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COX 0.049 black widow problems.

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COX 0.049 black widow problems.

Old 03-28-2003, 01:24 AM
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Mavericman
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Default COX 0.049 black widow problems.

I have a cox black widow, well I traded off blocks w/ a killer bee, and i cant get the blasted thging started!!! It pops, but it wont fully start. anny tips for me??? I wanna be in the air this weekend
Old 03-28-2003, 01:29 AM
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jetranger-RCU
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Default cox

Pull the head and see if the plug is good. If so take the tank off and see if any crud is in the line or needle flush out and try again
Old 03-28-2003, 01:46 AM
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Default COX 0.049 black widow problems.

Check to make sure that your reed is not sticking. If it is it would drive you nuts trying to figure out whats wrong with it. Clean the reedand spring woth either lacquer thinner or alcahol.
Old 03-28-2003, 02:00 AM
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Default COX 0.049 black widow problems.

yes, check tank lines and reed, clean well. gunk dries up in 'em. check the head shims, 3 make for easy starting. and if all fails, sell it on ebay and buy a norvel -just kidding, keep at it! and have patience.
Old 03-28-2003, 02:04 AM
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wild fred
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Default COX 0.049 black widow problems.

also- USE FRESH FUEL! old stuff absorbs water, and the nitro goes flat. makes them almost impossible to start, and they run like crap if you get them going on it! if the fuel has been opened and a few months old, get some new stuff, at least 15% nitro, I prefer a quart of sig 35% myself, it does good.
Old 03-28-2003, 12:10 PM
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Default COX 0.049 black widow problems.

I use cox super power fuel. I thought the fuel line might have needed cleaning. The reed is the needle , right?
Old 03-28-2003, 12:29 PM
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Default COX 0.049 black widow problems.

no, the reed is the little piece of plastic between the tank and crankcase that is held in by a G-shaped spring. it acts as a valve, allowing fuel into the crankcase. if it sticks to the tank, it won't allow fuel in.

even if it is stuck, it should still run off a prime unless battery low, or fuel old unless you have no head shims, which could make starting hard.
Old 03-29-2003, 01:18 AM
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Default COX 0.049 black widow problems.

well, I pulled a plastic part out, I thouight it was junk!! well I do not know what the spring looks like. can i get a pic????
Old 03-29-2003, 01:45 AM
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Default COX 0.049 black widow problems.

I don't have a pic, it is G shaped, literally. goes in the round part of tank that sticks into back of crankcase, and holds the thin clear plastic reed in. reed is a circle w/ both sides cut off, kind of oval. doesn't your lazy bee backplate have one, too? you might use that reed and spring.
Old 03-29-2003, 02:06 AM
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Default COX 0.049 black widow problems.

if its a newer BW it may have the plastic reed retainer instead of the wire clip.

AJC
Old 03-29-2003, 02:50 AM
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Default COX 0.049 black widow problems.

I found one, it is copper thought. I also found the spring!
Old 03-29-2003, 02:54 AM
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Default COX 0.049 black widow problems.

Then its an older black widow (the better ones IMO). They used a beryllium copper reed and a wire clip. Make sure the wire clip is in the correct way, allowing the reed to flex away from the seat, not holding it tight to the seat (then it couldnt open)

AJC
Old 03-29-2003, 02:57 AM
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Default COX 0.049 black widow problems.

yes, the prong coming from The center of the "G" is facing out. What are you talkin bout?? IMO?
Old 03-29-2003, 03:12 AM
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Default COX 0.049 black widow problems.

In My Opinion (IMO) the older black widows were made much better than the later Estes ones. The earlier ones have the aluminum tank vented for stunt flying (inverted short term without draining fuel out of the tank) and a metal packplate. The newer ones had the backplate replaced with a cheap plastic one first, then the tank was non vented and the vents were on the backplate as a babe bee, then to make things worse they went to a plastic tank too. That and the cyl/piston fits are no where near as reliable (hit or miss) as with the earlier higher quality Black Widows.

The newer plastic reeds however seem to run and hold up as good as the old metal ones. Just wish they left the rest of the engine alone... Good thing is that there are millions of good old used Cox widows and other engines out there for $10 or less

Thats what the Toledo show is for me, a chance to stock up on more parts engines!!!

AJC
Old 03-29-2003, 03:18 AM
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Default COX 0.049 black widow problems.

Well I took the block off of a newer lazy bee. Is this bad?? everythging else is old.
Old 03-29-2003, 03:29 AM
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Default COX 0.049 black widow problems.

You mean killer bee? By block you mean the cylinder? Hey, if it runs then it is OK! Its just that the older Cox stuff (especially piston to cylinder fit) was so darn good, much better than the newer (last 10 years) stuff.

AJC
Old 03-29-2003, 03:33 AM
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Default COX 0.049 black widow problems.

I am refering to the cox lazy bee trainer 2 channel airplane. It had a motor that had a plastic backplate but no fuel tank directly behind it. I know it was a cox 049 I took the piston, block, and crank and put it on a black widow tank.
Old 03-29-2003, 03:37 AM
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Default COX 0.049 black widow problems.

Oh the lazy bee plane! OK, that makes sense...

Like I said, if it works, it works!

I buy lots of used cox engines, and usually they need only a good cleaning and away they go. They will allways be one of my favourites no matter what better 1/2A's come out... it was my first engine and will allways be cool to me.

AJC
Old 04-03-2003, 02:52 AM
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Default COX 0.049 black widow problems.

I still cant get the blasted thing started! I have 2 shims, how many turns open do you open the needle??
Old 04-03-2003, 03:42 AM
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Default COX 0.049 black widow problems.

at least 3 turns, I usually start with 3 1/2 or 3 3/4 and then lean it out from there.

If you give it a good squirt into the exhaust ports, does it fire and run really fast while the prime burns out. If it won't even do that, then I would say there is a problem with the glow plug.

I have had plugs that lit, but as soon as I swaped them out with a different one my starting problems went away.

Even if there is a fuel delivery or reed problem, you should be able to burn the prime. If not, try a new glow plug.


it works for me.....


t
Old 04-03-2003, 03:45 AM
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prole
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Default COX 0.049 black widow problems.

oh, and you have to stop bad mouthing them, they can hear you...

you have to be nice to them, tell them how nice they look today, tell them they smell nice and that you like what they have done with their reed.

It works man, I don't know why, but I sweet talk all of my Cox's and they love me for it....


...really...
Old 04-03-2003, 12:24 PM
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Default COX 0.049 black widow problems.

the motor runs off of the prime fine, I cant get anything set right
Old 04-03-2003, 11:59 PM
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Default COX 0.049 black widow problems.

so, on your widow, you turn it out about 3 1/2 to 3 3/4? I just want to make sure your talkin about the right engine! I will start treating my motors good. And i will compliment them!
Old 04-04-2003, 04:36 AM
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Default COX 0.049 black widow problems.

yup. It says three in the instructions.

I'm not saying that this is the best way, I'm just saying it is what I do, but I also don't use my electric starter on my Cox's (only had to break one Rod to make that decision) and I am very careful and mindful of what I am doing.

I do 3 1/2 to 3 3/4 on my Baby Bee, my Texaco, and my Black Widow.

JUST BE CAREFUL, ESPECIALLY IF YOU ARE USING AN ELECTRIC STARTER.

...bare with me guys, I got to do it...

Here is the deal. Open up the needle, try 3 to start with, before you hook up the glow clip give a good squirt into the exhaust port and flip the prop 3 or 4 times. Now hook up the clip and just litsen, most of the time you can hear it start to burn off the fuel that is in the chamber, also if you move the piston to the BDC you should be able to see the reflection of the coil glowing orange off the top of the piston. Spin the prop COUNTER CLOCKWISE untill you start to feel resistance. Now flip it through.

I'll usually give it about 5 flips, if it hasn't started, close the needle and flip it until it starts. It will rev way up and run off the prime, and them quickly slow down and die.

Now start over.

WHY? If you get to much fuel into the cylinder the piston won't be able to go all the way up. This is called Hydrolic Lock, or something close to that. It's bad when you are using an electric starter because no matter how hard you force it, that piston will lock up and either the prop will fly off becuase the spinner and prop screw get loosened by the rapid spinning of the starter or the rod that connects the piston to the prop shaft will snap.

Wanna know how I know this, because I have done it, I have been jabbed in the face with a flying propeller because I had over-primed my Norvel, and I busted the con-rod in a brand new Tee Dee the very first time I tried to start it.


Now be nice to it, tell it that you are sorry for all the mean things that you said and that from now on things will be different. Follow that, step by step and see what happens.

If it doesn't work I will send you my address and I'll talk to it and see if it is ever going to give it up for you.


...and be careful, when it does start that prop is going to come back around REALLY FAST, and if your finger is in the way, you'll be sorry.



the prole
Old 04-04-2003, 11:57 AM
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Default COX 0.049 black widow problems.

ya, I dont use an electric starter, I just use the spring starter. I decided to put the original crank/pistion/cylinder/head back on. Thank you for all of your help, I am going to try to get her runninn this afternoon@!!@!!!!!!!!!!

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