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Old 11-24-2015, 10:52 AM
  #1851  
Chris P. Bacon
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Originally Posted by Sport_Pilot
Wal Mart and Amazon doesn't have 180K members and 0 people served by their drones. And there is a possibility that nobody will. Too my knowledge Best Buy only wants to sell them. True others are larger but AMA has far more at stake than Wal-Mart and Amazon.
Doesn't really matter at this point. The Task Force completed their job and submitted their recommendations to the FAA.
Old 11-24-2015, 10:56 AM
  #1852  
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If I felt that the AMA was going to supply politicians with large campaign contributions, foreign exotic location "junkets", expensive trinkets and prostitutes, than maybe I would feel better about us receiving favorable treatment.
Old 11-24-2015, 10:57 AM
  #1853  
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Originally Posted by Chris P. Bacon
Who do you think was representing the largest user base? The AMA, WalMart, or Amazon?
This is what is called, "Crispy Spin" or, "Crispy deflection".

It has no bearing on the question posed to him and no bearing on how the task force was to provide their recommendations.

The AMA was invited to the table because they represent a large contingency of parties that may be affected and because of their many years of experience being the (previously) primary regulator of R/C activity in the NAS.

It has ZERO to do with the number of people being represented by each invited party.

I'm not so naive to consider it MAY have more to do with the $$ represented, but if that is the case, we are all screwed anyway, as it would seem a few dollar dues increase every few years is too much for some members to bear.

Regards,

Astro
Old 11-24-2015, 10:59 AM
  #1854  
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Originally Posted by Chris P. Bacon
Are you admitting the AMA has done something right?
I think this is what you call, "AIR"?
Old 11-24-2015, 11:04 AM
  #1855  
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Originally Posted by Chris P. Bacon
So you think a tiny little organization of 180k members was going to push around everyone else sitting at the table? Time to wake up and smell the coffee.
More deflection! That is NOT what anyone was saying at all! (But you knew that) 😀

Regards,

Astro
Old 11-24-2015, 11:11 AM
  #1856  
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Originally Posted by Chris P. Bacon
So you think a tiny little organization of 180k members was going to push around everyone else sitting at the table? Time to wake up and smell the coffee.
So remind me then...why are we spending so much money ($1,000,000 so far) to exercise such little influence? Does not seem to be a particularly effective use of limited resources. Perhaps they should sue the FAA? Oh, that's right, they're doing that too. And how's that working out so far?
Old 11-24-2015, 11:18 AM
  #1857  
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Originally Posted by Chris P. Bacon
Doesn't really matter at this point. The Task Force completed their job and submitted their recommendations to the FAA.
And if AMA wanted to file a dissenting opinion and was not permitted, then they should have either not voted to support any of the recommendations or dropped out of the task force. But they did neither. They stayed and voted for the report. I'm sure nobody else got all they wanted either, but the AMA is the only one whining about it after the fact. I can't help but think this will further erode their credibility in the eyes of regulators or the rest of the aviation industry.
Old 11-24-2015, 11:23 AM
  #1858  
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Originally Posted by franklin_m
So remind me then...why are we spending so much money ($1,000,000 so far) to exercise such little influence? Does not seem to be a particularly effective use of limited resources. Perhaps they should sue the FAA? Oh, that's right, they're doing that too. And how's that working out so far?
Since when does lobbying come with a written guarantee of results?
Old 11-24-2015, 11:27 AM
  #1859  
Chris P. Bacon
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Originally Posted by franklin_m
And if AMA wanted to file a dissenting opinion and was not permitted, then they should have either not voted to support any of the recommendations or dropped out of the task force. But they did neither. They stayed and voted for the report. I'm sure nobody else got all they wanted either, but the AMA is the only one whining about it after the fact. I can't help but think this will further erode their credibility in the eyes of regulators or the rest of the aviation industry.
So everyone else on the task force got everything they wanted except the AMA?
Old 11-24-2015, 11:43 AM
  #1860  
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Originally Posted by Chris P. Bacon
Since when does lobbying come with a written guarantee of results?
It doesn't. But it does cause people to re-examine whether they want more money spent on it.
Old 11-24-2015, 11:44 AM
  #1861  
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Originally Posted by Chris P. Bacon
So everyone else on the task force got everything they wanted except the AMA?
I said: "I'm sure nobody else got all they wanted either [emphasis added], but the AMA is the only one whining about it after the fact."

Last edited by franklin_m; 11-24-2015 at 11:47 AM.
Old 11-24-2015, 12:00 PM
  #1862  
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Originally Posted by franklin_m
I said: "I'm sure nobody else got all they wanted either [emphasis added], but the AMA is the only one whining about it after the fact."
So you researched the feedback of all the other task force participants and no one else is whining about it after the fact?
Old 11-24-2015, 12:19 PM
  #1863  
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Originally Posted by Chris P. Bacon
So you researched the feedback of all the other task force participants and no one else is whining about it after the fact?
Most of them didn't comment at all as of today. In the two I found that did release a statement, neither complained (whining) about not being permitted to present dissenting opinion nor about not getting everything they wanted.

I'm sure you have examples of others complaining like AMA is doing.

P.S. One did say they would have liked to see requirement to provide email addresses and another said they would have preferred registration at point of sale. Nothing even close to the AMA's page long missive about being prevented from submitted and that it's members aren't the problem.

Last edited by franklin_m; 11-24-2015 at 12:28 PM.
Old 11-24-2015, 12:50 PM
  #1864  
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Originally Posted by rcmiket
Name one individual or organization on the list other than the AMA that has almost 80 years of expertise in R/C aviation?

Mike
Clearly, the AMA was the only organization there with 80 years of expertise in R/C aviation. That being said, this wasn't all about the AMA, or our hobby. We were a part of a larger issue, and there were many interests being protected and advocated for. I've said before, this was a larger issue that we got swept up in, this group wasn't put together just so our ideas and concerns could be dealt with. It is a far bigger "global" issue. That's why they involved some of the other players. And yes, absolutely 100% without a doubt a multi billion dollar player like Amazon or Walmart is going to trump our private membership only "club" with 180 members, many of which aren't voting age OR...that vote with their wallet.

This was another phase in a process that won't end soon, and regardless of the outcome will probably be challenged.

Not a huge daunting change to the hobby, not going to significantly change the way we operate. And so far....so far.....not costing us extra money.
Old 11-24-2015, 01:10 PM
  #1865  
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Originally Posted by franklin_m
Most of them didn't comment at all as of today. In the two I found that did release a statement, neither complained (whining) about not being permitted to present dissenting opinion nor about not getting everything they wanted.

I'm sure you have examples of others complaining like AMA is doing.

P.S. One did say they would have liked to see requirement to provide email addresses and another said they would have preferred registration at point of sale. Nothing even close to the AMA's page long missive about being prevented from submitted and that it's members aren't the problem.
So you're whining because the AMA is whining?
Old 11-24-2015, 01:29 PM
  #1866  
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Originally Posted by Sport_Pilot
Wal Mart and Amazon doesn't have 180K members and 0 people served by their drones. And there is a possibility that nobody will. Too my knowledge Best Buy only wants to sell them. True others are larger but AMA has far more at stake than Wal-Mart and Amazon.

Originally Posted by Chris P. Bacon
Doesn't really matter at this point. The Task Force completed their job and submitted their recommendations to the FAA.
The FAA doesn't have a great track record of following recommendations brought by others. They sorta have the ideology if we didn't invent orthink of it, it ain't worth pursuing. Hope tha stick to their normal ways. Same with Dead lines set for them.
Old 11-24-2015, 01:31 PM
  #1867  
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Originally Posted by Chris P. Bacon
Are you admitting the AMA has done something right?
It was a very simple question. Since they were the only organization there with that kind of experience and seeing the results I'm inclined to believe they were not a factor.

Mike
Old 11-24-2015, 01:41 PM
  #1868  
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Originally Posted by franklin_m
So remind me then...why are we spending so much money ($1,000,000 so far) to exercise such little influence? Does not seem to be a particularly effective use of limited resources. Perhaps they should sue the FAA? Oh, that's right, they're doing that too. And how's that working out so far?
Folks who have little respect for the value of a dollar do not think that $1 MM is a lot of money.
I wish to live long enough to see their beliefs and values rigorously tested should our economy ever fail.
Old 11-24-2015, 01:57 PM
  #1869  
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Originally Posted by combatpigg
Folks who have little respect for the value of a dollar do not think that $1 MM is a lot of money.
I wish to live long enough to see their beliefs and values rigorously tested should our economy ever fail.
Look we all know it's fun to spend money even more fun if no one asks on what or ask about results.

Mike
Old 11-24-2015, 02:07 PM
  #1870  
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Originally Posted by combatpigg
Folks who have little respect for the value of a dollar do not think that $1 MM is a lot of money.
I wish to live long enough to see their beliefs and values rigorously tested should our economy ever fail.


Originally Posted by rcmiket
Look we all know it's fun to spend money even more fun if no one asks on what or ask about results.

Mike
Even better yet when it not your own dollars U are spending.
Old 11-24-2015, 02:10 PM
  #1871  
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Originally Posted by Chris P. Bacon
Since when does lobbying come with a written guarantee of results?
The "Apologentsia" has spoken....too funny...!
Old 11-24-2015, 02:15 PM
  #1872  
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Originally Posted by HoundDog
Originally Posted by combatpigg
Folks who have little respect for the value of a dollar do not think that $1 MM is a lot of money.
I wish to live long enough to see their beliefs and values rigorously tested should our economy ever fail.



Even better yet when it not your own dollars U are spending.
Winner Winner Chicken Dinner...!

We could have / would have arrived at this same result after spending less than $20..........LOL.
Problem is, the folks who run The Show have bought into the notion that $1MM is NOT a lot of money to spend to voice your opinion..
Old 11-24-2015, 02:15 PM
  #1873  
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Originally Posted by Chris P. Bacon
Since when does lobbying come with a written guarantee of results?

We should have spent more ,Huh?
I'll clue you in it would have netted the same results.

Mike
Old 11-24-2015, 02:21 PM
  #1874  
Chris P. Bacon
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Originally Posted by rcmiket
We should have spent more ,Huh?
I'll clue you in it would have netted the same results.

Mike
The all knowing always have all the correct answers except the winning lottery numbers....
Old 11-24-2015, 02:23 PM
  #1875  
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Originally Posted by Lamoilleriver
If I felt that the AMA was going to supply politicians with large campaign contributions, foreign exotic location "junkets", expensive trinkets and prostitutes, than maybe I would feel better about us receiving favorable treatment.
haha...you're thinking about the other AMA.......

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