WAKE UP AMA. Another field closed!!
11-15-2015, 02:07 PM
#201
The coast was never going to "be clear", it was either be involved or not be involved. Not a great choice. If one is wondering why reps from the AMA don't come on here and answer questions, the above is a probably one of the reasons.....cynicism. Why bother asking a question when it's already clear the answer isn't going to be accepted. And now a conspiracy with AMA leadership and drone companies? Wow.
11-15-2015, 02:42 PM
#202
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The coast was never going to "be clear", it was either be involved or not be involved. Not a great choice. If one is wondering why reps from the AMA don't come on here and answer questions, the above is a probably one of the reasons.....cynicism. Why bother asking a question when it's already clear the answer isn't going to be accepted. And now a conspiracy with AMA leadership and drone companies? Wow.
Mike
11-15-2015, 02:58 PM
#203
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Take a look at the big picture and read between the lines. Multirotors (MR) have caused a huge disruption in the R/C marketplace. It's plausible that some companies that are not in the MR business appear to be using the negative drone publicity as justification for the AMA distance themselves from MRs, thereby protecting their vested financial interests in their existing non-MR aircraft. Sponsored pilots have jumped on the bandwagon in an effort to support their sponsors and their own financial interests.
This has been discussed ad nauseam in the past with both manufacturers and sponsored pilots in total denial of this blatantly obvious conflict of interest.
This has been discussed ad nauseam in the past with both manufacturers and sponsored pilots in total denial of this blatantly obvious conflict of interest.
The only concern we all have is that the AMA is taking Model Aviation association down a path of government regulation which we do not want or deserve, as the targeted group for this regulation (which has already begun and will only become increasing) is Drones, an not Model Aviation as it has been practiced for 78 years under the AMA.
For the record, Dave Johnson, owner and CEO of Desert Aircraft, has a huge vested interest in Drones: he nevertheless completely agrees that drones need to have their own organization separate from the AMA.
11-15-2015, 03:09 PM
#204
Astro, I'm not Anti Drone either.
I just don't see the urgency to get the AMA involved with FPV style flight until the smoke clears and the government has established rules to control the inevitable abuses that were to be expected.
If the AMA leadership has / had no COI or ties to the toy plane industry in any way, I think we might have seen this whole scenario handled much differently.
There is also a prevailing Belief System being spoon fed into the masses that we must embrace all new things as being "Progressive" and that "Progressive" always equals Good.
Common sense and good judgement are left on the back burner as one example of inept, corrupt and incompetent leadership after another are paraded before our eyes on a daily basis.
There is always plenty of time for the AMA to incorporate FPV style flight AFTER the lines that separate what sets AMA Flyers apart from rogue drone operators has been clearly defined and indelibly etched into the minds of our law makers and of the public.
One question that the AMA leadership should be asked is why they felt the urgent need to dive in before the "Coast was Clear". I would not expect an honest answer to that, nobody there would admit that they wanted to clear a path ASAP for their Buddies in the Drone Industry.
I just don't see the urgency to get the AMA involved with FPV style flight until the smoke clears and the government has established rules to control the inevitable abuses that were to be expected.
If the AMA leadership has / had no COI or ties to the toy plane industry in any way, I think we might have seen this whole scenario handled much differently.
There is also a prevailing Belief System being spoon fed into the masses that we must embrace all new things as being "Progressive" and that "Progressive" always equals Good.
Common sense and good judgement are left on the back burner as one example of inept, corrupt and incompetent leadership after another are paraded before our eyes on a daily basis.
There is always plenty of time for the AMA to incorporate FPV style flight AFTER the lines that separate what sets AMA Flyers apart from rogue drone operators has been clearly defined and indelibly etched into the minds of our law makers and of the public.
One question that the AMA leadership should be asked is why they felt the urgent need to dive in before the "Coast was Clear". I would not expect an honest answer to that, nobody there would admit that they wanted to clear a path ASAP for their Buddies in the Drone Industry.
If that's the truth U sure fooling every one
There is always plenty of time for the AMA to incorporate FPV style flight AFTER the lines that separate what sets AMA Flyers apart from rogue drone operators has been clearly defined and indelibly etched into the minds of our law makers and of the public.
That would be all well and good they are not clairvoyant or have a crystal ball. None of this was foreseeable. What was a big hint though was when the FAA decided to Interpret the amendment #336 to P.L.112-95 completely opposite the way it was intended.
11-15-2015, 03:12 PM
#205
Who is calling for the AMA to distance themselves from Multi Rotor aircraft...?
That's ridiculous.
The MRs fall right in with the choppers at any AMA field that allows choppers.
I'm not a "Chopper Guy", but I'd get a kick out of flying a MR if it has not been Dumbed Down with auto-stability controls that take the skill aspect out of it.
That's ridiculous.
The MRs fall right in with the choppers at any AMA field that allows choppers.
I'm not a "Chopper Guy", but I'd get a kick out of flying a MR if it has not been Dumbed Down with auto-stability controls that take the skill aspect out of it.
11-15-2015, 03:15 PM
#207
Repeating a lie (there is not other word for repeating an untrue and undocumented statement over and over) which comes as a conclusion obtained by faulty logic does not make it true, even if you repeat it "ad nauseam".
The only concern we all have is that the AMA is taking Model Aviation association down a path of government regulation which we do not want or deserve, as the targeted group for this regulation (which has already begun and will only become increasing) is Drones, an not Model Aviation as it has been practiced for 78 years under the AMA.
For the record, Dave Johnson, owner and CEO of Desert Aircraft, has a huge vested interest in Drones: he nevertheless completely agrees that drones need to have their own organization separate from the AMA.
The only concern we all have is that the AMA is taking Model Aviation association down a path of government regulation which we do not want or deserve, as the targeted group for this regulation (which has already begun and will only become increasing) is Drones, an not Model Aviation as it has been practiced for 78 years under the AMA.
For the record, Dave Johnson, owner and CEO of Desert Aircraft, has a huge vested interest in Drones: he nevertheless completely agrees that drones need to have their own organization separate from the AMA.
Lots of concern about the direction of the AMA, but I've yet to see anyone stepping up to the plate and running for office in order change the direction of the AMA, have you?
Last edited by Chris P. Bacon; 11-15-2015 at 03:52 PM.
11-15-2015, 03:35 PM
#208
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Please re-ready my post (#185), it does not identify any specific individuals or companies by name.
Lots of concern about the direction of the AMA, but I've yet to see anyone stepping up to the plate and running for office in order change the direction of the AMA, have you?
Lots of concern about the direction of the AMA, but I've yet to see anyone stepping up to the plate and running for office in order change the direction of the AMA, have you?
In fact, I quoted it in my post!
It does not make your "conflict of interest" statement any more true or accurate.
11-15-2015, 03:36 PM
#209
"I'm not Anti Drone either".
If that's the truth U sure fooling every one
There is always plenty of time for the AMA to incorporate FPV style flight AFTER the lines that separate what sets AMA Flyers apart from rogue drone operators has been clearly defined and indelibly etched into the minds of our law makers and of the public.
That would be all well and good they are not clairvoyant or have a crystal ball. None of this was foreseeable. What was a big hint though was when the FAA decided to Interpret the amendment #336 to P.L.112-95 completely opposite the way it was intended.
If that's the truth U sure fooling every one
There is always plenty of time for the AMA to incorporate FPV style flight AFTER the lines that separate what sets AMA Flyers apart from rogue drone operators has been clearly defined and indelibly etched into the minds of our law makers and of the public.
That would be all well and good they are not clairvoyant or have a crystal ball. None of this was foreseeable. What was a big hint though was when the FAA decided to Interpret the amendment #336 to P.L.112-95 completely opposite the way it was intended.
You did not need to be very "gifted" to foresee the potential for harm, mischief, mayhem and FAA BACKLASH that easily accessible Drones were going to cause.
Weren't YOU one of those who were calling some folks like ME "TIN FOIL HATS" a few years back for voicing our COMMON SENSE PREDICTIONS here....?
11-15-2015, 03:42 PM
#210
Horrace Cain did step up , got shot down , and ain't been seen since ........
11-15-2015, 03:42 PM
#211
Sorry Hound Dog, but it was very easily foreseeable.
You did not need to be very "gifted" to foresee the potential for harm, mischief, mayhem and FAA BACKLASH that easily accessible Drones were going to cause.
Weren't YOU one of those who were calling some folks like ME "TIN FOIL HATS" a few years back for voicing our COMMON SENSE PREDICTIONS here....?
You did not need to be very "gifted" to foresee the potential for harm, mischief, mayhem and FAA BACKLASH that easily accessible Drones were going to cause.
Weren't YOU one of those who were calling some folks like ME "TIN FOIL HATS" a few years back for voicing our COMMON SENSE PREDICTIONS here....?
+1
11-15-2015, 03:46 PM
#212
[QUOTE=Chris P. Bacon......
Lots of concern about the direction of the AMA, but I've yet to see anyone stepping up to the plate and running for office in order change the direction of the AMA, have you?[/QUOTE]
I should remember to use this line with my client next time I fail to perform my duties. If he / she complains about my service I'll just ask them to quit their jobs and then show me how they could do my job any better.....
Yep, that's the ticket...!
LOL.
Lots of concern about the direction of the AMA, but I've yet to see anyone stepping up to the plate and running for office in order change the direction of the AMA, have you?[/QUOTE]
I should remember to use this line with my client next time I fail to perform my duties. If he / she complains about my service I'll just ask them to quit their jobs and then show me how they could do my job any better.....
Yep, that's the ticket...!
LOL.
11-15-2015, 03:51 PM
#213
Yes and he was shot down at this forum by AMA SHILL ACCOUNTS that blew in here like tumbleweeds to spend their days ridiculing and vilifying him and then they mysteriously blew out of here[ just like tumbleweeds do] when their mission was complete.
11-15-2015, 03:55 PM
#214
I don't know how to "re-ready" your post, but I did re-read it.
I'm glad you were able overcome a simple typographical error. Congratulations!
In fact, I quoted it in my post!
Yes you did. You get an "A" for the day!
It does not make your "conflict of interest" statement any more true or accurate.
One would first need to fully understand the definition of a COI before they could apply it.
I'm glad you were able overcome a simple typographical error. Congratulations!
In fact, I quoted it in my post!
Yes you did. You get an "A" for the day!
It does not make your "conflict of interest" statement any more true or accurate.
One would first need to fully understand the definition of a COI before they could apply it.
11-15-2015, 03:58 PM
#215
11-15-2015, 04:01 PM
#216
Anyway , Crispy , you said you know of no one . Well , there ya go , Horrace is someone , and look where his good intentions for the AMA got him ...
11-15-2015, 04:16 PM
#217
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Mike,
11-15-2015, 04:42 PM
#218
You claim that Islandflyer doesn't understand the definition of a conflict of interest. Based on what? Have YOU shown that YOU understand it? ABSOLUTELY NOT! In fact, you have proven in the other thread/post, that you clearly DO NOT understand them.
If you are going to call someone out, it is your responsibility to PROVE your claims, not just strut around and act victorious. If your NOT going to prove your claims, just keep your mouth shut and don't make them to begin with. Just good, common-sense rules to live by in an otherwise good-natured community.
It's hilarious how you speak about how to deal with people in one post, and then make comments like above in others. You are just as hypocritical as your pal!
Regards,
Astro
11-15-2015, 05:29 PM
#220
Island I think you hit some major truths here in #206. What many seem to forget is that even though AMA is a non-profit, it is not a charity, and is a substantial business. In 2013 it reported revenue of $9,026,969 and $17,082,395 of assets on hand. In addition there were $2,512,999 worth of salaries paid out. I bring this up because AMA is not a trivial organization. It is a good size business who stated purpose is "Designed to encourage building of model aircraft, designing and participate in flying contests on the national and international levels. Museum and library are maintained to further educate and assist members." -I got all this from the AMA Form 990 filed with the IRS and available through Guidestar.com. First and foremost, AMA needs to protect model aircraft. Why? That's their promise to us as stated to the USG and us as members. Next, they need to have a strategy that does this. Now, I am not opposed to finding a place for the drone community within AMA. But that's only after traditional model aviation is protected. It seems like the reverse is happening these days. Now, I fully expect that the market is changing and that drones are a cash cow. Well, that's fine and good. But lets not forget that for 65+ years model aviation has been part of our communities and a good neighbor to many. That's the story that needs to be told by the $9M organization we are paying dues to. -Just a thought.
11-15-2015, 05:39 PM
#221
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Island I think you hit some major truths here in #206. What many seem to forget is that even though AMA is a non-profit, it is not a charity, and is a substantial business. In 2013 it reported revenue of $9,026,969 and $17,082,395 of assets on hand. In addition there were $2,512,999 worth of salaries paid out. I bring this up because AMA is not a trivial organization. It is a good size business who stated purpose is "Designed to encourage building of model aircraft, designing and participate in flying contests on the national and international levels. Museum and library are maintained to further educate and assist members." -I got all this from the AMA Form 990 filed with the IRS and available through Guidestar.com. First and foremost, AMA needs to protect model aircraft. Why? That's their promise to us as stated to the USG and us as members. Next, they need to have a strategy that does this. Now, I am not opposed to finding a place for the drone community within AMA. But that's only after traditional model aviation is protected. It seems like the reverse is happening these days. Now, I fully expect that the market is changing and that drones are a cash cow. Well, that's fine and good. But lets not forget that for 65+ years model aviation has been part of our communities and a good neighbor to many. That's the story that needs to be told by the $9M organization we are paying dues to. -Just a thought.
Mike
11-15-2015, 06:11 PM
#222
Island I think you hit some major truths here in #206. What many seem to forget is that even though AMA is a non-profit, it is not a charity, and is a substantial business. In 2013 it reported revenue of $9,026,969 and $17,082,395 of assets on hand. In addition there were $2,512,999 worth of salaries paid out. I bring this up because AMA is not a trivial organization. It is a good size business who stated purpose is "Designed to encourage building of model aircraft, designing and participate in flying contests on the national and international levels. Museum and library are maintained to further educate and assist members." -I got all this from the AMA Form 990 filed with the IRS and available through Guidestar.com. First and foremost, AMA needs to protect model aircraft. Why? That's their promise to us as stated to the USG and us as members. Next, they need to have a strategy that does this. Now, I am not opposed to finding a place for the drone community within AMA. But that's only after traditional model aviation is protected. It seems like the reverse is happening these days. Now, I fully expect that the market is changing and that drones are a cash cow. Well, that's fine and good. But lets not forget that for 65+ years model aviation has been part of our communities and a good neighbor to many. That's the story that needs to be told by the $9M organization we are paying dues to. -Just a thought.
11-15-2015, 06:11 PM
#223
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No, just smart enough to see the tin foil hat level crazy that is often spewed out in these and other forums. Always unsupported without so much as a grain of truth. And the purveyors of this blather always lash out at those who question it. So please...some evidence, otherwise it just looks like mad ramblings.
11-15-2015, 06:14 PM
#224
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Why wouldn't they look for a membership angle as well, which of course comes with dues as well? Like more members and more dues are bad? Don't most organizations want to grow, or at least strengthen themselves? The "drone" fireworks were coming with or without the AMA's involvement....I think most agree on that point.
11-15-2015, 06:20 PM
#225
Island I think you hit some major truths here in #206. What many seem to forget is that even though AMA is a non-profit, it is not a charity, and is a substantial business. In 2013 it reported revenue of $9,026,969 and $17,082,395 of assets on hand. In addition there were $2,512,999 worth of salaries paid out. I bring this up because AMA is not a trivial organization. It is a good size business who stated purpose is "Designed to encourage building of model aircraft, designing and participate in flying contests on the national and international levels. Museum and library are maintained to further educate and assist members." -I got all this from the AMA Form 990 filed with the IRS and available through Guidestar.com. First and foremost, AMA needs to protect model aircraft. Why? That's their promise to us as stated to the USG and us as members. Next, they need to have a strategy that does this. Now, I am not opposed to finding a place for the drone community within AMA. But that's only after traditional model aviation is protected. It seems like the reverse is happening these days. Now, I fully expect that the market is changing and that drones are a cash cow. Well, that's fine and good. But lets not forget that for 65+ years model aviation has been part of our communities and a good neighbor to many. That's the story that needs to be told by the $9M organization we are paying dues to. -Just a thought.