gretsch6136

Gidday All... I am new to this forum and I am starting this topic all the way from Australia.

I have a Cox Tee Dee 010 which I bought in the early nineties. I on bench ran it back then and since, it has been stored inan oily rag.

I recently set it back up again on the bench as attempted to start it. New fuel, new battery, new glow head and it won't start. I then took it apart completely (throttle body, crank, cylinder and piston all out) and thotoughly cleaned it. I then reassembled it. Still no start. I then purchased a new cylinder, piston and glow head and installed those... still no start.

I heave read my instructions over and over again. I don't think I have done anyhting wrong.

Anyway, the instructions talk about pressurizing. Is this something you must do or, is it a perfomance enhancing technique?

Any one got any suggestions or tips to get this 010 oout of retirement?

Cheers

Grestch6136 [:@]

SGC

does it fire/run breifly off a prime ? if so the needle spray bar assy and the venturie jets are probably blocked with dried castor and need cleaning.
Stewart

Raymond LeFlyr

My Feedback: (2)

G'day Gretsch,

I'd agree with Stewart that it sounds like fuel delivery since if you have any compression at all and a hot plug you can burn off the prime.

Perhaps the little holes in the tank (vent and pickup) have gotten clogged with dingo droppings. Maybe the fuel tubing has barbecue sauce in it?

ClemenTang

Agree it's fuel draw problems. And for pressurizing yes it's for pumping fuel with crank pressure to boost performance but DON'T FOLLOW THE INSTRUCTIONS. I tried with recommended drill bit which is too big and the venturi is gone. Called long distance and rep was kind enough to admit that specified bit was for 020. Rep also recommended NOT TO PRESSURIZED saying it's not worth the reduction in stability. I insisted to try since I already started anyway and thankfully on my request kind rep sent me extra venturis, free. Kind of a make up.

Clement

BMatthews

I go along with the blocked passages. I suggest you poke them clean with a strand of wire unraveled from stripping back a bit of electrical cord. Or possibly something like 20 lb test monofilament. In the case of the copper wire strand you can "harden" it and straighten it all at the same time by holding the two ends and twisting a few turns into it while holding it stretched straight. Something like a small pin vise. You'll need to twist in about 10 turns per inch to straighten and harden it. Then clip off the kinked ends.

Oh, and you do remember that these tiny ones need at LEAST 25% nitromethane fuel, right?

gretsch6136

Thanks Lads. I will follow your advice and clean all the passages again. That Dingo sh%t is hard to get out...... I am using 25% nitro.

By the way, you guys are lucky. Gas model airplanes are dead in Australia. The salesman at my local hobby shop has never heard of a Cox 010. Dopey bugger.

Cheers

DeviousDave

I don't know exactly how many turns out I have to use to start the .010, but it's quite a few. I think I start around 4 and prime it just up to the carb in the fuel line. Then I close the exhaust port with the piston, prime the port and try to start it. It will either burn off of the prime and run for a few seconds or sputter a bit until the engine gets unglued from old oil from the previous flying session. When you get to a point that it will run on the prime, start backing the needle off by 1/2 turn increments then prime and start. (usually another 1.5-2 turns out). Repeat as neccesary until the engine goes from running on the prime to a rich run. The starting needle position and the high speed running position are very far apart, probably 2 turns.

It's very easy to flood this engine and not recognize the problem. This is why I don't follow the directions when they say to choke the carb and flip it over a few times. Floods every time. These engines need all the help they can get so it will behoove you to set a regiment for starting and follow it-they definitely aren't like starting an O.S.! I had a lot of trouble with my TD's until I started being more scientific about it... It's the only glow engine I have ever had trouble starting!

ClemenTang

how does one dig out an age old thread an answer it? Guess the Oz is flying an indoor lecky...

DeviousDave

I was searching for FORA .020 info and pulled this thread out along with the other results. The search engine here isn't very discrimintory..

skaliwag

My Feedback: (1)

I have been playing with the TD.010 and the .020 a long time and if I get one that's mis-behaving the first thing to do is check the head is glowing bright and on tight.
Next is take the venturi off and make sure there is no Dingo Doo in the tiny holes.
Is the crancase seating on the tank with no leaks? Is the tank holding fuel? The gasket may be broken. Is the screw infar enough and not split the plastic back?
To start a kranky one I do the opposite to the Cox needle valve suggestions. I screw it all the way in. Put a tiny prime on the E' ports closed off by the piston. Then connect the heat and wind it up on the spring at least 3 times. Hand flipping is not too efficient on the .010 and the E starter can cause a lot of damage.
Let it run out the prime. Open the needle a full turn and run another prime. Open up a half turn and run a prime again.. Keep going till the needle falls out.
If it hasn't started it is flooded and you have a real head scratcher to work with... Start again ... Take it to pieces and look at all the components to see if you can any thing that might be the culprit.... Good luck.

RocketRob

My Feedback: (1)

Thanks Dave and Skaliwag,
I've got one I've been wanting to fool with but havn't gotten around to yet.

never could afford one as a kid, not much better as an adult, these days

Tee Bee

My .010 has been running great lately but after reading all this stuff, I'm scared to try starting it again.

skaliwag

My Feedback: (1)

Tee Bee ... All the more reason not to let it get cold and out of tune.

Tee Bee

Sounds like good advice. I think I'll charge up some batteries and go flying early Saturday morning. FWIW, my needle valve has been ending up around 1 1/2 to 2 1/2 turns on my latest runs.

DeviousDave

I'll be flying my .010 this weekend most likely and will try to get a baseline needle position for starting. The reason I haven't done this is that I direct connect the battery to save the weight of a switch so I am in a hurry to put the three tiny screws in the wing and get it started lest I run out of battery. Funny thing is that I average 25-28mah per flight, it's a 110mah pack, and I still worry about it!

RocketRob

My Feedback: (1)

How many volts to a cox glow head?

Is it the same for all size engines/glowheads?

MJD

My Feedback: (1)

1.5 volts - they were, like many plugs, designed to glow nicely on a 1-1/2 volt dry cell, the big old kind you used to have to use in them old days. If you use a glow panel, dial it all the way down, connect it to a loose plug, then crank it up slowly until you get a nice orange glow on the entire filament. Don't go too high, you want "bright" but not glowing like a torch or you will soon kiss your plug byebye. Just get the coil glowing a nice healthy orange from top to bottom. In general you'll find Cox plugs take a higher setting on most panels than your average 1/4-32 glow plug. I could be wrong but I believe a lot of modern plugs are designed to glow well on a 1.2V source such as a NiCAD driver, while still tolerating 1.5V. Also note, if you plan to make a portable driver from dry batteries, you'll need at least two alkaline D cells in parallel to handle th ecurrent and capacity demands for any noticable length of time.

Different plugs take different power panel settings - when changing plugs I always hook up first at the lowest setting, then find a good setting while I can see the filament in the open. If it is bright and sunny, shade it with your hand so you don't overdrive it due to tricks of the bright light.

If yer flooded, just open the exhaust ports and blow out the excess fuel and flip some more. And be careful of hydraulic lock on these wee buggers, generally I put a healthy drop of fuel in the exhaust port, then blow through to remove the excess. As I think of it, they like a decent prime but the mixture not overly rich to start well. Once you find a good needle setting, you can often start it there with a good prime and the fuel line full to the venturi, or you can also back off a quarter turn or so and quickly retune once running, which is what I do - I tune anything 1/2A or smaller every run.

I am worried about the three turn advice on the spring starter, having boorken a few in the past. I generally go no more than 1-1/2 turns; if the engine has a reasonable prime and setting, that will do the job fine.

Once you get the feel of an .010, they are not hard to start and handle. Nd if you ever try to run them (or .020's) on less than 25% nitro, you will soon learn the meaning of frustration. Same for Cox .049's on less than 15%, but they'll run okay on that unlike the smaller engines. I recommend 25%-35% for .010/.020, 25% for .049's as good levels for sport use.

MJD

Tee Bee

I'm careful to only wind mine 1 turn for starting. I do place my finger over the intake and draw fuel just up to the needle valve and stop. Then I prime the E ports with a drop. If it doesn't start after a few flips, then I reprime. If that doesn't work, I usually say a cuss word. That usually helps get it going. Running Sig 25% fuel.

DeviousDave

I'm having inconsistent runs on mine. Once or twice a flight the needle will go sour, then clean up mostly. I don't think the needle is moving as it seems to be in the same place I left it (stretched the spring too) and have tried a few different fuels, all with the same result. At first I suspected an air leak somewhere but it burbles rich. On some fuels (like Byron 1/2A) it won't lean all the way out either. It just starts to get all the way clean then falls off as I needle into the lean side of the mixture. There's a lot of lattitude with regards to needle position as well, maybe 1/4-13 turn.

??

skaliwag

My Feedback: (1)

The .010 really likes the NITRO. I try to give mine at least 33%. It likes more, but any more shortens plug life and heads are getting exxeee.

RocketRob

My Feedback: (1)

Thanks for this thread resurection - there'sa lot of valuable information.[8D]
Rob

DeviousDave

So far I've run 35% Norvel fuel, 25% Bryon, and a 45% home brew. They all ran and needled the same, but it was slower and had a little more 4 stroking (more like a fast miss) near peak RPM with the 25% Byron.

Tee Bee

Flew my LA Stick today lots of times and had a blast. It hit pretty hard during a launch that went bad and I noticed later that the vert stabilizer was knocked loose and just about to fall off! Found it after several more flights. Will be an easy repair. All in all lots of fun. The needle was about 1.5 turns most of the time and running great on 25% Sig fuel.