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The Poop has hit the fan !

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Old 09-24-2018, 01:42 PM
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Default The Poop has hit the fan !

Anyone else get the red alert message from the AMA today ? It appears the about to be enacted version of 336 puts our hobby directly under FAA control and does in fact impose a hard 400 foot limit on ALL hobby based model aircraft flights ! I'm sad to think about all the sailplane guys and everyone else whose models require more than 400 feet of flying space .
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Old 09-24-2018, 02:02 PM
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From everything that has transpired in threads both here and in other places, I have to chuckle a bit over this and say to all,

Told you so!

Also appears the 8.5 ounce lower limit for registration is no more.
And it appears a test is in the near future.
Plus any CBO will need to coordinate their safety and flight rules with the FAA.

Changes coming that's for sure!

When are the next AMA elections?

Last edited by Appowner; 09-24-2018 at 02:06 PM.
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Old 09-24-2018, 02:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Appowner View Post
From everything that has transpired in threads both here and in other places, I have to chuckle a bit over this and say to all,

Told you so!

Also appears the 8.5 ounce lower limit for registration is no more.
And it appears a test is in the near future.
Plus any CBO will need to coordinate their safety and flight rules with the FAA.

Changes coming that's for sure!

When are the next AMA elections?
I have felt for quite some time that the 400 foot limit was going to be enacted , because on an official level I have always believed that AC 91-57 was the FAA's imposition of that limit . In other words , on an official level the FAA had believed all these years that we were adhering to the 400 feet mentioned in 91-57 and now they want it set in stone . I'm not too sure who your "told you so" is for , just about everyone in these threads believed the future held more burdensome regulation , and it appears the future is now ....
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Old 09-24-2018, 02:28 PM
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gotta call to action email.
addressed to all leader members telly us to contact all our club members and others we know and TELL them to contact their congresscritters and TELL them to vote no on the authorization bill. now this is a bad idea inj thje first place, and if anyone actually thinks that they are gona sway a congress critter with the minuscule numbers of folk we have to vote no on a bill that is funding for DHS, TSA, ICE and lord knows what else just the FAA stuff, in an election year, this close to the actual election. well, i have a bridge in brooklyn i want to sell ya...
a lost cause.
really i think the call to action is more of a CYA act by the AMA, so they can blame the bills passage on US not turning out enough letters to get it stopped.
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Old 09-24-2018, 04:19 PM
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In the most recent version of HR 302, Section 336 is repealed. So yes, the hobby will be in direct FAA control. When questioning one of the clauses in Part 107, I was told by a medical examiner that people who were denied a medical certificate, also cannot use Part 107. So commercial drones are out. Will this also be the case with model airplanes? Because this bill does not prohibit the FAA from mandating a minimum medical requirement. There will also be a certification test involved. Overall, the media outcry against incompetent drone operators may be a contributing factor in this, and it may be the same way with some modelers in clubs. The AMA may have to start being a little more selective on who it accepts as members.
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Old 09-25-2018, 03:53 AM
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Originally Posted by init4fun View Post
.................................................. .........I'm not too sure who your "told you so" is for , just about everyone in these threads believed the future held more burdensome regulation , and it appears the future is now ....
Not here so much but there have been a couple. Mainly in other forums where one can get accused of all manner of things simply for not joining the herd.

And of course if I made it a bit more specific, i.e. "You know who you are!" No one would know!
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Old 09-25-2018, 11:16 AM
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Originally Posted by NorfolkSouthern View Post
In the most recent version of HR 302, Section 336 is repealed. So yes, the hobby will be in direct FAA control. When questioning one of the clauses in Part 107, I was told by a medical examiner that people who were denied a medical certificate, also cannot use Part 107. So commercial drones are out. Will this also be the case with model airplanes? Because this bill does not prohibit the FAA from mandating a minimum medical requirement. There will also be a certification test involved. Overall, the media outcry against incompetent drone operators may be a contributing factor in this, and it may be the same way with some modelers in clubs. The AMA may have to start being a little more selective on who it accepts as members.
This medical examiner may be incorrect for now, you do not need a Certificate of Airmanship to fly under 107. This is the screwy part of 107, you take a basic written knowledge based exam and renew it every two years, but do not need to fulfill any other requirements to fly under 107. Many who do hold pilot licenses and commercial ratings question the validity of this so called "drone" license, meaning if I had my medical pulled and held a commercial license, could I still fly under 107? Technically, yes, because 107 is neither a license nor an endorsement rating to a license. I suspect that soon the FAA will require someone to hold a GA and then work to have a commercial drone rating added.
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Old 09-26-2018, 01:21 PM
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Elect who you want in the AMA, but that’s not going to solve anything. When you have big $$$ lobbyists like Amazon pushing to uneccesarliy squash us flyers it’s like bringing chop sticks to a gun fight. When they talk of FPV vehicles flying all over populated areas it’s just a matter of time before a mishap and it won’t be from my 72” J-3 Cub!
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Old 09-26-2018, 03:52 PM
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I suppose more and more of us old timers on a limited budget who just want to build and fly our sport and scale fixed wing models are just gonna throw up our hands and say "Scr.. the AMA and the FAA"
If we can find a vacant field to fly safely in, we will. If not, then we`ll just throw in the towel and say "Sorry, R/C airplane industry, you won`t be getting any more of our money. You`ll have to go after the ones with money to burn and irresponsible quad pilots who ruined it for us.
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Old 09-26-2018, 04:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Stickslammer View Post
I "Sorry, R/C airplane industry, you won`t be getting any more of our money. You`ll have to go after the ones with money to burn and irresponsible quad pilots who ruined it for us.
Even before so many of the biggies went under, I always wondered with so much on the line, if or why they didn't seem to financially work with the AMA to keep the RC aeromodeling hobby on solid ground.
With collectively millions of dollars at their disposal, they could've paid for ads somewhere. Although, the name Traxxas was seen on TV on occasion.

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Old 09-27-2018, 02:00 AM
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I will continue to build with the kits and plans I have on hand. As long as materials remain available anyway. What my family does with it all when I'm gone I really do not care. Burn it all and send it to Muncie for a museum display.

The hobby I believe will continue but just what form it will take will depend on many factors. One is whether or not we continue to have something like the AMA. And second will be whether or not the leadership is competent in their duties? I believe the AMA currently is not and that the AMA under it's current leadership will not survive this whole fiasco in it's current form.

But once we again have a competent nationwide organization, then we can start a grass roots reconstruction of the hobby as we knew it. It will take time and it will experience changes from today and many of us I suspect will not be around to see it to fruition. But it CAN happen. The question is will it? That is up to the individual modelers out there.
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Old 09-27-2018, 02:03 AM
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Originally Posted by fliers1 View Post
Even before so many of the biggies went under, I always wondered with so much on the line, if or why they didn't seem to financially work with the AMA to keep the RC aeromodeling hobby on solid ground.
With collectively millions of dollars at their disposal, they could've paid for ads somewhere. Although, the name Traxxas was seen on TV on occasion.
Well, Drone racing was in prime time on ESPN the other day. I didn't watch but one thing is for sure, the drones have brought more media attention than the AMA and traditional RC ever has. Too bad it couldn't all be good attention.
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Old 09-27-2018, 03:03 AM
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2500 AMA clubs are the go to place for newcomers and for all intents and purposes club instructors run the show and have the last word. So, could it be that those who are uncomfortable flying with more than 2 planes in the air at the same time and already over burdened IIC (Instructors In Charge) call the shots and collectively suggest that AMA keep a low profile?
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Old 09-27-2018, 03:16 AM
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Originally Posted by fliers1 View Post
2500 AMA clubs are the go to place for newcomers and for all intents and purposes club instructors run the show and have the last word. So, could it be that those who are uncomfortable flying with more than 2 planes in the air at the same time and already over burdened IIC (Instructors In Charge) call the shots and collectively suggest that AMA keep a low profile?
I really don't see Muncie doing anything just because the clubs said so! I think the AMA's low profile in this regard is due purely to money. They don't have any they care to redirect to such a venture.
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Old 09-27-2018, 09:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Appowner View Post
Not here so much but there have been a couple. Mainly in other forums where one can get accused of all manner of things simply for not joining the herd.

And of course if I made it a bit more specific, i.e. "You know who you are!" No one would know!
Hi Appowner , yes indeed , I'm a 50 year member whose been called an "AMA Hater" more than once here myself when my views aren't in lock step with the uber AMA faithful .

Originally Posted by NorfolkSouthern View Post
In the most recent version of HR 302, Section 336 is repealed. So yes, the hobby will be in direct FAA control.
Hi NorfolkSouthern , Thank You for the correction , I had just finished reading the AMA's Email when I wrote this thread and although my brain was thinking HR 302 my fingers must have been just a bit TOO used to typing 336

PS , the most recent Email has HR 302 passing it's first hurdle ......
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Old 09-27-2018, 12:12 PM
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Originally Posted by init4fun View Post
Hi Appowner , yes indeed , I'm a 50 year member whose been called an "AMA Hater" more than once here myself when my views aren't in lock step with the uber AMA faithful .
.................................................. ...........
Well, from where I sit it has been us "Haters" who have been pointing out problems with and offering suggestions for the AMA to correct said problems. The "Advocates" have done little other than demand business as usual. And of course distribute the hate against the "Haters".
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Old 09-27-2018, 01:49 PM
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Finally it is good to see someone refer to the correct piece of legistature. It has been impossible to get AMA away from 336 which is a totally different section in HR 302. The new section in HR 302 is section 349 paragraph 44809.
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Old 09-28-2018, 04:27 AM
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Originally Posted by paulsf86 View Post
Finally it is good to see someone refer to the correct piece of legistature. It has been impossible to get AMA away from 336 which is a totally different section in HR 302. The new section in HR 302 is section 349 paragraph 44809.
In a way it is amusing to see the way people confuse and basically screw up all these references. But on the other hand, it's also somewhat sad to see Americans making so many errors in referencing governmental processes and documents. And don't get me started on the comprehension of the same.
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Old 09-28-2018, 03:45 PM
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I couldn`t tell you the difference between a Senator and a Congressman, as I was pathetically inattentive in my US Government class in high school. However, in my humble opinion many our so-called public servants are a bunch of overpaid crooked blowhards who are interested in nothing but lining their own pockets with the money they withhold from our paychecks and other ill gotten funds.
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Old 09-29-2018, 04:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Stickslammer View Post
I couldn`t tell you the difference between a Senator and a Congressman, as I was pathetically inattentive in my US Government class in high school. However, in my humble opinion many our so-called public servants are a bunch of overpaid crooked blowhards who are interested in nothing but lining their own pockets with the money they withhold from our paychecks and other ill gotten funds.
Assuming you would be interested, Hillsdale College offers a bunch of FREE online courses. Here's a list: Hillsdale College You can take each course at your leisure. Books are not needed so it costs only your time. There is usually a book or two associated with the course but their cost is usually quite reasonable. Especially for college books.

And yes, there is a lot of corruption in our government. They rely on the voting public remaining ignorant of the process, Constitution, etc. Taking these classes is one way to fight back and to make this nation what the founding fathers envisioned. But most people say they don't have the time. Wonder where we'd be had Washington, Jefferson, Adams, Monroe and others felt that way?
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Old 09-29-2018, 06:36 AM
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Thanks, Appowner, that is good advice. There is no excuse for being ignorant for most subjects, especially the " I don`t have time" one. I know about Hillsdale College from listening to Conservative Talk Radio. I`m a big fan of you know who, among others on the circuit. I know this isn`t a place for such discussion, or maybe it is, since politics and r/c model aircraft seem to be becoming increasingly intertwined. It seems as though the ever more prevalent tax and spend habits of Washington have caught on nicely down in Muncie also.
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Old 09-29-2018, 10:04 AM
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I've read on RCGroups that the bill got a one week extension, until October 7th. It might not make it. Who knows?
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Old 09-30-2018, 08:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Stickslammer View Post
Thanks, Appowner, that is good advice. There is no excuse for being ignorant for most subjects, especially the " I don`t have time" one. I know about Hillsdale College from listening to Conservative Talk Radio. I`m a big fan of you know who, among others on the circuit. I know this isn`t a place for such discussion, or maybe it is, since politics and r/c model aircraft seem to be becoming increasingly intertwined. It seems as though the ever more prevalent tax and spend habits of Washington have caught on nicely down in Muncie also.
Having lived for 29 years just 18 miles from the White House, trust me when I say, the crew in Muncie are amateurs when it comes to spending other peoples money. Though I will give them credit for trying.
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Old 09-30-2018, 08:17 AM
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Originally Posted by NorfolkSouthern View Post
I've read on RCGroups that the bill got a one week extension, until October 7th. It might not make it. Who knows?
The House passed it and sent it to the Senate via memo. What this means is the Senate can not change anything about it (no amendments) and they must do a simple yes or no vote. Shouldn't be too difficult for them to get to that.

Then again, we are talking about our elected officials!
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Old 09-30-2018, 04:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Appowner View Post
The House passed it and sent it to the Senate via memo. What this means is the Senate can not change anything about it (no amendments) and they must do a simple yes or no vote. Shouldn't be too difficult for them to get to that.

Then again, we are talking about our elected officials!
Looks like it's a done deal then. Will the Senate vote on it by October 7, though? Or will it end up being tabled yet again?
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