Another "Drone" incident in the news... , mostlikely non AMA member
09-01-2014, 12:55 PM
#101
Senior Member
Given the massive sales of copters with cameras and, maybe, FPV as well. I would argue that a small percentage have been bought by AMA members.
http://kxan.com/2014/08/31/ut-police...-use-over-dkr/
Here is a report of another incident.
http://kxan.com/2014/08/31/ut-police...-use-over-dkr/
Here is a report of another incident.
Last edited by Jim Thomerson; 09-01-2014 at 12:58 PM.
09-01-2014, 12:56 PM
#102
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09-01-2014, 12:57 PM
#103
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09-01-2014, 03:54 PM
#104
The majority of us, I would contend are only AMA members because we need it to be a member of our clubs, and also to enter at the events we fly at. The insurance is somwhat of a second thought by and large. Especially considering the small chance of an accident.
The FPV guys may be AMA members, but only in so far as they need it to be a member of a club that has a runway for the models that they have that require one.
The AMA needs to separate themselves from this FPV/UAV faction of this hobby as quickly as possible, otherwise we we all be lumped in with them. Then we all lose.
The FPV guys may be AMA members, but only in so far as they need it to be a member of a club that has a runway for the models that they have that require one.
The AMA needs to separate themselves from this FPV/UAV faction of this hobby as quickly as possible, otherwise we we all be lumped in with them. Then we all lose.
09-01-2014, 04:31 PM
#105
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The majority of us, I would contend are only AMA members because we need it to be a member of our clubs, and also to enter at the events we fly at. The insurance is somwhat of a second thought by and large. Especially considering the small chance of an accident.
The FPV guys may be AMA members, but only in so far as they need it to be a member of a club that has a runway for the models that they have that require one.
The AMA needs to separate themselves from this FPV/UAV faction of this hobby as quickly as possible, otherwise we we all be lumped in with them. Then we all lose.
The FPV guys may be AMA members, but only in so far as they need it to be a member of a club that has a runway for the models that they have that require one.
The AMA needs to separate themselves from this FPV/UAV faction of this hobby as quickly as possible, otherwise we we all be lumped in with them. Then we all lose.
09-01-2014, 04:40 PM
#106
If you want R/C as we know it to be under the same microscope as the FPV aircraft you are crazy! They are not the same thing. A runway is not required, and hence they can fly from anywhere. The main reason why I am a member of a club is I need the runway.
It has been my experience that the FPV pilots tend to be rouge by nature, so no rules matter at all. The FPV crowd can go and do the things they need to to preserve their own hobby, but it has nothing to do with mine. They are not related to what we do in any way, other than the fat that radio signals are used to control them. The general public will have no idea of the differences between our disciplines, and this whole can of worms could cost us our ability to fly.
This is a very touchy time for our hobby right now. The AMA is turning into a political action organization much like the NRA. Except we do not have a constitutional right here. It could be shot down very easily.
It has been my experience that the FPV pilots tend to be rouge by nature, so no rules matter at all. The FPV crowd can go and do the things they need to to preserve their own hobby, but it has nothing to do with mine. They are not related to what we do in any way, other than the fat that radio signals are used to control them. The general public will have no idea of the differences between our disciplines, and this whole can of worms could cost us our ability to fly.
This is a very touchy time for our hobby right now. The AMA is turning into a political action organization much like the NRA. Except we do not have a constitutional right here. It could be shot down very easily.
09-01-2014, 04:54 PM
#107
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If you want R/C as we know it to be under the same microscope as the FPV aircraft you are crazy! They are not the same thing. A runway is not required, and hence they can fly from anywhere. The main reason why I am a member of a club is I need the runway.
It has been my experience that the FPV pilots tend to be rouge by nature, so no rules matter at all. The FPV crowd can go and do the things they need to to preserve their own hobby, but it has nothing to do with mine. They are not related to what we do in any way, other than the fat that radio signals are used to control them. The general public will have no idea of the differences between our disciplines, and this whole can of worms could cost us our ability to fly.
This is a very touchy time for our hobby right now. The AMA is turning into a political action organization much like the NRA. Except we do not have a constitutional right here. It could be shot down very easily.
It has been my experience that the FPV pilots tend to be rouge by nature, so no rules matter at all. The FPV crowd can go and do the things they need to to preserve their own hobby, but it has nothing to do with mine. They are not related to what we do in any way, other than the fat that radio signals are used to control them. The general public will have no idea of the differences between our disciplines, and this whole can of worms could cost us our ability to fly.
This is a very touchy time for our hobby right now. The AMA is turning into a political action organization much like the NRA. Except we do not have a constitutional right here. It could be shot down very easily.
Now, we are well aware of the sociopathic a-holes out there and they are unlikely to join our little group. But they will be picked off one by one by law and order until the skies are clear again.
09-01-2014, 05:08 PM
#108
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The majority of us, I would contend are only AMA members because we need it to be a member of our clubs, and also to enter at the events we fly at. The insurance is somwhat of a second thought by and large. Especially considering the small chance of an accident.
The FPV guys may be AMA members, but only in so far as they need it to be a member of a club that has a runway for the models that they have that require one.
The AMA needs to separate themselves from this FPV/UAV faction of this hobby as quickly as possible, otherwise we we all be lumped in with them. Then we all lose.
09-01-2014, 05:09 PM
#109
I understand that we are under a microscope, but I feel we need a clear separation from that aspect of the hobby. This is not a case of strength through numbers. That aspect of the hobby is bad for us. They are proving themselves to be irresponsible, and there is no way that we can weed out the bad ones.
We can just agree to disagree. The top pilots that I know (and I fly at many, many events) are in agreement with me. Unfortunately, it may already be too late.
We can just agree to disagree. The top pilots that I know (and I fly at many, many events) are in agreement with me. Unfortunately, it may already be too late.
09-01-2014, 05:13 PM
#110
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If you want R/C as we know it to be under the same microscope as the FPV aircraft you are crazy! They are not the same thing. A runway is not required, and hence they can fly from anywhere. The main reason why I am a member of a club is I need the runway.
It has been my experience that the FPV pilots tend to be rouge by nature, so no rules matter at all. The FPV crowd can go and do the things they need to to preserve their own hobby, but it has nothing to do with mine. They are not related to what we do in any way, other than the fat that radio signals are used to control them. The general public will have no idea of the differences between our disciplines, and this whole can of worms could cost us our ability to fly.
This is a very touchy time for our hobby right now. The AMA is turning into a political action organization much like the NRA. Except we do not have a constitutional right here. It could be shot down very easily.
It has been my experience that the FPV pilots tend to be rouge by nature, so no rules matter at all. The FPV crowd can go and do the things they need to to preserve their own hobby, but it has nothing to do with mine. They are not related to what we do in any way, other than the fat that radio signals are used to control them. The general public will have no idea of the differences between our disciplines, and this whole can of worms could cost us our ability to fly.
This is a very touchy time for our hobby right now. The AMA is turning into a political action organization much like the NRA. Except we do not have a constitutional right here. It could be shot down very easily.
If I had to guess, I think I know what your position on ARFs, Helis, electrics, and Foamies are too.
Are you new to the hobby and AMA? They didn't just "start" doing anything, they have been advocating for the hobbyist since their inception, and will continue to do so.
You might be completely missing the fact that the technology isn't the bad guy here, it's the miscreants who abuse it. How you don't see the similarity between a quad being flown by remote control and a heli or plane being operated the same way is completely lost on me.
Wonder if we'd be flying anything other than control line if the same thought process was in place back in the day..........
09-01-2014, 05:17 PM
#111
The insurance that covers the flying site landowner actually does promote model aviation. Some potential flying site landowners are spooked by the potential liability of allowing model aircraft operations, and this insurance product helps mitigate that problem. I suppose it could be argued, though not convincingly to me, that the personal liability insurance is good thing too. It is bundled with insurance the landowner may think he needs and what we pay for it subsidizes the cost of insurance for him and generates more income for AMA.
Sounds almost too simple to need to say it, right? The part I highlighted is what drives my expectation that the scheme by AMA marketeers to build the empire with drone operators will fail. Any prior attempt to recruit members into AMA that has involved aircraft that do not need a fixed, dedicated flying site has failed. As you say, it is a condition of being admitted to a flying site, and it is enforced rigorously by existing users - it is easily AMA Rule #1. Don't need such a flying site, don't need AMA.
Amen
Sounds almost too simple to need to say it, right? The part I highlighted is what drives my expectation that the scheme by AMA marketeers to build the empire with drone operators will fail. Any prior attempt to recruit members into AMA that has involved aircraft that do not need a fixed, dedicated flying site has failed. As you say, it is a condition of being admitted to a flying site, and it is enforced rigorously by existing users - it is easily AMA Rule #1. Don't need such a flying site, don't need AMA.
Amen
09-01-2014, 05:19 PM
#112
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You might be completely missing the fact that the technology isn't the bad guy here, it's the miscreants who abuse it. How you don't see the similarity between a quad being flown by remote control and a heli or plane being operated the same way is completely lost on me. .
You might be completely missing the fact that the technology isn't the bad guy here, it's the miscreants who abuse it. How you don't see the similarity between a quad being flown by remote control and a heli or plane being operated the same way is completely lost on me. .
What about the wheel, how was that received? LOL! Not to forget about fire.
09-01-2014, 05:21 PM
#113
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Exactly. Why should the AMA embrace a group that does not need them? And then on top of that, would undermine the organization in the end. What tool can the AMA use to leverage the FPV crowd? They do not have competitions, they do not need a club, they do not need a runway, They do not have noise issues (by and large), And they do not follow any rule anyway.
09-01-2014, 05:25 PM
#114
The technology can go find another organization to maintain any right to fly in the eyes of the Gov. then. The operators of these things certainly will not be responsible enough to pull it off.
That is just silly to claim this is an anti technology argument. We do not race RC cars and boats at my flying field either. We are not a club of FPV flyers. We fly line of site model airplanes. And they are not generating bad press and having their operators arrested.
That is just silly to claim this is an anti technology argument. We do not race RC cars and boats at my flying field either. We are not a club of FPV flyers. We fly line of site model airplanes. And they are not generating bad press and having their operators arrested.
09-01-2014, 08:21 PM
#118
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The technology can go find another organization to maintain any right to fly in the eyes of the Gov. then. The operators of these things certainly will not be responsible enough to pull it off.
That is just silly to claim this is an anti technology argument. We do not race RC cars and boats at my flying field either. We are not a club of FPV flyers. We fly line of site model airplanes. And they are not generating bad press and having their operators arrested.
That is just silly to claim this is an anti technology argument. We do not race RC cars and boats at my flying field either. We are not a club of FPV flyers. We fly line of site model airplanes. And they are not generating bad press and having their operators arrested.
09-01-2014, 08:47 PM
#119
The technology can go find another organization to maintain any right to fly in the eyes of the Gov. then. The operators of these things certainly will not be responsible enough to pull it off.
That is just silly to claim this is an anti technology argument. We do not race RC cars and boats at my flying field either. We are not a club of FPV flyers. We fly line of site model airplanes. And they are not generating bad press and having their operators arrested.
That is just silly to claim this is an anti technology argument. We do not race RC cars and boats at my flying field either. We are not a club of FPV flyers. We fly line of site model airplanes. And they are not generating bad press and having their operators arrested.
all of sudden a lot of people think it such a bad thing. I do agree that FPV flying has the potential to be dangerous to both full scale planes and people on the
ground and needs to regulated. I also think the FAA needs to come up with rules for FPV operations not performed at a rc site but there is nothing wrong with
flying fpv if done with some common sense.
Last edited by ira d; 09-02-2014 at 07:19 AM.
09-02-2014, 03:26 AM
#120
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I'll take a stab at that.
Helis: NO NO NO
Foamies: NO NO NO
3D: NO NO NO
ARF: We'll let them fly, but they aren't "real" airplanes built by "real" modelers
Allowed: Scratch or kit built civilian and warbirds. Nitro, gas. MUST FLY RACETRACK PATTERN at all times. 72 mhz preferred.
Membership: Dwindling, can't figure out why.
Helis: NO NO NO
Foamies: NO NO NO
3D: NO NO NO
ARF: We'll let them fly, but they aren't "real" airplanes built by "real" modelers
Allowed: Scratch or kit built civilian and warbirds. Nitro, gas. MUST FLY RACETRACK PATTERN at all times. 72 mhz preferred.
Membership: Dwindling, can't figure out why.
09-02-2014, 05:52 AM
#121
It has been my experience that the FPV pilots tend to be rouge by nature, so no rules matter at all.
09-02-2014, 06:16 AM
#122
I cannot for the life of me understand why the AMA would embrace a group of flyers who have no intention or want to be a part of the organization. Forced membership would never be good for either party. On top of that the AMA will have no authority or ability to guide or enforce anything. At best they will remain but an advisory group. I think the best thing on this issue would be to distance themselves to all but the membership they serve. Let those who wish to operate outside the definition of hobby activity including any commercial enterprises fend for themselves. They could still act as an advisory body when asked without direct involvement or responsibilities which is what will happen anyhow.
09-02-2014, 06:36 AM
#123
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I cannot for the life of me understand why the AMA would embrace a group of flyers who have no intention or want to be a part of the organization. Forced membership would never be good for either party. On top of that the AMA will have no authority or ability to guide or enforce anything. At best they will remain but an advisory group. I think the best thing on this issue would be to distance themselves to all but the membership they serve. Let those who wish to operate outside the definition of hobby activity including any commercial enterprises fend for themselves. They could still act as an advisory body when asked without direct involvement or responsibilities which is what will happen anyhow.
09-02-2014, 08:24 AM
#125
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well...I think that's the problem for some here...How will AMA have authority to enforce without force??? AMA is working hard on it though... That's what modelers do!!! building a model of FAA is a great project for some now.