No Meeting Minutes?
04-04-2016, 08:46 PM
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No Meeting Minutes?
The new 2016 administration at our club decided not to published the meeting minutes anymore in the club's newsletter, or to read them at the club meeting, or to approve them at the club meeting. The only time that the meeting minutes can be reviewed is on the day of the club meeting (Saturdays) either before or after the meeting on the secretary's laptop providing that he is there or has the time. We are incorporated in the state of California and a 501.c.3 non-profit organization. This is the first time ever that our club has had such a situation happen like this.
We used to also include the treasurer's report in the newsletter and that also has been removed but can be reviewed separately as well. The administration thinks that if a club member wants to find out about what is happening at the club they can come to the meetings or ask the secretary. Getting the information second hand from others creates its own problems and is not dependable as you can guess.
Any comments out there? Maybe your experiences may add new insight. Thanks!
We used to also include the treasurer's report in the newsletter and that also has been removed but can be reviewed separately as well. The administration thinks that if a club member wants to find out about what is happening at the club they can come to the meetings or ask the secretary. Getting the information second hand from others creates its own problems and is not dependable as you can guess.
Any comments out there? Maybe your experiences may add new insight. Thanks!
04-05-2016, 02:44 AM
#2
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Although there might be some reasonable explanation for this, I can't think of one. This sounds like a power grab by the new admin. Controlling information, making it harder to get. So much for transparency. Perhaps its so more people come to meetings? Offer coffee and donuts, that always works.
I'd check your bylaws and see if this issue is covered there. Did you discuss with others in the club, what was their response? You can always bring it up in a meeting, and make a motion to have the bylaws changed.
At our club we post the meeting notes within a week of the meeting on our website. At the following meeting we cover "old business" but don't read everything that happened at the last meeting. We then require a motion to approve the meeting notes.
I'd check your bylaws and see if this issue is covered there. Did you discuss with others in the club, what was their response? You can always bring it up in a meeting, and make a motion to have the bylaws changed.
At our club we post the meeting notes within a week of the meeting on our website. At the following meeting we cover "old business" but don't read everything that happened at the last meeting. We then require a motion to approve the meeting notes.
04-05-2016, 04:49 AM
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The new 2016 administration at our club decided not to published the meeting minutes anymore in the club's newsletter, or to read them at the club meeting, or to approve them at the club meeting. The only time that the meeting minutes can be reviewed is on the day of the club meeting (Saturdays) either before or after the meeting on the secretary's laptop providing that he is there or has the time. We are incorporated in the state of California and a 501.c.3 non-profit organization. This is the first time ever that our club has had such a situation happen like this.
We used to also include the treasurer's report in the newsletter and that also has been removed but can be reviewed separately as well. The administration thinks that if a club member wants to find out about what is happening at the club they can come to the meetings or ask the secretary. Getting the information second hand from others creates its own problems and is not dependable as you can guess.
Any comments out there? Maybe your experiences may add new insight. Thanks!
We used to also include the treasurer's report in the newsletter and that also has been removed but can be reviewed separately as well. The administration thinks that if a club member wants to find out about what is happening at the club they can come to the meetings or ask the secretary. Getting the information second hand from others creates its own problems and is not dependable as you can guess.
Any comments out there? Maybe your experiences may add new insight. Thanks!
Mike
Last edited by rcmiket; 04-05-2016 at 04:52 AM.
04-05-2016, 05:13 AM
#4
I see bad things coming in the near future for your club. There are more reasons than, "finding out what is going on with the club" to make the minutes available to the membership. The reading of the previous meetings' minutes (and having the membership approve them as written) assures that someone did not omit or put their own personal "spin" on them.
Sounds like the "Good ole boys" are taking over!
Good luck!
Regards,
Astro
Sounds like the "Good ole boys" are taking over!
Good luck!
Regards,
Astro
04-05-2016, 05:15 AM
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I see bad things coming in the near future for your club. There are more reasons than, "finding out what is going on with the club" to make the minutes available to the membership. The reading of the previous meetings' minutes (and having the membership approve them as written) assures that someone did not omit or put their own personal "spin" on them.
Sounds like the "Good ole boys" are taking over!
Good luck!
Regards,
Astro
Sounds like the "Good ole boys" are taking over!
Good luck!
Regards,
Astro
Mike
04-05-2016, 05:27 AM
#6
As the secretary of a (non-RC) organization I found that the secretary is actually more powerful that the president because he writes the official/legal minutes. If he is in collusion with the president they can do almost anything - lie, cheat and steal.
04-05-2016, 08:03 AM
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rcmiket,
A motion of sorts, or it was asked, to read the last month's meeting minutes. The reply was to see the secretary before and after the meeting to read them on his computer. They would not be read at the meeting. Item finished.
A motion or sort, or it was asked, to approve the meeting minutes and it was not done but taken under advisement. (This would have meant reading the meeting minutes which they already decided they wouldn't.
A motion of sorts, or it was asked, to read the last month's meeting minutes. The reply was to see the secretary before and after the meeting to read them on his computer. They would not be read at the meeting. Item finished.
A motion or sort, or it was asked, to approve the meeting minutes and it was not done but taken under advisement. (This would have meant reading the meeting minutes which they already decided they wouldn't.
04-05-2016, 08:17 AM
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Does your club have by-laws or a constitution? If so, this should state the requirements for minutes and communication to the membership. If you do and the rules are not being followed, you have a reason to gripe and hold the officers accountable for not following the rules. If you don't, I suppose that the club membership could vote on creating one. Then, rules could be laid-out for such things. If the officers end-up stonewalling you at every turn, they're likely hiding something. Take that as a warning sign and proceed carefully.
04-05-2016, 08:28 AM
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rcmiket,
A motion of sorts, or it was asked, to read the last month's meeting minutes. The reply was to see the secretary before and after the meeting to read them on his computer. They would not be read at the meeting. Item finished.
A motion or sort, or it was asked, to approve the meeting minutes and it was not done but taken under advisement. (This would have meant reading the meeting minutes which they already decided they wouldn't.
A motion of sorts, or it was asked, to read the last month's meeting minutes. The reply was to see the secretary before and after the meeting to read them on his computer. They would not be read at the meeting. Item finished.
A motion or sort, or it was asked, to approve the meeting minutes and it was not done but taken under advisement. (This would have meant reading the meeting minutes which they already decided they wouldn't.
OK make a motion to amend the bylaws to include reading of the minutes at the meetings. You'll need members to back it. Insist that it's put on the agenda at a meeting for a vote by the members. If that fails make a motion to recall the new administration. Are the rest of the club members happy about all this? How many members in this club?
MIke
04-05-2016, 11:57 AM
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This issue here is that the board in question does not follow the bylaws. They have come in an pretty much do what ever they want. I am a former board member and former club member of this club. I have left because of this board.
04-05-2016, 12:02 PM
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Mike
04-05-2016, 12:34 PM
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Agreed, but it is at the point that no one cares anymore. Last year was out final year as board members, we left after years of getting beat up by this new group. We finally just gave up.
04-05-2016, 12:53 PM
#17
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That's so disappointing to read, what a shame. And people wonder why there aren't enough good people to run clubs. Most of the members probably just want to show up and fly and not deal with the politics, which I get, but eventually this will not turn out good. A mass exodus of members might bring more attention to the issue, but this might be what the new regime wants.
04-05-2016, 02:23 PM
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As secretary/treasurer for our club I make sure that all members receive a copy of the minutes, including the latest financials, on a monthly basis.
I try to provide the information within a couple of days after the meeting occurs, but on occasion personal issues have extended that to a couple of weeks.
Our membership would never stand for 'no minutes/no financials' and our club officers ensure that all members are given all the information we can provide and that they deserve.
I try to provide the information within a couple of days after the meeting occurs, but on occasion personal issues have extended that to a couple of weeks.
Our membership would never stand for 'no minutes/no financials' and our club officers ensure that all members are given all the information we can provide and that they deserve.
04-05-2016, 02:37 PM
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Thanks brentp76 for adding to the conversation.
The club in question is incorporated with the state of California, and a non-profit 501.c.3 organization. We have bylaws but no 'rules' or 'orders'. However it is noted in the bylaws that the club conduct itself using parliamentary procedure and since we have depended on Robert's Rules that is the choice. The main problem is that the administration (and we have a newly appointed parliamentarian) has no idea of parliamentary procedure, and appears not to be concerned with bylaws (either learning them or applying them) or their enforcement by they way they are conducting themselves. The meeting minutes thing is the tip of the iceberg.
The secretary is charged with doing the meeting minutes but when you add Robert's Rules in the equation giving club members meeting minutes, reading them and approving them is part of the process of conducting a 'normal meeting'. It is almost impossible to include every little detail in the bylaws but when you include parliamentary procedure as a driving force questions then have answers.
The club in question is incorporated with the state of California, and a non-profit 501.c.3 organization. We have bylaws but no 'rules' or 'orders'. However it is noted in the bylaws that the club conduct itself using parliamentary procedure and since we have depended on Robert's Rules that is the choice. The main problem is that the administration (and we have a newly appointed parliamentarian) has no idea of parliamentary procedure, and appears not to be concerned with bylaws (either learning them or applying them) or their enforcement by they way they are conducting themselves. The meeting minutes thing is the tip of the iceberg.
The secretary is charged with doing the meeting minutes but when you add Robert's Rules in the equation giving club members meeting minutes, reading them and approving them is part of the process of conducting a 'normal meeting'. It is almost impossible to include every little detail in the bylaws but when you include parliamentary procedure as a driving force questions then have answers.
04-05-2016, 03:04 PM
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Hinckley Bill,
You are exactly right in what you are doing and congratulations! You are my type of secretary and share that which every member is entitled to receive. Unfortunately it appears that not sharing, not providing basic club business through the meeting minutes is the route that is being taken. You would think that they would give the club members the opportunity to vote on it but it was entirely a board decision. There is no basis for their action.
It is not easy running a club, or a club meeting. It's impossible to know every small detail of Robert's Rules in order to conduct business. Until recently, and I am sad to admit it, I was not that involved in parliamentary procedure, and could manage my way through the bylaws. That changed last year when we beefed up our bylaws as to leave no room for current doubts. Never thought this meeting minute thing would escalate into what it has become. Working on the bylaws was a learning experience and an eye opener. But when you have bylaws, and have used them they (bylaws) can provide answers to most questions. However you have to look at things in an impartial manner. The questions you can't answer, or need assistance on you turn to Robert's Rules or look to practical examples.
To bad the club members don't rally but I think they see the writing on the wall. It is not a question of 'if you can lick them, join them' but more of 'why fight when you are going to lose'.
You are exactly right in what you are doing and congratulations! You are my type of secretary and share that which every member is entitled to receive. Unfortunately it appears that not sharing, not providing basic club business through the meeting minutes is the route that is being taken. You would think that they would give the club members the opportunity to vote on it but it was entirely a board decision. There is no basis for their action.
It is not easy running a club, or a club meeting. It's impossible to know every small detail of Robert's Rules in order to conduct business. Until recently, and I am sad to admit it, I was not that involved in parliamentary procedure, and could manage my way through the bylaws. That changed last year when we beefed up our bylaws as to leave no room for current doubts. Never thought this meeting minute thing would escalate into what it has become. Working on the bylaws was a learning experience and an eye opener. But when you have bylaws, and have used them they (bylaws) can provide answers to most questions. However you have to look at things in an impartial manner. The questions you can't answer, or need assistance on you turn to Robert's Rules or look to practical examples.
To bad the club members don't rally but I think they see the writing on the wall. It is not a question of 'if you can lick them, join them' but more of 'why fight when you are going to lose'.
04-05-2016, 04:01 PM
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http://www.dmlp.org/legal-guide/nonprofit-organization
☆ You may find something useful reading this. The part about bylaws and reporting.
☆ You may find something useful reading this. The part about bylaws and reporting.
04-05-2016, 07:43 PM
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Radfordc,
I think your model airplane club is the exception and not the rule. Our club has 10 club meetings a year. The two months that we don't have a meeting we have a club party/activity. The club sponsors events, parties, activities, work parties / maintenance projects, etc. Can't do that unless you have meetings to organize and get club support. If you are a AMA Charter Club you then have bylaws. And if you are incorporated, or a non-profit organization bylaws are required as far as I remember. Maybe the number of club members that you have and your event schedule creates a condition where having only 1 club meeting a year suffices. There comes a point when a group of people, because of their numbers/size, find themselves needing to follow parliamentary procedure to assist them with process. At some point it becomes a necessity. Thanks for sharing your comments.
I think your model airplane club is the exception and not the rule. Our club has 10 club meetings a year. The two months that we don't have a meeting we have a club party/activity. The club sponsors events, parties, activities, work parties / maintenance projects, etc. Can't do that unless you have meetings to organize and get club support. If you are a AMA Charter Club you then have bylaws. And if you are incorporated, or a non-profit organization bylaws are required as far as I remember. Maybe the number of club members that you have and your event schedule creates a condition where having only 1 club meeting a year suffices. There comes a point when a group of people, because of their numbers/size, find themselves needing to follow parliamentary procedure to assist them with process. At some point it becomes a necessity. Thanks for sharing your comments.
