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AMA EC Key Measures of Performance - Last 15yrs

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AMA EC Key Measures of Performance - Last 15yrs

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Old 02-21-2019, 06:59 AM
  #101  
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Originally Posted by speedracerntrixie View Post


You mean like those who want to maintain control of the AMA forum on RCU?
As opposed to those members who seem quite happy letting the AMA fiscally spiral into the toilet?
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Old 02-21-2019, 09:14 AM
  #102  
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Originally Posted by Appowner View Post
As opposed to those members who seem quite happy letting the AMA fiscally spiral into the toilet?
Yet by renewing my membership, supporting my local hobby shop, joining 3 local clubs, participating in up to 10 AMA sanctioned events per year, giving equipment to several youth AMA members and mentoring them, most would consider my actions having more of a positive impact on the health of the AMA then what any of the key players in this forum have accomplished.
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Old 02-21-2019, 09:23 AM
  #103  
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Originally Posted by speedracerntrixie View Post


Yet by renewing my membership, supporting my local hobby shop, joining 3 local clubs, participating in up to 10 AMA sanctioned events per year, giving equipment to several youth AMA members and mentoring them, most would consider my actions having more of a positive impact on the health of the AMA then what any of the key players in this forum have accomplished.

Please explain how your actions are convincing the EC that changes in the budget and spending need to be enacted?

You can join all the clubs you want and compete in all the contests there are. That won't do a thing to change the decades old patterns shown in Franks charts.
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Old 02-21-2019, 09:24 AM
  #104  
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Originally Posted by speedracerntrixie View Post
Yet by renewing my membership, supporting my local hobby shop, joining 3 local clubs, participating in up to 10 AMA sanctioned events per year, giving equipment to several youth AMA members and mentoring them, most would consider my actions having more of a positive impact on the health of the AMA then what any of the key players in this forum have accomplished.
Speedy, nobody is saying you cannot do that. You're perfectly free to keep handing the AMA money, directly or indirectly. You're perfectly free to keep doing all of what you described and more. But so too are others free to not do those things. If AMA can survive on folks like you, great. More power to them. But many of us believe they cannot, certainly not at their current spending levels.

And we appear to be in good company, as the CFO and Brady Ware is giving them the same warnings. Yet they continue spending as if there's no problem.
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Old 02-21-2019, 09:43 AM
  #105  
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And something else to think about. Club money is NOT AMA money. Who funds those contests you go to? I'll bet very little if any came from Muncie except for the NATs. You have entry fees and maybe some other costs going to the local club but by and large I'll wager it's the sponsoring club that funds the contest. NOT Muncie!

So what are you going to do when your dues is doubled and the NATs cancelled or cut way back due to lack of funds? Join another club?
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Old 02-21-2019, 10:55 AM
  #106  
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Originally Posted by speedracerntrixie View Post


Yet by renewing my membership, supporting my local hobby shop, joining 3 local clubs, participating in up to 10 AMA sanctioned events per year, giving equipment to several youth AMA members and mentoring them, most would consider my actions having more of a positive impact on the health of the AMA then what any of the key players in this forum have accomplished.
Ding Ding Ding we have a winner here!!!!!!!!!

Originally Posted by Appowner View Post
Please explain how your actions are convincing the EC that changes in the budget and spending need to be enacted.
And your constant sniveling helps how?????????
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Old 02-21-2019, 11:53 AM
  #107  
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Originally Posted by Appowner View Post
Please explain how your actions are convincing the EC that changes in the budget and spending need to be enacted?

You can join all the clubs you want and compete in all the contests there are. That won't do a thing to change the decades old patterns shown in Franks charts.
I do the same thing, belong to clubs, pay my $75, support LHS, take kids flying, participate in mall shows and parades, and what do correspondence do I get from the AMA, a few years ago a letter stating that I failed them at the Grass Roots level of their "Membership Drive".
I didn't even really know it was going on other than some three page article in MA.
I never got email
And what mail I get from AMA is in the form of sales promos for car insurance, vacations, and coins.
I used to write and even call my VP, anymore, its like writing or calling my Congressman, I get a "Note taken, thanks for your concern and call, don't worry, we are taking care it, have a nice day and be sure to support our Foundation so we can show what a great job we are doing in promoting model aviation by sending some kid to college".


Nope, if I was to make a real difference, then I would be getting letters, emails, and even phone calls from my VP and HQ asking for my input and help.
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Old 02-21-2019, 12:29 PM
  #108  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by speedracerntrixie
Yet by renewing my membership, supporting my local hobby shop, joining 3 local clubs, participating in up to 10 AMA sanctioned events per year, giving equipment to several youth AMA members and mentoring them, most would consider my actions having more of a positive impact on the health of the AMA then what any of the key players in this forum have accomplished.

Ding Ding Ding we have a winner here!!!!!!!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Appowner
Please explain how your actions are convincing the EC that changes in the budget and spending need to be enacted.

And your constant sniveling helps how?????????

Okay, first off, I'm going to say Speed is definitely helping the hobby AT THE LOCAL LEVEL, no arguments there. As someone else said, his participation at the 10 events and in the three clubs is helping keep them going. But, as also stated, unless the events are actually being run by the AMA home office, all the fees he pays to attend the 10 events go to the club or district that's putting it on, not the AMA. How do I know this? Every year, there is a NAMBA Nationals, a race put on by one of the districts that any and all R/C boat racers are invited to attend. The costs are covered, up front, by the district while the entry fees reimburse that district for said expenses. The NAMBA home office gets nothing for sanctioning the event. Therefore, I don't know how his actions make Speed an AMA winner, other than paying his membership dues.
As far as Appowner sniveling, I don't see how asking a question is sniveling. I could ask you the same questions, Propworm.
1) Do you "give" the AMA money every year, for them to waste on things that don't benefit you or any other member, such as the planned indoor flying facility?
2) Do you like getting a magazine that is giving information and such that is as much as six months out of date with nothing current and costing millions of dollars a year to produce?
3) Do you routinely fly at the flying field in Muncie, using the facilities that you pay property taxes on as well as the costs to keep the facilities maintained by a full time grounds crew?
4) Do you write to, email or call the AMA's office to ask how and why they are spending money on things that make no fiscal or common sense?
If you answered YES to the first and NO to the last three questions, the AMA is playing you for a fool, taking your money and telling you what a great value you're getting when, in actuality, all you're really getting is overpriced secondary insurance that may or may not pay, depending on the claim and an out of date magazine that isn't worth the paper it's printed on

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Old 02-21-2019, 03:32 PM
  #109  
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Lets see I join a shooting club $200 plus a year it gives me the use of the facilities I have no say in how its run or what is being offered. No vote. Once paid the money is no longer mine to direct in any fashion. I pay a membership in NHRA again it allows me to attend and compete at NHRA events but again I have no say in what is done once my membership money is paid. Take any organization i belong to and once you pay your fees for belonging its no longer your money. Its the cost of belonging you don't get to decide where your money is to be used. You receive what ever benefits are due and that's all you are really entitled to. Obviously the majority of the AMA are satisfied with the status quo as the few of you can be easily ignored by the powers to be. I don't see your numbers growing its the same half dozen or so egged on by guys like Franklin who get your knickers in a bunch and watch to see the antics you provide for his entertainment. When things get slow he tosses you guys another bone and like a pack of hounds off you go baying at the moon again. Don't you guys ever get out and just fly for fun????
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Old 02-21-2019, 04:01 PM
  #110  
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Originally Posted by Hydro Junkie View Post
As far as Appowner sniveling, I don't see how asking a question is sniveling.
He is not an AMA member as such has no right to even ask questions of an organization he has no stake in. Sniveling is the only way to describe it. No different than a nosy neighbor who thinks he has the right to interject in your family affairs.

I could ask you the same questions, Propworm.
1) Do you "give" the AMA money every year, for them to waste on things that don't benefit you or any other member, such as the planned indoor flying facility?

Nope I belong to MAAC smaller with the same problems with things like declining enrollment etc. but I do benefit greatly from my association with the AMA.
2) Do you like getting a magazine that is giving information and such that is as much as six months out of date with nothing current and costing millions of dollars a year to produce?
I do purchase the magazine when I notice it on the shelf at the local US hobby shop I go to. Our magazine is also a few months behind the times as it takes time to edit and put the magazine together. Especially when you are dependent on so many different people who must submit the articles. Many times an editor must chase down whoever is supposed to submit. The magazine is the legal communication of the organization. There are certain things such as your annual general meeting, district meeting etc that must reach each and every member and not everyone has or wants email. Your magazine is most likely the only legal way to accomplish this.
3) Do you routinely fly at the flying field in Muncie, using the facilities that you pay property taxes on as well as the costs to keep the facilities maintained by a full time grounds crew?
Not as of yet though now I just about have my truck, truck camper and trailer/toy box finalized and with a pending retirement fully intend on making Muncie for your NATS as a participant. In the mean time I have been traveling about your wonderful country flying at as many different fields as I can find.
4) Do you write to, email or call the AMA's office to ask how and why they are spending money on things that make no fiscal or common sense?
Nope but I have often emailed for information and each time have received a timely, polite reply.
If you answered YES to the first and NO to the last three questions, they AMA is playing you for a fool, taking your money and telling you what a great value you're getting when, in actuality, all you're really getting is overpriced secondary insurance that may or may not pay, depending on the claim and an out of date magazine that isn't worth the paper it's printed on
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Old 02-21-2019, 04:45 PM
  #111  
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Drop the magazine already ! This has been said by many for the last several years and with the new info of how much money it has been loosing , cutting it should be top priority.
Another money looser is the "trade show" coming up this weekend in NY. Trade shows are nice if the company has the money to spend(waste) on them but the AMA doesn't. Again, this isn't the 60's,70's or 80's when these shows were THE way to get a company and its new products noticed.
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Old 02-21-2019, 05:06 PM
  #112  
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Originally Posted by Appowner View Post
Please explain how your actions are convincing the EC that changes in the budget and spending need to be enacted?

You can join all the clubs you want and compete in all the contests there are. That won't do a thing to change the decades old patterns shown in Franks charts.
Unless you have a time machine nothing is going to change Frankie's charts. Having more members means the members voices being louder could help make the organization move in the direction the members want.
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Old 02-21-2019, 05:14 PM
  #113  
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Originally Posted by Propworn View Post
He is not an AMA member as such has no right to even ask questions of an organization he has no stake in. Sniveling is the only way to describe it. No different than a nosy neighbor who thinks he has the right to interject in your family affairs.

I could ask you the same questions, Propworm.
1) Do you "give" the AMA money every year, for them to waste on things that don't benefit you or any other member, such as the planned indoor flying facility?

Nope I belong to MAAC smaller with the same problems with things like declining enrollment etc. but I do benefit greatly from my association with the AMA.
2) Do you like getting a magazine that is giving information and such that is as much as six months out of date with nothing current and costing millions of dollars a year to produce?
I do purchase the magazine when I notice it on the shelf at the local US hobby shop I go to. Our magazine is also a few months behind the times as it takes time to edit and put the magazine together. Especially when you are dependent on so many different people who must submit the articles. Many times an editor must chase down whoever is supposed to submit. The magazine is the legal communication of the organization. There are certain things such as your annual general meeting, district meeting etc that must reach each and every member and not everyone has or wants email. Your magazine is most likely the only legal way to accomplish this.
3) Do you routinely fly at the flying field in Muncie, using the facilities that you pay property taxes on as well as the costs to keep the facilities maintained by a full time grounds crew?
Not as of yet though now I just about have my truck, truck camper and trailer/toy box finalized and with a pending retirement fully intend on making Muncie for your NATS as a participant. In the mean time I have been traveling about your wonderful country flying at as many different fields as I can find.
4) Do you write to, email or call the AMA's office to ask how and why they are spending money on things that make no fiscal or common sense?
Nope but I have often emailed for information and each time have received a timely, polite reply.
If you answered YES to the first and NO to the last three questions, they AMA is playing you for a fool, taking your money and telling you what a great value you're getting when, in actuality, all you're really getting is overpriced secondary insurance that may or may not pay, depending on the claim and an out of date magazine that isn't worth the paper it's printed on
Okay then, we don't need to debate the issue. Some of us, here in the US, have major issues with the AMA, as you already know. The questions I asked are directly related to the failings of the AMA as seen by many of us. Unfortunately, a majority of the members don't really care about what's happening or how funds get spent since they are only members so they can fly at clubs that require an AMA membership. Those of us that do care, whether members or not, are ignored by many that are members or, worse yet, organizational officers that have their own agendas. Some have tried to contact the AMA office, only to be ignored or told the office didn't have time to assist them. I guess members are not as important as guests from north of the border in the eyes of the home office.
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Old 02-21-2019, 05:27 PM
  #114  
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Originally Posted by speedracerntrixie View Post
Unless you have a time machine nothing is going to change Frankie's charts. Having more members means the members voices being louder could help make the organization move in the direction the members want.
Franklin's charts kind of say it all.
That said, all having more members is going to do is keep feeding the machine with funds to be wasted. The only thing that is going to change the organization is a total reorganization. As long as the structure only allows a specific group to be elected into office and that group is who accepts or rejects applications to join that group, nothing is going to change. Eliminate the leader member requirement and let anyone that wants be allowed to run for election. To take it one step further, INSTEAD of putting information about each candidate in the magazine, where they can be bashed by the editor and other incumbent officers, have anyone that wants to run for office fill out a standardized form and have all candidates forms emailed to all members so the members can see that form for themselves without any "editorial input".
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Old 02-21-2019, 05:27 PM
  #115  
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Originally Posted by Appowner View Post
And something else to think about. Club money is NOT AMA money. Who funds those contests you go to? I'll bet very little if any came from Muncie except for the NATs. You have entry fees and maybe some other costs going to the local club but by and large I'll wager it's the sponsoring club that funds the contest. NOT Muncie!

So what are you going to do when your dues is doubled and the NATs cancelled or cut way back due to lack of funds? Join another club?

As Frankie has pointed out, one of the dips in revenue is what the AMA gets from the clubs. The clubs charter has an annual fee associated with it. When a CD sends in an application to get an event sanctioned, there is a fee associated with the sanction. Supporting the clubs and events feed some funds into AMA. That is on the competition side. For an open house type event AMA offers help in the way of materials.

If the dues get doubled, I will pay them. I will still get good entertainment value for my money. NATs will never be cancelled. If the AMA is not able to hold them in Muncie then the Special Interest Groups ( IMAC for scale aerobatics, NSRCA for pattern, NMRPA for pylon racing ) will step in and hold the events on their own. We are actually seeing some of this already. Pattern is currently alternating between Muncie and Blytheville Ar. In order to spur some new interest. Warbird Pylon was tried at the NATs and was hoped that it would become an AMA event. That didn't happen so the NATs for Warbird pylon will be held again at my current home field here in Sacramento.
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Old 02-21-2019, 06:07 PM
  #116  
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Originally Posted by Propworn View Post
Lets see I join a shooting club $200 plus a year it gives me the use of the facilities I have no say in how its run or what is being offered. No vote. Once paid the money is no longer mine to direct in any fashion. I pay a membership in NHRA again it allows me to attend and compete at NHRA events but again I have no say in what is done once my membership money is paid. Take any organization i belong to and once you pay your fees for belonging its no longer your money. Its the cost of belonging you don't get to decide where your money is to be used. You receive what ever benefits are due and that's all you are really entitled to. Obviously the majority of the AMA are satisfied with the status quo as the few of you can be easily ignored by the powers to be. I don't see your numbers growing its the same half dozen or so egged on by guys like Franklin who get your knickers in a bunch and watch to see the antics you provide for his entertainment. When things get slow he tosses you guys another bone and like a pack of hounds off you go baying at the moon again. Don't you guys ever get out and just fly for fun????
I belong to a camping club. It has an initial fee and a $200 per year fee for campground maintenance. Since the sites are owned by the company, we get no say in what goes on or any of the decisions.
I belong to a square dance club. It's $50 per year for membership which includes insurance coverage. With that, being a non profit organization, I get a say in what goes on and what the treasury gets spent on
I belong to a scale hydroplane racing club. It's $15 per year per boat and that lets me race at any and all events that club holds as well as a say in what happens in the club. It's also non profit
I belong to NAMBA. It's $90 per year for the wife and I and that covers our insurance at the boat races and gives me a say in what's going on. Again, it's a non profit organization

Now, the question is what makes the first one different than the other three? The other three are all NON PROFIT. The camping club owns the campgrounds and, due to that ownership, they get to call the shots. In addition, the camping club IS NOT NON PROFIT, so all of their decisions are business based, not membership based.
Now, let's take another look at your memberships you listed in your post:
Your NHRA dues are paid to a FOR PROFIT organization since they want to make money and expand the sport
Your shooting club dues are paid to a privately owned For Profit company, just like my camping club
As I said in a previous post, most AMA members are only members so they can fly at clubs that require AMA membership. As far as everything else, they don't care since it doesn't directly affect them
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Old 02-21-2019, 06:17 PM
  #117  
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Originally Posted by speedracerntrixie View Post

most would consider my actions having more of a positive impact on the health of the AMA then what any of the key players in this forum have accomplished.
And more of a positive impact than the entire paid AMA staff......
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Old 02-21-2019, 06:50 PM
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Originally Posted by Hydro Junkie View Post
The questions I asked are directly related to the failings of the AMA as seen by many of us.
I only count about six or so of ya doesn't come anywhere near what any sane person would call many. Franklin at the head of a few baying sheep.
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Old 02-21-2019, 07:17 PM
  #119  
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I'm betting that the RCU membership has got to have at least 100 AMA members. Out of that 100 only about 6% ( very conservative figures IMO ) are here in the AMA forums complaining.
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Old 02-21-2019, 09:21 PM
  #120  
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Originally Posted by Propworn View Post
He is not an AMA member as such has no right to even ask questions of an organization he has no stake in. Sniveling is the only way to describe it. No different than a nosy neighbor who thinks he has the right to interject in your family affairs.
......................
Ah! Like when Canadians stick their noses into US business!

Actually I have every right since the actions of the AMA impact all who fly RC.
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Old 02-22-2019, 05:02 AM
  #121  
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Originally Posted by speedracerntrixie View Post
I'm betting that the RCU membership has got to have at least 100 AMA members. Out of that 100 only about 6% ( very conservative figures IMO ) are here in the AMA forums complaining.
Yep. About the same percentage of AMA members who vote in the AMA elections!!!

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Old 02-22-2019, 05:13 AM
  #122  
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Originally Posted by speedracerntrixie View Post
I'm betting that the RCU membership has got to have at least 100 AMA members. Out of that 100 only about 6% ( very conservative figures IMO ) are here in the AMA forums complaining.
Meanwhile, the AMA membership revenue, total revenue, and net assets continue to decline. And despite that, the EC and "Dear Leader" continue doing what they've always done ... that's proven not to work.

Our ideas have the advantage of not being tried yet.
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Old 02-22-2019, 05:34 AM
  #123  
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The really sad thing? As a non-member I demonstrate more concern for the AMA than most members here. Or anywhere for that matter. You guys should be ashamed of yourselves.
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Old 02-22-2019, 05:40 AM
  #124  
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Those lyrics from a Joanie Mitchell song: Don't it always seem to go
That you don't know what you've got
'Till it's gone They pave paradise (flying field in this case) and put up a parking lot.
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Old 02-22-2019, 06:06 AM
  #125  
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To whom it may concern:

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