Four Hundred Feet?
01-01-2016, 09:42 PM
#51
Just from slowing down the video and viewing it, I can most assuredly tell you, that the private plane, is, below 500ft, but just barely. He's also more diagonal to you then he is vertically above you. Question is, what's the tallest structure close by your property, because he's supposed to be 500ft above the tallest ground structure....unless, (and there are exceptions to this rule), he's coming in for a landing, or taking off from the airport. From the looks of how the plane was flying, he was going in for a landing.
There is a fairly tall cell phone tower that he flew [more or less] above.The tower is easily taller than 50 feet, closer to 100 feet I'll bet.
01-01-2016, 09:46 PM
#52
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Oh, well in that case, the FAA advises people to notify them in such instances, because that is in violation of Part 91.119, of the FAR, but other than doing that, I'd go out to the airport and try to find out from the pilots, their reason(s), for flying so low, over populated areas. I have a few friends that are private pilots and I've posed the same questions to them, because I'd occasionally have small planes flying lower than 500ft over the field where I used to fly at a lot and I used to never like flying under 1000ft! They all pretty much told me the same reasons, as to why.
Last edited by Maximilionalpha; 01-01-2016 at 09:52 PM.
01-01-2016, 09:50 PM
#53
I've flown here for 20 years, sharing the space with full scale planes [like Paul Allen's WWII fleet] and never experienced what I would call any close encounters and this has been with much larger and faster models than this one.
Maybe I'm just getting old.......
Maybe I'm just getting old.......
01-02-2016, 10:09 AM
#54
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Could not resist having a little fun with this. Given that the measured relative length of an object is directly proportionate to its distance from the viewer one can determine what it's relative size will be at any given distance without having to actually place it at that distance, in this case 500 feet. Using two known measures, in my case a 76" dresser (better yet, use your plane's wingspan) and a 12" ruler, hold the ruler at arm's length, close your non-dominant eye and back away from the object until the length of the ruler equals the length of the object. Measure the distance from you to the object, in my case 86". Solve the equation X = 12(distance in inches of the object at arm's length-could be any length you choose)*86(measured distance in inches from object when covered by 12" held at arm's length)/500(distance in question in feet)*12(converting feet to inches). In this case the 76" dresser would be the same length as 0.172" held at arms length. Wider and it is below 500 feet, wingspan shorter it is above 500 feet. This technique will vary somewhat for each individual depending on the length of their arm and the circumference of their eye, but will give you a very quick and fairly accurate estimation of altitude. What amazed me is just how small (equivalent to looking at a .172 inch wingspan plane at arm's length) a 6+ foot wing span plane appears at 500" Verify it for yourself, if I doubled the distance I was standing from the dresser to 172" it was indeed covered by 6" on the ruler.
01-02-2016, 11:05 AM
#55
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I've been flying for a long time without any altitude limit except the limits of my vision. Now that we have a Federally imposed altitude limit the question arises, just how does one determine a 400 foot altitude?
How will the Model Airplane Police come to my field and factually determine I have exceeded 400 feet?
I have thought about measuring a 400 foot string and attach a helium balloon to it and have someone from a distance away letting me know when I exceed the 400 foot level.
Are there devices that can determine my altitude other than an on-board device?
Any thoughts?
How will the Model Airplane Police come to my field and factually determine I have exceeded 400 feet?
I have thought about measuring a 400 foot string and attach a helium balloon to it and have someone from a distance away letting me know when I exceed the 400 foot level.
Are there devices that can determine my altitude other than an on-board device?
Any thoughts?
h
01-02-2016, 12:41 PM
#56
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Could not resist having a little fun with this. Given that the measured relative length of an object is directly proportionate to its distance from the viewer one can determine what it's relative size will be at any given distance without having to actually place it at that distance, in this case 500 feet. Using two known measures, in my case a 76" dresser (better yet, use your plane's wingspan) and a 12" ruler, hold the ruler at arm's length, close your non-dominant eye and back away from the object until the length of the ruler equals the length of the object. Measure the distance from you to the object, in my case 86". Solve the equation X = 12(distance in inches of the object at arm's length-could be any length you choose)*86(measured distance in inches from object when covered by 12" held at arm's length)/500(distance in question in feet)*12(converting feet to inches). In this case the 76" dresser would be the same length as 0.172" held at arms length. Wider and it is below 500 feet, wingspan shorter it is above 500 feet. This technique will vary somewhat for each individual depending on the length of their arm and the circumference of their eye, but will give you a very quick and fairly accurate estimation of altitude. What amazed me is just how small (equivalent to looking at a .172 inch wingspan plane at arm's length) a 6+ foot wing span plane appears at 500" Verify it for yourself, if I doubled the distance I was standing from the dresser to 172" it was indeed covered by 6" on the ruler.
I was flying a 600mm size Drone at a New Years Eve for a group of spectators. A Qantas A330 flew directly overhead. They appeared roughly the same size in the sky. Some of the spectators actually thought they were going to collide.
01-02-2016, 12:45 PM
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Oh, well in that case, the FAA advises people to notify them in such instances, because that is in violation of Part 91.119, of the FAR, but other than doing that, I'd go out to the airport and try to find out from the pilots, their reason(s), for flying so low, over populated areas. I have a few friends that are private pilots and I've posed the same questions to them, because I'd occasionally have small planes flying lower than 500ft over the field where I used to fly at a lot and I used to never like flying under 1000ft! They all pretty much told me the same reasons, as to why.
Last edited by Rob2160; 01-02-2016 at 12:47 PM.
01-02-2016, 12:54 PM
#58
The usual approach to land is 5 miles to the east of where you saw this guy putting along.
If he had an engine outage where you saw him and he tried to make a 5 mile "bee line" glide back to vacant airport property, could he have made it on a calm day over power lines, 100's of cars, etc....?
01-02-2016, 05:59 PM
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Ok, now that 400 feet is law, a few things to consider. If you are flying in or near a large population center you will have conflicts with civil or commercial aircraft if you repeatedly fly above 400 feet. The question is why would you want to endanger your r/c plane, or the lives of the people in the civil or commercial plane. I am a commercial pilot and we frequently fly as low as 1500 feet as we approach the airport to land. Civil planes are frequently seen flying at 500 feet or a bit higher and no one is going to give them a violation them because there is a tower sticking up 200 feet nearby. The odds of anyone reporting you for exceeding 400 feet are very remote, but could you live with the consequences of a midair with a civil plane? I recently talked to 2 people in the AMA safety office and the basic thought is "fly smart" , which is my advice to all.
01-02-2016, 06:40 PM
#60
Right here. This is what the cops will have. Good price too. We may all need one of these.
https://jet.com/product/detail/9f193...CzQRoC4dXw_wcB
01-02-2016, 07:04 PM
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Right here. This is what the cops will have. Good price too. We may all need one of these.
https://jet.com/product/detail/9f193...CzQRoC4dXw_wcB
https://jet.com/product/detail/9f193...CzQRoC4dXw_wcB
01-02-2016, 07:08 PM
#62
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I've got a question for everyone and then I'm off this thread, because it's run it's course...before the media started calling these aircraft drones, what were you calling them???
01-02-2016, 07:11 PM
#63
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Here's another. Eek! it's from those reckless ignorant drone people. http://www.instructables.com/id/The-...ino-altimeter/
01-02-2016, 07:41 PM
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Good for you, so provide a pointer to where to where folks can buy one.
01-02-2016, 07:55 PM
#66
Rewind the tape way back and we had Maynard Hill with his .60 powered, fixed wing autonomous model fly across the Atlantic.
We also had the military working at it with their big, ugly Unassisted Autonomous Vehicles [I think that's what they called them, or something stupid like that].
We also had the Rutan Bros. involved with a solar powered autonomous plane for gathering weather data if I remember that deal correctly.
I'm not sure when the term Drone first came into popularity [at this forum], so I'm not much help..!!
but at the bottom of the page there is a forum search function where you can look through thread titles.
I DO think the term DRONE is a perfectly accurate and powerful descriptor for planes that are capable of flying into a stadium while I'm sitting outside in my car having a beer..
01-02-2016, 08:04 PM
#67
Too bad the guys who were making the HOWFAST? and HOWHIGH? onboard data collectors quit selling them. I don't think they offered telemetry, but you could look at your highest readings after the plane landed.
If you did this enough times, you could train yourself to be a better judge of height.
I think I demonstrated earlier how easy it is to eat up 400 feet, even with a tiny plane that I was intentionally trying to be safe with.
I don't see why, [with proper coordination] that we can't be allowed more vertical space.
If you did this enough times, you could train yourself to be a better judge of height.
I think I demonstrated earlier how easy it is to eat up 400 feet, even with a tiny plane that I was intentionally trying to be safe with.
I don't see why, [with proper coordination] that we can't be allowed more vertical space.
01-02-2016, 08:15 PM
#68
Telemetry altitude data in real time has been around a long time. My A9 TX will do it. I have a Jeti with voice modulation that will tell you what it is. Real time.
That was not the original question though. Comes back to enforcement. What will the cops point at your plane to tell you you are too high? Bet the speed trap guns won't work!
This is clearly another reason not to register. I would never agree to these terms. Amazing how all of this feels like Obamacare.
That was not the original question though. Comes back to enforcement. What will the cops point at your plane to tell you you are too high? Bet the speed trap guns won't work!
This is clearly another reason not to register. I would never agree to these terms. Amazing how all of this feels like Obamacare.
01-02-2016, 09:53 PM
#71
01-02-2016, 09:54 PM
#73
Too bad the guys who were making the HOWFAST? and HOWHIGH? onboard data collectors quit selling them. I don't think they offered telemetry, but you could look at your highest readings after the plane landed.
If you did this enough times, you could train yourself to be a better judge of height.
I think I demonstrated earlier how easy it is to eat up 400 feet, even with a tiny plane that I was intentionally trying to be safe with.
I don't see why, [with proper coordination] that we can't be allowed more vertical space.
If you did this enough times, you could train yourself to be a better judge of height.
I think I demonstrated earlier how easy it is to eat up 400 feet, even with a tiny plane that I was intentionally trying to be safe with.
I don't see why, [with proper coordination] that we can't be allowed more vertical space.
01-03-2016, 04:33 AM
#74
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If we know the distance from our observation point to the launch pad (d) and the angle at which we can see the top of the rocket's trajectory (θ), we can calculate the altitude with the following equation:
Old school rocketry stuff.
Mike
Old school rocketry stuff.Mike
01-03-2016, 07:04 AM
#75
Ok, now that 400 feet is law, a few things to consider. If you are flying in or near a large population center you will have conflicts with civil or commercial aircraft if you repeatedly fly above 400 feet. The question is why would you want to endanger your r/c plane, or the lives of the people in the civil or commercial plane. I am a commercial pilot and we frequently fly as low as 1500 feet as we approach the airport to land. Civil planes are frequently seen flying at 500 feet or a bit higher and no one is going to give them a violation them because there is a tower sticking up 200 feet nearby. The odds of anyone reporting you for exceeding 400 feet are very remote, but could you live with the consequences of a midair with a civil plane? I recently talked to 2 people in the AMA safety office and the basic thought is "fly smart" , which is my advice to all.