Aero Works P-51?
10-29-2016, 01:26 PM
#1226
Maiden flight today with my AW P-51D at Old Kingsberry Aerodrome at Kingsberry, Texas. It is an aviation museum and old time aerodrome that has allowed the local club to use it's grass runway. Very Nice!!!
I flew just before the start of the TCF Warbird Fly-in.
The flight was great for the first 4 or 5 minutes then my DA-50 quit and I had to make my first landing a dead stick landing. It was a great no flap landing because I had not yet had a chance to test the flaps in actual flight. The engine quit at 3/4 throttle on the down wind with very little warning. I think I need to move the ignition box away from the muffler. Hopefully that will take care of the engine quitting problem. The engine started up easily and ran great until it quit. Still a great first flight, the plane is a great flyer,it did need a little more right rudder at the factory low rate setting. VERY HAPPY!!!
I flew just before the start of the TCF Warbird Fly-in.
The flight was great for the first 4 or 5 minutes then my DA-50 quit and I had to make my first landing a dead stick landing. It was a great no flap landing because I had not yet had a chance to test the flaps in actual flight. The engine quit at 3/4 throttle on the down wind with very little warning. I think I need to move the ignition box away from the muffler. Hopefully that will take care of the engine quitting problem. The engine started up easily and ran great until it quit. Still a great first flight, the plane is a great flyer,it did need a little more right rudder at the factory low rate setting. VERY HAPPY!!!
http://www.aero-works.net/
10-29-2016, 02:00 PM
#1227
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Very interesting that you flew today. I also flew my plane today in what I would consider my second maiden flight, or perhaps the first "successful" maiden flight. It's been a long journey of changing one thing after another for me as you know. Ultimately, I changed the stock tank out for a 4titude tank and opened the cowl quite a bit more for exhaust cooling. I'm not 100% sure which one made the biggest difference, but I feel like it might have been a combination of both.
I flew 11 minutes including 3 takeoffs and landings with no issues which is a first for my plane. EVERY time prior to today when I had engine problems, it was always 3-5 minutes and then an engine failure or irregular throttle response leading to an emergency landing. Good to hear yours was an uneventful dead stick landing. I am however concerned that you may be experiencing the same issue(s) I had. Particularly since you have a different engine than I do.
The thing about the 4titude tank that, whether it actually helps or not makes me feel better, is the "fuel magnet" built into the clunk that holds some fuel even if it sloshes into some air for a second. That could have been an issue I had in the past because I did observe air bubbles in my fuel line at one point during a ground run and it gave the same result I was hearing in the air. Also that tank has a stiffer clunk line that will not bend enough to go to the front of the tank and get stuck. I had that happen more than once with the stock tank and clunk. Then my clunk line got extremely stiff and stuck at the front at the same time and that's when I said that's enough and got the 4titude.
The photo below is how I have it now, which worked. I cut out about 4 inches of cowl that was in front of that lower firewall area. The line of thinking myself and my mentor here had with opening the cowling way up for cooling was this. Maybe the incoming air from the spinner area was going all the way back to that lower firewall area and in order for that (now hot) air to get out of the cowling, it would have to go forward, against the flow of incoming air, about 4 inches in order to get out and let new cool air in. So maybe the engine was getting too hot because of this, or starting to ingest hot air in the carb.
A couple of things made us think this may be the problem.
1. It never happened on the ground, only in flight when there would be constant incoming air "damming up" in there.
2. It didn't happen when I flew with the cowl removed.
So, my lessons learned going forward. Personally, I've got a bad taste in my mouth for stock fuel tanks at this point. I'll never use a stock tank without fuel magnet again. I'll probably continue to use 4titude. Also I'll probably lean toward too much cowl cutout rather than too little.
Take it for what it's worth...I may consider some of the things I changed on mine if I was you since our issue seems strikingly similar.
Today's flight
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FIlYOp4XWys
Stiff Fuel Line
https://youtu.be/1GDFOWfwvlE
I flew 11 minutes including 3 takeoffs and landings with no issues which is a first for my plane. EVERY time prior to today when I had engine problems, it was always 3-5 minutes and then an engine failure or irregular throttle response leading to an emergency landing. Good to hear yours was an uneventful dead stick landing. I am however concerned that you may be experiencing the same issue(s) I had. Particularly since you have a different engine than I do.
The thing about the 4titude tank that, whether it actually helps or not makes me feel better, is the "fuel magnet" built into the clunk that holds some fuel even if it sloshes into some air for a second. That could have been an issue I had in the past because I did observe air bubbles in my fuel line at one point during a ground run and it gave the same result I was hearing in the air. Also that tank has a stiffer clunk line that will not bend enough to go to the front of the tank and get stuck. I had that happen more than once with the stock tank and clunk. Then my clunk line got extremely stiff and stuck at the front at the same time and that's when I said that's enough and got the 4titude.
The photo below is how I have it now, which worked. I cut out about 4 inches of cowl that was in front of that lower firewall area. The line of thinking myself and my mentor here had with opening the cowling way up for cooling was this. Maybe the incoming air from the spinner area was going all the way back to that lower firewall area and in order for that (now hot) air to get out of the cowling, it would have to go forward, against the flow of incoming air, about 4 inches in order to get out and let new cool air in. So maybe the engine was getting too hot because of this, or starting to ingest hot air in the carb.
A couple of things made us think this may be the problem.
1. It never happened on the ground, only in flight when there would be constant incoming air "damming up" in there.
2. It didn't happen when I flew with the cowl removed.
So, my lessons learned going forward. Personally, I've got a bad taste in my mouth for stock fuel tanks at this point. I'll never use a stock tank without fuel magnet again. I'll probably continue to use 4titude. Also I'll probably lean toward too much cowl cutout rather than too little.
Take it for what it's worth...I may consider some of the things I changed on mine if I was you since our issue seems strikingly similar.
Today's flight
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FIlYOp4XWys
Stiff Fuel Line
https://youtu.be/1GDFOWfwvlE
Last edited by aadams1278; 10-29-2016 at 02:13 PM.
10-30-2016, 06:01 AM
#1228
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aadams1278, It looks like you have the landings down-pat, the engine sounds like it is running extremely well also. My cowl is pretty well open on the bottom also but my ignition module is mounted where you have those black tie raps X'd on the bottom box. Did you mount your ignition module on the inside in the same place? I have the 4titude tanks in my pilot 25% extra for the same stuck clunk issue. I have been very aware of your stuck clunk issue since you first posted the problem and have been diligent not to stand it on it's nose with or without fuel, that is a concern. My idle stays right where I set it with no variation which makes me think it is an overheated ignition module rather than a hot engine or carb air issue. I going to move the ignition inside and nervously fly it again. I know how you felt every time you flew yours wondering if you had figured it out or not!
I'll keep you posted,
Tom M.
I'll keep you posted,
Tom M.
10-30-2016, 07:21 AM
#1229
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My ignition module is inside but farther back than that. The straps you see are holding a battery for balance.
Ugh, those landings... glad you liked them but I highly hope to improve those going forward as I get more comfortable with the flight characteristics of this plane.
Ugh, those landings... glad you liked them but I highly hope to improve those going forward as I get more comfortable with the flight characteristics of this plane.
Last edited by aadams1278; 10-30-2016 at 07:33 AM.
10-30-2016, 08:09 AM
#1230
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My landing was without flaps and I found that the glide path and flair where very smooth and the plane stayed on the ground. The rollout was probably longer than with flaps and that would be helpful.
Overall a well behaved plane.
Tom M.
Overall a well behaved plane.
Tom M.
11-04-2016, 08:08 AM
#1231
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aadams1278, what do you have your rudder low rate's set at, or what rate's do you use for take-off and landing? I could hardly keep the airplane on the runway taking off and landing, it really seemed to pull left taking off and landing.
Tom M.
Tom M.
11-04-2016, 09:27 AM
#1232
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I haven't had enough successful flights to tweak or fine tune any settings like that of any kind. I went to fly yesterday for that purpose and there was a massive sink hole in the middle of our runway so that didn't work out.
So I haven't changed anything from what factory settings were. I don't use low and high rates so I'm guessing I have it set it up for high rates per the manual but I can't say for sure. I'd have to check. I do know I plan to increase the aileron throws whenever I get a chance so rolls will be quicker.
It does pull quite a bit and I expect since it's a P-51 that it will need a decent amount of right rudder trim even in flight to remain coordinated. Again I haven't had a chance to fine tune that yet but if I'm correct I believe that will help with the takeoffs also.
So I haven't changed anything from what factory settings were. I don't use low and high rates so I'm guessing I have it set it up for high rates per the manual but I can't say for sure. I'd have to check. I do know I plan to increase the aileron throws whenever I get a chance so rolls will be quicker.
It does pull quite a bit and I expect since it's a P-51 that it will need a decent amount of right rudder trim even in flight to remain coordinated. Again I haven't had a chance to fine tune that yet but if I'm correct I believe that will help with the takeoffs also.
11-04-2016, 10:28 AM
#1233
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Keep me posted, I won't have a chance to try a second flight for a few weeks. The weather has turned pretty rainy for the next couple of weeks it looks like, so I will have time to move the ignition module inside and adjust the low rate on the rudder up a little.
Tom M.
Tom M.
11-04-2016, 12:15 PM
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Well pending that runway sink hole I'm out of commission until that's fixed also. Plus I'm starting a new job Monday and will be training for probably the better part of 2 months. Then weather gets cold. We will see what happens.
Yet again...we are at a point or see who flies first, me or you...
Yet again...we are at a point or see who flies first, me or you...
11-04-2016, 07:43 PM
#1237
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I retired from American and my son flies for UPS. He was flying 747's from Anchorage to the Far East, he know has a new Son (1yr old) and wants to be home more, so he went to 767's flying in the contiguous US.
Tom M.
Tom M.
11-11-2016, 01:37 PM
#1239
