Charley

My Feedback: (2)

Whoa! You don't know any more about the program than you did before Hoss's post. You kow only how the $$ were split up. Wait 'til we know more before wanting to pillory the EC.

CR

eddieC

My Feedback: (2)

Amazing. How is spending $250K on an unknown program OK? Better to stop it now and let the membership make an informed decision based on whatever merits it has. The EC at this point seems to think we're incapable of such lofty concepts.

Luchnia

My Feedback: (21)

The AMA is much like our "brilliant" government. They "got your back" and know what is best and are looking out for YOU. They KNOW what is best with YOUR money.

So maintaining our insurance and getting a mag is not enough? The troubling thing is, most of the clubs require you to be an AMA member so you are sort of in a corner with this whole thing. You fly RC at most clubs you WILL be an AMA member which to me is perplexing as well.

I am not sure I would have joined the AMA had the local clubs not required it.That does not mean I would not have, just don't know really if I had of had other options. The insurance is the only real appeal to me. The rest of the "fluff" is not something I am into.

This is a time when I would love to see some competition for these organizations. It is like a merry-go-round with all the FPV and something new at every turn to get folks riled up. Read like US government to you?

Propworn

My Feedback: (3)

Unlike a hunting or fishing license you do have a choice. Find your own space to fly from and you can even purchase your own insurance. I don't understand why it is that there is a perception of entitlement. "Why am I not entitled to enjoy all the benefits even though I don't want to join?" It rates right up there with someone who thinks they should be allowed to trespass on private property to fly without paying membership or contributing to all the hard work and effort all those before him have invested.

Dennis

Charley

My Feedback: (2)

It's unknown to us but not to the EC. Obviously opinions differ, even there. I'm waiting to learn more.

CR

bradpaul

I am also waiting to hear more before deciding if I oppose the spending. However for those that are not willing to wait:

AMA Bi Laws
So if your DVP noted NO give him a reason to bring the subject back up by having a petition with a lot of AMA member signatures.

Luchnia

My Feedback: (21)

I think you made a great point yet that is not entirely my take on it. I realize I have a choice and can fly on land I buy or buy my own insurance. Choices are limited for me though. There are no fields around my area that are not AMA only fields. I don't consider my thoughts a perception of entitlement so much as they are just my options here where I live. I don't expect to enjoy the benefits without joining, yet I wish there were viable options for me without shelling out a fortune for land. I don't desire to purchase enough land to fly on at this time so I take the option of joining some local clubs.

I re-read my post and I guess my post comes across like an AMA basher. I do think the organization has a huge amount of good behind it, the insurance is a plus to have, and right now it is the best option for me. I do wish they had competition. Again, not sure I would have joined had the local club not required it.

AlW

My Feedback: (17)

Getting this item on the agenda will not accomplish much. Remember that the AMA has been working this stuff ''under the radar''for the last seven or eight months and the next Executive meeting is a couple of months away. The membership has a great opportunity to let it's feelings be heard at the upcoming election and make this a campaign issue. We know which members of the council voted "yes'' so let's begin by making sure that none of these individuals get re-elected and then move on from there. Brown needs to get the message that he ''WORKS FOR US'' and that his turn is coming.

cj_rumley

Luchnia, you made a good point too, relevant to this thread. The condition of having to join AMA in order to join a club and use a flying site is essential to AMA revenue flow. The business plan (the only one AMA knows) only works where a needed resource like an improved, fixed base R/C flying site is scarce and needs organization like a club and cost-sharing for most of us to reasonably afford. Previous marketing ventures by AMA, e.g., PPP, have failed miserably where the modelers generally do have other choices of where to fly. That is why this venture, in conflict with the interest of modelers to maintain separation from public/commercial users and so avoid regulation and a substantial drain on resources of our organization, will fail. Unless their is some segment of the sUAS market that wants or needs a model flying site that I don't know about............AUVSI predicts about 75% of sUAS will be employed in the ag business. What do farmers want with AMA chartered club sites? They have plenty of land to fly over, with purpose.

Luchnia

My Feedback: (21)

Interesting prediction and appreciate your insight into this. You know when FPV first started getting momentum, I told my wife that I believe these would be an invaluable resource for agriculture industry and huge to the farmers, especially the large mid west farms where they have to buy expensive helicopters, small aircraft, or run vehicles across the land to check their fence-lines, herds, crop conditions, and so forth. Can you imagine how much money would be saved for a farmer with an FPV verses a full sized heli?

Agreed, what do farmers want with AMA club sites, or even the AMA period unless there was some benefit that farmers could realize from the AMA? Right off-hand, I cannot think of what that benefit might be and AMA being a modeler's org would not be in the agriculture playing field.

Farmers are mostly self supporting self sufficient type of group. Farmers have gotten together many times and formed their own business coops like feed, insurance, ag equipment, workman's comp, etc. and saved millions in doing so. That probably made some orgs unhappy that they could not cash in on part of the farmer's pay band. Unfortunately RCers just don't have this type of financial power.

I wait to see what the 250k deal is all about and I expect we will find out more as it moves forward. It would be interesting to poll how many people given the choice of a club without AMA verses a club with AMA - which one they would join? An example might be club A is not AMA but has a small insurance fee added to the yearly dues and club B is AMA and you pay club fees and AMA fees. Some have said annual insurance fees would be as much as AMA dues. I have never checked but that could be substantial in the decision making piece.

bradpaul

Sorry to inform you, but in the upcoming 2014 election there are three DVP slots up and all three (III, VII and XI) all voted against the spending. The only real race with potential to change something is for EVP, with Gary Fitch (incumbent) vs Horrace Crain. The only possible way to change the outcome is a petition to revisit the issue.

DIII

AlW

My Feedback: (17)

OK - you are absolutely correct. We all get to vote for the EVP so lets get Horrace Cain elected.

eddieC

My Feedback: (2)

It's sad that some take a 'wait-and-see' attitude with regards to spending, and don't care about what the spending is really for.

I personally don't give a hoot whether farmers need FPV, quads, sUAS/UAVs, or what seems to be the next big trend. Our monies have no business being spent on sketchy research or training, especially where there may be a clear conflict of interest.

It might be a good time to revisit the bylaws with regards to a 3-5 year moratorium on AMA management or council working in the industry where they affected industry laws or legislation.

Hossfly

AIW, I like your way of thinking. On the other hand, my work will consist of informing the AMA membership on all items, then doing what the majority wants, or what is definitely the best road for AMA overall to take. That majority is the folks that let me know their preferences on any subject, and sends me that preference. Now I will have to do the bidding of those that direct me to the thinking of any majority, yet if it so happens that I am subject to using my many years of AMA to do what I surmise as the best overall direction for AMA to take, then that bridge will be crossed when I get to it. I do not profess to be either a know-it-all or be the better individual or anywhere near the smartest. My strength is in my long time of being involved in Aero-Modeling, all types, and the AMA for many years, ( CD 1963, and Leader 1964) and having watched many individuals work to steer AMA into their personal direction. If I should do that, then you should send me on another way, all by myself.

Thanks much for your push!

bradpaul

Hoss for what it is worth after a lot of let's say not being in total agreement, you have my vote for EVP and I will even try to get Red to vote for you............................................... .. The "managers" and "bureaucrats" that need to have a "consultant" tell them what to do have to go...............................

kurt2022

My Feedback: (18)

I think the AMA should not walk away from the drones, they should run!!! The AMA should be line of sight only, some other group (their own) can deal with all the riff-raff that FPV flying will be BURDENED with!!!

Tony Iannucelli

My Feedback: (193)

A quarter of a million is not much compared to the salaries and perks of AMA employees. Several years ago I wrote the executive director and asked what percentage of dues and other income went for salaries and related expenses. The answer was several million dollars a year, and over 50 percent of income. I actually think the percentage was higher than that, but can't remember exactly. The history of "our" organization has a very interesting past if you want to go way back to the 1970's and Reston, Virginia. The Sport Fliers Association lawsuit is a particularly interesting chapter. As another person has already pointed out, if you're in a club, there really isn't much choice regarding membership.

Luchnia

My Feedback: (21)

This is exactly why there needs to be competition to the AMA. You know when you are the ONLY BIG dog on the block who will reason with you? AMA is in a position to do whatever it pleases on the backs of the membership and folks like me just hope they do the best thing. I am one of many I am sure that simply does not have the time to make what the AMA does consume large blocks of my time.

This is much like what we have with government. The average citizen going through the daily grind simply cannot fight it and accept what comes down the pike. We hope our elected officials do what is right, yet we find that the large majority are corrupted in one way or another. Believe it or not I get most of my information from the forums and this is NOT the best way to obtain info. I know it is sad, but I cannot spend my time researching all the things that the AMA does. I would go broke quickly and RC planes would be the last thing on my mind.

I love flying RC and it is one of my favorite things I have ever done and at my age it fits perfectly for me. It is basically my only hobby at this time so these things are important to folks like me because a lot of what this "lone" AMA organization does means something to me - a concerned fellow RCer. Yes, so it is important that 250 grand is spent the way the majority of membership decides and not wastefully because two or three "good old boys" decide how it should be spent. I may buy that land after all and build my own field.

Charley

My Feedback: (2)

I believe that what we need is term limits for VPs & president. Too many EC members have been around for too many years. Once they get in it's almost impossible to unseat them; they've seen to that through the nominating process. Take Bob Brown for instance; he was D III VP for many terms & now he's prez.

CR

Hossfly

Hello Charley: Not really disagreeing with you, yet for consideration, isn't that what the VOTERS are supposed to do? The fact that voters fail to accomplish their true duty and remove the bad guys/gals, IMO, is the real problem. If the voters performed their duty, then the incumbent would think, "If I don't do a good job, then, whamo, I'm gone." Once Term Limits are the law, the incumbent will only think, "I only have XXX years, I have to get mine while I can!" THE TOTAL RESPONSIBILITY RESTS STRICTLY IN THE LAP OF THE VOTERS! Therefore, if one really wishes to make a change then that one needs to get out and inform the public as he sees, and work to get the right person into the elective position. Unfortunately that seldom happens. Can we ever MAKE it happen? We could do so, yet I am not holding my breath.

bradpaul

Term Limits??????? You mean these that already exist in the AMA Bi-laws??????
I also note that in two of the three DVP elections in 2014 that the candidates are unopposed. It is all well and good to be dissatisfied with AMA Officers, but put the blame where it belongs on a membership that does not vote and does not put themselves forward for election.

GerKonig

I agree with you, the problem is: How many people really vote? What percentage of AMA members actually vote?


gerry

Charley

My Feedback: (2)

How many time have you been nominated but didn't get on the ballot? How about when Hanson got on the ballot for District X and a popular former VP was left off?

CR

Hossfly

I have been nominated twice when I failed to get on the ballot.

#1 1981 for the 1982 race as DVP for Dist VI. I won that race by a write-in vote of the AMA District VI AMA members which were satisfied with my work.
Said works included the final operation that convinced the FCC to finally give AMA the new 72mhz frequencies after stalling for months. It took me 2 weeks to provide
what some others were doing for 2 years.

#2 was the previous election 2011 for EVP. The current incumbent won over 2 other favored individuals. I was not on that ballot. One of those favored individuals
was nominated this year but pulled out before the selection.

I was on the ballot a couple times for D-VIII VP, but failed election. There is no argument that I am not a yes-man to anyone other than those that are truly working for model aviation. When the membership leans to Mr. Smiley rather than AMA and Member needs, well that is their problem.

As for Hanson, those were the days when I went to Phoneix, AZ almost each year for Warbird Pylon Racing. I spoke several times with Rich about he should run for VP of Dist.-10. Look where he is now.

Thanks Charley, for this discussion, and review.

Charley

My Feedback: (2)

[QUOTE=Hossfly;11860728]I have been nominated twice when I failed to get on the ballot.

Rich was prexy of SWRA when I ran a couple of races at Horizon City, TX (El Paso area). That's where I met him. Nothing wrong with Rich, I like him. He's a born politician.
Just pointing out that the nominating process & committee needs overhaul.

Enough, we're OT.

CR