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05-19-2016, 05:14 PM
#5126
I'm not a member anymore, but based on the minutes last posted, it's about 35. Given the weather was terrible most days mid week, unless they were flying in the rain, those two weekends would have been the only flying opportunity. When I was a member it was always a weekend heavy flying group.
But of course, I should have anticipated that whatever day I went, you'd accuse me of going the wrong day. Going two days in a nine day period, on the only two good weather days as well -- wasn't good enough. I should have known.
But of course, I should have anticipated that whatever day I went, you'd accuse me of going the wrong day. Going two days in a nine day period, on the only two good weather days as well -- wasn't good enough. I should have known.
05-19-2016, 05:23 PM
#5127
Banned
My Feedback: (8)
My point is that they throw around the top level number as an indication of the health, but you have to admit that youth memberships are a good chunk of that total number. But what pays the bills, and I argue is the measure of true health, are the revenue generating memberships. And that number is somewhat obfuscated by the way they publicize the data.
As for the club...interesting you should mention that. I went out to the club field twice this past time I was home (I work two weeks on/two weeks off). It's just a tad under 13 miles one way. Went on a Saturday around 1pm one week, and a Sunday around 2pm the next week (should easily satisfy your stated "any given day" criteria). It was beautiful both days. Dry, light wind, and sunny (which has been rare in PA of late). How many people flying each time? Precisely zero.
I don't know how or even if the AMA will be able to capture the youth/MR crowd. They seem to be a group that eschews constraints, and I don't see the AMA being a good match. You're right about the demographic in my rather unscientific sampling of clubs I've been a member and in clubs I've visited. Youth memberships are perhaps the only way to draw kids in, but if they never turn into paying memberships, what's the point.
As for the club...interesting you should mention that. I went out to the club field twice this past time I was home (I work two weeks on/two weeks off). It's just a tad under 13 miles one way. Went on a Saturday around 1pm one week, and a Sunday around 2pm the next week (should easily satisfy your stated "any given day" criteria). It was beautiful both days. Dry, light wind, and sunny (which has been rare in PA of late). How many people flying each time? Precisely zero.
I don't know how or even if the AMA will be able to capture the youth/MR crowd. They seem to be a group that eschews constraints, and I don't see the AMA being a good match. You're right about the demographic in my rather unscientific sampling of clubs I've been a member and in clubs I've visited. Youth memberships are perhaps the only way to draw kids in, but if they never turn into paying memberships, what's the point.
I don't buy into the premise that they lie or pad the membership numbers, what possible motive would they have to do that? It doesn't change a thing for any of us does it? Long term perhaps, but why not cross that bridge when and if we get to it. Based on the numbers gathered far, the AMA and the hobby are doin just fine.
Now funny you mention the club visit. Our club just exceeded 200 members. 4 years ago we were at 125, we're now at 200 and have decided to cap it at this level for now. Although we have lots of property, two runways, and a heli/quad area, enough is enough. We only allow 4 aircraft in the air at once, and as big as the sky is, it suddenly shrinks when 2, then 3, then four ships are in the air. I was at the field twice this week, once on a perfect day, nobody was there. The second day, 7 people were there. On any given nice Saturday, maybe 20-25 will show up during the day. It's hit or miss. Sometimes on a perfect day I'm amazed it's empty and will take pics and send it to our board and say, real busy, standing room only !!! Meanwhile, on 1/1 of every year we have 50-70 pilots show up. Who can figure it out.
Club numbers ebb and flow. We've been on an upcycle. Another club I used to belong to dropped from 175 down to 70 or so in 3-4 years. One I flew at this year is down to the high 20's, is just hanging on. Although I'm 100% sure we have more "new" members in our state, I think they all get shared with one club or another. You try one on for size, then move on to the next. Different clubs have different personalities. I'm going to one tomorrow that's hosting a glider event, sits on top of a hill surrounded on all sides by cornfields. The field looks like a postage stamp, the pilots need precision to come in and land some of these huge gliders on the field, else they find themselves in the corn maze from hell.
05-19-2016, 05:26 PM
#5128
Banned
My Feedback: (8)
I'm not a member anymore, but based on the minutes last posted, it's about 35. Given the weather was terrible most days mid week, unless they were flying in the rain, those two weekends would have been the only flying opportunity. When I was a member it was always a weekend heavy flying group.
But of course, I should have anticipated that whatever day I went, you'd accuse me of going the wrong day. Going two days in a nine day period, on the only two good weather days as well -- wasn't good enough. I should have known.
But of course, I should have anticipated that whatever day I went, you'd accuse me of going the wrong day. Going two days in a nine day period, on the only two good weather days as well -- wasn't good enough. I should have known.
Geez dude, he didn't accuse you of anything, relax and have a conversation. The size of the club and the days one might go make a difference. I will agree though, the weather has been completely uncooperative this year, so far. Very few great flying days. The wind has been howling, and lots of rain.
05-19-2016, 05:46 PM
#5129
I'm not a member anymore, but based on the minutes last posted, it's about 35. Given the weather was terrible most days mid week, unless they were flying in the rain, those two weekends would have been the only flying opportunity. When I was a member it was always a weekend heavy flying group.
But of course, I should have anticipated that whatever day I went, you'd accuse me of going the wrong day. Going two days in a nine day period, on the only two good weather days as well -- wasn't good enough. I should have known.
But of course, I should have anticipated that whatever day I went, you'd accuse me of going the wrong day. Going two days in a nine day period, on the only two good weather days as well -- wasn't good enough. I should have known.
05-19-2016, 05:50 PM
#5130
Banned
My Feedback: (8)
If you re-read my post in its entirety you'll learn that no where in it did I accuse you of going the wrong day. The fact of the matter is that IMHO, many clubs these days have a large number of inactive members. Unfortunate, but that's been my experience over the past two decades.
05-20-2016, 08:38 AM
#5133
Nothing ventured, nothing gained. If they don't try...before long the often bandied about predictions will come true, the hobby will in fact die. The ED would have been derelict in not looking for all possible means of attracting and getting new members. Sure, 50k or more of the membership is free, so what? Yes, the rest of us make up for that, so what? Would it be great to pay less, sure, would it be great for the AMA to dish out an unlimited amount of money to anyone who asks, sure. Would it be wise, no. It never ceases to amaze me how many people equate the AMA dues to insurance, and insurance only. Stunning really. The 11 plus million is accounted for, not only by the board, but by the independent auditors (yes, that our dues go to pay for), and as it happens, by the feds as well. Now, if I was a glass half empty overly suspicious person I would really really wonder what made the feds suddenly interested in the AMA and decide to spring and audit on them. But I'll just chalk that up to blind...luck.
I don't buy into the premise that they lie or pad the membership numbers, what possible motive would they have to do that? It doesn't change a thing for any of us does it? Long term perhaps, but why not cross that bridge when and if we get to it. Based on the numbers gathered far, the AMA and the hobby are doin just fine.
Now funny you mention the club visit. Our club just exceeded 200 members. 4 years ago we were at 125, we're now at 200 and have decided to cap it at this level for now. Although we have lots of property, two runways, and a heli/quad area, enough is enough. We only allow 4 aircraft in the air at once, and as big as the sky is, it suddenly shrinks when 2, then 3, then four ships are in the air. I was at the field twice this week, once on a perfect day, nobody was there. The second day, 7 people were there. On any given nice Saturday, maybe 20-25 will show up during the day. It's hit or miss. Sometimes on a perfect day I'm amazed it's empty and will take pics and send it to our board and say, real busy, standing room only !!! Meanwhile, on 1/1 of every year we have 50-70 pilots show up. Who can figure it out.
Club numbers ebb and flow. We've been on an upcycle. Another club I used to belong to dropped from 175 down to 70 or so in 3-4 years. One I flew at this year is down to the high 20's, is just hanging on. Although I'm 100% sure we have more "new" members in our state, I think they all get shared with one club or another. You try one on for size, then move on to the next. Different clubs have different personalities. I'm going to one tomorrow that's hosting a glider event, sits on top of a hill surrounded on all sides by cornfields. The field looks like a postage stamp, the pilots need precision to come in and land some of these huge gliders on the field, else they find themselves in the corn maze from hell.
I don't buy into the premise that they lie or pad the membership numbers, what possible motive would they have to do that? It doesn't change a thing for any of us does it? Long term perhaps, but why not cross that bridge when and if we get to it. Based on the numbers gathered far, the AMA and the hobby are doin just fine.
Now funny you mention the club visit. Our club just exceeded 200 members. 4 years ago we were at 125, we're now at 200 and have decided to cap it at this level for now. Although we have lots of property, two runways, and a heli/quad area, enough is enough. We only allow 4 aircraft in the air at once, and as big as the sky is, it suddenly shrinks when 2, then 3, then four ships are in the air. I was at the field twice this week, once on a perfect day, nobody was there. The second day, 7 people were there. On any given nice Saturday, maybe 20-25 will show up during the day. It's hit or miss. Sometimes on a perfect day I'm amazed it's empty and will take pics and send it to our board and say, real busy, standing room only !!! Meanwhile, on 1/1 of every year we have 50-70 pilots show up. Who can figure it out.
Club numbers ebb and flow. We've been on an upcycle. Another club I used to belong to dropped from 175 down to 70 or so in 3-4 years. One I flew at this year is down to the high 20's, is just hanging on. Although I'm 100% sure we have more "new" members in our state, I think they all get shared with one club or another. You try one on for size, then move on to the next. Different clubs have different personalities. I'm going to one tomorrow that's hosting a glider event, sits on top of a hill surrounded on all sides by cornfields. The field looks like a postage stamp, the pilots need precision to come in and land some of these huge gliders on the field, else they find themselves in the corn maze from hell.
Speaking of losses, noted with interest some of the discussions in the recent minutes WRT investments. Looked back at the financial statements from '14 and wow. No wonder. I can only assume that from the discussion at the most recent EC, they're no better and may in fact be worse. My econ classes are coming back to me, the adage 'bout putting good money after bad.
As to the club thing. I actually was considering "coming back into the fold." Now, based on lack of activity, not so much anymore. I've got a few planes that should be flown at a club field, but I haven't flown them now in three years, and I don't feel any emotional injury. Hearing of your club, I can only imagine how nice it must be to have such a warm and welcoming group, that seem to seamlessly embrace every new technology or type w/o so much as a hiccup, and who seem to so peacefully co-exist. It sounds like the proverbial nirvana. I expect it never rains either, that the winds are always light and right down the runway, and there's nary a dangerous behavior or political issue that plagues other clubs. Enjoy it. Others' experiences are far less perfect, and it's causing some of us to evaluate other options.
05-20-2016, 08:48 AM
#5134
Geez dude, he didn't accuse you of anything, relax and have a conversation. The size of the club and the days one might go make a difference. I will agree though, the weather has been completely uncooperative this year, so far. Very few great flying days. The wind has been howling, and lots of rain.
05-20-2016, 09:11 AM
#5135
Speaking of losses, noted with interest some of the discussions in the recent minutes WRT investments. Looked back at the financial statements from '14 and wow. No wonder. I can only assume that from the discussion at the most recent EC, they're no better and may in fact be worse. My econ classes are coming back to me, the adage 'bout putting good money after bad.
As to the club thing. I actually was considering "coming back into the fold." Now, based on lack of activity, not so much anymore. I've got a few planes that should be flown at a club field, but I haven't flown them now in three years, and I don't feel any emotional injury. Hearing of your club, I can only imagine how nice it must be to have such a warm and welcoming group, that seem to seamlessly embrace every new technology or type w/o so much as a hiccup, and who seem to so peacefully co-exist. It sounds like the proverbial nirvana. I expect it never rains either, that the winds are always light and right down the runway, and there's nary a dangerous behavior or political issue that plagues other clubs. Enjoy it. Others' experiences are far less perfect, and it's causing some of us to evaluate other options.
05-20-2016, 09:15 AM
#5136
True...but for every one of those there's tens of thousands that go the other direction. That's all I'm saying. At what point do you stop putting good money after bad. How many years?
05-20-2016, 09:35 AM
#5137
I think we're more in agreement here than not. I'm all about accountability for the effective use of our dollars. Getting what we pay for if you will. If the MR thing works, and if the dollars gained exceed what we're spending on it, then great. But if not, then cut losses and move on. I have my opinion which direction it's gonna go, you have yours, and it's an issue upon which intelligent people can disagree.
Speaking of losses, noted with interest some of the discussions in the recent minutes WRT investments. Looked back at the financial statements from '14 and wow. No wonder. I can only assume that from the discussion at the most recent EC, they're no better and may in fact be worse. My econ classes are coming back to me, the adage 'bout putting good money after bad.
As to the club thing. I actually was considering "coming back into the fold." Now, based on lack of activity, not so much anymore. I've got a few planes that should be flown at a club field, but I haven't flown them now in three years, and I don't feel any emotional injury. Hearing of your club, I can only imagine how nice it must be to have such a warm and welcoming group, that seem to seamlessly embrace every new technology or type w/o so much as a hiccup, and who seem to so peacefully co-exist. It sounds like the proverbial nirvana. I expect it never rains either, that the winds are always light and right down the runway, and there's nary a dangerous behavior or political issue that plagues other clubs. Enjoy it. Others' experiences are far less perfect, and it's causing some of us to evaluate other options.
Speaking of losses, noted with interest some of the discussions in the recent minutes WRT investments. Looked back at the financial statements from '14 and wow. No wonder. I can only assume that from the discussion at the most recent EC, they're no better and may in fact be worse. My econ classes are coming back to me, the adage 'bout putting good money after bad.
As to the club thing. I actually was considering "coming back into the fold." Now, based on lack of activity, not so much anymore. I've got a few planes that should be flown at a club field, but I haven't flown them now in three years, and I don't feel any emotional injury. Hearing of your club, I can only imagine how nice it must be to have such a warm and welcoming group, that seem to seamlessly embrace every new technology or type w/o so much as a hiccup, and who seem to so peacefully co-exist. It sounds like the proverbial nirvana. I expect it never rains either, that the winds are always light and right down the runway, and there's nary a dangerous behavior or political issue that plagues other clubs. Enjoy it. Others' experiences are far less perfect, and it's causing some of us to evaluate other options.
05-20-2016, 01:19 PM
#5139
A couple of us old duffers were talking about the feature and present performance of our club and Model Flying today. At last weeks Monthly Meeting a group of guys that put on Demos of Model air planes for younger grade school kids found out thet they can't put on their show at this one school. Forgot Why. Anyways one of our memes of the 7 out of 70 or so out there today with 3 MPH winds down the runway ad 50 going to 70. Best day this season. Anyway Murph. Suggested that because one of out more senior members that just moved into a Assisted Living facility (Because of his wife) had last year got 3 of the guys he at breakfast with to come out and see what we do. 2 are now flying. Anyway Murph went over to the local Senior Center to Float the Idea that We would set up a flight Demo and Buddy Box session, If the powers that be might let us put up a sign up sheet at the senior REC center. No Cost to anyone except they would have to provide their own transportation. Murphs premis is that trying to get a grade school boys Father/Family to dish out the money for a plane he can total in 10 seconds is a dificult thing to accomplish. Murphs reasoning many of the People that use the Senior Rec center are Mobil and might just be looking for some out door activity that not being too strenuous would get their interest. Besides most of these people hav the monetary means too. Also most likely they have Gran Children too. Who Knows might just turn into a good deal for our club and the AMA. We have 3 or 4 of us that are Intro Pilots so getting these People interested for FREE where FREE is Good might just turn out , Can't hurt to try. Since we have New Housing moving in just 2000 feet from our center pilot station a few of the communities senior members could be a great help in keeping Our field at least for the near Feature.
U know it only takes ONE cranky Individual at a common council meeting to stir up a whole Hornets nest. Don't mater that the Club has been there since the late 70's and the full scale has been there since the late twenties.
U know it only takes ONE cranky Individual at a common council meeting to stir up a whole Hornets nest. Don't mater that the Club has been there since the late 70's and the full scale has been there since the late twenties.
05-20-2016, 01:30 PM
#5140
05-20-2016, 01:34 PM
#5141
Hey a little help here ... where's the UN Scribe button.
05-20-2016, 01:41 PM
#5142
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: El Paso,
TX
Posts: 5,277
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Received 0 Likes
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Frankie and all U others .... Ken is going to shut this forum down if U/WE/Me persist. U can't change city hall from the outside. It.s compleatly Useless to even talk about it. Change in an origination like the AMA has to be accomplished from within. 2 ways to accomplish this 1. Win a seat at the table. 2. Convince some one who already has a seat at the table your way is the wright way. But sadly again there those that make a lot of NOISE but do little to accomplish their agenda. So what they do is keep hoping the Squeaky wheel will get the greases so to speak. Think maybe I'll UnScribe from these Whiney sessions of course I already go to the field (some Field) if the day ends in a "Y" except for Rain"Y" or Wind"Y". By, Buy, Bye.
As members of the AMA we have the right and responsibility to question or support that organization.
Mike
Last edited by rcmiket; 05-20-2016 at 01:46 PM.
05-20-2016, 02:36 PM
#5143
Banned
My Feedback: (8)
Frankie and all U others .... Ken is going to shut this forum down if U/WE/Me persist. U can't change city hall from the outside. It.s compleatly Useless to even talk about it. Change in an origination like the AMA has to be accomplished from within. 2 ways to accomplish this 1. Win a seat at the table. 2. Convince some one who already has a seat at the table your way is the wright way. But sadly again there those that make a lot of NOISE but do little to accomplish their agenda. So what they do is keep hoping the Squeaky wheel will get the greases so to speak. Think maybe I'll UnScribe from these Whiney sessions of course I already go to the field (some Field) if the day ends in a "Y" except for Rain"Y" or Wind"Y". By, Buy, Bye.
Hey a little help here ... where's the UN Scribe button.
Hey a little help here ... where's the UN Scribe button.
Last edited by porcia83; 05-20-2016 at 06:36 PM.
05-20-2016, 02:44 PM
#5144
Banned
My Feedback: (8)
A couple of us old duffers were talking about the feature and present performance of our club and Model Flying today. At last weeks Monthly Meeting a group of guys that put on Demos of Model air planes for younger grade school kids found out thet they can't put on their show at this one school. Forgot Why. Anyways one of our memes of the 7 out of 70 or so out there today with 3 MPH winds down the runway ad 50 going to 70. Best day this season. Anyway Murph. Suggested that because one of out more senior members that just moved into a Assisted Living facility (Because of his wife) had last year got 3 of the guys he at breakfast with to come out and see what we do. 2 are now flying. Anyway Murph went over to the local Senior Center to Float the Idea that We would set up a flight Demo and Buddy Box session, If the powers that be might let us put up a sign up sheet at the senior REC center. No Cost to anyone except they would have to provide their own transportation. Murphs premis is that trying to get a grade school boys Father/Family to dish out the money for a plane he can total in 10 seconds is a dificult thing to accomplish. Murphs reasoning many of the People that use the Senior Rec center are Mobil and might just be looking for some out door activity that not being too strenuous would get their interest. Besides most of these people hav the monetary means too. Also most likely they have Gran Children too. Who Knows might just turn into a good deal for our club and the AMA. We have 3 or 4 of us that are Intro Pilots so getting these People interested for FREE where FREE is Good might just turn out , Can't hurt to try. Since we have New Housing moving in just 2000 feet from our center pilot station a few of the communities senior members could be a great help in keeping Our field at least for the near Feature.
U know it only takes ONE cranky Individual at a common council meeting to stir up a whole Hornets nest. Don't mater that the Club has been there since the late 70's and the full scale has been there since the late twenties.
U know it only takes ONE cranky Individual at a common council meeting to stir up a whole Hornets nest. Don't mater that the Club has been there since the late 70's and the full scale has been there since the late twenties.
Our club is right behind a seniors home, but not just any one. An outrageously expensive one, full service all the way...like monthly fees starting at 10k. Our field is ringed with a walking path, and protected wetlands filled with wildlife. We usually have one of our winter meetings in their auditorium, get food for them, and usually a raffle or door prize. One year we set up flight sims and could barely leave that night, they loved it. One of our members is a doc (nuero) and said that using the flight sim would be a fantastic rehab and memory enhancing activity for them to do. At every event, we have a tent and chairs front and center on the flight line for those folks only, and they get a lunch on us as well. Cost in dollars, pennies on the dollar. Goodwill...priceless. They love a free hot dog, and usually come down during non event days to just sit and watch. Some have joined, others have had their kids and grandkids join, but that isn't the goal. It's to promote the hobby, show that we are a good neighbor, and most importantly, keep the peace. They just finished a 30 million dollar addition to the place, I can only imagine the tax revenue the town gets from them. Us....$1.00 a year.
Last edited by porcia83; 05-20-2016 at 06:36 PM.
05-21-2016, 03:27 AM
#5145
True...but for every one of those there's tens of thousands that go the other direction.
If consistent repeatable returns were that easy to obtain there would be businesses guaranteeing results. Are you aware of any securities or firms that guarantee ROI?
That's all I'm saying. At what point do you stop putting good money after bad. How many years?
Good money after bad is only relative to the time period. As mentioned earlier, folks said the same thing about Jeff as well.
The bigger question is, at what point do you stop spectating and start actively participating in the decision making process yourself?
If consistent repeatable returns were that easy to obtain there would be businesses guaranteeing results. Are you aware of any securities or firms that guarantee ROI?
That's all I'm saying. At what point do you stop putting good money after bad. How many years?
Good money after bad is only relative to the time period. As mentioned earlier, folks said the same thing about Jeff as well.
The bigger question is, at what point do you stop spectating and start actively participating in the decision making process yourself?
05-21-2016, 05:28 AM
#5146
Of course I'd lose my house, my ability to support kids in college, have to sell my cabin, my boat, etc. Then I wouldn't have any money to pay for RC airplanes, but I could be part of the decision making process.
Let me think this over for a second...yep. No.
I pay my dues, I vote during the AMA elections, therefore I have a right to complain.
05-21-2016, 06:11 AM
#5147
Well, I've offered help and they've not accepted it.
By engaging in the decision making process, I wasn't referring to shouting from the sidelines. I was talking about active participation and taking responsibility for those decisions. Seems lots of folks want to be part of the decision making process in all areas of life, yet don't want to be responsible for the outcome of those decisions.
To do more, I suppose I could make time. Perhaps quit scuba diving, stop maintaining my cabin, give up hunting, or just stop staying proficient in full scale aircraft. Or maybe I won't go to my son's varsity or summer traveling team baseball games. Maybe I could stop going to my daughter's orchestra events as well. Better yet, since I work a job that limits my time home to only about 12 days a month, maybe I should quit that. Yeah, that's the ticket. Quit a six figure job to go work as a volunteer for an organization 1000 miles away from where I live.
That certainly is a lot of commitments. With all those commitments how are you able to spend as much time posting here as you do? With 1,505+ posts how much time have you spent on all those posts, including all research, analysis, evaluation, etc?
Of course I'd lose my house, my ability to support kids in college, have to sell my cabin, my boat, etc. Then I wouldn't have any money to pay for RC airplanes, but I could be part of the decision making process.
Who said anything about a full-time volunteer position? In fact, how many full-time no compensation positions does the AMA even have?
Let me think this over for a second...yep. No.
I pay my dues, I vote during the AMA elections, therefore I have a right to complain.
You certainly do have a right to complain. However, just a few posts a go you stated:
"At what point do you stop putting good money after bad."
Using your own analogy, as well as your commitments you identified above, at what number of posts do you determine whether your posts are having any measurable impact on the results you're trying to obtain?
By engaging in the decision making process, I wasn't referring to shouting from the sidelines. I was talking about active participation and taking responsibility for those decisions. Seems lots of folks want to be part of the decision making process in all areas of life, yet don't want to be responsible for the outcome of those decisions.
To do more, I suppose I could make time. Perhaps quit scuba diving, stop maintaining my cabin, give up hunting, or just stop staying proficient in full scale aircraft. Or maybe I won't go to my son's varsity or summer traveling team baseball games. Maybe I could stop going to my daughter's orchestra events as well. Better yet, since I work a job that limits my time home to only about 12 days a month, maybe I should quit that. Yeah, that's the ticket. Quit a six figure job to go work as a volunteer for an organization 1000 miles away from where I live.
That certainly is a lot of commitments. With all those commitments how are you able to spend as much time posting here as you do? With 1,505+ posts how much time have you spent on all those posts, including all research, analysis, evaluation, etc?
Of course I'd lose my house, my ability to support kids in college, have to sell my cabin, my boat, etc. Then I wouldn't have any money to pay for RC airplanes, but I could be part of the decision making process.
Who said anything about a full-time volunteer position? In fact, how many full-time no compensation positions does the AMA even have?
Let me think this over for a second...yep. No.
I pay my dues, I vote during the AMA elections, therefore I have a right to complain.
You certainly do have a right to complain. However, just a few posts a go you stated:
"At what point do you stop putting good money after bad."
Using your own analogy, as well as your commitments you identified above, at what number of posts do you determine whether your posts are having any measurable impact on the results you're trying to obtain?
05-21-2016, 07:04 AM
#5148
The whole red thing within a quote is a pain by the way...
As to being accountable for decisions, rest assured I have no fear of that, most of my life was spent being accountable for life and death decisions with respect to mission planning, execution, law enforcement actions I authorized, etc. The issue is time and money.
How do I spend so much time posting? I really don't have to justify that to you. However, since you asked, when I'm away at work - it's a remote worksite. 12 hour day, an hour to hit the gym, and then either TV, read, or iPad something in the evening. Not much outside activities (and certainly no flying) for a number of reasons I won't belabor here. So it's evenings when away where I do my research. When home, it's usually in the mornings over coffee after I've run the kids to school, in between other stuff, if the weather is bad, or just because I feel like it. Again, happy to help if it fits with the very real limits of my work schedule and family commitments. And those home times come in 11 day chunks a month apart - especially when during those same 11 days I have to do all the other stuff that most people do during their off time, including Drs, car repairs, etc. If I do get free time, honestly, I grab one of my helos and go to the park and fly (photo attached for proof).
As to putting good money after bad, that's a fair question. I stopped putting money into the club - three years of dues ($300) w/o going there to fly once was a waste. I wish I'd put that money into batteries or a nicer charger for the stuff I can fly within walking distance. On the AMA, I'm on the fence on that until I see how this CBO, flying rules, FAA, mandatory/non-mandatory membership sorts out (I'm being very general here - please don't nit pick my words). Rough timeline? At least through the end of the year (paid through December anyway).
(oh, and in case you're wondering what I'm doing right now? I'm typing this as I wait for a macro to finish on a 120mb workbook - 700,000 lines - so I can analyze some client financial / operational data).
As to being accountable for decisions, rest assured I have no fear of that, most of my life was spent being accountable for life and death decisions with respect to mission planning, execution, law enforcement actions I authorized, etc. The issue is time and money.
How do I spend so much time posting? I really don't have to justify that to you. However, since you asked, when I'm away at work - it's a remote worksite. 12 hour day, an hour to hit the gym, and then either TV, read, or iPad something in the evening. Not much outside activities (and certainly no flying) for a number of reasons I won't belabor here. So it's evenings when away where I do my research. When home, it's usually in the mornings over coffee after I've run the kids to school, in between other stuff, if the weather is bad, or just because I feel like it. Again, happy to help if it fits with the very real limits of my work schedule and family commitments. And those home times come in 11 day chunks a month apart - especially when during those same 11 days I have to do all the other stuff that most people do during their off time, including Drs, car repairs, etc. If I do get free time, honestly, I grab one of my helos and go to the park and fly (photo attached for proof).
As to putting good money after bad, that's a fair question. I stopped putting money into the club - three years of dues ($300) w/o going there to fly once was a waste. I wish I'd put that money into batteries or a nicer charger for the stuff I can fly within walking distance. On the AMA, I'm on the fence on that until I see how this CBO, flying rules, FAA, mandatory/non-mandatory membership sorts out (I'm being very general here - please don't nit pick my words). Rough timeline? At least through the end of the year (paid through December anyway).
(oh, and in case you're wondering what I'm doing right now? I'm typing this as I wait for a macro to finish on a 120mb workbook - 700,000 lines - so I can analyze some client financial / operational data).
05-21-2016, 07:11 AM
#5149
Ken got a bit perturbed over the personal attacks on that other thread, warned those and it continued. He shut down it down. He won't shut the forum down and has posted in the past that as long as the conversation is civil he had no problems with people expressing their views for or against. I the past he also posted he'll "banish" the violators before shutting down the forum. He also said that if it bothers some that much use the ignore feature. Trust me that works wonders.
As members of the AMA we have the right and responsibility to question or support that organization.
Mike
As members of the AMA we have the right and responsibility to question or support that organization.
Mike
Hi Mike 
In my opinion Ken set a very bad precedent in that thread by going back on his previous statement of not closing threads , and removing problem posters from those threads instead . Your right Mike , More than once he said he'd not allow the bad actions of posters to get a thread closed down , and here we had a thread closed due to people's bad actions . What that does , is it now affirms the strategy of when someone is uncomfortable with a thread's topic , all they have to do is personally attack the thread originator long enough to become a bother to moderate , and then the thread they didn't like gets closed . Despite repeated pictures of Trolls and repeated warnings from Ken that he was going to start censuring people , we ended up with the thread censured instead . I , myself , attacked NO ONE in that thread and repeatedly tried to get people to stop attacking Franklin and start talking about his thread's topic , since Franklin himself WAS talking about his topic all the while deflecting the personal attacks of those who wanted the thread shut down , right till the time the lock was put on it . His thread should have been allowed to continue minus the folks who just couldn't stop taking swipes at him long enough to discuss the thread topic . How our money is spent by the AMA most certainly is as relevant as any other AMA forum topic and difficulty of moderating the problem posters now appears to be reason that any other of those threads could be shut down as well , once the behavior becomes too much of a moderation chore . 
And with that out of the way , to answer the thread's topic question , "are you ready to register your aircraft ?" Well , I guess instead of registering aircraft , we ended up with it being ourselves registered , and the aircraft haven't been registered at all . Kinda funny how that stuff ends up sometimes ......
Last edited by init4fun; 05-21-2016 at 07:17 AM. Reason: fix some typos
05-21-2016, 07:21 AM
#5150
Hi Mike In my opinion Ken set a very bad precedent in that thread by going back on his previous statement of not closing threads , and removing problem posters from those threads instead . Your right Mike , More than once he said he'd not allow the bad actions of posters to get a thread closed down , and here we had a thread closed due to people's bad actions . What that does , is it now affirms the strategy of when someone is uncomfortable with a thread's topic , all they have to do is personally attack the thread originator long enough to become a bother to moderate , and then the thread they didn't like gets closed . Despite repeated pictures of Trolls and repeated warnings from Ken that he was going to start censuring people , we ended up with the thread censured instead . I , myself , attacked NO ONE in that thread and repeatedly tried to get people to stop attacking Franklin and start talking about his thread's topic , since Franklin himself WAS talking about his topic all the while deflecting the personal attacks of those who wanted the thread shut down , right till the time the lock was put on it . His thread should have been allowed to continue minus the folks who just couldn't stop taking swipes at him long enough to discuss the thread topic . How our money is spent by the AMA most certainly is as relevant as any other AMA forum topic and difficulty of moderating the problem posters now appears to be reason that any other of those threads could be shut down as well , once the behavior becomes too much of a moderation chore . And with that out of the way , to answer the thread's topic question , "are you ready to register your aircraft ?" Well , I guess instead of registering aircraft , we ended up with it being ourselves registered , and the aircraft haven't been registered at all . Kinda funny how that stuff ends up sometimes ......