Four Hundred Feet?
01-10-2016, 12:49 PM
#351
Ive got some land and some relatives near Bar Harbor , and my family up there calls us Mass. drivers "Mass holes" for our rude driving habits . 
01-10-2016, 02:22 PM
#360
Time will tell.
01-10-2016, 03:04 PM
#361
He said "its under review," but then again I doubt he'd walk into that audience and drop a bombshell like a hard 400' limit. While it still might not happen, I don't know how they're going to maintain traffic separation from full scale if they allow unrestricted flights up in same airspace as manned aircraft.
Time will tell.
Time will tell.
He (FAA) made a lot of references to 336 and CBO. I got no feeling that Hoot was hiding anything about 400 feet. But some people see wolves everywhere. Who knows.
I am going to go ahead and register.
01-10-2016, 03:35 PM
#362
And pray tell How many AG Planes have flown directly over or even within 1 mile of any ones AMA flying site.
I can say at least one last summer made about 10 trips in and out of the Airport on which our
RC field is located. that's here https://www.google.com/maps/place/Oc...2f7545fd?hl=en
I can say at least one last summer made about 10 trips in and out of the Airport on which our
RC field is located. that's here https://www.google.com/maps/place/Oc...2f7545fd?hl=en
01-10-2016, 03:47 PM
#364
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Sydney, AUSTRALIA
Posts: 4,786
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
YES! a court would uphold the guidelines. There was a case a while back where an Ag pilot hit an unmarked tower and died. The tower was shorter than the law actually required to be marked but there was separate guidance in the form of an "AC" from the FAA on how to mark the tower and the court upheld it and found the tower owner liable for the accident. This was a big win for aviation because these nearly invisible unmarked towers were popping up all over the place just few inches shorter than the law required marking and they represent an extreme hazard to low flying aircraft.
01-10-2016, 03:49 PM
#365
I was surprised when Hoot Gibson turned out to be working for the FAA now, in UAS integration. He has between an AMA ambassador for a long time.
He (FAA) made a lot of references to 336 and CBO. I got no feeling that Hoot was hiding anything about 400 feet. But some people see wolves everywhere. Who knows.
I am going to go ahead and register.
He (FAA) made a lot of references to 336 and CBO. I got no feeling that Hoot was hiding anything about 400 feet. But some people see wolves everywhere. Who knows.
I am going to go ahead and register.
Different guy. The FAA's "Hoot Gibson" is Marke Gibson ( https://www.faa.gov/news/updates/?newsId=83628 ). The "Hoot Gibson" that's been the AMA ambassador is Robert L Gibson ( http://www.modelaircraft.org/news/HootGibson.aspx ).
01-10-2016, 03:51 PM
#366
And pray tell How many AG Planes have flown directly over or even within 1 mile of any ones AMA flying site.
I can say at least one last summer made about 10 trips in and out of the Airport on which our
RC field is located. that's here https://www.google.com/maps/place/Oc...2f7545fd?hl=en
I can say at least one last summer made about 10 trips in and out of the Airport on which our
RC field is located. that's here https://www.google.com/maps/place/Oc...2f7545fd?hl=en
01-10-2016, 03:56 PM
#367
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Sydney, AUSTRALIA
Posts: 4,786
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
However, I have a great interest in this topic as my full size job involves flying an N registered jet with an FAA ATP Licence, we spend on average 3 months of each year in the USA (mainly Arizona) and while there I fly RC regularly.
Last edited by Rob2160; 01-10-2016 at 04:47 PM. Reason: typos.
01-10-2016, 04:40 PM
#368
None of this affect me at all when flying down under.
However, I have a great interest in this topic as my full size job involves flying an N registered jet with an FAA Licence, we spend on average 3 months of each year in the USA (mainly Arizona) and while there I fly RC regularly.
However, I have a great interest in this topic as my full size job involves flying an N registered jet with an FAA Licence, we spend on average 3 months of each year in the USA (mainly Arizona) and while there I fly RC regularly.
Rob; This subject would concern me too with an FAA ATP. I truly see this is not the end of these restrictions, but the beginning. I soon see that the FAA/FAA Medical will soon be tied to r/c models. Why? Because they can! I also see, that if a pilot lost his medical for a none r/c issue; that if he can't legally fly as a full scale, the pilot can't fly r/c. Not to mention how the FAA medical is tied to our driver's license for DUI's, speeding tickets, etc. Too many DUI's or speeding tickets, a pilot looses his medical, thus looses his job and the way he was trained to make a living.
01-10-2016, 04:50 PM
#369
He said "its under review," but then again I doubt he'd walk into that audience and drop a bombshell like a hard 400' limit. While it still might not happen, I don't know how they're going to maintain traffic separation from full scale if they allow unrestricted flights up in same airspace as manned aircraft.
Time will tell.
Time will tell.
An area of 1/4 mile Radius up to 1500' is not a lot to ask. It's less than two tenths of a square mile in area where just 1 airport of 5 mile radius covers 78.53 Square Miles.. That's 3,948 Times the size of 1 R/C Flight area. If all 2366 AMA fields had a 1/4 mile radius protected area that's less area than just 6 airports of the Over 1200 towered airports.
According to government issued databases, there are about 14000 airports in the U.S. Of those only about 5000 have paved runways. And out of that 5000, there are only 376 that have regularly scheduled airline service.
According to the CIA World Factbook (refer to the link, below), there were 14,951 airports in the fifty U.S. States, as of 2008. As of 2010, the CIA reports that there were 15,079 airports in the United States.
01-10-2016, 05:09 PM
#370
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Vestal, NY
Posts: 5
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The 400 foot "rule" seems to have odd history This was first published in 1981, FAA AC 91-57. clearly states 400 feet limit. This AC was replaced in Sept 2015 by AC 91-57A, which has no limit specified. The AMA web site calls out AC 91-57, I contacted them when 91-57A was released. They told me they had some objections to the AC, therefore they only reference 91-57.
So, the FAA sUAS certificate calls out 400 feet, the AMA says there is no limit specified. So, it appears to me both sides are "cherry picking" through the documents. What can you expect when this was all done in 5 weeks.
So, the FAA sUAS certificate calls out 400 feet, the AMA says there is no limit specified. So, it appears to me both sides are "cherry picking" through the documents. What can you expect when this was all done in 5 weeks.
01-10-2016, 05:27 PM
#371
YOU are the one comparing aircraft to other vehicles and equipment wanting horns and such.
I just mentioned horns as one means of an alert system.
YOU are the one insisting the pilot should have risked killing himself for an unseen and unknown hazard. I find it highly doubtful you would have done differently. It is very easy to Monday morning quarterback and karma is *****. I hope you do not have find out what it is like to think you are in the clear only to find out differently afterwards then have everyone pick apart your actions without any pertinent information what so ever.
So you saying the pilot was justified in killing an innocent civilian on the ground in order to minimize risk to himself and his aircraft?
You seem to think I favor adding regulations. If that is the case... YOU ARE WRONG! Unfortunately the explosion of technology and the abuse of that technology is forcing the issue. I hate it when the majority is punished for the actions of a few.
I just mentioned horns as one means of an alert system.
YOU are the one insisting the pilot should have risked killing himself for an unseen and unknown hazard. I find it highly doubtful you would have done differently. It is very easy to Monday morning quarterback and karma is *****. I hope you do not have find out what it is like to think you are in the clear only to find out differently afterwards then have everyone pick apart your actions without any pertinent information what so ever.
So you saying the pilot was justified in killing an innocent civilian on the ground in order to minimize risk to himself and his aircraft?
You seem to think I favor adding regulations. If that is the case... YOU ARE WRONG! Unfortunately the explosion of technology and the abuse of that technology is forcing the issue. I hate it when the majority is punished for the actions of a few.
01-10-2016, 05:30 PM
#372
And pray tell How many AG Planes have flown directly over or even within 1 mile of any ones AMA flying site.
I can say at least one last summer made about 10 trips in and out of the Airport on which our
RC field is located. that's here https://www.google.com/maps/place/Oc...2f7545fd?hl=en
I can say at least one last summer made about 10 trips in and out of the Airport on which our
RC field is located. that's here https://www.google.com/maps/place/Oc...2f7545fd?hl=en
01-10-2016, 05:34 PM
#373
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Sydney, AUSTRALIA
Posts: 4,786
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Not really, I fly 550 size helis and do aerobatics with them. I position myself at the far end of a park so the single entrance point is clearly within my field of view. Its actually hard to miss people even 300 feet away and if they start walking towards me I land.
Last edited by Rob2160; 01-10-2016 at 05:37 PM.
01-10-2016, 05:42 PM
#374
I'll answer both posts. Yes, I fly at a school field that's big enough for me to see 100' in all directions from my heli. I'm not so overtasked flying mentally that I can't scan from time to time around me -- in the jet we call it mission cross check time. It's like a little alarm clock that goes off in your head every few seconds. I've been trained to do it for 20+ years and it works. Now maybe that's too much for you, in which case you probably need to plan for that and allow a lot more space, controls, or not fly. Even when I'm flying at a club field, I'm the guy that "notices" everything - cars driving up, out of control aircraft, etc. Again, decades of training to develop and maintain situational awareness in environments that are much more mentally tasking, where things move much faster, and where if you're wrong they send a chaplain to your house.
So yes, I can scan the area, maintain situational awareness, and if someone comes into the area at all, dog on or off leash, then I land.
So your entire justification for "you" to fly at a public school without need for AMA is based solely on your training and flying style? Are you implying no one else should be allowed to fly there due to their lack or training of the fact that they may fly a more demanding flight routine that may affect their situational awareness?
As for the other failures, they're prevented through thorough preflights, redundancy (in some cases), failsafes, and operational limits that allow if something does happen, it's damage to the aircraft only. In case you haven't noticed, helis are inherently unstable, and absent control and if at low altitude, they generally crash within a few rotor diameters if you lose signal.
How do you pre-flight for a potential catastrophic servo failure? How about an internal short in a battery? What redundancies have you implemented on your aircraft?
And no...in over 10 years of flying so far, I've not had one flyaway. EVER. Because I know the limits of my equipment, expect failures, plan for them, and then impose on myself operational limitations that even if everything goes wrong at once, only the aircraft is destroyed.
Sounds impressive, but as you're well aware, there's only so much you can do. Additionally, how would you know the limits of you equipment unless you've tested it to the point of failure?
So yes, I can scan the area, maintain situational awareness, and if someone comes into the area at all, dog on or off leash, then I land.
So your entire justification for "you" to fly at a public school without need for AMA is based solely on your training and flying style? Are you implying no one else should be allowed to fly there due to their lack or training of the fact that they may fly a more demanding flight routine that may affect their situational awareness?
As for the other failures, they're prevented through thorough preflights, redundancy (in some cases), failsafes, and operational limits that allow if something does happen, it's damage to the aircraft only. In case you haven't noticed, helis are inherently unstable, and absent control and if at low altitude, they generally crash within a few rotor diameters if you lose signal.
How do you pre-flight for a potential catastrophic servo failure? How about an internal short in a battery? What redundancies have you implemented on your aircraft?
And no...in over 10 years of flying so far, I've not had one flyaway. EVER. Because I know the limits of my equipment, expect failures, plan for them, and then impose on myself operational limitations that even if everything goes wrong at once, only the aircraft is destroyed.
Sounds impressive, but as you're well aware, there's only so much you can do. Additionally, how would you know the limits of you equipment unless you've tested it to the point of failure?
01-10-2016, 06:05 PM
#375
0WI8 a private restricted airport that has been in existence for for over 85 years has it's days numbered. Thought it was gone 10 years ago when the Owner was selling off the family farm 5/8 of a mile south of our airport and started selling quarter acre lots for $78K to $110K then the housing crisis hit and we got a reprieve. Well 2 years ago a housing area was started 2200 feet to the SSE from where stand to fly and worse yet we fly toward them. We Might be able to keep our R/C field by going all electric. Who Knows.