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Oct 2004 EC Meeting - Interesting

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Old 10-06-2004, 05:54 PM
  #1  
J_R
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Default Oct 2004 EC Meeting - Interesting

Dr. Frank, AMA D 8 VP, just posted this on the D 8 list. Formating changed in posting here. The agenda should be posted on the AMA site soon, but, is not at this time. In addition, Joyce Hager said she was going to raise the subject of .pdf document 537.

***************

Hello, d8 list.

the below is the agenda for the OCT 30/31,2004 AMA EC meeting...

If you have questions or concerns please direct them to me personally
at: VicePres@AMA-Dist-8.org

for a response or directions as to who to ask...

Best regards.

Dr.Sandy Frank
VicePres@AMA-Dist-8.org
2004-10-06

October 30, 2004
National Aeromodeling Center Headquarters
Muncie Indiana

Executive Council Meeting will start at 8:00 A.M.

1. Introductions
Presidents Report
Introduction of guests
Approval of July Minutes
Executive Vice Presidents Report
Executive Directors Report
NAA Report

2. Committee Reports
(Reports limited to 15 minutes - 5 to 10 minute question and answer)
Budget R Miller
Education Presentation G Schimmel
Disaster Relief Fund (Ad hoc) Powell/Bauer
Nats Report HQ
Bylaws R Hanson
Disaster Relief Fund Powell/Bauer
AST Report R Hanson
Site hours B Brown

3. Old Business
Safety Video Report B Oberdieck


4. New Business

a. Create program to assist in getting flying sites S Frank
for indoor & park fliers

b. Mandate all R/C transmitters have AMA number, J Dunlap
pilot's name, address, phone and frequency #
visible at all times.

c. Discussion: develop a program to generate non-dues
revenue earmarked for Flying Site Assistance Program D Mathewson

d. M. A. Disclaimer HQ

e. Accept & implement Chartered Clubs/Model Industries HQ
Program for supporting charities.

5. Awards 10/6/2004
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Old 10-06-2004, 06:19 PM
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patf
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Default RE: Oct 2004 EC Meeting - Interesting

>>>>>>>.
b. Mandate all R/C transmitters have AMA number, J Dunlap
pilot's name, address, phone and frequency #
visible at all times.
>>>>>>>>>.

what's with this. let the ama just mandate we wear a "hello my name is" badge instead.....
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Old 10-06-2004, 06:32 PM
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Woody218
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Default RE: Oct 2004 EC Meeting - Interesting

Hell, while they're at it, have us show our blood type, the names of all our children, who we voted for in the last election, what our favorite food is, and if we prefer it missionary position or doggy style.
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Old 10-06-2004, 06:54 PM
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skerrin
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Default RE: Oct 2004 EC Meeting - Interesting

ORIGINAL: patf

>>>>>>>.
b. Mandate all R/C transmitters have AMA number, J Dunlap
pilot's name, address, phone and frequency #
visible at all times.
>>>>>>>>>.

what's with this. let the ama just mandate we wear a "hello my name is" badge instead.....
It certainly shows that she has a firm grasp of the really important issues facing model avaiation [:'(]

SK
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Old 10-06-2004, 06:57 PM
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Jerry Sigur
 
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Default RE: Oct 2004 EC Meeting - Interesting

Why not just have us tattoo that info on our foreheads?
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Old 10-06-2004, 07:53 PM
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BillHarris
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Default RE: Oct 2004 EC Meeting - Interesting

I call it McN's Revenge.

--Bill Harris
AMA 607983 and getting embarrassed.
District 5 and really embarrassed. Lets change that!

Vote the incumbents out.
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Old 10-06-2004, 09:14 PM
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Default RE: Oct 2004 EC Meeting - Interesting

d. M. A. Disclaimer HQ

e. Accept & implement Chartered Clubs/Model Industries HQ
Program for supporting charities.
OK JR I give:

What is the disclaimer for? "M.A." Is that Model Aviation? I wouldn't claim that either.

"Accept and Implement": seems like another already-decided-on-program of the AMA Big Brother. Will each Chartered Club now be expected to pay a tax for supporting charities? [:-]

Here the new SC made me think that maybe there is some turn-around, but it seems that just like a liberal congress on its way out -- instill all the tax & spend social programs before the change. [:'(]

Ya'll bend over now!
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Old 10-06-2004, 10:41 PM
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Default RE: Oct 2004 EC Meeting - Interesting

Hi Horrace

I really don't know. Just as a WAG, there was a previous item to develop a disclaimer related to instant memberships. I have no idea, if that is the case, why it would be under New Business.
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Old 10-07-2004, 05:49 AM
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Default RE: Oct 2004 EC Meeting - Interesting

Where in the world would you put all that information on the TX where it would be "VISIBLE AT ALL TIMES". Shoud I put it on the screen of my computer radio?
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Old 10-07-2004, 07:39 AM
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Default RE: Oct 2004 EC Meeting - Interesting

If I was in her district, Judy would now have my vote, after bringing such and important issue to the forefront....NOT!
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Old 10-07-2004, 10:24 AM
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Mike Wiz
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Default RE: Oct 2004 EC Meeting - Interesting

ORIGINAL: P-51B

If I was in her district, Judy would now have my vote, after bringing such and important issue to the forefront....NOT!
Ya gotta admit that it would sound like a good idea to sombody who dosen't know the first thing about R/C.

Wiz
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Old 10-07-2004, 10:48 AM
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Red Scholefield
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Default Frequency ID on Tx.

If I were making a recommendation I would start with the existing from the Membership Manual.

2.2. Frequency Display: The AMA strongly recommends that
RC transmitters display operating frequency in the following
manner:

2.2.4. CHANNEL number frequencies: CHANNEL
number frequencies should display the CHANNEL number on a
plaque attached to the transmitter antenna. The displayed number
should be easily visible to other RC users.


Change to:2.2. Frequency Display: RC transmitters WILL display operating Channel in the following manner:

2.2.4. CHANNEL number frequencies: CHANNEL
numbers will be displayed on a
plaque attached to the transmitter antenna. The displayed number
should be easily visible to other RC users within 25 ft.
Yes, I know the exact size, color, font, etc. could be mandated, but lets leave a little to the discretion of the modeler and something for the field Nazi to nit pick.

There is nothing that makes me more nervous than someone getting ready to fly next to me with NO Channel ID on the transmitter. How many times have you seen the WRONG pin taken from the impound when the guy switches transmitters to one on another frequency?


As for the rest, name and address, phone number - this should be left up to the individual owner how he wants to identify his own equipment. Simply for the purpose of getting your transmitter back if left at meet or at the field it would seem prudent to have this information somewhere on the transmitter. But it should not be mandated! On the same subject, its not a bad idea to put your personal information on the INSIDE of the battery compartment behind the battery pack, !QUOT!THIS TRANSMITTER MAY HAVE BEEN STOLEN FROM . . . . . . . . . .Contact . . . . to confirm!QUOT!.

Apparently Judi D is no more aware of the present Channel Number ID recommendation than she was of the requirements to be made a Leader Member. Does someone want to tell her that it is the Channel number that should be displayed, NOT the frequency number? How many people can translate from memory the frequency number 72.xx to channel yy?


S
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Old 10-07-2004, 12:41 PM
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Default RE: Frequency ID on Tx.

Agreed with all you said, Red.

I don't think anyone uses a channel # on the transmitter anymore except myself. I don't see them or the red flag anywhere anymore.

It is a sad thing that even seasoned RC fliers are so undisciplined and they are too da_n lazy to set the examples of following guidelines. I suppose that is one excuse to make so many mandates.

Too bad. If all the more senior fliers followed good practices, then the newer people would be inclined to do same.
When those that know better refuse to do what is the right thing, those that want to "keep us all safe,'' those that have no clue as to what is going on, will constantly initiate absolute stupidity into mandated law. (Just visit your local passenger terminal at the airport. [:@])

Sure, my name and address is on the bottom of the transmitter. In addition, several selected inner places as you mention, and my red flag plus channel # are out there to be seen.
Yep, I've picked up the wrong Trsmttr and/or the wrong pin. That channel # on the trans. may have saved me from buying someone a new airplane. In addition, I've been called to see if I really didn't want that JR 8103 anymore. [X(]
So some things are good, but some are definitely just stupid.
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Old 10-07-2004, 12:59 PM
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Default RE: Oct 2004 EC Meeting - Interesting

Listed in another thread:

The info was poorly listed in the minutes (could have been that JD wasn't clear on her intentions) . I have suggested that she might clarify at the next EC meeting. The minutes should have stated that all transmitters should have the pilot's names clearly marked on the front of the tx, and their AMA number and address clearly marked on the back of the tx. The only thing that should be visible at all times is the the channel card and red 72 mhz flag. She has good intentions on the other info. What if you were to leave a 9Z or 10X at an out of town or state fly in?? Wouldn't you want someone to have the adequate info to return it to you???
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Old 10-07-2004, 01:15 PM
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Default RE: Oct 2004 EC Meeting - Interesting

ORIGINAL: nick.wright
//SNIP??
What if you were to leave a 9Z or 10X at an out of town or state fly in?? Wouldn't you want someone to have the adequate info to return it to you???
??SNIP??
If I had the money to afford one of those it would never leave my side so as to be left at the field.
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Old 10-07-2004, 01:18 PM
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Default RE: Oct 2004 EC Meeting - Interesting

What if you were to leave a 9Z or 10X at an out of town or state fly in?? Wouldn't you want someone to have the adequate info to return it to you???
Nick,

You can't mandate intelligence!!!

I'll bet you one thing if you were to lose a 9c or 10x that it would be a lesson few of us would soon forget
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Old 10-07-2004, 01:21 PM
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Default RE: Oct 2004 EC Meeting - Interesting

I agree. Just done as a "what if" situation. Jim, I thought you ran across a good bit of money a while back.
ORIGINAL: Crashem

What if you were to leave a 9Z or 10X at an out of town or state fly in?? Wouldn't you want someone to have the adequate info to return it to you???
Nick,

You can't mandate intelligence!!!

I'll bet you one thing if you were to lose a 9c or 10x that it would be a lesson few of us would soon forget
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Old 10-07-2004, 01:29 PM
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Default RE: Oct 2004 EC Meeting - Interesting

You know nothing goes as far as common sense. If you are really worried about leaving your transmitter at a fly-in, or if you are prone to do it, then label it, but for heaven's sake, should it be made a mandate from the EC that all transmitters be labeled? This is ludicrous. I work in a field where people come up with useless rules all the time. I call it self perpetuating mental masturbation. It does nothing but create more headaches for those of us who actually "fly", but more fodder for the lawyers and legislative bodies. It makes it look like they have done something worthwhile, when in reality all they have done is wasted everyone's time. I sincerely hope this election sees the demise of some of the BS before it gets totally out of hand.
My $0.02
Tommy
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Old 10-07-2004, 01:45 PM
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Default RE: Oct 2004 EC Meeting - Interesting

ORIGINAL: nick.wright

Listed in another thread:

The info was poorly listed in the minutes (could have been that JD wasn't clear on her intentions) . I have suggested that she might clarify at the next EC meeting. The minutes should have stated that all transmitters should have the pilot's names clearly marked on the front of the tx, and their AMA number and address clearly marked on the back of the tx. The only thing that should be visible at all times is the the channel card and red 72 mhz flag. She has good intentions on the other info. What if you were to leave a 9Z or 10X at an out of town or state fly in?? Wouldn't you want someone to have the adequate info to return it to you???


Ahhhh.... yet another noble example of "leadership" wanting to protect us from ourselves.

SK
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Old 10-07-2004, 01:52 PM
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Default RE: Oct 2004 EC Meeting - Interesting

This is the type of item that might well be published in a VP's column as a suggestion... not as an EC agenda item calling for a mandate.
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Old 10-07-2004, 01:58 PM
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Default RE: Oct 2004 EC Meeting - Interesting

[ul][*] While we're at it lets mandate that all aircraft AND fliers have AMA numbers clearly displayed in 5" high, black with white border, Machiavelli Bold font on the top and bottom/front and back (we DO get to choose between us and the plane here). [*] That all transmitters have an audible warning at 1 KHz and 85 db level to indicate operation with the antenna collapsed. [*] That all aircraft be equipped with an avoidance detection and correction system to avoid dumb midair’s and flying over the pits (perhaps with a punitive measure added). [*] That an IQ and sobriety test be required before entering the pits as well as audible warning units attached to little children and animals that may wander into the flight areas.
[/ul]
I can think of many others, but the best fix seems to be a vote for Tony Stillman in district V and Dave Mathewson for president


quint
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Old 10-07-2004, 02:00 PM
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Default RE: Oct 2004 EC Meeting - Interesting

How bout just an IQ and sobriety test for the EC????
Tommy
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Old 10-07-2004, 02:04 PM
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Default RE: Oct 2004 EC Meeting - Interesting

ORIGINAL: nick.wright

She has good intentions on the other info. What if you were to leave a 9Z or 10X at an out of town or state fly in?? Wouldn't you want someone to have the adequate info to return it to you???

Yep I would hope it got returned, but I don't think they AMA has any business mandating that information has to be put anywhere.

While your putting out "what if situations" here's one potential downfall to having an address listed; say someone STEALS my transmitter while at a meet. Then, they flip it over, see the address and say to themselves "know I can go get some more RC goodies". That proposed AMA rule has just made my family and I targets...not a good idea.
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Old 10-07-2004, 02:20 PM
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Default RE: Oct 2004 EC Meeting - Interesting

P-51B

It's a nonsensical argument. Ever been to an organized event? What happens to your Tx at sign up? Did it get marked, at some way, so that it could be identified in the impound? Was some cross reference made to your name, perhaps on a sign up sheet? Was your AMA number required somewhere in that paperwork?

Do you think that, even if the organizers did not, for some unknown reason, have your address and phone, that a note to AMA HQ asking them to contact you with the information your Tx was being held would not be honored?

One wonders if the originator of this proposal has any experience around events, or… if there is some other reason for the mandate. Nick has not said that his explanation was that of J Dunlop.

As you stated, having the info on the Tx is like an invitation. In California, years ago, a vehicle registration was required to show from the outside of a car. After many instances of that leading to illegal activities, the practice was discontinued. Nothing like knowing where the exact vehicle you want to steal is garaged.

Well, it took the members of the forum less than 24 hours to determine the mandate is a horrible idea. I wonder how long it took to think up the idea of calling for the mandate.
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Old 10-07-2004, 03:10 PM
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Default RE: Oct 2004 EC Meeting - Interesting

This information mandate begs the question. Did Judi D. consult with her AVPs, Frequency Coordinator or any of her hundreds of Leader Members before she put this absurdity on the table? Or wanting to look VPish did she came up with it all by herself? Maybe McNeill willed her his wish book of ways to agrivate the flying members.

S
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