.

KidEpoxy

Seems ther is still plenty of whitespace in most plans to include a BlackList. Just print in the notes of the tital block the cutters & printers that are Non-Cooperative/Non-Endorsed by UlmerRC. Would you send your cutjob to a cutter the plans called out by name not to use?

combatpigg

My Feedback: (3)

Anyone with half a brain stem can see the difference between duplicating parts from an old RCM plan, and profiteering from Marks' work. To do a one off parts cutting for a customer with Marks' drawings is one thing.....but to list his work as part of your on going business is down right wormy and rodent-like behavior. Don't try to put a positive spin on LAZER WORKS backing down when their hand got caught in the cookie jar, they will continue to do business the same way. Their attitude is to take all you can until you get caught, knuckle under when neccessary........but without other peoples' talents, hard work and ideas, they really have nothing expect a machine that can cut out parts.

Bipe Flyer

I know this thread is pretty old, but I just came across it.

No, I didn't realize that someone had made a short kit.

I did give the plan and all related info away free, including files for laser cutting, but not for someone to make a profit. It would have been nice to have at least been asked. I probably should have put a GNU GPL style Copyleft license on it to allow unlimited free distribution and modification, providing it was not for profit.

It's no loss to me as I never intended to make anything from it, so in that sense it's OK, but it just isn't right to take someone else's work and sell it without at least a conversation.

If I were in MarkD's position, I would feel completely different about it - he was ripped off.

EDIT:

I used the Wayback Machine http://www.archive.org/index.php and looked at the July 2006 version of the website and compared it to the current version. I see that Lazer Works has removed the short kits mentioned in this thread.