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Are we as hobbyist UAS users in the clear for now? can we jump for joy? or to soon?

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Are we as hobbyist UAS users in the clear for now? can we jump for joy? or to soon?

Old 07-14-2016, 10:35 AM
  #276  
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...

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Old 07-14-2016, 11:15 AM
  #277  
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Originally Posted by init4fun
Nope , not in the least .

It's funny , and I do mean comical , how this played out . If you want real entertainment , read this ;


I stayed away from these threads for a while purposefully so as to not taint the results of the experiment I planned to perform . I took 5 of Franklin's posts , and 5 each of yours , and five each of your buddy's responses to him , and showed them to uninvolved people and asked them what they thought .

To a person , EACH one of them called your posts rude , condescending , and a few other descriptors that I won't repeat here . I gave the two of you a fair chance , didn't say a thing except "please read these comments and tell me what ya think" , and using their responses I'll now give you and your buddy's posts all the due inattention they deserve .

Good Bye ......
Very scientific, One can only wonder what criteria you used to the select each of the posts in your study.

I can't help but notice you didn't include any of your own posts in your scientific study. Perhaps you were too embarrassed to include your own posts?
Old 07-14-2016, 11:17 AM
  #278  
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jeepers dude....be happy. We have a great hobby we're involved in, a site we're able to yammer back and forth on, and a great time of the year to go out and fly and have fun. I'm sure the results of your experiment are interesting, but to what end? Is it not possible to agree to disagree with you? I'll jump for joy if you will......albeit with the need to warm up.

Turn your PM back on too...tried to shoot you a message, no bueno?
Old 07-14-2016, 11:18 AM
  #279  
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Originally Posted by Sport_Pilot
Ah! Cerveza con un caballito de tequila! Un boilermaker mexicano! Deee! Deee! Haaa! Whoo! Viva Mexico!

Bang! Bang! Bang!
It's always good to add a bang bang bang.
Old 07-14-2016, 11:50 AM
  #280  
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Originally Posted by porcia83
It's always good to add a bang bang bang.
I thought it good to give the impression of a Mexican bandit shooting up the town! Maybe better than shooting up the thread!
Old 07-14-2016, 12:25 PM
  #281  
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Originally Posted by porcia83
jeepers dude....be happy. We have a great hobby we're involved in, a site we're able to yammer back and forth on, and a great time of the year to go out and fly and have fun. I'm sure the results of your experiment are interesting, but to what end? Is it not possible to agree to disagree with you? I'll jump for joy if you will......albeit with the need to warm up.

Turn your PM back on too...tried to shoot you a message, no bueno?
You might be able to reach him through Franklin. It's a great hobby, but it's also what we make of it too. For some, the glass will always be half empty, no matter what.

I'm at the age where I've come to realize that some folks are happy being miserable.
Old 07-14-2016, 12:57 PM
  #282  
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Originally Posted by Chris P. Bacon
You might be able to reach him through Franklin. It's a great hobby, but it's also what we make of it too. For some, the glass will always be half empty, no matter what.

I'm at the age where I've come to realize that some folks are happy being miserable.
Plenty of happiness at my house...where I fly a lot more than I ever did when I was a member of the club. All I had to do is make some small adjustments to what I fly.I

Now, I can go out my garage door, fly 8 batteries worth, and be back in less time than it would have taken me to drive to the club field and back. Not to mention, I get a nice walk, easy place to fly, nobody bugging you, nobody crashing into the pits, no waiting for someone to stop hovering a 20cc over the runway preventing anyone else from flying, etc.

As I've said, I'm not a club social type person. So the value proposition is limited. I'd rather spend my time flying. I'd rather spend my money with HK to get more stuff to fly. To each his own though.
Old 07-14-2016, 01:09 PM
  #283  
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Originally Posted by porcia83
The FAA will never go with a specific entity...can't ever see that happening. They will probably go with the general term CBO rather than list the CBO, if there ever is more than one.
And that is a good thing because until they name a specific CBO in writing and also put in writing that all who fly RC must join that CBO we don’t have to worry about being prosecuted for not being a AMA member.
Old 07-14-2016, 01:16 PM
  #284  
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Originally Posted by ira d
And that is a good thing because until they name a specific CBO in writing and also put in writing that all who fly RC must join that CBO we don’t have to worry about being prosecuted for not being a AMA member.
Never gonna happen. If it happened where would it end? Everyone else would jump on the bandwagon too. The NRA would require all gun owners to be members. AAA would require everyone with a drivers license to be a member.
Old 07-14-2016, 01:22 PM
  #285  
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Originally Posted by franklin_m

Now, I can go out my garage door, fly 8 batteries worth, and be back in less time than it would have taken me to drive to the club field and back. Not to mention, I get a nice walk, easy place to fly, nobody bugging you, nobody crashing into the pits, no waiting for someone to stop hovering a 20cc over the runway preventing anyone else from flying, etc.

As I've said, I'm not a club social type person. So the value proposition is limited. I'd rather spend my time flying. I'd rather spend my money with HK to get more stuff to fly. To each his own though.
Maybe, just maybe, that's why:

Originally Posted by franklin_m
in my area, youngsters are not "joining types." They're "grazers."
Old 07-14-2016, 03:49 PM
  #286  
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Originally Posted by Chris P. Bacon
Maybe, just maybe, that's why:
So I'm somehow at fault because the kids in the neighborhood don't have an interest? I offer the kids an opportunity to try it. Some do, some don't. None have come back wanting to know more. Some seem to think that participation in RC flying carries some obligation to be part of a "press gang" for the AMA. Call me crazy, but I though the idea of a hobby was to participate - which I do. And I participate far more than when I was a member of a club. If kids don't want to do it, I'm not going to force it on them. Same with AMA membership.
Old 07-14-2016, 03:57 PM
  #287  
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Originally Posted by franklin_m
So I'm somehow at fault because the kids in the neighborhood don't have an interest? I offer the kids an opportunity to try it. Some do, some don't. None have come back wanting to know more. Some seem to think that participation in RC flying carries some obligation to be part of a "press gang" for the AMA. Call me crazy, but I though the idea of a hobby was to participate - which I do. And I participate far more than when I was a member of a club. If kids don't want to do it, I'm not going to force it on them. Same with AMA membership.
Where ya been it's always our fault no matter how hard we try and what programs we offer it's always our fault that the youngsters don't jump on and embrace model aviation as we did. Apparently were the problem.
They have more distractions than we did as kids hell most don't even go outside to fool around anymore too busy with their noses in their phones I guess.
They have no idea what their missing.
Mike

Last edited by rcmiket; 07-14-2016 at 03:59 PM.
Old 07-14-2016, 04:07 PM
  #288  
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Originally Posted by franklin_m
Plenty of happiness at my house...where I fly a lot more than I ever did when I was a member of the club. All I had to do is make some small adjustments to what I fly.I

Now, I can go out my garage door, fly 8 batteries worth, and be back in less time than it would have taken me to drive to the club field and back. Not to mention, I get a nice walk, easy place to fly, nobody bugging you, nobody crashing into the pits, no waiting for someone to stop hovering a 20cc over the runway preventing anyone else from flying, etc.

As I've said, I'm not a club social type person. So the value proposition is limited. I'd rather spend my time flying. I'd rather spend my money with HK to get more stuff to fly. To each his own though.
I do loves me some HK for some stuff (Cannot beat the D.H. Vampire for the cost and capabilities) but Motion RC has been knocking it out of the park, at least with fixed wing. At the end the day as long as we are all having fun and being safe, you're right, to each his own.
Old 07-14-2016, 04:41 PM
  #289  
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....

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Old 07-14-2016, 04:51 PM
  #290  
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Thankfully we've got plenty of youngsters willing to do this for a living .... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pz2Cl3TnRyM

Or this... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AjtSXJGxMNE

Miss that a lot...

Last edited by franklin_m; 07-14-2016 at 04:59 PM. Reason: Updated linked video to better one...
Old 07-14-2016, 04:55 PM
  #291  
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Originally Posted by franklin_m
Thankfully we've got plenty of youngsters willing to do this for a living .... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GKRBIY3GsmI

Miss that a lot...
Pretty soon the way it's going the pilot will be a thing of the past. End of a era.

Mike
Old 07-14-2016, 06:00 PM
  #292  
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Originally Posted by ira d
And that is a good thing because until they name a specific CBO in writing and also put in writing that all who fly RC must join that CBO we don’t have to worry about being prosecuted for not being a AMA member.
I guess that's one way to look at it. The other is to do what 99.99 % of us do, which is fly where we should, and in a safe manner. Then, there's little risk of getting in trouble for anything.
Old 07-14-2016, 06:04 PM
  #293  
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Originally Posted by franklin_m
Thankfully we've got plenty of youngsters willing to do this for a living .... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pz2Cl3TnRyM

Or this... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AjtSXJGxMNE

Miss that a lot...
Saw this last year at Westover AFB, I can't prove it but I think it went faster with this livery.
http://<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/l50SGhyZG8M" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
Old 07-14-2016, 06:17 PM
  #294  
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Originally Posted by init4fun
"When the Student is ready to learn , the Teacher will appear" .....

Guys , I really think the fact is that the latest generations of folks just don't have the same fascination with remote controlling model aircraft , or really remote controlling model anything for that matter , that people of our generations did . Like Porcia mentioned in his recent AMA thread , today's youth are far more interested in Pokemon and other video games , those being this generation's entertainment like our models and for some Lionel trains were our generation's favorite pastimes . And I can't particularly fault this , folks are interested in what catches their eye and if that ain't model aircraft I'm not ever gonna be the one to push them on the unwilling . I can see too why most youngsters who are interested in flying things these days are into quads , quads are the future and no youngster wants to play with outdated technology as proven by the push for the latest and greatest video game consoles whenever they are released . PS3 ? It was the hottest thing Sony sold , right up till PS4 was announced , at which point PS3 was overnight "passe" . I guess 113 years since Wilbur and Orville have dulled the public's awe of flying machines with folks now seeing them as SO commonplace as to not warrant much attention or adoration , compared to how the youth of the 1950s felt about flying things , when pretty much all modes of flight were still relatively new . I don't go as far as to say flying machines today are totally taken for granted , just that they don't generate the kinds of excitement they did back in our youth , back when they were "PS4 new" .....
although our club recently capped it's membership, we had a family show up last month looking to join. a few of our members found the family flying in a nearby field with their grandpa at different times during the week. Grandpa was visiting from Canada and had brought his usual gifts with him for his visit, new RC planes for the kids. They were told to come over to our field and fly as guests, our field has short grass runways and a blacktop one as well. Grandpa is an old hand at RC, yes a "traditional" dude through and through but said later that the newer foam stuff was the way to get the kids involved, when they get a bit older he'll start them building. So, the oldest boy was 7, and was flying his Duet all by himself. His sister..yes sister....is 5. after dad launched her Delta Ray she laid on her stomach and put the transmitter out in front of her on the ground, then flew the plane that way. Why that method, that's how her and her brother use their PS3.

There was no way we were letting them leave without having them join. So rare to have a family join now, let alone one with young kids, and even more rare for a girl to be interested in flying. There's always room for a few more like that. That was probably the easy part, now to keep them interested.
Old 07-14-2016, 06:53 PM
  #295  
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Originally Posted by franklin_m
So I'm somehow at fault because the kids in the neighborhood don't have an interest? I offer the kids an opportunity to try it. Some do, some don't. None have come back wanting to know more. Some seem to think that participation in RC flying carries some obligation to be part of a "press gang" for the AMA. Call me crazy, but I though the idea of a hobby was to participate - which I do. And I participate far more than when I was a member of a club. If kids don't want to do it, I'm not going to force it on them. Same with AMA membership.
There are varying levels of participation. In my neck of the woods some clubs actively engage the local schools in order to provide the modeling experience to hundreds of students rather than just the few who randomly pass by. Like junk mail bingo cards the success rate is small, but it's to be expected. The low success rates of telemarketers or junk mail hasn't stopped them.
Old 07-14-2016, 06:57 PM
  #296  
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Originally Posted by porcia83
although our club recently capped it's membership, we had a family show up last month looking to join. a few of our members found the family flying in a nearby field with their grandpa at different times during the week. Grandpa was visiting from Canada and had brought his usual gifts with him for his visit, new RC planes for the kids. They were told to come over to our field and fly as guests, our field has short grass runways and a blacktop one as well. Grandpa is an old hand at RC, yes a "traditional" dude through and through but said later that the newer foam stuff was the way to get the kids involved, when they get a bit older he'll start them building. So, the oldest boy was 7, and was flying his Duet all by himself. His sister..yes sister....is 5. after dad launched her Delta Ray she laid on her stomach and put the transmitter out in front of her on the ground, then flew the plane that way. Why that method, that's how her and her brother use their PS3.

There was no way we were letting them leave without having them join. So rare to have a family join now, let alone one with young kids, and even more rare for a girl to be interested in flying. There's always room for a few more like that. That was probably the easy part, now to keep them interested.
Leadership at it's best. I can't imagine how many clubs would have turned them away saying nothing more than "we're full". I've seen it to many times.
Old 07-14-2016, 09:21 PM
  #297  
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Originally Posted by porcia83
I guess that's one way to look at it. The other is to do what 99.99 % of us do, which is fly where we should, and in a safe manner. Then, there's little risk of getting in trouble for anything.
with all the talk about declining club membership within the AMA, i am thinking that that 99.9% number is a bit high. at least if you are thinking that one has to fly in a club environment, to be flying where we should and in a safe manner, which i, and some few others do not agree with.

my self, i have been a non club affiliated AMA member since 2001 or so,and i have a feeling that close to 50% of AMA members are more like me(non club) than are like you(club guy). at one time, while dave brown was president, he stated in his column that less than 50 of AMA members were club affiliated. no one at AMA has wanted to update us on that stat since.
Old 07-15-2016, 03:26 AM
  #298  
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Originally Posted by mongo
with all the talk about declining club membership within the AMA, i am thinking that that 99.9% number is a bit high. at least if you are thinking that one has to fly in a club environment, to be flying where we should and in a safe manner, which i, and some few others do not agree with.

my self, i have been a non club affiliated AMA member since 2001 or so,and i have a feeling that close to 50% of AMA members are more like me(non club) than are like you(club guy). at one time, while dave brown was president, he stated in his column that less than 50 of AMA members were club affiliated. no one at AMA has wanted to update us on that stat since.
Interesting. First time I've ever heard that figure and I'm surprised it's so high considering so many say they're only a member because it's required for the club they belong to. On the flip, it may still be necessary for those who do not belong to a club, but still participate in AMA sanctioned events.
Old 07-15-2016, 04:07 AM
  #299  
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Originally Posted by mongo
with all the talk about declining club membership within the AMA, i am thinking that that 99.9% number is a bit high. at least if you are thinking that one has to fly in a club environment, to be flying where we should and in a safe manner, which i, and some few others do not agree with.

my self, i have been a non club affiliated AMA member since 2001 or so,and i have a feeling that close to 50% of AMA members are more like me(non club) than are like you(club guy). at one time, while dave brown was president, he stated in his column that less than 50 of AMA members were club affiliated. no one at AMA has wanted to update us on that stat since.
I intentionally steered clear of the labels you just used, in certain cases they tend to be polarizing. They create an us versus them scenario. I belong to 4 clubs over 3 states, but actually end up doing more of my flying in local fields, not clubs. Perhaps you misunderstood what I said, because I never said that one has to be flying at a club to be flying in the right place and be safe. I've said in the past that I believe there are more people flying RC that are not part of the AMA, and that is perfectly fine. Flying where they should be usually goes hand in hand with being safe, ie large open fields away from roads, town athletic fields (with smaller park fliers), private fields with approval of owners.

I have said in the past that I think there are probably more people flying RC that are not part of the AMA than are, AMA membership is voluntary and doesn't have any affect on how someone enjoys the hobby. I'm a proud member and I've derived far more benefits from my membership than just insurance, I've tried to make the most out of it, otherwise why pay the money to join? As with most things we do in life, it's a personal choice.

As for "all the talk about declining club membership", that's usually coming from the same folks who say that AMA membership is 15 year decline. Either they are unable to read, or they are just flat out lying (sort of like the lie that AMA is tricking people into thinking they have to join). Club levels ebb and flow, just as membership to the AMA (which by the way has actually been growing for 4 years). One club I belong to has gone from a cap of 125 to 209 in 4 years, some have had to cap membership. Another club I just rejoined went from almost 200 people down to 70 because the large scale "traditional" folks wouldn't let anyone else fly with them, and only one plane in the air. Nobody is going to wait 2 hours to fly once, then get back in a line. Thankfully new officials were elected there.

Clubs hold their own destiny in their hands. Aggressive ones who get out there and interact with their community and drive traffic to their club, and even utilize programs available to them through, wait for it...the AMA... will be just fine. Clubs that shut themselves off from those things, as well as fun flys and accepting of all disciples of flight will eventually realize the error of their ways. They again, they might want it that way, an "exclusive" type of deal, and that's perfectly fine as well if that's what the membership wants.

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Old 07-15-2016, 05:58 AM
  #300  
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Originally Posted by porcia83
As for "all the talk about declining club membership", that's usually coming from the same folks who say that AMA membership is 15 year decline. Either they are unable to read, or they are just flat out lying [emphasis added].
In all fairness, it was an article in Model Aviation that provided the information about 15 year decline. While it's alleged above that we can't read, or that we're lying, I offer the following proof:

"Starting approximately 15 years ago, many model airplane clubs began seeing a decline in membership — fewer new people were joining and interested visitors to the flying field often did not return. This trend continues today. [emphasis added]."

"My efforts to highlight these tendencies and help stem the 15-year trend of declining club membership might prove to be wishful thinking."

- Dave Scott
- May 2016 issue of Model Aviation (the AMA's own magazine I'd add)

http://www.modelaviation.com/fostering-active-clubs

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