Senate Version of FAA bill will destroy model aviation
03-12-2016, 06:01 AM
#76
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03-12-2016, 06:03 AM
#77
03-12-2016, 06:13 AM
#78
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If you want to continue this start a thread new thread as we've really derailed this one, which isn't fair to the OP.
Mike
03-12-2016, 06:35 AM
#79
wikipeda another credible source. I won't play the post a link game due to whatever side you take on this they have their own "slant". I watched the hearings and formed my opinion based on testimony (or lack of in the case of Learner).
If you want to continue this start a thread new thread as we've really derailed this one, which isn't fair to the OP.
Mike
If you want to continue this start a thread new thread as we've really derailed this one, which isn't fair to the OP.
Mike
03-12-2016, 01:44 PM
#80
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I really don't have time for this today but here goes.
The IRS is not a good example of a credible source of information. Theses are the same idiots that targeted conservatives along with conservative non profits for political gain. Just where is their poster child L Learner...........Oh yea sitting home collecting retirement rather than being in a jail cell.
Mike
The IRS is not a good example of a credible source of information. Theses are the same idiots that targeted conservatives along with conservative non profits for political gain. Just where is their poster child L Learner...........Oh yea sitting home collecting retirement rather than being in a jail cell.
Mike
Who is a credible source to you?
03-12-2016, 03:55 PM
#82
They are trying to stop the FPVs and drones the AMA took in and linked us to them. Who cares if your flying a glider higher than 400 ft like i did long ago . Your beef is not with the FAA or the senate its a toss up between drones and our own AMA ,bunch of greedy jack arses . joe
03-15-2016, 10:04 AM
#84
In Canada our national aeromodelling association is MAAC Transport Canada is our equivalent to your FAA. Rules as far as allowed altitude and distance from full size airfields very similar to what your hearing came down the pipe. Then our aeromodelling association MAAC received an exemption. Due to our safety record and our adopting best practice self-regulation we MAAC members flying at MAAC fields and or in accordance to our safety guidelines were exempt from the restrictions placed on non-members. We have continued flying as we always have many clubs actually operating from local airstrips.
SOOOOOO if you’re a non-member finding yourself restricted by these new rules I think you should take it up with the other non-members whose stupid actions have put you in this position. It is so counterproductive to listen to your excuses and rhetoric about your so called rights when the hobby didn’t even exist when the bill of rights were conceived.
I have a feeling it’s going to end up very similar in the US when it’s all said and done with. Honestly I have heard every excuse in the book why we should not have to follow any rules, guidelines or regulations. Most of this comes from non-members on both sides of the border. You know what? I hope they stick it to ya for all the grief you give everyone else because of your selfishness it will look good on ya. Meanwhile I will just keep flying as I always have not caring one bit if you lose your ability to enjoy the hobby.
Dennis
SOOOOOO if you’re a non-member finding yourself restricted by these new rules I think you should take it up with the other non-members whose stupid actions have put you in this position. It is so counterproductive to listen to your excuses and rhetoric about your so called rights when the hobby didn’t even exist when the bill of rights were conceived.
I have a feeling it’s going to end up very similar in the US when it’s all said and done with. Honestly I have heard every excuse in the book why we should not have to follow any rules, guidelines or regulations. Most of this comes from non-members on both sides of the border. You know what? I hope they stick it to ya for all the grief you give everyone else because of your selfishness it will look good on ya. Meanwhile I will just keep flying as I always have not caring one bit if you lose your ability to enjoy the hobby.
Dennis
03-15-2016, 11:11 AM
#87
Amendment 9 says all rights not enumerated in the Constitution belong to the States or People. A privilege is a right given to specific people or with additional responsibilities so all of those things NS mentioned are rights, but most are also privileges. To my knowledge model airplanes have never been restricted or given additional responsibilities so sorry, model airplanes and most other hobbies is a right not a privilege.
03-15-2016, 12:12 PM
#91
Amendment 9 says all rights not enumerated in the Constitution belong to the States or People. A privilege is a right given to specific people or with additional responsibilities so all of those things NS mentioned are rights, but most are also privileges. To my knowledge model airplanes have never been restricted or given additional responsibilities so sorry, model airplanes and most other hobbies is a right not a privilege.
I would say almost any activity you can think that does not directly harm or interfere with someone else can be considered a right but any right can be limited or taken away by the government if need be to protect
others if the performing of said right becomes a problem to them.
03-15-2016, 08:19 PM
#93
I would say almost any activity you can think that does not directly harm or interfere with someone else can be considered a right but any right can be limited or taken away by the government if need be to protect
others if the performing of said right becomes a problem to them.
others if the performing of said right becomes a problem to them.
03-16-2016, 08:13 AM
#94
03-16-2016, 02:30 PM
#95
Latest news out of the Senate markup session today. Paragraphs 3, 4, & 5 are of particular interest.
https://cei.org/blog/senate-faa-reau...ll-disappoints
https://cei.org/blog/senate-faa-reau...ll-disappoints
03-16-2016, 02:33 PM
#96
My Feedback: (569)
For what it's worth....I have just sent the following urgent letter to both of my Senators, Senator Dick Durbin and Senator Mark Kirk
Dear Senator Durbin (Senator Kirk)
I come seeking your help in preventing the destruction of the remote control model aircraft community in the United States.
Federal Aviation Administration Reauthorization Act of 2016 as it now stands would impose such onerous rules and regulations on our hobby that it likely would cease to exist for all practical purposes.
The Academy of Model Aeronautics, the only Community Based Organization (CBO) in the United States recognized by the FAA and representing all the model aviation enthusiasts, has been a strong advocate for safe flying of remote control aircraft since its inception in 1966. The AMA has established and enforced rules and regulations that have allowed safe flying of model aircraft to be performed with very few issues relating to interference with full scale flying. Even the FAA admits to the overwhelming safe flying that the members of the AMA have practiced throughout the years.
What I and my fellow RC aircraft pilots are asking is that cooler heads in government like yours prevail, allowing appropriate regulation to be put in place that will continue to allow RC aircraft to be flown while ensuring the safety of the air occupied by full scale aircraft and the ground below.
First:
Please be aware of a serious distinction that is being forgotten/overlooked in this entire discussion:
1) LOS flight - Line of site flight - this is what most typical R/C Aircraft model flyers have practiced for the past 50 years, with the aircraft under their control always being clearly within their direct line of site. LOS flying means that the person in control of his/her remote control aircraft always has a full unobstructed view of the sky around him/her. LOS flying means that if a full scale aircraft enters the same airspace as an aircraft piloted by a LOS pilot it is immediately visible to the LOS pilot who can react instantly to ensure that the full scale plane has the right of way, keeping all safe from harm.
2) FPV flying - FPV is the acronym derived from the term "first person view". It has become the standard term used for piloting RC (remote controlled) aircraft remotely using wireless video downlinks (Another term commonly used is RPV, or "remotely piloted vehicle"). Both are also commonly referred to as DRONE flying. Because the pilot of a FPV or RPV aircraft DOES NOT NECESSARILY have his/her aircraft within their line of site there is a chance that they will not know when/if a full scale aircraft is within the same airspace as their FPV/RPV aircraft, which could lead to the potential for an interaction between the two.
Second:
LOS flying has been the norm for decades, with a miniscule amount of potential interactions having taken place with full scale aircraft. The FAA has rarely had an issue with LOS aircraft and pilots who obey the AMA rules and regulations.
Third:
FPV flying has only been in existence for a handful of years, but interactions between FPV aircraft and full scale aircraft have been constantly in the news almost since their inception, which unfortunately is leading to this headlong rush to regulate R/C aircraft, both LOS AND FPV, into oblivion.
I would ask for your support in ensuring that our skies are kept safe for full scale aircraft, their pilots and passengers, as well as for the use of those same skies by LOS aircraft, AND for FPV aircraft. Well thought out regulations to allow this to happen are possible only when we all take the time and make the effort to make it so.
I would be more than happy to discuss this in person with you or a member of your staff, and would gladly make the time to show what LOS flying of R/C aircraft and FPV flying of Drones are all about.
I look forward to hearing back from you at your earliest convenience.
I have sent this letter to all of my fellow club members and asked that they send something similar to both gentlemen, one of whom is up for re-election this year.
Please understand I know this isn't perfect but I believe it expresses the nature of the issue, what's at stake and a plea for help in ensuring all parties come to the table in order to develop real solutions.
Dear Senator Durbin (Senator Kirk)
I come seeking your help in preventing the destruction of the remote control model aircraft community in the United States.
Federal Aviation Administration Reauthorization Act of 2016 as it now stands would impose such onerous rules and regulations on our hobby that it likely would cease to exist for all practical purposes.
The Academy of Model Aeronautics, the only Community Based Organization (CBO) in the United States recognized by the FAA and representing all the model aviation enthusiasts, has been a strong advocate for safe flying of remote control aircraft since its inception in 1966. The AMA has established and enforced rules and regulations that have allowed safe flying of model aircraft to be performed with very few issues relating to interference with full scale flying. Even the FAA admits to the overwhelming safe flying that the members of the AMA have practiced throughout the years.
What I and my fellow RC aircraft pilots are asking is that cooler heads in government like yours prevail, allowing appropriate regulation to be put in place that will continue to allow RC aircraft to be flown while ensuring the safety of the air occupied by full scale aircraft and the ground below.
First:
Please be aware of a serious distinction that is being forgotten/overlooked in this entire discussion:
1) LOS flight - Line of site flight - this is what most typical R/C Aircraft model flyers have practiced for the past 50 years, with the aircraft under their control always being clearly within their direct line of site. LOS flying means that the person in control of his/her remote control aircraft always has a full unobstructed view of the sky around him/her. LOS flying means that if a full scale aircraft enters the same airspace as an aircraft piloted by a LOS pilot it is immediately visible to the LOS pilot who can react instantly to ensure that the full scale plane has the right of way, keeping all safe from harm.
2) FPV flying - FPV is the acronym derived from the term "first person view". It has become the standard term used for piloting RC (remote controlled) aircraft remotely using wireless video downlinks (Another term commonly used is RPV, or "remotely piloted vehicle"). Both are also commonly referred to as DRONE flying. Because the pilot of a FPV or RPV aircraft DOES NOT NECESSARILY have his/her aircraft within their line of site there is a chance that they will not know when/if a full scale aircraft is within the same airspace as their FPV/RPV aircraft, which could lead to the potential for an interaction between the two.
Second:
LOS flying has been the norm for decades, with a miniscule amount of potential interactions having taken place with full scale aircraft. The FAA has rarely had an issue with LOS aircraft and pilots who obey the AMA rules and regulations.
Third:
FPV flying has only been in existence for a handful of years, but interactions between FPV aircraft and full scale aircraft have been constantly in the news almost since their inception, which unfortunately is leading to this headlong rush to regulate R/C aircraft, both LOS AND FPV, into oblivion.
I would ask for your support in ensuring that our skies are kept safe for full scale aircraft, their pilots and passengers, as well as for the use of those same skies by LOS aircraft, AND for FPV aircraft. Well thought out regulations to allow this to happen are possible only when we all take the time and make the effort to make it so.
I would be more than happy to discuss this in person with you or a member of your staff, and would gladly make the time to show what LOS flying of R/C aircraft and FPV flying of Drones are all about.
I look forward to hearing back from you at your earliest convenience.
I have sent this letter to all of my fellow club members and asked that they send something similar to both gentlemen, one of whom is up for re-election this year.
Please understand I know this isn't perfect but I believe it expresses the nature of the issue, what's at stake and a plea for help in ensuring all parties come to the table in order to develop real solutions.
The AMA has been around a lot longer than 1966 . You need to correct that .
03-16-2016, 03:18 PM
#98
My Feedback: (569)
Actually the AMA only became a 'separate' body in 1966....prior to that it was associated with the NAA.... but I will mention it's inception in 1936 when / if I meet with any officials
From the AMA History page
The idea for the AMA began in 1935 (perhaps even before that) at the National Championships in Detroit, Michigan. Leaders and contestants were interested in a self-governing body of aeromodeling experts, the thought being that there should be expert guidance of, for, and by model builders. Modelers wanted a single voice to develop national rules for aeromodeling contests, as well as one voice to speak to the government.
First known as the American Academy of Model Aeronautics (AAMA), the organization dropped 'American' from its official title within a few years. The AMA’s first mailing address,1732 RCA Building, Rockefeller Center, New York, solidified its legitimacy in 1936. Later that year, the headquarters of the AMA moved to Dupont Circle, Washington D.C. as part of the National Aeronautic Association (NAA).
AMA elected officials included an Executive Committee, Advisory Board, and Council, and a publication, Model Aviation. The first issue of Model Aviation, June 1936, included a list of these newly elected officials, a two-page description of the 1936 Nats, and seven pages listing the eighteen events, contestants, and results.
Both the NAA and AMA moved their offices to the Willard Hotel in Washington D.C. in 1940. While in the same building, it was the first time that the AMA had separate offices from the NAA, along with its own budget and officers. However, it was not until 1966 that the AMA became fully independent from the NAA.
From the AMA History page
The idea for the AMA began in 1935 (perhaps even before that) at the National Championships in Detroit, Michigan. Leaders and contestants were interested in a self-governing body of aeromodeling experts, the thought being that there should be expert guidance of, for, and by model builders. Modelers wanted a single voice to develop national rules for aeromodeling contests, as well as one voice to speak to the government.
First known as the American Academy of Model Aeronautics (AAMA), the organization dropped 'American' from its official title within a few years. The AMA’s first mailing address,1732 RCA Building, Rockefeller Center, New York, solidified its legitimacy in 1936. Later that year, the headquarters of the AMA moved to Dupont Circle, Washington D.C. as part of the National Aeronautic Association (NAA).
AMA elected officials included an Executive Committee, Advisory Board, and Council, and a publication, Model Aviation. The first issue of Model Aviation, June 1936, included a list of these newly elected officials, a two-page description of the 1936 Nats, and seven pages listing the eighteen events, contestants, and results.
Both the NAA and AMA moved their offices to the Willard Hotel in Washington D.C. in 1940. While in the same building, it was the first time that the AMA had separate offices from the NAA, along with its own budget and officers. However, it was not until 1966 that the AMA became fully independent from the NAA.
Last edited by Hinckley Bill; 03-16-2016 at 03:54 PM.
03-16-2016, 04:53 PM
#99
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Latest news out of the Senate markup session today. Paragraphs 3, 4, & 5 are of particular interest.
https://cei.org/blog/senate-faa-reau...ll-disappoints
https://cei.org/blog/senate-faa-reau...ll-disappoints
Gee from what I've been reading here for the past year or so, the "traditional" folks would be thrilled to see homebuilt "drone" usage grounded. Are these people ever satisfied?
03-16-2016, 05:41 PM
#100
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Ummm... I guess you do not realize that the bill does not use the word "drone". It talks about sUAS, and guess what, WE fly sUAS according to the Congress and FAA. So it would also stop you from scratch building a model airplane as well.
