porcia83

My Feedback: (8)

Who would be best man?

Chris P. Bacon

My Feedback: (4)

While well aware of BH's affiliation with the AMA I was never under the impression he was working here in any official capacity as a representative of the AMA.

porcia83

My Feedback: (8)

He wasn't, never did, and even clarified that he never would, his comments are his own. Made that crystal clear. That was of course looked over. And now the suggestion I guess is that he announce his affiliation in every post, maybe his sig line, perhaps have a sticky out there, who knows what one person wants. It's a bizzare request as far as I can see, perhaps an attempt to limit his ability to speak? I see it as another way to change the discussion to the person, rather than the content of the message. As if somehow his comments can onl be viewed through an AMA prism rather than those of any other person. It's presumptuous to think that an affiliation with the AMA will automatically predetermine a persons view on them. Again, we can go back to Hossfly to see that was absolutely not the case, and yet, here we are discussing the person, rather than the message.

Chris P. Bacon

My Feedback: (4)

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Hydro Junkie

I'm going to throw a few thoughts out and maybe BH could comment on them or, if they are good enough, relay them to the EC:
1) Throw a monthly newsletter out to the members, giving an up date of what's going on. An easy way to do so would be to include it in a member's area of the website where you would need an AMA password to get in like R/C Unlimiteds has in their website
2) Have someone tasked by the EC to respond to member emails, a corresponding secretary if you will. That person would be responsible for forwarding all emails to the EC as part of their meetings.
3) Have someone tasked by the EC to perform the task of webmaster, updating information as it becomes available

Any thoughts from anyone on this?

Hydro Junkie

Originally Posted by franklin_m
Ever stop to wonder why they're so overwhelmingly negative?

Every organization has a small population of disgruntled members just as every employer as a small percentage of disgruntled employees. Agreed

Could there be even a grain of truth in the issues raised?

Certainly, but see my statement above. Disgruntled members are happy being disgruntled. No change will ever change their perception. Not true. While some never seem to be satisfied, many would be if changes were made or the reason why they aren't was given.

Could it reflect an underlying morale issue?

Highly unlikely. The small number of disgruntled members is insignificant compared to the membership as a whole. Again, not necessarily. Most of the members probably only have a membership because their club requires it. As long as they are not directly affected by what's going on, they don't see a need to ruffle feathers

Or perhaps a simmering dissatisfaction with the leadership?

Perhaps, but what happens when something simmers too long? At that point, it's time for others to step up and do something rather than stew on it and complain

I'm interested in your sage thoughts.

See above.
My thoughts on these are posted in blue so they don't mix in with Frankin's or Chris' posts

porcia83

My Feedback: (8)

I gave it a shot if you don't mind. Love the blue too...my color of choice.

I think you are looking for a more timely or specific platform that speaks to the members, perhaps on a regional basis? If that's the case, something along those lines also already exists, but I know from personal experience isn't always as updated and current as even the AMA site. That's the district specific web pages. I was frustrated at how long our district site was down, and under construction. Why? Because it's expenive to sublet that out to a vendor to run, and if nobody else sticks their hand up to volunteer to get it up and running, and keep it current, who does that fall on? The district VP of course. Once ours was up and running, we see new content being added, and jurisdictional information provided as well (very important info on pending legislation). Some sites might not have the content to update, that's where AVPs, and all other members can chip in. If you they have an event, take pics and do a write up, and sent it in. Member generated content is always great for the AMA mag, but those spots are limited. Not so much on the websites. Got a good story in the local area that relates to the hobby, sent it in, it might make it in there.

Back to the big AMA site, I would like to see some changes to how it flows, it feels old to me. I'm not in it all the time so when I go to look for something it takes a while, it doesn't feel intuitive to me. Some of the info is outdated too, the Leader member section has info posted as of 2013 if I read that right. Seems to me more info can be in there as well.

Chris P. Bacon

My Feedback: (4)

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franklin_m

What am I going to do?

Well, if you recall I asked AMA about the membership data, they refused to provide or publish.
Survey results? Give me the data they hold and I'll get it published. Heck I'll probably even do a little analysis
Busted links? I already provided many to the AMA, including safety of flight info on the NOTAM page. Some are fixed, some ignored

Additionally, when FAA published the registration info, I wrote a macro that went through a zip lookup table and corrected city info and added county. I offered to the EVP to do the data analysis to match AMA member location data with the FAA stuff. For example, to show where there's high registrations but comparatively low AMA members hip (market penetration). Could even do analysis of registrations by location to bet geographically target regional events - i.e. what locations are within xx miles of the maximum number of registrations. Etc.

Offered that to EVP and regional VP; not even the professional courtesy of a response from either.

You asked me to offer help, I have.

Sport_Pilot

Gripe to the AMA all you want. I don't understand why Ken lets you and others bicker on a constant basis. It it their site and they don't have to allow this.

porcia83

My Feedback: (8)

Sport...you've been just as involved in almost every AMA thread there is, since when is having a back and forth discussion bickering? There's good conversation going on.

Sport_Pilot

franklin_m

The salary comparison was germane with respect to performance of the staff. And it wasn't against Timbuktoo, it was compared with the locale and the state in which the job is performed. If you're ok paying for that kind of performance, then more power to you. This issue is level of compensation vs. performance of the staff he manages. Finding and getting things like this fixed are all part of what we're paying the ED to do (checking on the staff's work, QA/QC, etc.).

“You've said your (sic) quitting the AMA.” What I actually said was that I'm considering it, but will base it on some objective criteria including, but not limited to how many times I actually fly at the local club field where AMA membership is required.

“You even started a thread extolling the virtues of flying by yourself at a local field.” You say it as if that's somehow wrong. If indeed we believe what the AMA is saying, that this isn't about using the law to grow membership, then one would think you would cheer anytime someone is out enjoying the hobby. What is wrong with extolling the virtues of finding places to fly close to home, whether AMA membership is required or not? Is there a fear that others might realize that you can indeed do a lot of flying w/o AMA?

You've documented your displeasure with the AMA over the past what, 8 years? Yep. So what? Am I not entitled to voice my opinion? I pay dues just like everyone else. Or are those who don't become leader members or holders of other lofty titles somehow second class members? Your comments would seem so, since you continue to say “why don't I get involved?” and then closely follow that with something about becoming a leader member.

“The shame of it is you probably have at least some good suggestions, as I indicated above. But who in their right mind would think the AMA would want to get involved with you after all these years of non stop criticism?” If an organization is committed to getting better, they'll accept the ideas regardless of the source. After all, if they're a good idea, who cares from where it orginates? However, it seems that it does matter from who it originates. Another proven method used in most of the rest of the world is to co-opt critics. I worked for a one-star that took one of his fiercest internal critics and put them in a position of finding and bringing errors to our attention. He had a talent for it, so why not put it to good use? But then again, that's would I'd consider an advanced management technique

“Since you use military examples at times, I'll use one here. Think a private is going to run up to a general and tell him what to do, all the mistakes he thinks the general has made, and all the ways the private would run his army? What kind of reception do you think that private is going to get?” Maybe that's your experience, but it's precisely why we maintained a direct feedback method where anyone could communicate with the front office (and me) directly. We recognized that some of the best ideas did in fact come from the front lines. At least when someone took the time to make a suggestion, we gave them the professional courtesy of a response – even if we chose not to accept the idea. This wasn't just at one base either, all of them in our region did it. It's now a core component of my consulting – and a best practice. But then again, I'm working with organizations that are deeply committed to being the best in the industry.

Let's see: I pointed out that NOTAMS (safety of flight info) were out of date - got an admission that their internal process broke down and now is being fixed. I noted that AMA's own news release had busted links; they got fixed (took two tries, but got both fixed eventually). I pointed out survey results were two years overdue, they're now posted (albeit with a gibberish title in the PDF file, and most all of the actual survey questions cut off mid-sentence). So while you say I'm not being effective, there certainly appears to be some measure of success.

porcia83

My Feedback: (8)

I'd use the AMA forum blogs to put your suggestions out there. It's public, and viewed by AMA employees who often times respond to comments and suggestions. At a minimum folks viewing them might agree and push for changes etc, either at the national or local level.

porcia83

My Feedback: (8)

While I might not agree with everything he has said, I don't believe he has ever said anything about an aspect of the hobby that he would like to see extinct. One man's bicker is another man's Debate.

BarracudaHockey

My Feedback: (11)

1) Actually we/they do, it's called Model Aviation and each district VP, the ED, President, etc all have a column in it. Lead time being what it is for a print magazine it's not the fastest means of dissemination but it is there.
2) All of our emails are listed in the above column, email your EC member they should respond. I try to at least answer every email I get, even if it may not be the answer a member wants to hear.
3) The staff already uses the blogs, AMA Air, and the AMA News emails which can be subscribed to and information coming out of there is generally timely. The web site itself is undergoing some work and IMO it needs to.

franklin_m

BH, here's one for you in your official capacity:

All the blogs are topical, how about creating something akin to an electronic suggestion box blog? Solicit ideas from the front lines, the core of the AMA membership, and then require that an AMA staffer responds promptly for all to see.

franklin_m

The blogs are all topical. I suggested to BH that they create an electronic suggestion box blog (see below). We'll see how that's received.

porcia83

My Feedback: (8)

I suspect the suggestion will be passed on, will you be acceptable if that is the response? If it's not implemented, will this be the basis for complaint? At some point there has to be a measure of trust that if someone says they will do something, they do it. The same measure of good faith would have to be accepted if the suggestion was implemented and answers were given. And again, it's one person making the suggestion, One downside of course would be the box getting flooded with all types of duplicative questions, or questions that could have been answered if the person asking them had utilized already available means to answer it. The final issue of course is staffing, would this require a new position, or does the responsibility go to existing staff.

While existing threads may be topical, they still afford people the ability to ask questions and get answers. I do see some complaints of "my post got deleted", but since we've both been in those threads it's not a shocker to see some of the questions and comments from folks get censored/deleted.

Sport_Pilot

Perhaps extinct is too strong but I do not believe he is a fan of MR's or FPV.

Chris P. Bacon

My Feedback: (4)

Why would you think the AMA would even considering trusting you with the data? Every analysis I've ever seen you complete was used to belittle the AMA. Have you ever considered the AMA treats this data as proprietary? Also, if they made it available to one member they would have to make it available to all members. There's an old saying, the numbers don't like, but liars figure.

I see you offer to help as one to merely use additional data for personal gain against the AMA.

Lastly, what makes you think the AMA doesn't already have more qualified data-mining folks already analyzing the data?

BarracudaHockey

My Feedback: (11)

I'll think this over as to how to best present it but yes, I'll pass it on.

porcia83

My Feedback: (8)

He can clarify further, but I believe he actually has MRs.

franklin_m

I own two: a 180QX and a nano QX. I have nothing against MRs. I am opposed to BLOS FPV (as it's illegal per FAA).

Chris P. Bacon

My Feedback: (4)

While a good idea, I wouldn't want it to become a burden for an AMA staffer. I'm not sure I see the relevancy for prompt responses. It's likely most suggestions, especially those proposing business process changes would take some time to research and answer.

If implemented, I recommend the suggestion box be part of the "members only" content area and all suggestions posted include the full name and AMA number of the person making the suggestion.

Considering the source, I can't help but wonder whether this is yet another attempt to send the AMA staff on daily wild goose chases only to justify one's own position of what they consider "helping" and the AMA "not listening". Seems it would be only a matter of time before we start seeing daily "number submitted" vs. "number implemented" stats.