Awful new AMA sUAS website
05-17-2016, 02:27 PM
#101
Thread Starter
PS , to those throwing around the troll label , I don't see any trolls here at all ,
maybe a sockpuppet or two but that besides the point , I see a bunch of guys who DO care about the AMA , and the problems arise when someone points out something they think isn't right and then gets dogpiled on , as Franlkin has here . Franklin IS right , the new UAS website IS "clunky" and poorly set up , and as a bunch of folks in a hobby as technology bound as ours is , we should be able to do better . Yes , the AMA is a fine organization , that makes the occasional mistake as all Human run enterprises will at times do . If a man points out a legitimate mistake , it's just patently not right to attack him for pointing out the mistake ! Here's something great the AMA did , I just got an Email that this year $48K in scholarship money has been given out , with a total scholarship amount totaling $1 Million . That's great and to be commended ! But does it make up for the whole CBO gaffe ? Maybe to some , but since I call em like I see em , I'd say it's more like "two steps forward , two steps back" and I still say they sold us out in an attempt for total control over all UAS . Now if seeing both the good and the bad makes me a troll , well then I'll proudly stand with Franklin and CombatPigg and wear the label rather than continually assert that everything the AMA has ever done or will do is absolutely perfect when I see mistakes have been made .
Thanks...
It's been my experience leading organizations for over 20 years that those which do not take a candid look at their own performance and hold themselves accountable are doomed to failure. It's the slow drip, drip, drip of mediocrity.
My principle beef is that the members are paying the ED a princely sum, top 1.5% of all incomes in Muncie and top 3% of all incomes in the state of Indiana. His job is to run the staff. And whether it's the drone survey results they promised would be posted in 2014 that still aren't up, or this crummy website, or insurance and other reports to members that haven't been done since 2007, I contend we're not getting anything near top 1.5% management performance for our money. Staffs make mistakes. But it's the job of the ED to ensure they get corrected. So far as I can tell, nobody seems to care.\
On the subject of subordinates/staffs making mistakes, General Eisenhower once said the following to General Patton: "I’m not looking to hang some kid because he made a mistake. But this happened because that kid wasn’t prepared for it. That’s his commander’s mistake, and if his commander wasn’t prepared, it’s your mistake.”
So the staff seems to be performing poorly...and I argue it's the fault of the ED and his management.
Last edited by franklin_m; 05-17-2016 at 03:29 PM. Reason: Fixed spacing from PPT cut and paste
05-17-2016, 03:01 PM
#102
Thanks...
It's been my experience leading organizations for over 20 years that those which do not take a candid look at their own performance and hold themselves accountable are doomed to failure. It's the slow drip, drip, drip of mediocrity.
My principle beef is that the members are paying the ED a princely sum, top 1.5% of all incomes in Muncie and top 3% of all incomes in the state of Indiana. His job is to run the staff. And whether it's the drone survey results they promised would be posted in 2014 that still aren't up, or this crummy website, or insurance and other reports to members that haven't been done since 2007, I contend we're not getting anything near top 1.5% management performance for our money. Staffs make mistakes. But it's the job of the ED to ensure they get corrected. So far as I can tell, nobody seems to care.\
On the subject of subordinates/staffs making mistakes, General Eisenhower once said the following to General Patton: "I’mnot looking to hang some kid because he made a mistake. But this happenedbecause that kid wasn’t prepared for it. That’s his commander’s mistake, and ifhis commander wasn’t prepared, it’syourmistake.”
So the staff seems to be performing poorly...and I argue it's the fault of the ED and his management.
It's been my experience leading organizations for over 20 years that those which do not take a candid look at their own performance and hold themselves accountable are doomed to failure. It's the slow drip, drip, drip of mediocrity.
My principle beef is that the members are paying the ED a princely sum, top 1.5% of all incomes in Muncie and top 3% of all incomes in the state of Indiana. His job is to run the staff. And whether it's the drone survey results they promised would be posted in 2014 that still aren't up, or this crummy website, or insurance and other reports to members that haven't been done since 2007, I contend we're not getting anything near top 1.5% management performance for our money. Staffs make mistakes. But it's the job of the ED to ensure they get corrected. So far as I can tell, nobody seems to care.\
On the subject of subordinates/staffs making mistakes, General Eisenhower once said the following to General Patton: "I’mnot looking to hang some kid because he made a mistake. But this happenedbecause that kid wasn’t prepared for it. That’s his commander’s mistake, and ifhis commander wasn’t prepared, it’syourmistake.”
So the staff seems to be performing poorly...and I argue it's the fault of the ED and his management.
05-17-2016, 03:31 PM
#103
Thread Starter
Well said , It's a sad fact of life that most folks while on the job will do as little as they can get away with doing , until someone higher up takes notice and demands better job performance of them . No insurance report since 07 ? No drone survey results since 14 ? And we're trolls for wanting folks to do what our dues are paying them to do ? I'll bet if there were no year end bonus' paid to the EC till the ALL of each year's affairs are in order , you'd see ALL the paperwork completed in blocks of less than 12 month's time , rather than the NINE YEARS we've been without the insurance report . With no built in system of accountability for tasks not completed it's no real surprise that we haven't seen an insurance report in nearly a decade .....
I shot a note to the D3 VP about the drone survey, missing reports, etc. All he said in response was "They're working on it."
Well I should hope so!
Last edited by franklin_m; 05-17-2016 at 03:35 PM.
05-17-2016, 03:34 PM
#104
Banned
My Feedback: (8)
PS , to those throwing around the troll label , I don't see any trolls here at all ,
maybe a sockpuppet or two but that besides the point , I see a bunch of guys who DO care about the AMA , and the problems arise when someone points out something they think isn't right and then gets dogpiled on , as Franlkin has here . Franklin IS right , the new UAS website IS "clunky" and poorly set up , and as a bunch of folks in a hobby as technology bound as ours is , we should be able to do better . Yes , the AMA is a fine organization , that makes the occasional mistake as all Human run enterprises will at times do . If a man points out a legitimate mistake , it's just patently not right to attack him for pointing out the mistake ! Here's something great the AMA did , I just got an Email that this year $48K in scholarship money has been given out , with a total scholarship amount totaling $1 Million . That's great and to be commended ! But does it make up for the whole CBO gaffe ? Maybe to some , but since I call em like I see em , I'd say it's more like "two steps forward , two steps back" and I still say they sold us out in an attempt for total control over all UAS . Now if seeing both the good and the bad makes me a troll , well then I'll proudly stand with Franklin and CombatPigg and wear the label rather than continually assert that everything the AMA has ever done or will do is absolutely perfect when I see mistakes have been made .
By all means though, show us those that "continually assert that everything the AMA has ever done or will do is absolutely perfect".
I have yet to see a single person say anything like that, or close to it.
05-17-2016, 03:39 PM
#105
Banned
My Feedback: (8)
Thanks...
It's been my experience leading organizations for over 20 years that those which do not take a candid look at their own performance and hold themselves accountable are doomed to failure. It's the slow drip, drip, drip of mediocrity.
My principle beef is that the members are paying the ED a princely sum, top 1.5% of all incomes in Muncie and top 3% of all incomes in the state of Indiana. His job is to run the staff. And whether it's the drone survey results they promised would be posted in 2014 that still aren't up, or this crummy website, or insurance and other reports to members that haven't been done since 2007, I contend we're not getting anything near top 1.5% management performance for our money. Staffs make mistakes. But it's the job of the ED to ensure they get corrected. So far as I can tell, nobody seems to care.\
On the subject of subordinates/staffs making mistakes, General Eisenhower once said the following to General Patton: "I’m not looking to hang some kid because he made a mistake. But this happened because that kid wasn’t prepared for it. That’s his commander’s mistake, and if his commander wasn’t prepared, it’s your mistake.”
So the staff seems to be performing poorly...and I argue it's the fault of the ED and his management.
It's been my experience leading organizations for over 20 years that those which do not take a candid look at their own performance and hold themselves accountable are doomed to failure. It's the slow drip, drip, drip of mediocrity.
My principle beef is that the members are paying the ED a princely sum, top 1.5% of all incomes in Muncie and top 3% of all incomes in the state of Indiana. His job is to run the staff. And whether it's the drone survey results they promised would be posted in 2014 that still aren't up, or this crummy website, or insurance and other reports to members that haven't been done since 2007, I contend we're not getting anything near top 1.5% management performance for our money. Staffs make mistakes. But it's the job of the ED to ensure they get corrected. So far as I can tell, nobody seems to care.\
On the subject of subordinates/staffs making mistakes, General Eisenhower once said the following to General Patton: "I’m not looking to hang some kid because he made a mistake. But this happened because that kid wasn’t prepared for it. That’s his commander’s mistake, and if his commander wasn’t prepared, it’s your mistake.”
So the staff seems to be performing poorly...and I argue it's the fault of the ED and his management.
You've been calling for the slow demise of the AMA for some time, and noting all of your perceived issues and errors they have committed. So far....you've managed to get them to correct a broken link and a misspelling. What positive change to you hope to affect?
05-17-2016, 03:41 PM
#106
Banned
My Feedback: (8)
Failure to provide insurance reports to members for nearly a decade is not just a mistake, I argue it borders on incompetence.
I shot a note to the D3 VP about the drone survey, missing reports, etc. All he said in response was "They're working on it."
Well I should hope so!
I shot a note to the D3 VP about the drone survey, missing reports, etc. All he said in response was "They're working on it."
Well I should hope so!
Since you seem to be communicating with Chad, have you asked for this information?
05-17-2016, 04:10 PM
#107
Join Date: Dec 2003
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Failure to provide insurance reports to members for nearly a decade is not just a mistake, I argue it borders on incompetence.
I shot a note to the D3 VP about the drone survey, missing reports, etc. All he said in response was "They're working on it."
Well I should hope so!
I shot a note to the D3 VP about the drone survey, missing reports, etc. All he said in response was "They're working on it."
Well I should hope so!
Mike
05-17-2016, 04:22 PM
#108
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2016
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Thanks...
It's been my experience leading organizations for over 20 years that those which do not take a candid look at their own performance and hold themselves accountable are doomed to failure. It's the slow drip, drip, drip of mediocrity.
My principle beef is that the members are paying the ED a princely sum, top 1.5% of all incomes in Muncie and top 3% of all incomes in the state of Indiana. His job is to run the staff. And whether it's the drone survey results they promised would be posted in 2014 that still aren't up, or this crummy website, or insurance and other reports to members that haven't been done since 2007, I contend we're not getting anything near top 1.5% management performance for our money. Staffs make mistakes. But it's the job of the ED to ensure they get corrected. So far as I can tell, nobody seems to care.\
On the subject of subordinates/staffs making mistakes, General Eisenhower once said the following to General Patton: "I’m not looking to hang some kid because he made a mistake. But this happened because that kid wasn’t prepared for it. That’s his commander’s mistake, and if his commander wasn’t prepared, it’s your mistake.”
So the staff seems to be performing poorly...and I argue it's the fault of the ED and his management.
It's been my experience leading organizations for over 20 years that those which do not take a candid look at their own performance and hold themselves accountable are doomed to failure. It's the slow drip, drip, drip of mediocrity.
My principle beef is that the members are paying the ED a princely sum, top 1.5% of all incomes in Muncie and top 3% of all incomes in the state of Indiana. His job is to run the staff. And whether it's the drone survey results they promised would be posted in 2014 that still aren't up, or this crummy website, or insurance and other reports to members that haven't been done since 2007, I contend we're not getting anything near top 1.5% management performance for our money. Staffs make mistakes. But it's the job of the ED to ensure they get corrected. So far as I can tell, nobody seems to care.\
On the subject of subordinates/staffs making mistakes, General Eisenhower once said the following to General Patton: "I’m not looking to hang some kid because he made a mistake. But this happened because that kid wasn’t prepared for it. That’s his commander’s mistake, and if his commander wasn’t prepared, it’s your mistake.”
So the staff seems to be performing poorly...and I argue it's the fault of the ED and his management.
how much $ humV drop ed make
05-17-2016, 04:25 PM
#109
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best not post until aproved
05-17-2016, 05:45 PM
#111
Thread Starter
I'd recommend folks start peppering their district VPs. W/o a groundswell, it's not going to get fixed. We are the ones paying the bills after all - the shareholders so to speak.
05-17-2016, 06:01 PM
#112
Ok gentlemen, you will notice I have just deleted a huge chunk of posts. It's time that you all stop this silly child like posting in the these threads. For awhile many of the threads here in the AMA Forum did shape up and discussed real issues that we were facing in this hobby, but now many of you are just back to the same childlike behavior you have had in the past. Well it's time that stops. I have deleted a bunch of posts and I will continue to delete stupid posts that have nothing to do with the topic at hand. And if there are members here that are just "shills" or "trolls" that are posting to cause problems then I recommend that you simply put them on your ignore list and forget about them.
Ken
Ken
05-17-2016, 06:01 PM
#113
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Wow someone up there heard me. They were just posted from the April Meeting.
http://www.modelaircraft.org/aboutam...ecminutes.aspx
Mike
http://www.modelaircraft.org/aboutam...ecminutes.aspx
Mike
05-17-2016, 06:17 PM
#114
Banned
My Feedback: (8)
Yeah, there's nothing that prevents them from doing that via a phone vote, or heck even by email. As init4fun said above, for such an esteemed group of professionals leading in such a technologically intensive area, you'd think there'd be a little electronic collaboration!
I'd recommend folks start peppering their district VPs. W/o a groundswell, it's not going to get fixed. We are the ones paying the bills after all - the shareholders so to speak.
I'd recommend folks start peppering their district VPs. W/o a groundswell, it's not going to get fixed. We are the ones paying the bills after all - the shareholders so to speak.
More involvement is always good of course, but what's the next step Franklin? It's great to have the information, but what's going to happen once you get it? More complaints, more criticisms, more comments about what they SHOULD have done instead of what they did? What's the end game?
Don't expect to get everything you ask for, though. You're not entitled to it. The whole "I pay for their salary so I can have anything I want" reminds me of the rants from folks who get pulled over by the cops, and feel the need to mention, I PAY YOUR SALARY. You're absolultely right to expect a more timely posting of all meeting notes, I think within 30 days is more than fair.
Want to have every data point and metric at your fingertips? Great, get involved. No, not by commenting online, not by sending a note to Chad, I mean get involved.
Are you a Leader member? If not, why? The inclination here will be to demean the position, but take a look at what it entails first, then ask yourself, do you meet those qualifications? That's a starting point.
Do you do ANYTHING that would qualify as meaningful in terms of advancing the hobby or helping the AMA? If not, why? Whats holding you back?
I think you've been pretty vocal about not being part of a club, might want to rethink that. And not just join, why not lead. You have a wealth of information about how things should work, from management to operations to safety, why not share that on a smaller scale before moving on to a regional or nation level? I
Those who will actually get more involved might want to consider the way they go about asking/demanding the info as well.
Is it more likely one can make change happen from the outside, or the inside?
05-17-2016, 06:31 PM
#115
Banned
My Feedback: (8)
Wow someone up there heard me. They were just posted from the April Meeting.
http://www.modelaircraft.org/aboutam...ecminutes.aspx
Mike
http://www.modelaircraft.org/aboutam...ecminutes.aspx
Mike
Undoubtedly.
Pretty thorough notes. 99% sure the work on the Muncie property will again be a point of contention, can't help but wonder if anything positive will be noted? Grants? Boots on the Ground proposal? President's travel from Jan to April....too much, not enough (as compared to his salary as compared to the average salary in Muncie?) or just right? 32 congressional office visits, wow. Any other President of a non profit you know made that many visits last year? How about the last 5 years? How about the EVP's report...when do the complaints come in about his salary?
Lots of info to digest.
05-17-2016, 06:45 PM
#116
Banned
My Feedback: (8)
Actually that's not true. You have a district VP who participates in those meetings (although he has already been absent I believe), a quick call or e-mail to him (or one of the many AVPs in your area) will get you the same information. You could get that info much quicker than waiting for it to post online.
05-17-2016, 07:32 PM
#117
Is the well dry, we're back to salary shaming and comparing apples to bananas? Other than one other who agrees with virtually everything you say, there doesn't seem to be a drumbeat out there about the ED's salary. Why is that? Of all the folks in these threads that have disdain for the AMA, why isn't this a big issue for anyone else?
You've been calling for the slow demise of the AMA for some time, and noting all of your perceived issues and errors they have committed. So far....you've managed to get them to correct a broken link and a misspelling. What positive change to you hope to affect?
You've been calling for the slow demise of the AMA for some time, and noting all of your perceived issues and errors they have committed. So far....you've managed to get them to correct a broken link and a misspelling. What positive change to you hope to affect?
You mean like the poll that shows 75% of the respondents who think the AMA mishandled this drone issue...?
Yes, this thread is "Small Potatoes" compared to the bigger issue but it none-the-less points to incompetent leadership.
05-18-2016, 03:14 AM
#118
Banned
My Feedback: (8)
There is no drumbeat, more like a pitter patter. 275 people said "no", and it wasn't "no" indicating the AMA had mishandled, it was that the AMA shouldn't have "embraced"...a bit different no? 187,000 members....22,546 views.......275 responses. Context.
Considering how it was worded and where the poll was taken, the response rate is actually extremely low. Think the responses would be the same at a website primarily focused on MR/Quads?
http://uavcoach.com/drone-news/
Pick 4 sites and throw the poll question up there, then let's compare the results.
Of course everything leads back to the new drumbeat of "the leaders are horrible", "incompetent leadership"....etc etc. More empty sloganeering. Why empty? Because there are no solutions being presented of any substance other than "they need to go". Great, lets get them all out of there...then what? Of the 4 or 5 people here who seem to loath the AMA and it's leadership, I have yet to see any of them indicate they will lift a finger to do anything different. Who exactly will replace these incompetent leaders? Are you throwing your hat in the ring? All I've heard so far is one excuse after another as to why someone can't be involved more, all the while doing nothing more than criticizing.
Where are all the people lined up waiting to take those jobs (that apparently are overpaid). If we look at the new VP candidates over the past year....well, nobodies exactly banging down the door are they? How many ran unopposed? There are more elections coming up this year, lets count the number of people taking a run at the positions, and equally as important, how many people actually vote.
05-18-2016, 03:58 AM
#119
Gee , I guess we're supposed to praise the good and totally ignore the bad according to some , but sorry for them , when money is being spent for jobs not done , and part of it is my money being spent , I believe that entitles me to speak out about it . There should be no year end bonus or raises or anything for the EC till each year's responsibilities have been squared away . There should be NO open business carried year to year and to think it's been almost a decade since the insurance report that was mentioned earlier would almost be comical were it not so blatantly obvious that they just can't be bothered doing what we're paying them to do .
05-18-2016, 04:15 AM
#120
05-18-2016, 04:55 AM
#121
PS , to those throwing around the troll label , I don't see any trolls here at all ,
maybe a sockpuppet or two but that besides the point , I see a bunch of guys who DO care about the AMA , and the problems arise when someone points out something they think isn't right and then gets dogpiled on , as Franlkin has here . Franklin IS right , the new UAS website IS "clunky" and poorly set up , and as a bunch of folks in a hobby as technology bound as ours is , we should be able to do better . Yes , the AMA is a fine organization , that makes the occasional mistake as all Human run enterprises will at times do . If a man points out a legitimate mistake , it's just patently not right to attack him for pointing out the mistake ! Here's something great the AMA did , I just got an Email that this year $48K in scholarship money has been given out , with a total scholarship amount totaling $1 Million . That's great and to be commended ! But does it make up for the whole CBO gaffe ? Maybe to some , but since I call em like I see em , I'd say it's more like "two steps forward , two steps back" and I still say they sold us out in an attempt for total control over all UAS . Now if seeing both the good and the bad makes me a troll , well then I'll proudly stand with Franklin and CombatPigg and wear the label rather than continually assert that everything the AMA has ever done or will do is absolutely perfect when I see mistakes have been made .
05-18-2016, 05:00 AM
#122
Not jibber jabber I made it clear that his lie was not on purpose. Of course you did not comment on the fact that the AMA has no such policy to require membership for over 55 pound models. Just some AMA person making such a claim, which does not make it policy.
05-18-2016, 05:02 AM
#123
You mean like the poll that shows 75% of the respondents who think the AMA mishandled this drone issue...?
05-18-2016, 05:03 AM
#124
Gee , I guess we're supposed to praise the good and totally ignore the bad according to some , but sorry for them , when money is being spent for jobs not done , and part of it is my money being spent , I believe that entitles me to speak out about it .
05-18-2016, 05:08 AM
#125
Where are the complete poll results?