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View Poll Results: A poll

Voters
520. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes, our self-policing efforts (i.e. AMA Safety Codes) aren''t working.

    25 4.81%
  • Yes, the world has changed considerably since 9/11.

    83 15.96%
  • I''m not sure.

    29 5.58%
  • No, the FAA has no business regulating "hobby" airplanes.

    180 34.62%
  • No, we are fully capable of policing ourselves.

    66 12.69%
  • No, the perceived threat to society doesn't exist!

    72 13.85%
  • I hate polls like this!

    65 12.50%
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  1. #76
    wahoo's Avatar
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    RE: Do you think the FAA should be sticking its nose into our hobby?

    +1000Capgains



    When ever I feel like expressing my own opinion... I just ask an RCU moderator. Better safe than sorry I always say.

  2. #77
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    RE: Do you think the FAA should be sticking its nose into our hobby?


    ORIGINAL: 804

    Right after you say this:'' There have been some good points brought out by both sides. Unfortunately, too few have shown a willingness to listen.
    2. Much like in an armed conflict, the ''enemy'' (in this case, the FAA) knows that it will enjoy an easy victory when it sees that its opposition is spending all of its energy fighting among themselves. ''

    Harvey

    you say this?
    ''Despite your intentions not to hurt anyone, you clearly and willfully showed a complete disregard for the AMA Safety Code AND the existing Federal Aviation Regulations regarding dropping potentially harmful objects from an aircraft (ANY aircraft). It appears to me that YOU are one of those malcontents who is now bringing the government down on the entire hobby.

    Thanks!''

    Harvey

    Wow!

    If you really want a laugh (or cry), think about how many folks have died as a result of
    full scale aviation just in the last year.

    And FAA wants to protect them from us???[:@]
    I'm not sure I understand your point. My first statement was an observation on the deeply polarizing nature of the subject and how the two sides were very opinionated in their beliefs, often to the point of refusing to listen to each other.

    Then this guy suddenly pops up out of the mist bragging about how he has been using his models to drop explosives. I accused him of thumbing his nose at the AMA Safety Codes and adding support to the arguement that modelers should be controlled.

    What is the connection that you're trying to make between my two statements?

    Harvey
    Weather Geek

  3. #78
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    RE: Do you think the FAA should be sticking its nose into our hobby?

    ORIGINAL: wahoo

    Yeah I'm 13 and I'm just tired of some of our own communities way of thinking.Β*
    Just a suggestion that if you want anyone to take you seriously, don't have a signature line that says...

    "How do you make a cat go . ."WHOOOF" ? . . .Dowse it in gasoline and throw it in the fireplace."

    Harvey
    Weather Geek

  4. #79

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    RE: Do you think the FAA should be sticking its nose into our hobby?

    Funny thing about this poll is this:
    Model aircraft stuck their nose into the FAA's business long before the FAA (other than an advisory) began looking at sUAS applications.

  5. #80

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    RE: Do you think the FAA should be sticking its nose into our hobby?


    ORIGINAL: H5487

    ORIGINAL: cublover
    I made my own ordinance and dropped them many times, but they were never,,,,NEVER,,, made to kill anyone... They just made a nice boom....
    Despite your intentions not to hurt anyone, you clearly and willfully showed a complete disregard for the AMA Safety Code AND the existing Federal Aviation Regulations regarding dropping potentially harmful objects from an aircraft (ANY aircraft). It appears to me that YOU are one of those malcontents who is now bringing the government down on the entire hobby.

    Thanks!

    Harvey

    Agree with that ! +

  6. #81

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    RE: Do you think the FAA should be sticking its nose into our hobby?

    Guys like you are exactly why we need regulations... why anyone would come on an open web site and make the incriminating statements you have made is beyond my comprehension. I do not know the circumstances, but I do invite you to never fly near me for any reason whatsoever.



    ORIGINAL: cublover

    as of 8:54,,, the 9% who said yes, needs to leave the hobby!!!! We don't need any more people telling us what to do,,,if you see something unsafe or hear of a dummy doing something with a RC aircraft that could kill someone,,,,,here is an idea,,,,TURN THEM IN!!!!....I love to see poll's like this...shows me how many dumb asses there really are in America... I made my own ordinance and dropped them many times, but they were never,,,,NEVER,,, made to kill anyone... They just made a nice boom....Please don't ask how I did it, I dont need you 9% to make something that could hurt anyone....Use the thing between your ears guys...don't be a dumb ass!!!

  7. #82

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    RE: Do you think the FAA should be sticking its nose into our hobby?


    ORIGINAL: wahoo

    Yeah I'm 13 and I'm just tired of some of our own communities way of thinking.Β*



    ORIGINAL: Lins


    ORIGINAL: ggraham500

    I think you need one more option in the vote:

    ''Yes, but I think our self-policing efforts (i.e. AMA Safety Rules) are probably enough.''
    I agree with the above statement. Sure, the older smaller aircraft couldn't do much damage, but the newer, larger, more powerful aircraft out now can surely hurt someone or worse. And I don't necessarily mean intentionally. Do you think each person does a proper pre- and post-flight inspection 100% of the time? Definitely worthy of the FAA or TC to be concerned.
    So ya ...if Β*what it takes is a 13 year old to make the case that giant scale planes are not any more to blame then any other size rc plane so be it.

    Not to many newbies that I've witnessed can afford a 40% Carden or a multi-thousand dollar turbine, I'm sure there are the exceptions, but it seem that the 40 size circle jerks and warturd fliers would lead one to believe that this mess was created because of them.



    Wow, who pissed in your corn flakes this morning? The fact that you are picking on '40 size circle jerks' and 'warturds fliers' shows how mature you are. I fly both rotary and fixed, from 12" to 12', and don't discriminate against any. The fact is, the FAA won't care about little park flyers, you can't do much damage to those. If they are actually going to build a case, it will be against the larger aircraft, especially ones that can carry a payload. Thankfully in Canada we can go as large as 77.2lbs which I hope to get in the future, hopefully it won't be banned by the time I am able to acquire one.
    Cub Brother #10
    Waco Brother #221

  8. #83
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    RE: Do you think the FAA should be sticking its nose into our hobby?

    ORIGINAL: on_your_six
    Guys like you are exactly why we need regulations... why anyone would come on an open web site and make the incriminating statements you have made is beyond my comprehension. I do not know the circumstances, but I do invite you to never fly near me for any reason whatsoever.
    And curiously, he started out by saying:

    ORIGINAL: cublover ...if you see something unsafe or hear of a dummy doing something with a RC aircraft that could kill someone,,,,,here is an idea,,,,TURN THEM IN!!!
    Hello, operator? Could you please connect me with the Sparks, Nevada police department?

    Harvey
    Weather Geek

  9. #84
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    RE: Do you think the FAA should be sticking its nose into our hobby?


    ORIGINAL: H5487

    ORIGINAL: Desertlakesflying
    The government is not the answer in any case except what the government is granted in the Constitution.
    Actually, our Constitution charges the government with protecting its citizens.

    ORIGINAL: Desertlakesflying
    The government is already far to involved with every aspect of our lives, and need to get out of most of it.
    In a fantasy world where every person on the planet is respectful, fair, and considerate of everyone else, we wouldn't need a single law. However, in reality, it seems that damn near everyone is constantly trying to steal, rob, shaft, burn, coerce, manipulate, screw, injure, or kill everybody else. And those who are not doing so intentionally, are doing it through incompetance, irresponsibility, immaturity, or just a simple lack of common sense. Either way, something has to be done to try to protect society from those who would do us wrong, either intentionally or unintentionally. Hence, our ever-increasing number of laws.

    If you have a better way, we're all ears!

    Harvey
    Well said. Government is not the problem. A self-enlarging government given authority by a few fanatics scared by self-grandising anarchists is the problem.

  10. #85

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    RE: Do you think the FAA should be sticking its nose into our hobby?


    ORIGINAL: snurckle

    I'm not completely opposed to some sort of regulation- perhaps just one that states: All aero-modelers that participate in flying model aircraft larger than a 'park-flyer' are required to join and adhere to the rules, regulations and safety standards established by the AMA.

    If the FAA gets involved more that that- you will be required to have a license to operate an RC airplane. I'm not opposed to a license idea- but I am opposed to having to pay 100+ dollars to get one.

    [quote
    [/quote]


    What you stated seems to be more or less what is in the works that being if you fly larger models you will have to join the AMA.
    Ira d

  11. #86
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    RE: Do you think the FAA should be sticking its nose into our hobby?


    ORIGINAL: ira d


    ORIGINAL: snurckle

    I'm not completely opposed to some sort of regulation- perhaps just one that states: All aero-modelers that participate in flying model aircraft larger than a 'park-flyer' are required to join and adhere to the rules, regulations and safety standards established by the AMA.

    If the FAA gets involved more that that- you will be required to have a license to operate an RC airplane. I'm not opposed to a license idea- but I am opposed to having to pay 100+ dollars to get one.



    What you stated seems to be more or less what is in the works that being if you fly larger models you will have to join the AMA.
    Which isn't as bad as it sounds. If you can fork out a few thousand dollars for a sophisticated model, what is wrong with the cost of insurance to protect your bird?
    I think it's a pretty good solution, to be honest.

    "Any landing you can walk away from probably wasn't that exciting to watch"
    Sig Kadet Brotherhood #8

  12. #87

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    RE: Do you think the FAA should be sticking its nose into our hobby?

    Ever try to collect on AMA's insurance? It is not a primary plan. Especially for your plane,car,or boat. AMA is simply a magazine subscription and a ticket to fly. I encourage everyone to READ your AMA insurance documents closely.

    BTW....the cat joke is not funny and should be removed. Lots of things are funny when you are 13 but when you turn 18 they become crimes. It could also be that the person that posted this comment is older than 13 but just stated so in order to avoid reprimands?

    WAHOO's profile states 30 years operating and 30 years flying. That is a major accomplishment for only being "13". I would guess about 40 with the maturity of a 13 year old.

  13. #88

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    RE: Do you think the FAA should be sticking its nose into our hobby?


    ORIGINAL: H5487


    ORIGINAL: 804

    Right after you say this:'' There have been some good points brought out by both sides. Unfortunately, too few have shown a willingness to listen.
    2. Much like in an armed conflict, the ''enemy'' (in this case, the FAA) knows that it will enjoy an easy victory when it sees that its opposition is spending all of its energy fighting among themselves. ''

    Harvey

    you say this?
    ''Despite your intentions not to hurt anyone, you clearly and willfully showed a complete disregard for the AMA Safety Code AND the existing Federal Aviation Regulations regarding dropping potentially harmful objects from an aircraft (ANY aircraft). It appears to me that YOU are one of those malcontents who is now bringing the government down on the entire hobby.

    Thanks!''

    Harvey

    Wow!

    If you really want a laugh (or cry), think about how many folks have died as a result of
    full scale aviation just in the last year.

    And FAA wants to protect them from us???[:@]
    I'm not sure I understand your point. My first statement was an observation on the deeply polarizing nature of the subject and how the two sides were very opinionated in their beliefs, often to the point of refusing to listen to each other.

    Then this guy suddenly pops up out of the mist bragging about how he has been using his models to drop explosives. I accused him of thumbing his nose at the AMA Safety Codes and adding support to the arguement that modelers should be controlled.

    What is the connection that you're trying to make between my two statements?

    Harvey
    In one breath you are saying we should be open-minded and stick together as modelers (flyers),
    and in the next you (and others) are racking a guy over something you know nothing about as far as how he did it, where he did it.
    In reality, the airplane he was flying (and that all of us fly) could be potentially more dangerous
    than dropping some homemade firecrackers from it. And yet, model aviation has been and is a very statistically safe pastime.

    Don't you see the irony in that, and the fact FAA is trying to protect
    something (full-scale aviation) which kills hundreds of people a year
    from something (model aviation) which is safe?

    The point is that we (the modeling community) need to quit pointing the finger at each other.
    So far, large planes, small ones, fast ones, slow ones, whatever, have an exemplary safety record.
    In regard to the sentence I bolded, if we try hard enough , all of us can find something about the other guy's modeling pursuits we thing unsafe.

  14. #89
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    RE: Do you think the FAA should be sticking its nose into our hobby?

    ORIGINAL: 804
    ...In one breath you are saying we should be open-minded and stick together as modelers (flyers), and in the next you (and others) are racking a guy over something you know nothing about as far as how he did it, where he did it.
    My definition of open-minded doesn't include ignoring someone who has just bragged about doing something illegal, right in the middle of a discussion about how some modelers' flagrant disregard for the Safety Code are possibly responsible for bringing the FAA's eyes upon all of us. I don't have to know the details of how or why he did it, what color his aircraft was, or what type of clouds were in the sky that day. Dropping explosives (even if just a harmless little firecracker) from a model airplane is expressly forbidden by the AMA. There's no grey area here. He self-confessed that he did it so there's nothing that I, or the rest of us need to prove. He pronounced himself guilty. I see no reason to appologize for disapproving of an illegal act that he bragged about doing in a public forum.

    It's no wonder that the FAA is proposing legislation for tighter controls on us!

    Harvey
    Weather Geek

  15. #90

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    RE: Do you think the FAA should be sticking its nose into our hobby?


    ORIGINAL: H5487

    ORIGINAL: 804
    ...In one breath you are saying we should be open-minded and stick together as modelers (flyers), and in the next you (and others) are racking a guy over something you know nothing about as far as how he did it, where he did it.
    My definition of open-minded doesn't include ignoring someone who has just bragged about doing something illegal, right in the middle of a discussion about how some modelers' flagrant disregard for the Safety Code are possibly responsible for bringing the FAA's eyes upon all of us. I don't have to know the details of how or why he did it, what color his aircraft was, or what type of clouds were in the sky that day. Dropping explosives (even if just a harmless little firecracker) from a model airplane is expressly forbidden by the AMA. There's no grey area here. He self-confessed that he did it so there's nothing that I, or the rest of us need to prove. He pronounced himself guilty. I see no reason to appologize for disapproving of an illegal act that he bragged in a public forum about doing. It's no wonder that the FAA is proposing legislation for tighter controls on us!

    Harvey
    +1 [sm=thumbup.gif]
    HARRUMFFF Harvey!!!!!!

  16. #91
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    RE: Do you think the FAA should be sticking its nose into our hobby?


    ORIGINAL: H5487



    My definition of open-minded doesn't include ignoring someone who has just bragged about doing something illegal, right in the middle of a discussion about how some modelers' flagrant disregard for the Safety Code are possibly responsible for bringing the FAA's eyes upon all of us. I don't have to know the details of how or why he did it, what color his aircraft was, or what type of clouds were in the sky that day. Dropping explosives (even if just a harmless little firecracker) from a model airplane is expressly forbidden by the AMA. There's no grey area here. He self-confessed that he did it so there's nothing that I, or the rest of us need to prove. He pronounced himself guilty. I see no reason to appologize for disapproving of an illegal act that he bragged in a public forum about doing. It's no wonder that the FAA is proposing legislation for tighter controls on us!

    Harvey
    You do know AMA rules aren’t law...don’t you?

    Maybe there is an actual law in regards to dropping fireworks from models but I have never heard of it. Heck, I remember a funny TV show that depicted explosives on model trains... Back then everyone thought it funny...what has happened to us?
    It is very important to understand that Jesus not only died for our sins but died because of our sins...even harder to understand now, exactly what were those sins???

  17. #92
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    RE: Do you think the FAA should be sticking its nose into our hobby?


    ORIGINAL: Speedy-Gonzales
    +1 [sm=thumbup.gif]
    HARRUMFFF Harvey!!!!!!
    I take it that I'm not alone in this.

    Harvey
    Weather Geek

  18. #93
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    RE: Do you think the FAA should be sticking its nose into our hobby?

    ORIGINAL: littlecrankshaf
    You do know AMA rules aren’t law...don’t you?
    Yeah, I realize that but the FAA has acknowledged that the AMA Safety Code is a viable set of accepted standards that modelers should abide by in order to stay out of trouble. In addition, and possibly more certifying, AMA's rules are endorsed by AMA's insurance underwriter as go/no go criteria on whether a claimant's actions are covered.


    ORIGINAL: littlecrankshaf
    Heck, I remember a funny TV show that depicted explosives on model trains... Back then everyone thought it funny...what has happened to us?
    Yeah, that was the Adams Family. (You just admitted that you're as old as I am!) What has happened since then is that we have learned (the hard way) to take things more seriously because, sadly, the world just isn't the same as when you and I used to watch Leave It To Beaver on TV.

    Harvey
    Weather Geek

  19. #94

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    RE: Do you think the FAA should be sticking its nose into our hobby?


    ORIGINAL: H5487


    ORIGINAL: Speedy-Gonzales
    +1 [sm=thumbup.gif]
    HARRUMFFF Harvey!!!!!!
    I take it that I'm not alone in this.

    Harvey
    Bingo!!!!

  20. #95
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    RE: Do you think the FAA should be sticking its nose into our hobby?

    ORIGINAL: littlecrankshaf
    Maybe there is an actual law in regards to dropping fireworks from models but I have never heard of it.
    FAR91.13 (Careless or reckless operation) and FAR91.15 (Dropping of objects) are both aimed at full scale aircraft operations. However, if someone were to find themselves on the receiving end of an FAA court trial due to their operation of a model, especially if it resulted in a fatality to someone on the ground, I wouldn't be surprised if the two regs were used by the FAA's attorneys as supporting documentation. Remember, the jury will likely be composed of twelve people who won't differentiate whether the fatality was caused by a "real" airplane or "just a model" of one. All they will see is that the FAA, Supreme Regulator Almighty of all things that leave the ground, is the prosecutor.

    Stranger things have happened in a courtroom!

    Harvey
    Weather Geek

  21. #96

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    RE: Do you think the FAA should be sticking its nose into our hobby?

    There has always been an altitude restriction regarding model aircraft & rockets.

  22. #97

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    RE: Do you think the FAA should be sticking its nose into our hobby?

    My dear old Dad of 80 has some great old quotes from the past. Like this one:

    Christians vs. Lions at the Roman Colliseum

    "The Christians had a good coach but the lions ended up winning anyways!"

    These days it seems to be common sense vs. majority rules.

    I have learned that being a part of the majority does not necessarily mean you are right.

    Common sense and practical thinking have become a rarity when viewing the masses, thus the world we live in today.

    God Bless Texas!!!!

    SPEEDY

  23. #98
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    RE: Do you think the FAA should be sticking its nose into our hobby?


    ORIGINAL: jkpape

    There has always been an altitude restriction regarding model aircraft & rockets.
    AC91-57 specifies it as 400AGL but we all know that waivers are usually available as long as safety isn't compromised.

    Harvey
    Weather Geek

  24. #99

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    RE: Do you think the FAA should be sticking its nose into our hobby?


    ORIGINAL: H5487

    ORIGINAL: 804
    ...In one breath you are saying we should be open-minded and stick together as modelers (flyers), and in the next you (and others) are racking a guy over something you know nothing about as far as how he did it, where he did it.
    My definition of open-minded doesn't include ignoring someone who has just bragged about doing something illegal, right in the middle of a discussion about how some modelers' flagrant disregard for the Safety Code are possibly responsible for bringing the FAA's eyes upon all of us. I don't have to know the details of how or why he did it, what color his aircraft was, or what type of clouds were in the sky that day. Dropping explosives (even if just a harmless little firecracker) from a model airplane is expressly forbidden by the AMA. There's no grey area here. He self-confessed that he did it so there's nothing that I, or the rest of us need to prove. He pronounced himself guilty. I see no reason to appologize for disapproving of an illegal act that he bragged about doing in a public forum.

    It's no wonder that the FAA is proposing legislation for tighter controls on us!

    Harvey

    You are aware that AMA itself has for some years thumbed its nose at FAA's
    recommendation to fly under 400', correct?l

    So, while I personally have not seen any mention of "some modelers' flagrant disregard..."
    being the catalyst for this,
    I can imagine that AMA itself might have some 'splainin' to do.

    Earilier, as I quoted before, you said this:

    'Much like in an armed conflict, the ''enemy'' (in this case, the FAA) knows that it will enjoy an easy victory when it sees that its opposition is spending all of its energy fighting among themselves. ''

    Then, you go and start a thread that promises just that.
    I don't get it.

  25. #100
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    RE: Do you think the FAA should be sticking its nose into our hobby?

    ORIGINAL: 804
    Earilier, as I quoted before, you said this:

    'Much like in an armed conflict, the ''enemy'' (in this case, the FAA) knows that it will enjoy an easy victory when it sees that its opposition is spending all of its energy fighting among themselves. ''

    Then, you go and start a thread that promises just that.
    I don't get it.
    To be honest with you, I started the thread to see what the sentiment was amongst the modelers here. I had no idea that there were two strongly-opinionated sides who were ready to come out fighting. That being said, I am pleased that the responses/arguements have been mostly civil.

    At least for me, this thread has been both informative and entertaining.

    Harvey
    Weather Geek


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