Never before have I ever seen anything like this
#51
Not sure how you arrived at us looking to violate the marking requirement? We're following the same principles that we would for AMA Safety Code adherence. We'll keep a roster that documents registration with both FAA and AMA so that we have a record that demonstrates that members have registered. As for rule adherence, we're not running around the field now checking that aircraft are marked per the AMA safety code, we'll choose to not do this with the FAA marking as well. We place individual accountability for membership to follow the rules. If they don't, there are consequences for rule infractions per the by-laws. We didn't see a benefit to p!ssing everyone off creating a police state of inspections.
At the end of the day, the membership had to vote to amend the club by-laws. If there's wasn't buy-in to the change, it would have been voted down. I'm not saying that this is all logical in the least. In fact, I find the entire FAA registration initiative a joke and think it will have little if any impact on curbing irresponsible flying practices. I'm simply sharing our club's decision on how we're managing this mess. It's not a perfect solution but I suppose it's better than nothing.
At the end of the day, the membership had to vote to amend the club by-laws. If there's wasn't buy-in to the change, it would have been voted down. I'm not saying that this is all logical in the least. In fact, I find the entire FAA registration initiative a joke and think it will have little if any impact on curbing irresponsible flying practices. I'm simply sharing our club's decision on how we're managing this mess. It's not a perfect solution but I suppose it's better than nothing.
There's a note here recently too, mentioning "pirating" of our FAA #s. THAT'S my biggest fear in this whole thing - truly - somebody seeing one of my planes, copying the # and putting it on their own to do whatever/whereever with. That's probably where this whole thing will break down first.
#52
Senior Member
My Feedback: (5)
I don't post often but, I'm seriously considering throwing in the towel. Not being a baby, just being realistic. To answer one poster's question, one thing that bothers Me about putting My number on My aircraft for everyone to see, or letting everyone see my card reg. number is, what is to stop someone from assuming My number? If someone causes an incident with My number found, Who's door is going to get knocked on? It's like being able to take the reg.number off of someone's gun, put it on Your's, and go do harm with it, and let let the poor schmuck You stole the number from take the fall. Or at the very least, have a very unpleasant visit from law enforcement. This whole thing was very hastily and unprofessionally set up from the get go, and I can see this happening. The self appointed brainiacs that made up the task force simply did'nt bother to think this stuff through and, I have too much to lose to subject Myself to Their potential subjective judgement. There are several other points I can mention that I have already made on other forums here. I try not to troll to much but please consider My point!
Remember, you are still required to attach in some form your " AMA " information to the interior of the model. Thus, if their was an incident and even if somebody did steal and use your FAA registration number, the Sky Cops would still have to open up your model, find your AMA info and attempt prove the model was yours.
#53
For better or worse, my club chose to update the by-laws requiring both AMA and FAA registration in order to be eligible to fly. As part of enforcement, members will be required to provide their FAA number the same as their AMA number to be included in the membership roster. We do not plan to go as far as checking aircraft for proper markings. We'll expect that members will abide by the rules and mark their planes in accordance with AMA and FAA requirements.
We choose this to avoid running afoul of the entity from whom we lease our flying site. I suspect this this is the best reason for any club to require adherence and to stay out of the political football game that is the FAA vs. the AMA. While we don't like the FAA registration concept, we also don't like the idea of possibly losing our field because a non-complying member causes an accident and an investigation shows they're not complying with the laws of the land.
Until a court rules that the FAA registration is unlawful, we'll require club member adherence through gritted teeth.
We choose this to avoid running afoul of the entity from whom we lease our flying site. I suspect this this is the best reason for any club to require adherence and to stay out of the political football game that is the FAA vs. the AMA. While we don't like the FAA registration concept, we also don't like the idea of possibly losing our field because a non-complying member causes an accident and an investigation shows they're not complying with the laws of the land.
Until a court rules that the FAA registration is unlawful, we'll require club member adherence through gritted teeth.
#54
Not sure how you arrived at us looking to violate the marking requirement? We're following the same principles that we would for AMA Safety Code adherence. We'll keep a roster that documents registration with both FAA and AMA so that we have a record that demonstrates that members have registered. As for rule adherence, we're not running around the field now checking that aircraft are marked per the AMA safety code, we'll choose to not do this with the FAA marking as well. We place individual accountability for membership to follow the rules. If they don't, there are consequences for rule infractions per the by-laws. We didn't see a benefit to p!ssing everyone off creating a police state of inspections.
At the end of the day, the membership had to vote to amend the club by-laws. If there's wasn't buy-in to the change, it would have been voted down. I'm not saying that this is all logical in the least. In fact, I find the entire FAA registration initiative a joke and think it will have little if any impact on curbing irresponsible flying practices. I'm simply sharing our club's decision on how we're managing this mess. It's not a perfect solution but I suppose it's better than nothing.
At the end of the day, the membership had to vote to amend the club by-laws. If there's wasn't buy-in to the change, it would have been voted down. I'm not saying that this is all logical in the least. In fact, I find the entire FAA registration initiative a joke and think it will have little if any impact on curbing irresponsible flying practices. I'm simply sharing our club's decision on how we're managing this mess. It's not a perfect solution but I suppose it's better than nothing.
#55
Sport I'm Calling U an IDIOT .... U and the rest are telling people to break federal law ... Look what happened in the north west. If we/u F with the FAA U better bend over and take it like a man. The congress has designated the FAA to protect the NSA and Saftey is what will get any court decision thrown out. Safety Trumps all. All I'm saying if we mess with the FAA it will get much worse than putting a simple peice of paper on/in your DRONE. i.e. any R/C Device that flys in the NAS.
#56
Or maybe on that appendage where the sub skipper had tattooed in the movie periscope down!
#57
My Feedback: (49)
I don't post often but, I'm seriously considering throwing in the towel. Not being a baby, just being realistic. To answer one poster's question, one thing that bothers Me about putting My number on My aircraft for everyone to see, or letting everyone see my card reg. number is, what is to stop someone from assuming My number? If someone causes an incident with My number found, Who's door is going to get knocked on? It's like being able to take the reg.number off of someone's gun, put it on Your's, and go do harm with it, and let let the poor schmuck You stole the number from take the fall. Or at the very least, have a very unpleasant visit from law enforcement. This whole thing was very hastily and unprofessionally set up from the get go, and I can see this happening. The self appointed brainiacs that made up the task force simply did'nt bother to think this stuff through and, I have too much to lose to subject Myself to Their potential subjective judgement. There are several other points I can mention that I have already made on other forums here. I try not to troll to much but please consider My point!
My take is the FAA did the Least (Took the easy way out) and gave us a break with merely a process of registration. They could and will if F'ed with, Implement much more stringent rules and much steeper fees associated with our R/C TOYs.
Mess'n with the ALL POWERFUL GOD LIKE FAA is a stupid stupid move on anyone's part. They hold all the "SAFETY ACES" at this Poker table. And congress will or has folded.
#58
My Feedback: (49)
Just making a point that Compliance with registration is so easy and simple it's not worth the Possibility of far Worse Regulations, by the FAA, if the simple thing of registration is shunned of not complied with. I for one don't want to be the one made an example of. Do U think your buddies or the AMA will contribute to Your defense fund. Not on your Life ... They will just comply in a heart beat so as not to suffer your fate. Talk is Cheep fighting the FAA is anything but cheep. Your Call. Every individual should make up their own mind as to their tolerance for risk Either financial and chance of incarnation. The risk isn't worth it in my opinion.. But then there a lot of O'l struben Gezzers in this hobby that ain't gona told anything by any authority no mater what.
Wonder how many people at Munci have or will get their FAA Registration by the dead line
/
#59
Better Check with your Landlord especially if it is some form of city, county state,federal Park or recreations i.e. government agency that controls your lease ... I'd check with your legal counsel as to refusing to comply with Federal Law and what it does concerning your legal status. Just saying there are Many Many hidden ramifications That have not even been thought Through. By the way what does the AMA Safety Code or any other AMA Document say about Breaking any laws and your AMA and your Land Lords insurance, Coverage.
Just making a point that Compliance with registration is so easy and simple it's not worth the Possibility of far Worse Regulations, by the FAA, if the simple thing of registration is shunned of not complied with. I for one don't want to be the one made an example of. Do U think your buddies or the AMA will contribute to Your defense fund. Not on your Life ... They will just comply in a heart beat so as not to suffer your fate. Talk is Cheep fighting the FAA is anything but cheep. Your Call. Every individual should make up their own mind as to their tolerance for risk Either financial and chance of incarnation. The risk isn't worth it in my opinion.. But then there a lot of O'l struben Gezzers in this hobby that ain't gona told anything by any authority no mater what.
Wonder how many people at Munci have or will get their FAA Registration by the dead line
/
Just making a point that Compliance with registration is so easy and simple it's not worth the Possibility of far Worse Regulations, by the FAA, if the simple thing of registration is shunned of not complied with. I for one don't want to be the one made an example of. Do U think your buddies or the AMA will contribute to Your defense fund. Not on your Life ... They will just comply in a heart beat so as not to suffer your fate. Talk is Cheep fighting the FAA is anything but cheep. Your Call. Every individual should make up their own mind as to their tolerance for risk Either financial and chance of incarnation. The risk isn't worth it in my opinion.. But then there a lot of O'l struben Gezzers in this hobby that ain't gona told anything by any authority no mater what.
Wonder how many people at Munci have or will get their FAA Registration by the dead line
/
#62
#63
With you two's luck , the FAA inspector would end up being a woman and when you showed your tattooed junk she would pull out her magnifying glass to read your numbers , she'd deem you both to be a "small threat" , and she'd end up letting you go , so she could find some "bigger fish to fry"
#67
My Feedback: (49)
Why would the land lord care? The AMA insurance is in effect registered or not. The FAA is responsible for enforcement, not the landlord. The landlord is not responsible for keeping track of cars that are not registered and not anymore required to check for FAA registration. Not any more than you being responsible for someone who drives into your driveway without vehicle registration. Or carrying a concealed firearm without registering. No the landlord is not responsible at all. I know not all will not be registered because not all are required. Because of this and the fact that some models are not required to be registered Munci will likely not check during the Nationals.
The Contract we have with the county park system states any neglect of Flagrant disregard for any rules or outright violations of any laws is grounds for vacating our right to the field. Furthermore we would be required by contract to tear up the 150 thousand dollar runway/pit area and put the land back the way it was 20 some years ago at our own expense. It took 2-1/2 years of negotiations till when we final convinced the county Park system we would be good responsible tenants. U better "BET YOUR BIPPY" it maters. And it maters BIG TIME. Check with your landlord and see if he wants U to comply with Federal Law or not. Tell ya what gimmie his phone number and i'll ask him for ya and get back to U with his answer unless of course he doesn't call u befor i can post right here again.
Any of these clubs where U fly?
*Indicates clubs participating in AMA’s Introductory Pilot Program. For more information on this program please Click Here.[TABLE="width: 700"]
[TR="bgcolor: #5D7B9D"]
[TD]Name[/TD]
[TD]Number[/TD]
[TD]Members[/TD]
[TD]Contact[/TD]
[TD]Info[/TD]
[TD]District[/TD]
[TD]*Intro Pilots[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="bgcolor: #F7F6F3"]
[TD]PAULDING COUNTY MODEL AVIATION INC.
Flying Site Details
0.00 miles[/TD]
[TD]2713[/TD]
[TD]80[/TD]
[TD]MATTHEW BEEBE
Email Contact[/TD]
[TD]Phone: 770.362.4080
Visit Website
[/TD]
[TD]5[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]COBB COUNTY RC MODELERS
4.32 miles[/TD]
[TD]736[/TD]
[TD]112[/TD]
[TD]WADE NIELSEN
Email Contact[/TD]
[TD]Phone: 404-432-7165
Visit Website
[/TD]
[TD]5[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="bgcolor: #F7F6F3"]
[TD]TAILDRAGGERS R/C CLUB
Flying Site Details
12.89 miles[/TD]
[TD]4555[/TD]
[TD]48[/TD]
[TD]KENNETH WRIGHT
Email Contact[/TD]
[TD]Phone: 404-783-7271
Visit Website
[/TD]
[TD]5[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]BARTOW COUNTY MODEL AVIATION
Flying Site Details
14.11 miles[/TD]
[TD]2475[/TD]
[TD]63[/TD]
[TD]WILLIAM ROPER
Email Contact[/TD]
[TD]Phone: 404-509-9805
Visit Website
[/TD]
[TD]5[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="bgcolor: #F7F6F3"]
[TD]GEORGIA MODEL AVIATORS
Flying Site Details
19.01 miles[/TD]
[TD]2418[/TD]
[TD]199[/TD]
[TD]CHRIS MEEKS
Email Contact[/TD]
[TD]Phone: 770.887.5677
Visit Website
[/TD]
[TD]5[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]DOUGLAS COUNTY AERO MODELERS -Email Club
Flying Site Details
20.25 miles[/TD]
[TD]879[/TD]
[TD]50[/TD]
[TD]JOHN COWART
Email Contact[/TD]
[TD]Phone: 678.715.6435
Visit Website
[/TD]
[TD]5[/TD]
[TD]Yes[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="bgcolor: #F7F6F3"]
[TD]COOSA VALLEY FLYERS
Flying Site Details
20.61 miles[/TD]
[TD]993[/TD]
[TD]14[/TD]
[TD]DON SMITH
Email Contact[/TD]
[TD]Phone: 706-381-2057
Visit Website
[/TD]
[TD]5[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
#68
Your are telling me that if the LANDLORD is the federal government state city or a federal county city Park system they won't care? U better step back and consult your legal counsel on any one of your marked questions/statements. All of the above do care and very much so.
The Contract we have with the county park system states any neglect of Flagrant disregard for any rules or outright violations of any laws is grounds for vacating our right to the field. Furthermore we would be required by contract to tear up the 150 thousand dollar runway/pit area and put the land back the way it was 20 some years ago at our own expense. It took 2-1/2 years of negotiations till when we final convinced the county Park system we would be good responsible tenants. U better "BET YOUR BIPPY" it maters. And it maters BIG TIME. Check with your landlord and see if he wants U to comply with Federal Law or not. Tell ya what gimmie his phone number and i'll ask him for ya and get back to U with his answer unless of course he doesn't call u befor i can post right here again.
Any of these clubs where U fly?
*Indicates clubs participating in AMA’s Introductory Pilot Program. For more information on this program please Click Here.[TABLE="width: 700"]
[TR="bgcolor: #5D7B9D"]
[TD]Name
[/TD]
[TD]Number
[/TD]
[TD]Members
[/TD]
[TD]Contact
[/TD]
[TD]Info
[/TD]
[TD]District
[/TD]
[TD]*Intro Pilots
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="bgcolor: #F7F6F3"]
[TD]PAULDING COUNTY MODEL AVIATION INC.
Flying Site Details
0.00 miles
[/TD]
[TD]2713
[/TD]
[TD]80
[/TD]
[TD]MATTHEW BEEBE
Email Contact
[/TD]
[TD]Phone: 770.362.4080
Visit Website
[/TD]
[TD]5
[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]COBB COUNTY RC MODELERS
4.32 miles
[/TD]
[TD]736
[/TD]
[TD]112
[/TD]
[TD]WADE NIELSEN
Email Contact
[/TD]
[TD]Phone: 404-432-7165
Visit Website
[/TD]
[TD]5
[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="bgcolor: #F7F6F3"]
[TD]TAILDRAGGERS R/C CLUB
Flying Site Details
12.89 miles
[/TD]
[TD]4555
[/TD]
[TD]48
[/TD]
[TD]KENNETH WRIGHT
Email Contact
[/TD]
[TD]Phone: 404-783-7271
Visit Website
[/TD]
[TD]5
[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]BARTOW COUNTY MODEL AVIATION
Flying Site Details
14.11 miles
[/TD]
[TD]2475
[/TD]
[TD]63
[/TD]
[TD]WILLIAM ROPER
Email Contact
[/TD]
[TD]Phone: 404-509-9805
Visit Website
[/TD]
[TD]5
[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="bgcolor: #F7F6F3"]
[TD]GEORGIA MODEL AVIATORS
Flying Site Details
19.01 miles
[/TD]
[TD]2418
[/TD]
[TD]199
[/TD]
[TD]CHRIS MEEKS
Email Contact
[/TD]
[TD]Phone: 770.887.5677
Visit Website
[/TD]
[TD]5
[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]DOUGLAS COUNTY AERO MODELERS -Email Club
Flying Site Details
20.25 miles
[/TD]
[TD]879
[/TD]
[TD]50
[/TD]
[TD]JOHN COWART
Email Contact
[/TD]
[TD]Phone: 678.715.6435
Visit Website
[/TD]
[TD]5
[/TD]
[TD]Yes
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="bgcolor: #F7F6F3"]
[TD]COOSA VALLEY FLYERS
Flying Site Details
20.61 miles
[/TD]
[TD]993
[/TD]
[TD]14
[/TD]
[TD]DON SMITH
Email Contact
[/TD]
[TD]Phone: 706-381-2057
Visit Website
[/TD]
[TD]5
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
The Contract we have with the county park system states any neglect of Flagrant disregard for any rules or outright violations of any laws is grounds for vacating our right to the field. Furthermore we would be required by contract to tear up the 150 thousand dollar runway/pit area and put the land back the way it was 20 some years ago at our own expense. It took 2-1/2 years of negotiations till when we final convinced the county Park system we would be good responsible tenants. U better "BET YOUR BIPPY" it maters. And it maters BIG TIME. Check with your landlord and see if he wants U to comply with Federal Law or not. Tell ya what gimmie his phone number and i'll ask him for ya and get back to U with his answer unless of course he doesn't call u befor i can post right here again.
Any of these clubs where U fly?
*Indicates clubs participating in AMA’s Introductory Pilot Program. For more information on this program please Click Here.[TABLE="width: 700"]
[TR="bgcolor: #5D7B9D"]
[TD]Name
[/TD]
[TD]Number
[/TD]
[TD]Members
[/TD]
[TD]Contact
[/TD]
[TD]Info
[/TD]
[TD]District
[/TD]
[TD]*Intro Pilots
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="bgcolor: #F7F6F3"]
[TD]PAULDING COUNTY MODEL AVIATION INC.
Flying Site Details
0.00 miles
[/TD]
[TD]2713
[/TD]
[TD]80
[/TD]
[TD]MATTHEW BEEBE
Email Contact
[/TD]
[TD]Phone: 770.362.4080
Visit Website
[/TD]
[TD]5
[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]COBB COUNTY RC MODELERS
4.32 miles
[/TD]
[TD]736
[/TD]
[TD]112
[/TD]
[TD]WADE NIELSEN
Email Contact
[/TD]
[TD]Phone: 404-432-7165
Visit Website
[/TD]
[TD]5
[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="bgcolor: #F7F6F3"]
[TD]TAILDRAGGERS R/C CLUB
Flying Site Details
12.89 miles
[/TD]
[TD]4555
[/TD]
[TD]48
[/TD]
[TD]KENNETH WRIGHT
Email Contact
[/TD]
[TD]Phone: 404-783-7271
Visit Website
[/TD]
[TD]5
[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]BARTOW COUNTY MODEL AVIATION
Flying Site Details
14.11 miles
[/TD]
[TD]2475
[/TD]
[TD]63
[/TD]
[TD]WILLIAM ROPER
Email Contact
[/TD]
[TD]Phone: 404-509-9805
Visit Website
[/TD]
[TD]5
[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="bgcolor: #F7F6F3"]
[TD]GEORGIA MODEL AVIATORS
Flying Site Details
19.01 miles
[/TD]
[TD]2418
[/TD]
[TD]199
[/TD]
[TD]CHRIS MEEKS
Email Contact
[/TD]
[TD]Phone: 770.887.5677
Visit Website
[/TD]
[TD]5
[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]DOUGLAS COUNTY AERO MODELERS -Email Club
Flying Site Details
20.25 miles
[/TD]
[TD]879
[/TD]
[TD]50
[/TD]
[TD]JOHN COWART
Email Contact
[/TD]
[TD]Phone: 678.715.6435
Visit Website
[/TD]
[TD]5
[/TD]
[TD]Yes
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="bgcolor: #F7F6F3"]
[TD]COOSA VALLEY FLYERS
Flying Site Details
20.61 miles
[/TD]
[TD]993
[/TD]
[TD]14
[/TD]
[TD]DON SMITH
Email Contact
[/TD]
[TD]Phone: 706-381-2057
Visit Website
[/TD]
[TD]5
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
HD the landlord is not the violator, and not responsible for enforcement, Not even state or local government. If they write that in their laws or lease then the club should abide or move, but the law does not require and landlord to enforce the FAA regulations. LEO can do so voluntarily but it is not a requirement.
#69
I don't post often but, I'm seriously considering throwing in the towel. Not being a baby, just being realistic. To answer one poster's question, one thing that bothers Me about putting My number on My aircraft for everyone to see, or letting everyone see my card reg. number is, what is to stop someone from assuming My number? If someone causes an incident with My number found, Who's door is going to get knocked on? It's like being able to take the reg.number off of someone's gun, put it on Your's, and go do harm with it, and let let the poor schmuck You stole the number from take the fall. Or at the very least, have a very unpleasant visit from law enforcement. This whole thing was very hastily and unprofessionally set up from the get go, and I can see this happening. The self appointed brainiacs that made up the task force simply did'nt bother to think this stuff through and, I have too much to lose to subject Myself to Their potential subjective judgement. There are several other points I can mention that I have already made on other forums here. I try not to troll to much but please consider My point!
#71
I'm hoping you didn't take offense to what I said earlier - we're all trying to make the best of what AT BEST is a horrid overreach by a totally outlandish government, and I really don't disagree with how y'all did it. Actually, re-reading what you first wrote, I DO see where you're doing your best to comply with a totally stupid reg and still not turn into FAA Nazis.
There's a note here recently too, mentioning "pirating" of our FAA #s. THAT'S my biggest fear in this whole thing - truly - somebody seeing one of my planes, copying the # and putting it on their own to do whatever/whereever with. That's probably where this whole thing will break down first.
There's a note here recently too, mentioning "pirating" of our FAA #s. THAT'S my biggest fear in this whole thing - truly - somebody seeing one of my planes, copying the # and putting it on their own to do whatever/whereever with. That's probably where this whole thing will break down first.
#72
Banned
My Feedback: (8)
Meanwhile, the flying continues. No arrests, no big bad FAA storm troopers or local LEO jackboots invading the fields. Registration was pretty smooth, didn't cost anything, and everyone is still going about doing what they want to do. If you don't do nothin wrong, you won't get caught. Those that do better be ready for the consequences.
#73
#74
#75
My Feedback: (49)
[h=1]Shuster proposes FAA reauthorization bill removing ATC from FAA
What does this mean to Model aviation?[/h]Read both stories.
http://atwonline.com/air-traffic-control/shuster-proposes-faa-reauthorization-bill-removing-atc-faa?NL=ATW-04&Issue=ATW-04_20160203_ATW-04_974&sfvc4enews=42&cl=article_2&utm_rid=CPEN1000002227788&utm_campaign=4872&utm_medium=email&elq2=5b67d159fa5244a9ba8821d24a0b8393
What does this mean to Model aviation?[/h]Read both stories.
http://atwonline.com/air-traffic-control/shuster-proposes-faa-reauthorization-bill-removing-atc-faa?NL=ATW-04&Issue=ATW-04_20160203_ATW-04_974&sfvc4enews=42&cl=article_2&utm_rid=CPEN1000002227788&utm_campaign=4872&utm_medium=email&elq2=5b67d159fa5244a9ba8821d24a0b8393