prole

My Feedback: (3)

Hey Guys

So I'm hauling butt through this Simple Mustang and I figure if I don't work out the covering situation soon I'm going to get held up waiting to get something.


So far, this kit has been a blast to build, nothing matches the plans but everything fits together. It is kind of a testament to how well you paid attention to all the other kits you built.


Every kit that I've covered so far that hasn't been tissue and Dope has been Monokote. They say in the directions that you have to use a low temp covering or it will melt the foam.


I was wondering what you guys have used on your Simple's and/or other foam wings?


I've used Econokote and that is lower temp, usually set the iron to 225 for that and 275 for monokote. Is that low-temp enough. If not, what brands make the right kind of low-temp film.


I was also thinking about sheeting them, anybody have any experience with that?


I guess I'm just looking to hear about what all of you did for the wings of your Simple's. I've heard enough about these kits around here, someone must have some good ideas.


Thanks guys....

-theprole-

dennis

My Feedback: (90)

Don't sheet them too heavy, use some of the low temp films. If your cheap and don't want to do that then use silkspan and premixed wall papaer paste to cover your wing and then paint.,or film.This makes a more rigid wing. Of course strapping tape will do the same thing, I just hate the appearance of the tape showing through the covering

LoneRanger

My Feedback: (1)

I sheeted my Simple Corsair with 1/64th and It came out great!

would use Sorghum or thinned epoxy again though!

and be sure to cut off like 1/4th or 3/8th of an inch of the leading edge and epoxy on a cap strip~

IT DOES NOT ADD THAT MUCH WEIGHT AND MAKES FOR A HELLA STRONG WING! (espicialy if using a .074) lol






L.R.

prole

My Feedback: (3)

L.R.

I'm not quite sure I understand about cutting off the leading edge and putting on a cap strip.

Do you mean not to sheet all the way up to the leading edge but run a strip from the L.E to the sheeting???


Also who makes Low temp covering? What are some product names for it (solarfilm, ultracote...). I really just don't have any idea what to look or ask for.


I was thinking about sheeting it like Bipe Flyer was talking about. I've seen this before and always heard it worked good.

L.R. - what did you use to cover your wings after you sheeted them? Did you do it like this or did you do the whole thing. Also what is Sorghum???


this photo is from Bipe Flyer....I can't take any credit.

tiggerinmk

I covered a Sturdy Birdy with Black Baron film.

This is low temp and it worked fine. The instructions for the SB say to run lengths of strapping tape across the wings for strength as there is no spar in the foam wing. The tape doesn't show as much as you think it would.

If you're worried about the heat, get a coverite thermometer and place it on the iron to make sure you have the right temperature. I did this and had no problems.....

flyinrog

My Feedback: (1)

Hey Prole, no he means to slice off about 3/8" off the leading edge and replace it with a balsa strip and sand and finish to match I , use the packing fiberglass tape on my simple extra 230 wing and covered in monokote just watch the temp, course I havent had time to finish it yet.... but the wing looks good..Rog

prole

My Feedback: (3)

tiggerinva-

Thanks, I have one of those thermometers, just don't know what range is safe!...

There are good and bad points to a kit without directions, I'm full on obsessive compulsive (all lines MUST be straight!!) and when I get cought up on something I can sit and stare at it for days.

Seriously! I'm a big pacer as well!


and Rog, in going on about my O.C. disorder, things like that kill me. I'd of thought about the 1/4 and 3/8" thing for hours and hours, might have even kept me up tonight wondering how to match that up.

Now that makes sense.

So you just used Monokote huh, is this not as big of a deal as I think. Monokote is like the highest temp covering isn't it??



Alright guys, so how did the rest of you do this???!???!

LoneRanger

My Feedback: (1)

sheet the whole thing then cut off and cap it.

sorghum is awesome stuff- use it on my jet wings for sheeting.


I used Monokote and got away with it but I would suggest using ekonokote or being realy trick and fiberglassing them!




L.R.

goldguy

An excellent low temp covering which can be applied directly to the Ace foam wing is Easycote. It's made in Germany by the manufacturer of Ultracote, now imported by Horizon.

fastlash

My Feedback: (7)

The way that bipefly did his is just like Lanier did with the giant scale stingers but you still need low temp covering, its light and if you are going to really stress the plane (ie big eng.)you can add some carbon strands under the sheeting, or even a half dozen strands of NON waxed dental floss. you would be better of to see what your local hobby store has on there self and read the wrapper for temp settings, the lower temp coverings don't like the sun or the trunk of your car, Just my thought.

Bipe Flyer

The wing in the picture Prole posted is a lower density white foam than the ACE wings and is sheeted with 1/32 balsa. The wing was covered in Ultracote.

Here are links to some small foam wings I've done.

The first is the plane that the wing in the picture Prole posted was used on. 1/32 leading edge and cap strip with aliphatic resin on 3/4lb foam.
http://donatelli.net/12aee/12Aee2.jpg

The next is a tapered ACE wing with 1/32 balsa sheeting on the top of the wing only, attached with 3M77 and covered with Ultracote. Yes, the bottom side of the wing has the Ultracote ironed directly to the foam.
http://donatelli.net/skougar/skougar1.jpg

This one has 2 wings. The first wing is fully sheeted 3/4lb with 1/32 balsa and 3m77. The second is an ACE wing with leading edge and cap strip with 3M77 covered with Ultracote.
http://donatelli.net/firefly/firefly2.jpg
http://donatelli.net/firefly/firefly5.jpg

The next picture shows the result of a full speed mid air with the plane that originally had the wing that is now on the Firefly posted above. The wing actually cut the red plane in half with only a dent in the leading edge. It was this experience that convinced me that leading edge and cap strip sheeting was sufficient. http://www.missionwings.com/images/p...sc/airwars.jpg


This last picture is a .46 size Pitts I've been flying for a couple of years. The wing has stood up to some pretty heavy duty maneuvers with only 3/4lb foam sheeted with 1/32 balsa and 3M77.
http://donatelli.net/pittss2s/Pitts_s2s_12.jpg

None of the wings have spars, carbon fibre strips or anything added else for strength other than the sheeting. None, other than the small Kougar, even have leading edge balsa, just the sheeting wrapped over the leading edge.

On the most recent couple of planes I've used ProBond Polyurethane, and I prefer it to all other glues I've tried for sheeting.

Sorry for the long winded post, but hopefully someone finds some of it helpful.

J0E

I used solarfilm on the wing of my simple extra 230. It will have sufficient heat to stick nicely but not melt the foam. I did not sheet the wing but instead installed a hollow carbon rod. I just dug a trench to fit the rod and filled with epoxy. I am using an enya ss15bb and the wing has so far showed no sign of stress, even after violent snap and spin manoeuvres.

Derek_TX

My Feedback: (1)

Almost all the iron-on coverings besides MonoKote are low temp. EconoKote works fine...the thing to do is simply test it on a piece of scrap foam. Adjust the temp to keep from melting the foam. What will happen is the foam will melt and turn the surface of the coated foam into a dimpled surface, alot like a footbnall surface. *wonder how I know that*

I like to use a strip of fiberglass reinforced tape under neath the covering. The very best to use is Scotch 3M Super Strength, It has fiber strands running both length-wise and perpendicular to the length and is 2" wide. Having fibers running both directions makes for excellent torsional strength. I can add that to a flimsy foam wing core and it is strong enough to support the plane by the wingtip alone!

prole

My Feedback: (3)

thanks guy,

I really appreciate all the help and Bipe Flyer that post was just what I needed. It was great to be able to see what the wing style was in conjunction to how it was sheeted and what the plane looked like after being covered with it.

I just got 4 sheets of 1/32x4x36 and I'm going to do the leading/trailing edge and cap strip method. If it works well enough to cut a plane in half then I would hope it would stand up to the punishment of my inexperience.

Also, if the Ace wings are heavier than the two others that you make then it probably could use that little bit of weight that I'm going to save.

I have a bottle of 3M spray adhesive at home, I'm not sure if it's specifically the *3M77*, is that a specific type of spray adhesive or should any work.

I've also heard about coating the back of the sheets with aliphatic resin, letting it dry, than applying it with heat like covering film. I was thinking that since the foam is temperature sensitive that it wouldn't be a good idea to do it that way. How did you do it with the aliphatic?

Can I just use 45 min. epoxy thinned 1/3 with alcohol? They didn't have any of the sorghum at the hobby shop, will it work without it?


Thanks guys, I'll post some pics when I get it finished.


-theprole-

LoneRanger

My Feedback: (1)

thinned epoxy works fine- work fast if your like me and know there is only 1 type of epoxy------ the 5 minute kind!


just be sure to make sure it is straight when you weight it down during the sheeting process-






happy trails to you..........



L.R.

Bipe Flyer

Originally posted by prole
thanks guy,

I really appreciate all the help and Bipe Flyer that post was just what I needed. It was great to be able to see what the wing style was in conjunction to how it was sheeted and what the plane looked like after being covered with it.

I just got 4 sheets of 1/32x4x36 and I'm going to do the leading/trailing edge and cap strip method. If it works well enough to cut a plane in half then I would hope it would stand up to the punishment of my inexperience.

Also, if the Ace wings are heavier than the two others that you make then it probably could use that little bit of weight that I'm going to save.

I have a bottle of 3M spray adhesive at home, I'm not sure if it's specifically the *3M77*, is that a specific type of spray adhesive or should any work.

No, the only 3M sprays that I know of that are foam safe are 77 & 88 and I heard that 3M recently changed the formulation of 77. Test any contact adhesives on a styro-faom cup before using them.

I've also heard about coating the back of the sheets with aliphatic resin, letting it dry, than applying it with heat like covering film. I was thinking that since the foam is temperature sensitive that it wouldn't be a good idea to do it that way. How did you do it with the aliphatic?
I've done it both ways. I like the iron on method, it makes a very good bond. The balsa creates a bit of a protective barrier when, so you have to hold the iron in one spot for a while before the foam will melt. Try it on some scrap foam to find the right temperature.


Can I just use 45 min. epoxy thinned 1/3 with alcohol? They didn't have any of the sorghum at the hobby shop, will it work without it?


That works well. You can also try Pro Bond Polyurethane if you want to do fully sheeted wings. I spread a thin coat of the poly on the balsa sheets wiht a drywall spatula and apply it to the wing. Once all the sheets are on, I tape them down and lightly mist the outside of the wing with water. I put the wings back into their saddles and weight them down overnight. This method makes the strongest, lightest wings. I've attached a picture of a bipe I'm currently building which has 62" wings sheeted with 1/16" balsa and Pro Bond. Each wing weighs less than a pound.


Thanks guys, I'll post some pics when I get it finished.


-theprole-

I'm looking forward to seeing them.