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FAA Issues "Interpretation of the special rule for model aircraft"

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FAA Issues "Interpretation of the special rule for model aircraft"

Old 08-08-2014, 10:21 AM
  #701  
Propworn
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Originally Posted by bradpaul
A good example is fishing, here in Florida if you don't follow the rules you can have your fishing gear and even your boat confiscated by the game warden. Ignorance of the regulations is not a mitigating factor. That puts the burden of risk on the ignorant or idiotic and lets those that can follow the AMA safety code and Doc 550 free to enjoy the hobby.
I really like that. The really stupid have lost their hunting/fishing privileges, equipment, vehicles and even ended up with jail time. Ding the idiot on the spot, take his equipment and let the courts decide how stiff the punishment is.

Dennis
Old 08-08-2014, 10:30 AM
  #702  
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Originally Posted by bradpaul
Since our public schools teach "feel good" and self esteem building" rather then how to read and do math there is just no hope for "informing and educating" the operator(s) buyer(s) of these things"..... Idiots will be idiots. IMHO the best outcome is the use of large fines and confiscation of those that will not through either ignorance or deliberation don't follow AMA (CBO) rules.

A good example is fishing, here in Florida if you don't follow the rules you can have your fishing gear and even your boat confiscated by the game warden. Ignorance of the regulations is not a mitigating factor. That puts the burden of risk on the ignorant or idiotic and lets those that can follow the AMA safety code and Doc 550 free to enjoy the hobby.

I will take responsibility for my flying and as a Club Officer the flying at my AMA Club. Again IMHO the AMA should stick to educating AMA Members and Clubs and let the youtube morons and commercial sUAS flyers fend for themselves.


That ain't about to happen, Two reasons
1.The AMA being the only CBO they hope to swell their ranks.
Under 18 U can join the AMA for Free right now
2.The FAA can't stop anyone from doing anything till theymake
Specific FAR's to cover the the use of any and all sUAS
JMHO
Old 08-08-2014, 10:44 AM
  #703  
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Treating it like hunting or fishing license could work. The commercial operators would have their own licensing system with more stringent requirements. The FAA would be responsible to actively monitor this group.

The hobby group would fall into two categories. The AMA and everyone else. The AMA member needs not purchase a license as long as his AMA number is displayed on the craft. Those who do not want to belong to the AMA need purchase a license for a nominal fee and display that number on their craft. One license would suffice for multiple craft as long as the number is displayed. Like the fishing regulations the hobby UAS/UAV/FPV regulations would be available to the person purchasing a license. Like the fishing regs reading, understanding and abiding by the regulations is the operator’s responsibility.

Federal, state and local authorities could apply the confiscation and/or charges for violations.

Hey Bradpaul you not just another pretty face are ya? Good Idea!!!!

Dennis

Last edited by Propworn; 08-08-2014 at 10:46 AM.
Old 08-08-2014, 01:51 PM
  #704  
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Originally Posted by DocYates
Meanwhile, there are guys out there like this punk who are intentionally atagonizing the police, flying in an obvious restricted area, and then plastering it all over the internet for people to see, all the while claiming their "civil rights" are being violated. The only thing that would make this better would have been for the cops to jump the fence and beat down his punk friend who continues to mouth off to the officer who is only doing his job.....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XGtqVLMGV74#t=1441
Yeah, this guy is an idiot. He has NO IDEA what he is talking about. He did get sited for the correct ordinance. It is guys just like him in the video that don't know his bunghole from a hole in the ground and could care less about model aviation. He only cares to fly his gopro around.

.....Shocked that the LAPD just did not beat him into submission..........
Old 08-19-2014, 08:38 AM
  #705  
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From and including: Monday, June 23, 2014 Start date of Thread
To, but not including Friday, August 8, 2014 Last comment before 9 day lull

[h=2]Result: 46 days of life for this thread.[/h]It is 46 days from the start date to the end date, but not including the end date
Or 1 month, 16 days excluding the end date


How quickly things evaporate in this world.Then 9 days of silence ...
Guess it wasn't much of a discussion anyway.
Old 08-19-2014, 09:19 AM
  #706  
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Originally Posted by HoundDog

XXXX
That ain't about to happen, Two reasons
1.The AMA being the only CBO they hope to swell their ranks.

JMHO
Hound Dog, I need your help. I keep hearing about AMA being the "Community Based Organization" for model aviation.

Now while the FAA and AMA signed some paper last January, 2014, that has the subject of an "...Understanding..." I have yet to find any designation that the Academy of Model Aeronautics has been KNIGHTED with any blessed governmental power of "Community Based Organization for Model Aviation throughout the United States and its holdings, territories, etc."

If you please, I would be very much indebted to you for your kind assistance and knowledge if you care to share your information, or the source of said information.

Many Thanks

Hoss!
Old 08-19-2014, 10:27 AM
  #707  
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Originally Posted by Hossfly
Hound Dog, I need your help. I keep hearing about AMA being the "Community Based Organization" for model aviation.

Now while the FAA and AMA signed some paper last January, 2014, that has the subject of an "...Understanding..." I have yet to find any designation that the Academy of Model Aeronautics has been KNIGHTED with any blessed governmental power of "Community Based Organization for Model Aviation throughout the United States and its holdings, territories, etc."

If you please, I would be very much indebted to you for your kind assistance and knowledge if you care to share your information, or the source of said information.

Many Thanks

Hoss!
The President's Perspective in the September issue of MA says what you are saying ,Hoss. Apparently the FAA is lagging on producing an official recognition of teh AMA as a CBO, although the FAA Official Interpretation of section 336 alludes to AMA as a CBO without naming it. The allusion indirectly acknowledges the AMA policy on aircraft over 55 Lbs.
Old 08-19-2014, 10:37 AM
  #708  
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Originally Posted by Hossfly
Hound Dog, I need your help. I keep hearing about AMA being the "Community Based Organization" for model aviation.

Now while the FAA and AMA signed some paper last January, 2014, that has the subject of an "...Understanding..." I have yet to find any designation that the Academy of Model Aeronautics has been KNIGHTED with any blessed governmental power of "Community Based Organization for Model Aviation throughout the United States and its holdings, territories, etc."

If you please, I would be very much indebted to you for your kind assistance and knowledge if you care to share your information, or the source of said information.

Many Thanks

Hoss!
i don't believe the AMA has been knighted, but certainly they are the experts on the matter no? Do you know of any other group or organization that is working with any government agency on these issues? Any other group that has the ability to help shape and form policy (within reason and ability)? Any other entity that has the funding, knowledge, or vested interest in protecting/advancing the hobby?
Old 08-19-2014, 11:07 AM
  #709  
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It turns out that the 5 mile "rule" may eventually impact one of our club's fields.
There are two private strips about 4.5 miles away. No "services" or communications exist at the private fields,
and they are seldom used.
Old 08-19-2014, 11:32 AM
  #710  
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I would like to pass along a link that I was just made aware of. This appears on the FAA web site.

http://www.faa.gov/uas/publications/...aft_operators/

Seems pretty reasonable and straightforward to me in the context of our club and our flying field. If this remains the FAA’s guidance about model aircraft, I am fine with it. But I hope AMA will keep a close eye on them.

Note that near the bottom of the page is a link to the AMA home page. Interesting.

There is a clause about flying within 5 miles of an airport. Based on what that says, a letter to an airport informing them that a model aviation flying field exists and where it is would seem to be enough to meet the requirement. Doesn’t imply need for permission. Of course if the airport wanted you to not fly then it might create an issue, but I don’t know how that would be addressed.




Last edited by aeajr; 08-20-2014 at 12:52 PM.
Old 08-19-2014, 12:02 PM
  #711  
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Why should the AMA be "knighted" as a Community Based Organization? Wouldn't it make better sense if that task was given to the local clubs and fields? The AMA is not community based. It is an insurance company, which is only trying to seek other markets that could generate more revenue (commercial drones, for example). I think the FAA really needs to further define what a CBO really is.
Old 08-19-2014, 12:20 PM
  #712  
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Why? Because the AMA IS a community based organization. And, it just happens to be the ONLY community based organization that has spent over $1M working with the FAA and Congress on behalf of model aviation. What they have accomplished is amazing.

Now, if your local club would like to spend time and money to work with the FAA to become a recognized community based organization I don't think anyone is going to stop them. I, for one, would be interested to know what your local club has done to date, working with the FAA and Congress to help protect the model aviation community from over regulation. What AMA has done is huge and well documented.

And, BTW, the AMA is NOT an insurance company, they buy insurance from an insurance company on behalf of the members to get us the lowest rates possible. I suggest you do a little more research.
Old 08-19-2014, 12:24 PM
  #713  
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Originally Posted by aeajr
Why? Because the AMA IS a community based organization. And, it just happens to be the ONLY community based organization that has spent over $1M working with the FAA and Congress on behalf of model aviation. What they have accomplished is amazing.
Would you please cite a few specific examples of what has been accomplished? I just can't put my finger on it..............
Old 08-19-2014, 12:50 PM
  #714  
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Originally Posted by aeajr
I would like to pass along a link that I was just made aware of. This appears on the FAA web site.

http://www.faa.gov/uas/publications/model_aircraft_operators/

Seems pretty reasonable and straightforward to me in the context of our club and our flying field. If this remains the FAA’s guidance about model aircraft, I am fine with it. But I hope AMA will keep a close eye on them.

Note that near the bottom of the page is a link to the AMA home page. Interesting.
It would seem to be an indirect (rather passive aggressive to me) recognition of the AMA as a CBO.

Originally Posted by aeajr
There is a clause about flying within 5 miles of an airport. Based on what that says, a letter to an airport informing them that a model aviation flying field exists and where it is would seem to be enough to meet the requirement. Doesn’t imply need for permission. Of course if the airport wanted you to not fly then it might create an issue, but I don’t know how that would be addressed.
The problem remains, and it is a legitimate concern, that if the airport does not want you to fly nearby then they can and will put a stop to it, one way or another. So you still need a reply from the airport granting permission or you can't fly.
Old 08-19-2014, 02:02 PM
  #715  
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Originally Posted by aeajr
Why? Because the AMA IS a community based organization. And, it just happens to be the ONLY community based organization that has spent over $1M working with the FAA and Congress on behalf of model aviation. What they have accomplished is amazing.
Then, You, aeajr, can inform me just who and when this contract by some designated governmental authority placed the recognition of being the only (or any) Community Based Organization over model aviation.
I have never been concerned that AMA was simply a provider for a commercial insurance company to make said insurance available to the members of AMA. We AMA members went through a lot of work to get that insurance coverage back in the late '60s and early '70s. It pretty much saved RC as they became able to cope with places to fly.
Old 08-19-2014, 02:20 PM
  #716  
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Originally Posted by NorfolkSouthern
Why should the AMA be "knighted" as a Community Based Organization? Wouldn't it make better sense if that task was given to the local clubs and fields? The AMA is not community based. It is an insurance company, which is only trying to seek other markets that could generate more revenue (commercial drones, for example). I think the FAA really needs to further define what a CBO really is.
Just to set the record straight, the AMA has an outside insurance underwriter.

CR
Old 08-19-2014, 04:53 PM
  #717  
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CBO = Congresional Budget Office ? Yes?
Old 08-19-2014, 05:45 PM
  #718  
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Originally Posted by chuckk2
It turns out that the 5 mile "rule" may eventually impact one of our club's fields.
There are two private strips about 4.5 miles away. No "services" or communications exist at the private fields,
and they are seldom used.
All the more reason to track down the owners and have a friendly chat. Invite them to the field for a show and tell. Being proactive never hurts and you may find it is not an issue and because you were respectful enough to contact them it never will become an issue.

Worked for our club and we are a lot closer than three miles.
Old 08-19-2014, 06:59 PM
  #719  
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Originally Posted by Charley
Just to set the record straight, the AMA has an outside insurance underwriter.

CR
Shhhh, Charley, the program has changed and y'all need to get with it.

Marketing/Membership heading, Apr 6, '14 EC meeting minutes:

"G. Fitch reported the department/committee has developed some new marketing pieces. The project plan includes: marketing in print magazines, especially in non-AMA publications; buying key words with Google; sending pro-rate advertising emails to new members and sending renewal emails to current members. They are also trying to engage the youth since the conversion rate for a Youth member to an Open member is quite low. Marketing and IT are developing a program for this and it is expected emails will be going out September 14.

Council viewed a brochure handout that lists why a person needs to belong to the AMA. These will be distributed at trade shows and going out as part of the Point of Purchase displays with the hobby shop program. (If any Council members wants a supply of these they should contact Erin Dobbs Headquarters.)

One of the things learned from the MCA survey is that even though AMA has been passive about talking about insurance in the past, members perceive it as one of the number one benefits we provide to our members so we should laud it.
"

Now then if AMA is going to laud it, it wouldn't be righteous to credit an outside company for making it happen, would it? Nearly all liability claims are paid from AMA coffers anyway (IOW AMA is for all practical purposes the underwriter), and it's no longer in the game plan to deny it.
Old 08-20-2014, 04:15 AM
  #720  
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For those who are uninformed about the efforts AMA has put forth around government relations over the past few years I would point you to the AMA government relations blog. If you are really interested, I am sure you will find this very informative.
http://amablog.modelaircraft.org/amagov/

AMA has a long history of advocating for the model aviation community with the FAA and the FCC. It was partially through the efforts of AMA that we have had designated frequencies for flying over the years.

For those who are AMA members, supporting this good work, thanks. Because of you I can enjoy model aviation, have a great flying field and have someone keeping an eye on the government for me.

For those who are not AMA members, you might consider joining and supporting and adding your voice and your dollars to the effort to protect our ability to fly recreational model aircraft with relatively little federal government interference.

Last edited by aeajr; 08-20-2014 at 05:27 AM.
Old 08-20-2014, 05:07 AM
  #721  
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Originally Posted by aeajr
For those who are uninformed about the efforts AMA has put forth around government relations over the past few years I would point you to the AMA government relations blog. If you are really interested, I am sure you will find this very informative.
http://amablog.modelaircraft.org/amagov/

AMA has a long history of advocating for the model aviation community with the FAA and the FCC. I was partially through the efforts of AMA that we have had designated frequencies for flying over the years.

For those who are AMA members, supporting this good work, thanks. Because of you I can enjoy model aviation, have a great flying field and have someone keeping an eye on the government for me.

For those who are not AMA members, you might consider joining and supporting and adding your voice and your dollars to the effort to protect our ability to fly recreational model aircraft with relatively little federal government interference.
Well said!!!!!
Old 08-20-2014, 06:38 AM
  #722  
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Originally Posted by aeajr
For those who are uninformed about the efforts AMA has put forth around government relations over the past few years I would point you to the AMA government relations blog. If you are really interested, I am sure you will find this very informative.
http://amablog.modelaircraft.org/amagov/

AMA has a long history of advocating for the model aviation community with the FAA and the FCC. It was partially through the efforts of AMA that we have had designated frequencies for flying over the years.

For those who are AMA members, supporting this good work, thanks. Because of you I can enjoy model aviation, have a great flying field and have someone keeping an eye on the government for me.

For those who are not AMA members, you might consider joining and supporting and adding your voice and your dollars to the effort to protect our ability to fly recreational model aircraft with relatively little federal government interference.
Nothing like having a moderator with an obvious political bias weighing in.

Anyway... as for as the radio frequency stuff goes...I hear tell it was Hoss that met with the FCC in a dark, smoke filled room to administer a bribe of $10,000 to an agent of the FCC, and that bribe instantly saved us all, if my memory serves... Heck, maybe ole Hoss will weigh in and give us a refresher for old times sake.
Old 08-20-2014, 06:55 AM
  #723  
porcia83
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Originally Posted by littlecrankshaf
".......Nothing like having a moderator with an obvious political bias weighing in.

....
Or from another party with a well established disdain for the organization...?

His status as a moderator is completely irrelevant, so why mention it?
Old 08-20-2014, 06:59 AM
  #724  
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Originally Posted by aeajr
For those who are uninformed about the efforts AMA has put forth around government relations over the past few years I would point you to the AMA government relations blog. If you are really interested, I am sure you will find this very informative.
http://amablog.modelaircraft.org/amagov/

AMA has a long history of advocating for the model aviation community with the FAA and the FCC. It was partially through the efforts of AMA that we have had designated frequencies for flying over the years.

For those who are AMA members, supporting this good work, thanks. Because of you I can enjoy model aviation, have a great flying field and have someone keeping an eye on the government for me.

For those who are not AMA members, you might consider joining and supporting and adding your voice and your dollars to the effort to protect our ability to fly recreational model aircraft with relatively little federal government interference.
+10. Not a perfect organization (then again, who is), but clearly the only organization with the ability to deal with this issue.
Old 08-20-2014, 07:01 AM
  #725  
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Originally Posted by porcia83
Or from another party with a well established disdain for the organization...?

His status as a moderator is completely irrelevant, so why mention it?
Disdain for AMA??? AMA is an organization comprised of many people...some pretty bright...some blindly following the guy ahead of them. I will accept I have disdain for some of those that can't distinguish the difference...But AMA as an organization, trying to do what was once their goal is a great thing... Too many lost soles in the way now. Move over, please?

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