Four Hundred Feet?
#626
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I first tried a ducted fan electric jet over ten years ago and the brushed motor was so underpowered it barely flew.
Brushless motors and LiPos changed everything.
Last edited by Rob2160; 01-22-2016 at 09:49 PM.
#627
My Feedback: (21)
We can assume something more sensible was done before the LEs landed on that field, yet odds are it wasn't, due to the simple fact they did land on the field. Are the odds worth playing that this was not their first resort as to whom was to blame? Go for it if you like and get all the info of how it was handled, then let us know.
If I am wrong about the local LEs, I will retract any of my statements that may have been in error.
#628
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I disagree with you. I totally got the point I was making. Based on the information we have from the video, I maintain this was handled poorly by the LEs. As far as the local RC guys, I did not comment on how they handled the situation. Maybe you were reading something into the post that was not there?
We can assume something more sensible was done before the LEs landed on that field, yet odds are it wasn't, due to the simple fact they did land on the field. Are the odds worth playing that this was not their first resort as to whom was to blame? Go for it if you like and get all the info of how it was handled, then let us know.
If I am wrong about the local LEs, I will retract any of my statements that may have been in error.
We can assume something more sensible was done before the LEs landed on that field, yet odds are it wasn't, due to the simple fact they did land on the field. Are the odds worth playing that this was not their first resort as to whom was to blame? Go for it if you like and get all the info of how it was handled, then let us know.
If I am wrong about the local LEs, I will retract any of my statements that may have been in error.
This is why they landed but when the Club safety officer assured them it wasn't any of his club members they were happy and left. The Police didn't mention FAA registration at all. ( I got these details second hand but I think that is the gist of it)
#629
Banned
My Feedback: (8)
All's well that ends well. If I were the cop I would have probably done the same thing, it's a natural conclusion for him to have made. The club handled it well (per the video) and didn't take it to another level.
This will happen more and more, so clubs need to talk about it and come up with a plan. My club does, and this week I went to another clubs meeting and discussed this issue as well. They are on a busier street and about a mile away from an active runway, right in the approach. We had a copy of the FAA directions to local LE to go over as well. In short, bring the aircraft down, have a chat, have your card ready, and that is that. An "attitude" isn't going to help any situation.
This will happen more and more, so clubs need to talk about it and come up with a plan. My club does, and this week I went to another clubs meeting and discussed this issue as well. They are on a busier street and about a mile away from an active runway, right in the approach. We had a copy of the FAA directions to local LE to go over as well. In short, bring the aircraft down, have a chat, have your card ready, and that is that. An "attitude" isn't going to help any situation.
#630
My Feedback: (21)
All's well that ends well. If I were the cop I would have probably done the same thing, it's a natural conclusion for him to have made. The club handled it well (per the video) and didn't take it to another level.
This will happen more and more, so clubs need to talk about it and come up with a plan. My club does, and this week I went to another clubs meeting and discussed this issue as well. They are on a busier street and about a mile away from an active runway, right in the approach. We had a copy of the FAA directions to local LE to go over as well. In short, bring the aircraft down, have a chat, have your card ready, and that is that. An "attitude" isn't going to help any situation.
This will happen more and more, so clubs need to talk about it and come up with a plan. My club does, and this week I went to another clubs meeting and discussed this issue as well. They are on a busier street and about a mile away from an active runway, right in the approach. We had a copy of the FAA directions to local LE to go over as well. In short, bring the aircraft down, have a chat, have your card ready, and that is that. An "attitude" isn't going to help any situation.
As you put it, "clubs need to come up with a plan". I think clubs need to address this issue and have a solid plan on how they will handle it - especially clubs in busy areas as they are more likely to encounter this. I question how many clubs will make the needed effort - they will deal with the results of the lack of effort they put in.
Out of all the variables, I think location of an RC field is probably the biggest one. Heavily populated areas are more likely to get reports and sightings of "drones" as most (not all) of your reckless drone flyers are kids and adults in neighborhoods that choose to do stupid acts. Any RC field in close proximity will have a lot to deal with.
We all know it will happen. It is just how we address it. I realize we do not have all the facts in the video, yet being solutions minded does not negate addressing when issues might have been mishandled. Calling out the possibility of someone not using good judgment does not need to be categorized as negative.
#631
Banned
My Feedback: (8)
I agree and I would have done the same thing as well because if I were not properly trained and educated how would I have known that the local RC clubs are not the problem?
As you put it, "clubs need to come up with a plan". I think clubs need to address this issue and have a solid plan on how they will handle it - especially clubs in busy areas as they are more likely to encounter this. I question how many clubs will make the needed effort - they will deal with the results of the lack of effort they put in.
Out of all the variables, I think location of an RC field is probably the biggest one. Heavily populated areas are more likely to get reports and sightings of "drones" as most (not all) of your reckless drone flyers are kids and adults in neighborhoods that choose to do stupid acts. Any RC field in close proximity will have a lot to deal with.
We all know it will happen. It is just how we address it. I realize we do not have all the facts in the video, yet being solutions minded does not negate addressing when issues might have been mishandled. Calling out the possibility of someone not using good judgment does not need to be categorized as negative.
As you put it, "clubs need to come up with a plan". I think clubs need to address this issue and have a solid plan on how they will handle it - especially clubs in busy areas as they are more likely to encounter this. I question how many clubs will make the needed effort - they will deal with the results of the lack of effort they put in.
Out of all the variables, I think location of an RC field is probably the biggest one. Heavily populated areas are more likely to get reports and sightings of "drones" as most (not all) of your reckless drone flyers are kids and adults in neighborhoods that choose to do stupid acts. Any RC field in close proximity will have a lot to deal with.
We all know it will happen. It is just how we address it. I realize we do not have all the facts in the video, yet being solutions minded does not negate addressing when issues might have been mishandled. Calling out the possibility of someone not using good judgment does not need to be categorized as negative.
The same should be said for anyone deciding to fly at a location other than a club as well. Keep a cool and calm head when approached by LE. You never know if they are were called by someone else to investigate, or really just want to chat because they are interested in getting into the hobby.
#632
I disagree with you. I totally got the point I was making. Based on the information we have from the video, I maintain this was handled poorly by the LEs. As far as the local RC guys, I did not comment on how they handled the situation. Maybe you were reading something into the post that was not there?
We can assume something more sensible was done before the LEs landed on that field, yet odds are it wasn't, due to the simple fact they did land on the field. Are the odds worth playing that this was not their first resort as to whom was to blame? Go for it if you like and get all the info of how it was handled, then let us know.
If I am wrong about the local LEs, I will retract any of my statements that may have been in error.
We can assume something more sensible was done before the LEs landed on that field, yet odds are it wasn't, due to the simple fact they did land on the field. Are the odds worth playing that this was not their first resort as to whom was to blame? Go for it if you like and get all the info of how it was handled, then let us know.
If I am wrong about the local LEs, I will retract any of my statements that may have been in error.
That's how life works, you can never predict when LE is going to visit so it's always a good idea for a club and its members to be prepared not only on how to deal with the situation, but also how to capitalize on an opportunity to make the most of the situation to educate LE about the club, its operations, and contact information. Of course, cop an attitude, tell LE they're all wrong, and maybe, just maybe, you'll get an unwelcoming return visit.
Last edited by Chris P. Bacon; 01-23-2016 at 06:17 AM.
#633
I liken it to Vacuum tubes , of which I am a Vacuum tube radio collector . There are literally thousands of Antique radio collectors who preserve Vacuum tube radios , even though the Vacuum tube past the torch onto the Transistor some 60 or so years ago .
Here's 4 of the real deal . Actual 1920s radios with Vacuum tubes , restored and playable . No "Thomas reproduction" junk here .....
#635
Rob, what point were you trying to make with that 4:18 video..?
That an engine could make 4 props rotate fast enough to stir up the air..?
Do you understand why / how many ways an engine powered, toy scale quad is at a disadvantage / inferior to direct drive electric..?
Especially for the mass toy level market..?
If not, there isn't enough time to go into it here.
Do you understand the point that Vertical Grimace was trying to make or were you just looking for a reason to show us how ANYTHING is possible, no matter how impractical, mechanically flawed, archaic, unnecessarily complex, convoluted, Rube Goldbergish, Homer Simpsonish, economically unfeasible the contraption may be...?
That an engine could make 4 props rotate fast enough to stir up the air..?
Do you understand why / how many ways an engine powered, toy scale quad is at a disadvantage / inferior to direct drive electric..?
Especially for the mass toy level market..?
If not, there isn't enough time to go into it here.
Do you understand the point that Vertical Grimace was trying to make or were you just looking for a reason to show us how ANYTHING is possible, no matter how impractical, mechanically flawed, archaic, unnecessarily complex, convoluted, Rube Goldbergish, Homer Simpsonish, economically unfeasible the contraption may be...?
#637
Apparently the police were friendly and did not target that RC field specifically. They heard the report of a drone sighting at 3,100ft over the radio and happened to be flying past the field and noticed one of the pilots on the ground wearing FPV goggles.
This is why they landed but when the Club safety officer assured them it wasn't any of his club members they were happy and left. The Police didn't mention FAA registration at all. ( I got these details second hand but I think that is the gist of it)
This is why they landed but when the Club safety officer assured them it wasn't any of his club members they were happy and left. The Police didn't mention FAA registration at all. ( I got these details second hand but I think that is the gist of it)
#638
Seriously?? You clearly have no understanding about how the police operate and what they are allowed to do? Also, if the helicopter was trespassing why would a radio car not also be trespassing??
#639
I'll agree with this , because once there aren't enough buyers to keep the manufacturing profitable , the glow engine manufacturing will cease . There will always be motorheads and folks with sentimental attachments to glow engines as a "niche market" , but as a mass market power source for our models ? Glow has already "seen it's days" and is "well past it's prime" . The Lipo was the very last nail in Glow's coffin as far as being the most employed power source in our hobby .
I liken it to Vacuum tubes , of which I am a Vacuum tube radio collector . There are literally thousands of Antique radio collectors who preserve Vacuum tube radios , even though the Vacuum tube past the torch onto the Transistor some 60 or so years ago .
Here's 4 of the real deal . Actual 1920s radios with Vacuum tubes , restored and playable . No "Thomas reproduction" junk here .....
I liken it to Vacuum tubes , of which I am a Vacuum tube radio collector . There are literally thousands of Antique radio collectors who preserve Vacuum tube radios , even though the Vacuum tube past the torch onto the Transistor some 60 or so years ago .
Here's 4 of the real deal . Actual 1920s radios with Vacuum tubes , restored and playable . No "Thomas reproduction" junk here .....
#640
And yes I do know and you clearly do not.
#641
yep , and ya can just walk right into any old Sears or Macys and buy a Vacuum tube radio or HI FI , Eh Sport ?
My point exactly was that yes they still DO exist , even after not being "MASS MARKET" for some 60 or more years . And It'll be the same for glow .
But neither will be as readily available in the future as they were in their heyday past .................................................. ....................
My point exactly was that yes they still DO exist , even after not being "MASS MARKET" for some 60 or more years . And It'll be the same for glow .
But neither will be as readily available in the future as they were in their heyday past .................................................. ....................
Last edited by init4fun; 01-23-2016 at 09:26 AM. Reason: forgot a word .....
#642
I may be wrong, but only if the property was public. You are allowed to drive into an open driveway and/or walk to an open door. But you are not allowed to be on any other part of the property. I think that is pretty much true for all 50 states. But even if public property it was stupid because the helicopter was at risk of getting hit by a model.
And yes I do know and you clearly do not.
And yes I do know and you clearly do not.
#643
My Feedback: (49)
Originally Posted by HoundDog
First page of 195 pages of the sUAV NPRM
21
ALL RIGHT sport read what from where to in the 195 pages Is Your skull so thick or U so lazy U can't provide the Info Sorry but that's how it is.
Page 8 of 195 Explination of the NPM
A. Comments InvitedB. Availability of Rulemaking DocumentsI. Executive SummaryA. Purpose of the Regulatory ActionThis rulemaking proposes operating requirements to allow small unmanned aircraftsystems (small UAS) to operate for non-hobby or non-recreational purposes. A small UASconsists of a small unmanned aircraft (which, as defined by statute, is an unmanned aircraftweighing less than 55 pounds3) and equipment necessary for the safe and efficientoperation of that aircraft. The FAA has accommodated non-recreational small UAS usethrough various mechanisms, such as special airworthiness certificates, exemptions, andcertificates of waiver or authorization (COA). This proposed rule would be the next phaseof integrating small UAS into the NAS.The following are examples of possible small UAS operations that could beconducted under this proposed framework:
Crop monitoring/inspection;
Research and development;
Educational/academic uses;
Power-line/pipeline inspection in hilly or mountainous terrain;
Antenna inspections;
Aiding certain rescue operations such as locating snow avalanche victims;
This only covers UAS for Non recreational.
Where is the stuff for Us Please...
First page of 195 pages of the sUAV NPRM
21
Page 8 of 195 Explination of the NPM
A. Comments InvitedB. Availability of Rulemaking DocumentsI. Executive SummaryA. Purpose of the Regulatory ActionThis rulemaking proposes operating requirements to allow small unmanned aircraftsystems (small UAS) to operate for non-hobby or non-recreational purposes. A small UASconsists of a small unmanned aircraft (which, as defined by statute, is an unmanned aircraftweighing less than 55 pounds3) and equipment necessary for the safe and efficientoperation of that aircraft. The FAA has accommodated non-recreational small UAS usethrough various mechanisms, such as special airworthiness certificates, exemptions, andcertificates of waiver or authorization (COA). This proposed rule would be the next phaseof integrating small UAS into the NAS.The following are examples of possible small UAS operations that could beconducted under this proposed framework:
Crop monitoring/inspection;
Research and development;
Educational/academic uses;
Power-line/pipeline inspection in hilly or mountainous terrain;
Antenna inspections;
Aiding certain rescue operations such as locating snow avalanche victims;
This only covers UAS for Non recreational.
Where is the stuff for Us Please...
Last edited by HoundDog; 01-23-2016 at 09:29 AM.
#644
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I'll agree with this , because once there aren't enough buyers to keep the manufacturing profitable , the glow engine manufacturing will cease . There will always be motorheads and folks with sentimental attachments to glow engines as a "niche market" , but as a mass market power source for our models ? Glow has already "seen it's days" and is "well past it's prime" . The Lipo was the very last nail in Glow's coffin as far as being the most employed power source in our hobby .
I liken it to Vacuum tubes , of which I am a Vacuum tube radio collector . There are literally thousands of Antique radio collectors who preserve Vacuum tube radios , even though the Vacuum tube past the torch onto the Transistor some 60 or so years ago .
Here's 4 of the real deal . Actual 1920s radios with Vacuum tubes , restored and playable . No "Thomas reproduction" junk here .....
I liken it to Vacuum tubes , of which I am a Vacuum tube radio collector . There are literally thousands of Antique radio collectors who preserve Vacuum tube radios , even though the Vacuum tube past the torch onto the Transistor some 60 or so years ago .
Here's 4 of the real deal . Actual 1920s radios with Vacuum tubes , restored and playable . No "Thomas reproduction" junk here .....
#645
Senior Member
My Feedback: (3)
yep , and ya can just walk right into any old Sears or Macys and buy a Vacuum tube radio or HI FI , Eh Sport ?
My point exactly was that yes they still DO exist , even after not being "MASS MARKET" for some 60 or more years . And It'll be the same for glow .
But neither will be as readily available in the future as they were in their heyday past
.................................................. ..................
My point exactly was that yes they still DO exist , even after not being "MASS MARKET" for some 60 or more years . And It'll be the same for glow .
But neither will be as readily available in the future as they were in their heyday past
.................................................. ..................
I also prefer a power source that gains power and loses weight as the tank empties out.
#646
My Feedback: (49)
I'll agree with this , because once there aren't enough buyers to keep the manufacturing profitable , the glow engine manufacturing will cease . There will always be motorheads and folks with sentimental attachments to glow engines as a "niche market" , but as a mass market power source for our models ? Glow has already "seen it's days" and is "well past it's prime" . The Lipo was the very last nail in Glow's coffin as far as being the most employed power source in our hobby .
I liken it to Vacuum tubes , of which I am a Vacuum tube radio collector . There are literally thousands of Antique radio collectors who preserve Vacuum tube radios , even though the Vacuum tube past the torch onto the Transistor some 60 or so years ago .
Here's 4 of the real deal . Actual 1920s radios with Vacuum tubes , restored and playable . No "Thomas reproduction" junk here ....
.
I liken it to Vacuum tubes , of which I am a Vacuum tube radio collector . There are literally thousands of Antique radio collectors who preserve Vacuum tube radios , even though the Vacuum tube past the torch onto the Transistor some 60 or so years ago .
Here's 4 of the real deal . Actual 1920s radios with Vacuum tubes , restored and playable . No "Thomas reproduction" junk here ....
.
have made a difference as have ARF's and Foam
airplanes.
Lipos still don't have the power to weight ratio (ie flight time) of either Glow fuel or Gas or even Jet A or Kero that Turbines have. Likewise a 3 to 4 minute flight in an Electric ducted fan and an 30 to 45 minute charge are barley tolerable. A glow engine doesn't HAVE to be back on the ground in 6 minutes or ruin the expensive batteries... Also Motors and speed controls & Lipos are still expensive and sensitive. Then the support equipment is expensive. Chargers, Power supplies and Power source ie a Large expensive Deep Cycle Battery or a thousand dollar generators. Lipos are very sensitive and dangerous when mishandled.
The Next generation of Battery Technology will make Electric more viable and eventually less expensive. It will not Religate GLOW to the museum.
#647
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Wrong again INIT Glow is alive and well. Granted Lipos
have made a difference as have ARF's and Foam
airplanes.
Lipos still don't have the power to weight ratio (ie flight time) of either Glow fuel or Gas or even Jet A or Kero that Turbines have. Likewise a 3 to 4 minute flight in an Electric ducted fan and an 30 to 45 minute charge are barley tolerable. A glow engine doesn't HAVE to be back on the ground in 6 minutes or ruin the expensive batteries... Also Motors and speed controls & Lipos are still expensive and sensitive. Then the support equipment is expensive. Chargers, Power supplies and Power source ie a Large expensive Deep Cycle Battery or a thousand dollar generators. Lipos are very sensitive and dangerous when mishandled.
The Next generation of Battery Technology will make Electric more viable and eventually less expensive. It will not Religate GLOW to the museum.
have made a difference as have ARF's and Foam
airplanes.
Lipos still don't have the power to weight ratio (ie flight time) of either Glow fuel or Gas or even Jet A or Kero that Turbines have. Likewise a 3 to 4 minute flight in an Electric ducted fan and an 30 to 45 minute charge are barley tolerable. A glow engine doesn't HAVE to be back on the ground in 6 minutes or ruin the expensive batteries... Also Motors and speed controls & Lipos are still expensive and sensitive. Then the support equipment is expensive. Chargers, Power supplies and Power source ie a Large expensive Deep Cycle Battery or a thousand dollar generators. Lipos are very sensitive and dangerous when mishandled.
The Next generation of Battery Technology will make Electric more viable and eventually less expensive. It will not Religate GLOW to the museum.
I'll happily agree with you on flight times but some of these top acro multicopters now have thrust to weight ratios around 14 to 1. That is based on the entire flying weight, not just the motors. e.g. 14 lb thrust in a 1 lb. model.
Maybe that thrust to weight ratio also exists in glow powered fixed wing aircraft too but personally I have not seen one. Would love to if anyone has a link?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d6sz8bquB50
Last edited by Rob2160; 01-23-2016 at 07:25 PM.
#648
Wrong again INIT Glow is alive and well. Granted Lipos
have made a difference as have ARF's and Foam
airplanes.
Lipos still don't have the power to weight ratio (ie flight time) of either Glow fuel or Gas or even Jet A or Kero that Turbines have. Likewise a 3 to 4 minute flight in an Electric ducted fan and an 30 to 45 minute charge are barley tolerable. A glow engine doesn't HAVE to be back on the ground in 6 minutes or ruin the expensive batteries... Also Motors and speed controls & Lipos are still expensive and sensitive. Then the support equipment is expensive. Chargers, Power supplies and Power source ie a Large expensive Deep Cycle Battery or a thousand dollar generators. Lipos are very sensitive and dangerous when mishandled.
The Next generation of Battery Technology will make Electric more viable and eventually less expensive. It will not Religate GLOW to the museum.
have made a difference as have ARF's and Foam
airplanes.
Lipos still don't have the power to weight ratio (ie flight time) of either Glow fuel or Gas or even Jet A or Kero that Turbines have. Likewise a 3 to 4 minute flight in an Electric ducted fan and an 30 to 45 minute charge are barley tolerable. A glow engine doesn't HAVE to be back on the ground in 6 minutes or ruin the expensive batteries... Also Motors and speed controls & Lipos are still expensive and sensitive. Then the support equipment is expensive. Chargers, Power supplies and Power source ie a Large expensive Deep Cycle Battery or a thousand dollar generators. Lipos are very sensitive and dangerous when mishandled.
The Next generation of Battery Technology will make Electric more viable and eventually less expensive. It will not Religate GLOW to the museum.
No doubt it depends on the specific application to determine the best fuel source wither it be gas, glow, or electric, but in the mainstream mid-sized stuff electric has taken over.
I don't miss the slime or the noise one bit, good riddance. I still have two glow engines in my hangar, but that's only because I'm too lazy to sell them.
#649
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By comparison the 5 year old JR 11X is pristine clean and I love that aspect of flying electrics. (But I am envious of Init's Rotary, that is a sweet motor)
Last edited by Rob2160; 01-23-2016 at 07:54 PM.
#650
My Feedback: (49)
I'll happily agree with you on flight times but some of these top acro multicopters now have thrust to weight ratios around 14 to 1. That is based on the entire flying weight, not just the motors. e.g. 14 lb thrust in a 1 lb. model.
Maybe that thrust to weight ratio also exists in glow powered fixed wing aircraft too but personally I have not seen one. Would love to if anyone has a link?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d6sz8bquB50
Maybe that thrust to weight ratio also exists in glow powered fixed wing aircraft too but personally I have not seen one. Would love to if anyone has a link?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d6sz8bquB50