JohnShe

Like I said, strange. You can't mean the AMA as their member handbook, with safety guidelines, is online for all to see, both members and nonmembers.

cj_rumley

John, you really ought to have look at the AMA EC minutes that are posted quarterly. Not timely, a couple of months after the EC has acted on any issues, and often cryptic, but still provides members with the only hints they will get as what the EC is up to.

One of many mentions of the safety material I alluded to and action taken to protect it as proprietary intellectual property is under ED's report in the Jan '13 minutes, not to mention the minutes of the latest meeting that I have already referred you to in the course of this thread.

JohnShe

Nevertheless, the member Handbook is free to all comers. So what's your point?

Bob Pastorello

My Feedback: (198)

:\\

JohnShe

Well, maybe you should burn your membership card.

Bob Pastorello

My Feedback: (198)

Probably like thousands of others perhaps, the insurance coverage (even though "additional") is too affordable to give up.
If there was an alternative insurance source, I probably would.

bradpaul

I thought the minutes of the last EC meeting were very informative........ of course you need to read between the lines........ there does seem to be a very real split in the EC over just what to do about FPV from get into the insurance business for "light commercial" to some comments to have nothing to do with it.

Here is a link to the minutes. http://www.modelaircraft.org/aboutam...ecminutes.aspx

cj_rumley

My point was to answer your question, but it appears that is in and of itself pointless.

Sport_Pilot

I don't recall the AMA selling copies of their rules, or dissallowing others to copy them, so his accusation is vague to say the least.

Sport_Pilot

What did you answer? That they discussed the possibility of protecting the material in the safety handbook? So what? It is free for all to use so obviously nothing has yet changed. Or perhaps they discussed some new safety issue that we yet know nothing about. But if we know nothing about it, how can one say it is unetical. Without details you are just spitting in the wind. Hurting nobody but yourself.

phlpsfrnk

I do not understand what your beef is. Copyrighting material that is created and published by an organization does not mean it is "hidden". It just means that no one else can take that same published material and call it their own. The material is still available to the public. As a paying member of an organization I would think you would want your investment in the organization protected. Except for the costs involved it would make sence to copyright all of an organizations published material.

Frank

cj_rumley

You're a leader member. Have you seen it?

littlecrankshaf

My Feedback: (58)

CJ, are you referring to the so called "standards" that the AMA hopes to use to be crowned the CBO?

phlpsfrnk

If the "it" you are refering to is the Jan 2013 minutes (see link) then yes.

http://www.modelaircraft.org/aboutam...ecminutes.aspx

Frank

cj_rumley

Well yeah, Frank. That's what I said, referring to safety material discussed therein that was presented to FAA, but AFAIK never disclosed to the membership.

Am I the only one that sees a pitch about standards AMA aka CBO wannabe members are claimed to abide by, though they have never seen them, as "imaginative" to excess?

cj

phlpsfrnk

Snip from minutes;

Mathewson passed around a document that was put together by HQ staff. At the beginning of the year AMA presented its support materials in request for the FAA to recognize AMA as a Community Based Organization (CBO). That included the safety program that Council saw at the October 2012 meeting and another book that was an effort of R. Hanson’s team and the AMA Staff. Putting this book together turned into a 2-week project and Mathewson recognized Chris Savage for his working nights and weekends, including Christmas Eve and Christmas, so AMA could have the book to the FAA before the end of the year (2012). Once the book is finalized each Council member will receive a copy.

If I read this correctly this book/manual/document that was put together is nothing more than a collection of all the AMA's documents that have anything to do with safety encluding the latest 550 doc presented in Oct. This collection of published material was being used as justification to be declared a CBO by the FAA. Is this what you have a "moral" issue with?

Frank

cj_rumley

And there is more in the Oct '12 minutes about it and the need to keep it from members, blah, blah........
This has been a real diversion from the topic of this thread. I have abetted that, and apologize to forum members interested in the title topic and of course to RCKen for trying his patience.
If you want to continue this discussion, suggest that you start another thread, or take it offline via PM...........my interest in it is wearing down, but I'd be amenable to discussing it further in the interest of coming into an understanding with you, even if that leads only to an agreement to disagree.

cj

radfordc

My Feedback: (14)

Yep...I would say you are. Is you're tin foil hat adjusted properly?

radfordc

My Feedback: (14)

To be clear, the context is that it shouldn't be released until it is finished so as to not create confusion by releasing a working document that hasn't been properly staffed. This is just good basic staff work.

Here's a quote: "Hanson reiterated that there is nothing new in the Safety Program. Its’ entire contents can be pulled from documents from the website right now; it was just put into a single package."