PAW diesel! I got the .033!
03-18-2007, 08:22 PM
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PAW diesel! I got the .033!
A few weeks ago at SMS, I picked up a PAW .033 from Mr. Clutton. It's a really well made engine. I got some fuel, but still have a few questions. I've got a balloon tank adapter here and am looking for some off-the-shelf item to use on it. What materials are compatible with model diesel fuel? How 'bout fuel line?
03-18-2007, 08:28 PM
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RE: PAW diesel! I got the .033!
Pat,
The baloon is Latex right? Latex and petrolium don't do well together. Silicone doesn't last long with it etiher. Use the gasoline fuel line. It will kill fuel bulbs unless they are gas compatible. you could use a saringe.
The carb set screws may back out and fall off. The cylinder may unscrew while running. Locktight will help.
The baloon is Latex right? Latex and petrolium don't do well together. Silicone doesn't last long with it etiher. Use the gasoline fuel line. It will kill fuel bulbs unless they are gas compatible. you could use a saringe.
The carb set screws may back out and fall off. The cylinder may unscrew while running. Locktight will help.
03-18-2007, 08:34 PM
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RE: PAW diesel! I got the .033!
Don't tighten the prop nut too tight or it will slide back and jam the crank ( easy fix ) If you ever bend the rod you can straithen it by holding the pistion with the cylinder and bend it back straigh - ask me how I know! There may be burs on the rod that could use deburig.
You can use a Sulivan starter but you have to be carefull!
You can use a Sulivan starter but you have to be carefull!
03-18-2007, 08:35 PM
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RE: PAW diesel! I got the .033!
I thought I smelt somethin'.......hope you get lots of fun out of it! Neoprene and Tygon tubing work. I have never seen anything in Tygon less than medium line, Tygon is the best. I think I have some tiny neoprene lying around that I could send you. Otherwise, Dr Diesel should have what you need. Don't use silicone, ever. Now I know what your quest for lightweight batteries was all about. I'm tempted to try a 1cc PAW.
Don't use a syringe unless it has a neoprene plunger seal. Use a shampoo bottle with a nipple on the cap that you can attach your fuel line to, then just hook up and squeeze the bottle to fill your tank.
Don't use a syringe unless it has a neoprene plunger seal. Use a shampoo bottle with a nipple on the cap that you can attach your fuel line to, then just hook up and squeeze the bottle to fill your tank.
03-18-2007, 08:54 PM
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RE: PAW diesel! I got the .033!
Chevy, thanks for the tips!
CP, the fuel nipple is huge on this thing. Weedeater fuel line would probably work. (<---not exaggerating!) Three years in a row I walked by and looked at the PAW's. Why not buy one the first time? Well, the engine, radial mount and one quart of fuel was over a hundred bucks. I hated to kick out that kind of money for it, but they were so quiet that he was cranking them up and running them inside the building. My tables were about half way across the building and I never heard it! I just couldn't stand it any more.
He claims that it has as much power as a Cox .049. I'm assuming he meant a Surestart with the crappy original head, but that's still ok. Whatever airframe I use, it will have a Koverall and dope finish. That's something I've been wanting to do. (something different)
CP, the fuel nipple is huge on this thing. Weedeater fuel line would probably work. (<---not exaggerating!) Three years in a row I walked by and looked at the PAW's. Why not buy one the first time? Well, the engine, radial mount and one quart of fuel was over a hundred bucks. I hated to kick out that kind of money for it, but they were so quiet that he was cranking them up and running them inside the building. My tables were about half way across the building and I never heard it! I just couldn't stand it any more.
He claims that it has as much power as a Cox .049. I'm assuming he meant a Surestart with the crappy original head, but that's still ok. Whatever airframe I use, it will have a Koverall and dope finish. That's something I've been wanting to do. (something different)
03-18-2007, 09:27 PM
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RE: PAW diesel! I got the .033!
Yep, Neoprene or Tygon for fuel lines. Old Perfect metal tanks work good for that engine 'cuz you only need about 3/4 ounce. Brodak has some metal tanks too I believe. I agree with CP about a small Pizza Box Flyer, I'd vote for 15 - 16 inches but others might recommend 18.
I hope you bought Doctor Diesel's book too. It has good information that will probably keep you from over-compressing. If you ever get a chance to attend one of Mr. Clutton's seminars - get a seat inb the first row. He's more fun than TV.
I hope you bought Doctor Diesel's book too. It has good information that will probably keep you from over-compressing. If you ever get a chance to attend one of Mr. Clutton's seminars - get a seat inb the first row. He's more fun than TV.
03-18-2007, 09:27 PM
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RE: PAW diesel! I got the .033!
pt - don't bet on that surestart comparison. I wouldn't be at all surprised if it's at least as powerful as a Black Widow or even greater. I used to have a PAW .19 that swung 10" and 11" props with AUTHORITY. I had it on a Kadet Jr. and it would very nearly hold vertical. That plane also introduced me to the concept of the torque roll. If I set the manuever up right it would do purty axial rolls - even without ailerons.
03-18-2007, 10:28 PM
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RE: PAW diesel! I got the .033!
Raymond, he seemed to be a lively old gentleman. No wonder you like him so much. Birds of a feather and all that.[X(] I've got a pbf here that just needs servos. Yet another on my stack. I can only go so far here in my office, then it goes downstairs. My shop is getting a new workbench (was, now I need to buy a new table saw to finish) so when that's finished there will be a rash of new airplanes exiting my shop.
While the metal tank is an option, it's a heavy option. I wonder if nitrile is ok? I've got a box of gloves and the fingers would be a good size.
I've got a pbf here that just needs servos. Yet another on my stack. I can only go so far here in my office, then it goes downstairs. My shop is getting a new workbench (was, now I need to buy a new table saw to finish) so when that's finished there will be a rash of new airplanes exiting my shop.While the metal tank is an option, it's a heavy option. I wonder if nitrile is ok? I've got a box of gloves and the fingers would be a good size.
03-18-2007, 10:36 PM
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RE: PAW diesel! I got the .033!
ORIGINAL: combatpigg
Neoprene and Tygon tubing work. I have never seen anything in Tygon less than medium line, Tygon is the best.
Neoprene and Tygon tubing work. I have never seen anything in Tygon less than medium line, Tygon is the best.
03-18-2007, 10:42 PM
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RE: PAW diesel! I got the .033!
Patrick, the lightest diesel tank that I know of is made from aluminum foil that is 3M77'd to balsa sheet. I have never tried it firsthand, but was told that it can be CA glued together. To keep with the lightness theme, use aluminum tubing. You could also try using a section off of an aluminum cigar tube, with a neoprene end plug.
03-18-2007, 10:45 PM
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RE: PAW diesel! I got the .033!
On that radial mount; it can come loose too and that's no fun. You can use locktight but it will be hard to get it off if you need to.
Put the radial mount on and screw it down to a turn or so from tight then wick a little locktight in there and tighten it down. A quarter fit my .061 perfectly. I put the quarter in the vise and held the engine and radial mount in my hand.
Horizontal mounting is the easiest for running but I've had success upsidedown and upright.
Treven.
Put the radial mount on and screw it down to a turn or so from tight then wick a little locktight in there and tighten it down. A quarter fit my .061 perfectly. I put the quarter in the vise and held the engine and radial mount in my hand.
Horizontal mounting is the easiest for running but I've had success upsidedown and upright.
Treven.
03-19-2007, 12:14 AM
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RE: PAW diesel! I got the .033!
Ptulmer:
So I suppose wedding bubble bottles are chopped liver now?! Diesel engines have good fuel draw.
I have used perfect tanks, buna rubber and neoprene line with good success.
regards - Steve B.
An IV line is neoprene tubing. I you know anybody in the hospital have them save the IV line when they
yank it out. I mean they paid for it...
So I suppose wedding bubble bottles are chopped liver now?! Diesel engines have good fuel draw.
I have used perfect tanks, buna rubber and neoprene line with good success.
regards - Steve B.
An IV line is neoprene tubing. I you know anybody in the hospital have them save the IV line when they
yank it out. I mean they paid for it...
03-19-2007, 02:17 AM
#15
RE: PAW diesel! I got the .033!
ORIGINAL: ptulmer
Chevy, thanks for the tips!
CP, the fuel nipple is huge on this thing. Weedeater fuel line would probably work. (<---not exaggerating!) Three years in a row I walked by and looked at the PAW's. Why not buy one the first time? Well, the engine, radial mount and one quart of fuel was over a hundred bucks. I hated to kick out that kind of money for it, but they were so quiet that he was cranking them up and running them inside the building. My tables were about half way across the building and I never heard it! I just couldn't stand it any more. He claims that it has as much power as a Cox .049. I'm assuming he meant a Surestart with the crappy original head, but that's still ok. Whatever airframe I use, it will have a Koverall and dope finish. That's something I've been wanting to do. (something different)
Chevy, thanks for the tips!
CP, the fuel nipple is huge on this thing. Weedeater fuel line would probably work. (<---not exaggerating!) Three years in a row I walked by and looked at the PAW's. Why not buy one the first time? Well, the engine, radial mount and one quart of fuel was over a hundred bucks. I hated to kick out that kind of money for it, but they were so quiet that he was cranking them up and running them inside the building. My tables were about half way across the building and I never heard it! I just couldn't stand it any more.
He claims that it has as much power as a Cox .049. I'm assuming he meant a Surestart with the crappy original head, but that's still ok. Whatever airframe I use, it will have a Koverall and dope finish. That's something I've been wanting to do. (something different)
A buddy of mine imports PAW. Yes, they have at the power of a reedie and weigh about the same. They sound very cool and throttle really well.
You're going to enjoy that little engine, Patrick.
03-19-2007, 09:50 AM
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RE: PAW diesel! I got the .033!
Is it just me or is this forum getting hilarious? burtcs, they're not chopped liver! I just get tunnel vision. That might even hold enough to run it for a good while.
03-19-2007, 11:04 AM
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RE: PAW diesel! I got the .033!
ORIGINAL: ptulmer
While the metal tank is an option, it's a heavy option. I wonder if nitrile is ok? I've got a box of gloves and the fingers would be a good size.
While the metal tank is an option, it's a heavy option. I wonder if nitrile is ok? I've got a box of gloves and the fingers would be a good size.
MJD
03-19-2007, 11:16 AM
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RE: PAW diesel! I got the .033!
Re humor; to paraphrase my favorite murderous despot, "humor is the opiate of the masses." To me this means that a good joke is better than a punch in the arm. And everyone knows that a punch in the arm is better than a finger in a spinning prop. Hence. More people ought to fly small airplanes - then they won't need a sense of humor. And it follows logically that the ether in diesel fuel is better for you than a sharp stick in the eye that has been dipped in glow fuel. Which makes your PAW purchase morally sound. Isn't that obvious?
03-19-2007, 01:35 PM
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RE: PAW diesel! I got the .033!
Power? I flew the Sharkface with one swinging a MA 6X4 and it flew just as well as the later re-fit with Golden Bee, PLUS I could throttle it.
Fuel Line? Tygon, Dr Diesel sells some that is more flexible than I can find in any lawn mower shop.
Fuel Tank? I've used a brass float from the old style Ford fuel guage sending units. Or a Sullivan one ounce round with the gasoline stopper (black).
My favorite small engine. Currently flying one on a Tomboy with only throttle and rudder control.
When I fly a lot of electric, this is what I fly to get rid of those nasty guilt feelings from not having to clean a model airplane.
Fuel Line? Tygon, Dr Diesel sells some that is more flexible than I can find in any lawn mower shop.
Fuel Tank? I've used a brass float from the old style Ford fuel guage sending units. Or a Sullivan one ounce round with the gasoline stopper (black).
My favorite small engine. Currently flying one on a Tomboy with only throttle and rudder control.
When I fly a lot of electric, this is what I fly to get rid of those nasty guilt feelings from not having to clean a model airplane.
03-19-2007, 02:23 PM
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RE: PAW diesel! I got the .033!
Hollis,
Oi vey (sp?), talk about your guilt already. Yesterday I was flying a glow model (and handling a lot of wind thank you) when a guy who joined our club last Spring came up and told me that he had never seen me fly anything but small electrics. Mea culpa. I think his memory is flawed - but he made his point.
Well, my thanks to Rog, the CC, and the BARKS Boyz - they keep me building little models. If it wasn't for them and the twice a year infusion of high nitro and castor - I'm afraid to think of the consequences. OK, I may be exagerating just a smidge - but youse-all and da boyz do keep my nose in it - so to speak. Thanks.
Oi vey (sp?), talk about your guilt already. Yesterday I was flying a glow model (and handling a lot of wind thank you) when a guy who joined our club last Spring came up and told me that he had never seen me fly anything but small electrics. Mea culpa. I think his memory is flawed - but he made his point.
Well, my thanks to Rog, the CC, and the BARKS Boyz - they keep me building little models. If it wasn't for them and the twice a year infusion of high nitro and castor - I'm afraid to think of the consequences. OK, I may be exagerating just a smidge - but youse-all and da boyz do keep my nose in it - so to speak. Thanks.
03-19-2007, 06:02 PM
#21
RE: PAW diesel! I got the .033!
I really like mine--yes, the sound is delightful, especially on a landing approach, and it runs a ridiculously long time on 1/2 oz Perfect fuel tank. I don't think the weight of a small metal tank is enough to worry about, and they are trouble free. I like a 7x3 prop on mine, but the Zingers in that size are not efficient unless you thin them toward the tips and trailing edges. I think an 8x3 would be possible on a vintage type, and give you even better sound. Please don't put that little jewel on a pizza box--build something worthy of it.
Hey, what's a hundred bucks when you've got something that nice! Jim
Hey, what's a hundred bucks when you've got something that nice! Jim
03-19-2007, 06:25 PM
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RE: PAW diesel! I got the .033!
I thought the uninitiated might like a look at these engines. A close look at them shows good quality and an very simple design. The carb is actually cute. It's proof that you don't have to be complex to work well. If it had cost about half that, I'd be won over completely. As it stands, this is my first PAW and will likely be my last. Don't get me wrong, I'm not complaining. They're just overpriced for my budget. I've got plenty of glow 1/2a engines to hold me over and a 35cc gas engine that's begging for a Bridi airframe.
CP, both have their value I suppose. Fun wins out around here, though!
CP, both have their value I suppose. Fun wins out around here, though!
03-19-2007, 08:01 PM
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RE: PAW diesel! I got the .033!
Right on, Bro........next model I build that takes 200 hours to complete, has a 1:2 power to weight ratio, takes 300 feet of straightaway and 50 feet of altitude to complete one roll, needs a 100 foot dive to complete a loop, will be dubbed, "the RORER 714".
Oh, the 35cc engine....just apply the same design principals that we use around here [TLAR}. Rip your own spruce or hemlock, ply joiner plates, gorilla glue, dacron and house paint, just wing it, man. You dun nee no steenkin keet!
Just scale up your DNU to 90" of span. I'd go with at least HS 81s on this one, too. Those 55s are starting to stink up the joint.
Is the engine an airplane engine, or does it need a conversion yet?
Oh, the 35cc engine....just apply the same design principals that we use around here [TLAR}. Rip your own spruce or hemlock, ply joiner plates, gorilla glue, dacron and house paint, just wing it, man. You dun nee no steenkin keet!
Just scale up your DNU to 90" of span. I'd go with at least HS 81s on this one, too. Those 55s are starting to stink up the joint.Is the engine an airplane engine, or does it need a conversion yet?
03-19-2007, 08:05 PM
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RE: PAW diesel! I got the .033!
cp, I had one of them things...a Piece-O-Cake. Why, once it even ROG'd off a grass runway! I have no idea how though, I could never repeat the feat.