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Old 01-09-2016, 08:27 AM
  #276  
porcia83
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Originally Posted by jelge
Last year I saw a story where a man with a giant scale Extra actually harassed a helicopter working in Illinois. I did an internet search for the story but could not find it today. I originally received it in a fax from an aviation group. I doubt I still have it but if I come across it I will scan it and post it.
Now see that's the kind of person that needs to get the book thrown at them...figuratively and literally. What would ever make a person think that would be a wise thing to do....wow.
Old 01-09-2016, 08:28 AM
  #277  
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Originally Posted by HoundDog
Well, Houndog cited one. The midair between the biplane and the RC model is another.

And it was the HOT Dog "Eddy Rickerbacker" type FOOL in the Bi Plane shown off his BIG TOY. High Speed Smoke on Passes are not approaches to Land so the Full Scale Pilot is Lucky his Hot Dogg'n didn't get him self killed along with a number of spectators.


Count Down timer Till FAA Mandatory Registration:

http://www.timeanddate.com/countdown...ion&font=serif
HD you sure are digging that timer!
Old 01-09-2016, 08:37 AM
  #278  
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Originally Posted by jelge
Last year I saw a story where a man with a giant scale Extra actually harassed a helicopter working in Illinois. I did an internet search for the story but could not find it today. I originally received it in a fax from an aviation group. I doubt I still have it but if I come across it I will scan it and post it.

Originally Posted by porcia83
Now see that's the kind of person that needs to get the book thrown at them...figuratively and literally. What would ever make a person think that would be a wise thing to do....wow.
Better yet take his AMA card.
Old 01-09-2016, 08:41 AM
  #279  
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Originally Posted by porcia83
HD you sure are digging that timer!
Just a reminder wouldn't to see any R/C TOY flyer get in trouble over a 10 digit Alphanumeric Number Got Yours.
Now here's another reminder ....


Count Down timer Till FAA Mandatory Registration:

http://www.timeanddate.com/countdown...ion&font=serif
Old 01-09-2016, 08:46 AM
  #280  
Chris P. Bacon
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Originally Posted by HoundDog
Just a reminder wouldn't to see any R/C TOY flyer get in trouble over a 10 digit Alphanumeric Number Got Yours.
Now here's another reminder ....


Count Down timer Till FAA Mandatory Registration:

http://www.timeanddate.com/countdown...ion&font=serif
I think we have enough reminders already.
Old 01-09-2016, 09:07 AM
  #281  
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How about turbine flyers? Keeping a fast moving jet mdel below 400ft is a severe restriction.
Old 01-09-2016, 09:19 AM
  #282  
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Originally Posted by porcia83
The last report put out by the FAA is questionable, as was the analysis by the AMA that basically reduced the number of "sightings" down to almost nil. I don't know if the truth lies anywhere near the middle...but there are probably more than we don't know about.
Here's a link to report on analysis of FAA data done by a university...you can download complete report at the bottom of the page.

"We counted 158 incidents in which a drone came within 200 feet or less of a manned aircraft (two-thirds of all Close Encounters in which a concrete drone-to-aircraft proximity is given), 51 incidents in which the proximity was 50 feet or less, and 28 incidents in which a pilot maneuvered to avoid a collision with a drone."

http://dronecenter.bard.edu/drone-si...se-encounters/
Old 01-09-2016, 09:21 AM
  #283  
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Originally Posted by Captainbob
How about turbine flyers? Keeping a fast moving jet mdel below 400ft is a severe restriction.

With the majority of manned aircraft t 500'AGL and above (police, fire, EMT/LifeFlite, and news helicopters; agricultural aircraft, and military) all routinely operate at 500' or so... I really think the most reliable way to consistently separate manned and unmanned is altitude. I'm of the belief it's not if there is a 400' AGL restriction nationwide for all non-commercial sUAS/UAS, but rather when.
Old 01-09-2016, 09:23 AM
  #284  
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Originally Posted by HoundDog
Originally Posted by jelge
Last year I saw a story where a man with a giant scale Extra actually harassed a helicopter working in Illinois. I did an internet search for the story but could not find it today. I originally received it in a fax from an aviation group. I doubt I still have it but if I come across it I will scan it and post it.


Better yet take his AMA card.

And yet I'm sure that doesn't appear anywhere in the "safety data" that AMA is presenting to the FAA to prove we're safe. It's an issue of credibility. If FAA knows AMA doesn't track and report on that type of action by members, why should they view AMA data as credible?
Old 01-09-2016, 09:26 AM
  #285  
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Originally Posted by franklin_m
With the majority of manned aircraft t 500'AGL and above (police, fire, EMT/LifeFlite, and news helicopters; agricultural aircraft, and military) all routinely operate at 500' or so... I really think the most reliable way to consistently separate manned and unmanned is altitude. I'm of the belief it's not if there is a 400' AGL restriction nationwide for all non-commercial sUAS/UAS, but rather when.
Can you explain to us why this has not been an issue for the past 8 decades, but suddenly in your mind it should be done??

I fly gliders, IMAC and pattern and not once have I heard or witnessed a situation where they conflicted with manned aircraft. And certainly not one single accident caused by flying over 400 feet.

It appears you are willing to ignore empirical data while trying to satisfy your "gut" feeling on what should be done.


BTW - I have found a new candidate for my ignore list. Looking back over 40 pages of franklin_m's post I have not seen a single one related to actually owning or flying model aircraft. It appears his sole purpose in these forums is to troll the modelers. Buh-Bye!!!

Last edited by Silent-AV8R; 01-09-2016 at 09:33 AM.
Old 01-09-2016, 09:39 AM
  #286  
Chris P. Bacon
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Originally Posted by Silent-AV8R
Can you explain to us why this has not been an issue for the past 8 decades, but suddenly in your mind it should be done??

I fly gliders, IMAC and pattern and not once have I heard or witnessed a situation where they conflicted with manned aircraft. And certainly not one single accident caused by flying over 400 feet.

It appears you are willing to ignore empirical data while trying to satisfy your "gut" feeling on what should be done.


BTW - I have found a new candidate for my ignore list. Looking back over 40 pages of franklin_m's post I have not seen a single one related to actually owning or flying model aircraft. It appears his sole purpose in these forums is to troll the modelers. Buh-Bye!!!
He's a very disgruntled AMA member looking for any and every opportunity conceivable to spite the AMA leadership & AMA membership. No need to take my word for it though, just read his post history and you'll find a common theme there.
Old 01-09-2016, 09:42 AM
  #287  
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Originally Posted by Silent-AV8R
Can you explain to us why this has not been an issue for the past 8 decades, but suddenly in your mind it should be done??
"We counted 158 incidents in which a drone came within 200 feet or less of a manned aircraft (two-thirds of all Close Encounters in which a concrete drone-to-aircraft proximity is given), 51 incidents in which the proximity was 50 feet or less, and 28 incidents in which a pilot maneuvered to avoid a collision with a drone."

http://dronecenter.bard.edu/drone-si...se-encounters/

Oh, as for flying... and Audacity P6, Raptor 50, Trex500, Trex450, Blade 450x, Blade 300x, Sig Somethin' Extra, Great Planes Skybolt, Sailplane built from plans, SureShark built from plans, SureShark XV built from short kit, Sig Wonder, .40CL, .25CL, kitbashed .40 trainer on floats, Golden Age 60 from plans/short kit, Adrenaline Rush (22in ws, 65mph+ pylon racer), quickwing 12mm w/ brushless 5400kv inrunner, Kyosho AutoKite, and others I've fogotten their names.

In fact, but two batteries through one of my 450's this morning.
Old 01-09-2016, 09:44 AM
  #288  
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Originally Posted by Chris P. Bacon
He's a very disgruntled AMA member looking for any and every opportunity conceivable to spite the AMA leadership & AMA membership. No need to take my word for it though, just read his post history and you'll find a common theme there.
I'll freely admit that I'm no fan of the AMA and the decisions that led to the current state of affairs. I don't see how that changes the analysis done by Bard University center that shows there have been several genuine close encounters with manned aircraft.

As you think of those encounters, keep in mind the general public's tolerance for drones hitting airplanes = about zero.
Old 01-09-2016, 10:01 AM
  #289  
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Originally Posted by franklin_m
I mean the Blue Angels can design two different shows based on the ceilings...a "high show" and a "low show.".
Actually, there are three: High, Low, and Flat...depending upon the weather.

Originally Posted by franklin_m
A true requirement is something like stall speed. For example, aircraft are typically limited to less than 250KIAS below 10,000 feet. Some, but not all, types of TACAIR have a waiver for 300KIAS in formation when below 10,000 feet. This is done to maintain acceptable stall margin for the aircraft flying wing.
We were told the TACAIR waiver was for the windmill airstart requirements. For the F-14, 310 KIAS comes to mind...yep, just checked my NATOPS, and it is 310 for the left (295 for the right)...man, not bad recall for an old guy who's not flown the jet since 1987, surprised even myself

(In case some may be wondering why the two numbers, a brief systems 'lecture': the "Combined" hydraulic system, who's pump was driven from the left engine, was the "big ticket" system, powering not just flight controls but other things like landing gear retraction/extension, and therefore placed a higher load/drag on the left engine than the "Flight" hydraulic system placed on the right. Thus, more KIAS were required to spin the left engine up to min re-light rpm for a chance at a windmill start. Class dismissed. Open-book exam tomorrow )

Last edited by VF84sluggo; 01-09-2016 at 10:19 AM.
Old 01-09-2016, 11:05 AM
  #290  
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Originally Posted by VF84sluggo
Actually, there are three: High, Low, and Flat...depending upon the weather.


We were told the TACAIR waiver was for the windmill airstart requirements. For the F-14, 310 KIAS comes to mind...yep, just checked my NATOPS, and it is 310 for the left (295 for the right)...man, not bad recall for an old guy who's not flown the jet since 1987, surprised even myself

(In case some may be wondering why the two numbers, a brief systems 'lecture': the "Combined" hydraulic system, who's pump was driven from the left engine, was the "big ticket" system, powering not just flight controls but other things like landing gear retraction/extension, and therefore placed a higher load/drag on the left engine than the "Flight" hydraulic system placed on the right. Thus, more KIAS were required to spin the left engine up to min re-light rpm for a chance at a windmill start. Class dismissed. Open-book exam tomorrow )
Nicely done! Amazing how those numbers stick in your head eh? I'd imagine you approach flying RC the same way. It's a professionalism thing I think that's hammered into us from day one at Whiting, Corpus, etc. I think for each plane it's different and for different factors. In the double ugly it was for formation. "Combined hydraulic system" wow, haven't heard that in a while myself. Ticking through my mind right now is all the things on the secondary that you lose when you have a hyd failure...lets' see if I can name a few: normal brakes, landing gear extension, hook retract, wing fold, nose wheel steering, flaperon popups, normal flap/slat extension, ....
Old 01-09-2016, 11:53 AM
  #291  
porcia83
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Originally Posted by franklin_m
And yet I'm sure that doesn't appear anywhere in the "safety data" that AMA is presenting to the FAA to prove we're safe. It's an issue of credibility. If FAA knows AMA doesn't track and report on that type of action by members, why should they view AMA data as credible?
Why do you automatically presume this was an AMA cardholder that did this? If he isn't, or this didn't happen at a chartered field....why would the AMA feel the need to advise anyone of this?
Old 01-09-2016, 12:09 PM
  #292  
porcia83
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http://www.thedailybeast.com/article...eople-die.html

Another perspective....he takes shots at the FAA and the AMA.
Old 01-09-2016, 12:23 PM
  #293  
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Originally Posted by porcia83
http://www.thedailybeast.com/article...eople-die.html

Another perspective....he takes shots at the FAA and the AMA.
Wow! Can't say he isn't wrong! I didn't like the fact he stated that the AMA has the least influence. I am sure it is true.
Old 01-09-2016, 01:03 PM
  #294  
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Originally Posted by porcia83
Why do you automatically presume this was an AMA cardholder that did this? If he isn't, or this didn't happen at a chartered field....why would the AMA feel the need to advise anyone of this?
Fair enough. I extrapolated based on comment that it was an IMAC aircraft and that the particular field has since held some events elsewhere. Both led me to conclude it as AMA member.
Old 01-09-2016, 01:06 PM
  #295  
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Originally Posted by RCFlyerDan
Wow! Can't say he isn't wrong! I didn't like the fact he stated that the AMA has the least influence. I am sure it is true.
Concur. Now where is that countdown timer of HoundDogs?

It'll be interesting how AMA tries to "spin" the 19 February announcement that despite their chest thumping that everyone needs to register.
Old 01-09-2016, 01:16 PM
  #296  
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Originally Posted by franklin_m
In fact, but two batteries through one of my 450's this morning.
Franklin! If you flew outside this morning with temperatures in the high 30's to low 40's, you are more of a die hard then I for flying r/c!!! I won't fly if the temperatures are below 65 and of course the visiting snowbirds just laugh!
Old 01-09-2016, 01:22 PM
  #297  
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Originally Posted by RCFlyerDan
Franklin! If you flew outside this morning with temperatures in the high 30's to low 40's, you are more of a die hard then I for flying r/c!!! I won't fly if the temperatures are below 65 and of course the visiting snowbirds just laugh!
Thanks! My personal limit is feeling in the tips of my fingers...especially important with helis. Have some other stuff to do today, and it's misty and damp out now, but this morning was able to sneak out a couple flights.
Old 01-09-2016, 01:33 PM
  #298  
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Originally Posted by franklin_m
Thanks! My personal limit is feeling in the tips of my fingers...especially important with helis. Have some other stuff to do today, and it's misty and damp out now, but this morning was able to sneak out a couple flights.
Yeah! I remember when I lived up North and flew r/c, until late fall, early winter and then again in late winter, prior to spring; leaving the car running with the heater on high to warm my hands in between flights. Glad I don't do that anymore!! LOL>>> Summer time here though, we use a wet rag around the neck to stay cool, and wipe the sweat off.

Last edited by RCFlyerDan; 01-09-2016 at 01:42 PM.
Old 01-09-2016, 01:38 PM
  #299  
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Originally Posted by Chris P. Bacon
He's a very disgruntled AMA member looking for any and every opportunity conceivable to spite the AMA leadership & AMA membership. No need to take my word for it though, just read his post history and you'll find a common theme there.
Chris I don't think it's right to evoke post history against Franklin unless you'd like post history held against you ?

In my last 50 posts , at least 5 were helping actual hobbyists with actual information that is helpful to getting their models to fly .

Each and every one of your posts are here in the AMA forum , arguing some viewpoint or other . Not one post ever about an actual model aircraft .

Does this mean my word matters more than yours , using your all important post history yardstick ?

I think post history really should be put to rest as to whose point matters more . Sometimes I agree with Franklin . Sometimes I disagree with him . Just as , at times , I've both agreed and disagreed with you . Lets keep it to the pure facts of issues , and not go down the ugly path of trying to tear down positions by tearing down people with attacks on things like post history .
Old 01-09-2016, 02:09 PM
  #300  
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Originally Posted by porcia83
http://www.thedailybeast.com/article...eople-die.html

Another perspective....he takes shots at the FAA and the AMA.
I don't think he took a shot at the AMA. Seemed almost complementary.


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