CaptainHook

My Feedback: (80)

Yeah Bob, it sure is.[]

combatpigg

My Feedback: (3)

HI MONGO. I should have said that offering insurance & paying claims is what I see as their only responsibility to me. When I drive up to a contest, walk up to the registration table and show them my card, that is where the AMAs' responsibilty towards me ends. For the rest of the day, nothing else matters except to have a good time, and to help other competitors have fun also. There isn't one single thing that DB or any other AMA official can do to spoil my fun, as long as they hold up their end of the bargain in the event that something bad happens. I don't really care what the bylaws say about their stated purpose because I can't for the life of me think of anything else that they have to offer me that I have any use for at all, besides the mag and the insurance. Don't have too much use for the mag either.

abel_pranger

Not only is it absent from the bylaws, as many times as I have heard this, if true, then it is unique in the insurance industry. Real insurance companys do some screening to determine if a claim is legit before they pay it. There's lots of noise from them lately in TV adverts about how much claims that are not legit are costing us, and what they are doing to shoot down the perps that make illegitimate claims. For all the blustering made by AMA about how insurance will be voided if AMA fiats are not complied with, it apparently never happens, judging by the testimonials.
Just observation - not complaining by any means.

Abel

SSRCCPREZ

CP,

I htink you have a valid point, and to tell you the truth DB does not effect my daily hobbying activities. I try my damndest to make my club a better place to play, but when that is hindered by AMA and DB in any way I get a little ruffled. However, everything that the AMA does and that DB does will have an effect either positive or negative on the rest of the hobby as does any governing body on those it governs.
Having said that, if there was noone in DB's office all year I do not think I would notice short of a lot less paperwork to do for the club.

combatpigg

My Feedback: (3)

HI PREZ, I sure can't speak for any club officials. Hopefully the AMA doesn't place too much of a red tape burden on you guys, at least if there is red tape, let it be the type that seems necessary. The extra time that is needed to arrange all the other club related functions is work enough, and my hat is off to you guys who take the time. After all, it is YOU GUYS who are the REAL AMA.

Hossfly

CP, please feel free to correct me if I am making a wrongful assumption.

"..... drive up to a contest ..... There isn't one single thing that DB or any other AMA official can do to spoil my fun, as long as they hold up their end of the bargain in the event that something bad happens. I don't really care what the bylaws say about their stated purpose because I can't for the life of me think of anything else that they have to offer me that I have any use for at all, besides the mag and the insurance. ....."

From this I assume you are not considering all the AMA factors that make it possible for that contest to happen. Organization, CD, flying site availability, club recognition, sponsor recognition, event rules and standards, event publicity, and a host of other items.

"HI PREZ, I sure can't speak for any club officials. Hopefully the AMA doesn't place too much of a red tape burden on you guys, at least if there is red tape,... The extra time that is needed to arrange all the other club related functions is work enough, and my hat is off to you guys who take the time. ...."

From this I assume that while you well recognize the workload of the event organizers and club officials, you yourself don't participate in that portion of the event.

As one who has for many years shouldered some of the workload as a Club officer, appointed AMA position (RCCC), elected position (DVP) and CD for many competitions -- CL, FF, and RC -- from local Fly-Ins to and including Assistant Category Director at the NATs, and one that has previously had lots of FUN with those positions, I have over the past 12 years observed most of the fun to slowly fade into the sunset. That fade is directly because of the problems of overbearing rules reference various events and operations at the flying facility. AMA is navigating in the wrong direction.
As an event director, do I have fun telling someone that his actions are outside the limits reference some AMA rule that exists mainly to serve the insurance? Not just NO but _ell no. Yet if it must be done it will be done. [>:]

Therefore, IMO, those that simply enjoy those events and facilities solely provided by *someone else* could be a major assist to those that work behind the scenes to provide those events and facilities. Those workers that you, CP, do recognize as persons donating their time to YOUR pleasure, need not only your support ,but would also like to have the support of the national organization for their labor, rather than more and more Maginot Lines placed in their road by that national organization. There is far too much red tape. OTOH if you are an active CD and club worker, I am ready to listen to your methods for cutting all the tape.

Looking to making event work fun again for each of our interests. So far I only have two events, sanction #s 113 and 128 on my 2005 calendar. Not so bad.

8178

My Feedback: (17)

IMHO you’ all sound like sour grapes! It’s obvious that the RC world is much larger than the few of us that log-on to RCU. The majority rules and they have spoken! People vote all the time for leaders that they think are idiots because they are terrified of change! Like mindless frightened sheep. This happens even when the challenger, like Dave Mathewson, has very good ideas and would have been an excellent leader. Dave Brown won with a very large margin and has been given political capital by the AMA members and he will spend it the way HE wants to. I’m sure he will do his best to unite the apposing AMA groups by reaching out to those members and groups that SHARE his goals and ideas.

So if you want to be included to help the AMA you need to support the man and his goals. For starters we could follow his lead in the December column by checking our radio fail safe settings and dumping the electric starters. You can’t argue with his fewer rules are better approach.

Take care, and keep your body parts out of the prop’s arc.

combatpigg

My Feedback: (3)

HI HOSSFLY, Although I don't know anything about the AMA related duties of a club officer, I do take part in the planning, organization, advertising, promotion, sponsorship, grunt work, etc.,etc., of local contests. Our AVP takes care of getting sanction, he can do it in his sleep. Our local CDs are old pros at running the show and usually compete, it too is a slam dunk. The real work comes from the arrangements that have to be made at the local level, and have nothing to do with anything that is caused by the AMA. It's about as hard to get a contest canction as it is to look at my Email. I think the AMA is so well organized, set up, well oiled, etc., that even I would have a tough time running it into the ground.

rw Guinn

and you totally missed Hoss's point.
The proliferation of "rules" that have nothing to do with competition OR actual (as opposed to somebody's skewed perception of ) safety make the job of the guy on the hotseat (AKA the CD) much more difficult--and a whole lot less fun.
this is why fewer and fewer of us do it any more, and why those who do come across as flaming A$#$%*&S or field Nazi's at times.
Roger
AMA5536

combatpigg

My Feedback: (3)

Give me an example, and give an example that DB is DIRECTLY at fault for imposing on you. I only fly CL combat, RC combat, and a little pylon, so I am not aware of any evil that DB has done elsewhere. He surely hasn't done anything to harm the events, [that I fly in]or made the amount of work needed to host an event any more difficult than it was 20 years ago when I first got started.

combatpigg

My Feedback: (3)

About safety rules, in this day and age when my son isn't even allowed to play catch with a hardball at school [really], and construction workers are expected to be tied off if their feet are more than 8 feet above grade, it is kind of amazing that they still let us fly planes past each others' heads at 150mph. Usually rules aren't made until someone gets maimed or killed. I think one of DBs' main dutys is to see to it that competition doesn't get shutdown by escalating insurance rates.

Bob101

I'd like to see an AMA wide poll of how many people would still be members of the organization if they didn't offer insurance - which is not their primary purpose - it's the advancement of aero modeling in general.

I'm willing to bet that 90% of all AMA members get nothing in return for their dues other than insurance.

The AMA shouldn't be an insurance broker, but that's what it has become.

If somehow the AMA got insurance available separately that had a good history/background I'd jump ship in a heartbeat as long as I keep flying at my own private field.

Ever go to a field as a guest and they require AMA - do what I do - ask them why. You never hear "because we want to promote the modeling and flying of aircraft like the AMA" hell no - you'll hear "for the insurance".

combatpigg

My Feedback: (3)

The promotional stuff in the mission statement is a little bit dated,[1930's?] if the AMA couldn't offer me one heck of a pretty good group rate on a coverage that is UNIVERSALLY recognized, I wouldn't have much use for them either, except they have done one heck of a good job designing the various competition categories, which is VERY useful. I can drive anywhere in this country and show up at a contest on the same page equipment wise with everyone else. Why shouldn't they be the insurance broker?. Again all I hear are assertions being made without reasons or examples being given. It makes me wonder sometimes if some people can't be happy unless they are unhappy. I'll bet alot of you couldn't go from sun up to sun down with out a single negative or surly thought creeping into your heads. Try it sometime,[ I don't mean you BOB specifically, but the bulk of the forum members in general] it takes practice.

F106A

My Feedback: (2)

What is it you are specifically looking for? Do a search on rule 9, the turbine regs, captive corporations, rewritting the safety code, etc and it's all there. Obviously you think that DB is the man for the job, well, you've got him for three more years. If you approve of DB using the insurance to beat clubs and members into submitting to more of his useless rules, well, hey, you're going to have three more great years with ole Dave.
For the 3D guys and the turbine community, it's going to be a long 3 years. IMHO, Dave got them in his sights and they are going to be number one and two on his retribution list, especially the turbine group.
Since Dave seems to have a cadre of 15,000 members who will vote for him no matter what he does or says, there's no way to vote him out of office. The only hope is for the EC to isolate him, thereby minimizing his influence and the damage he can cause to the organization.
Time will tell....

combatpigg

My Feedback: (3)

Rule 9 was an ignorant rule, and it got turned around. It proves that we have a democratic system that works. The turbine rules obviously err in many peoples' eyes on the side of caution, mainly to appease the insurance company. The only guy I know who runs a turbine wont operate it from any of the local club fields around here because of limited space, proximity to the public, and his own common sense tells him it's better to take a 2 hour trip to eastern WA, in the desert where he can run it any which way he likes. I'll be willing to bet alot of other turbine guys handle the situation the same way, without making a federal case out of it. Has anyone been sent to TURBINE PRISON yet for going too fast? As far as I know the 3D guys are scraping tails again, I never broke rule 9 on purpose with MY profile,but accidents happen. The rule had very little impact on anyones' fun. I never heard of any 3D contests getting cancelled, or weekends getting spoiled over it, but as I said before, rule 9 is history now anyway. I'm sorry, but I just think alot of the "problems" that some of the physically and technically extreme SIGs have with DB are about ,"He is picking on us because he doesn't like what we do". I doubt that is the case, he has a business to run, and I'll bet if he didn't have any safety or liability concerns, things would be much different.

mongo

My Feedback: (15)

i have known him since the late 70s, and no, things wouldna be no different. it is just the way he is, and always has been. very myopic

combatpigg

My Feedback: (3)

but Pylon and C/L Combat are left to run, unfettered. Have you stood in the infield recently, or in the pilots' circle?If this guy was really the SAFETY NAZI that he is made to be here, this stuff would have been shut down long ago. The danger presented here is really only present in contest form, not done much by the masses. The danger that DB acted upon with the turbines and R9 was [I think] done because this stuff has mass appeal, and showed a risk factor for abuse that needed to be acted upon. A guy would need a well calibrated crystal ball to do his job perfectly.

BillHarris

In addition to rule 9, the turbine regs, captive corporations, rewriting the safety code, look at his LiPo battery outburst, his myopic visit to the FAA on r/c pilots flying at 29,000 feet, and other loose cannons.

But with an entourage of 15,000 devotees, we're stuck with him. We need to get good people on the EC and insulate him from acting just as he is isolated from reality.

--Bill

"Dave, step down"

SSRCCPREZ

Rules are rules. and the fun begins at a contest when the first plane leaves the ground. I for one,enjoy putting on contests just so I may be with good people and laugh and joke all day with people I love. Safety is priority 1, and those rules are and should be adhered to. If someone does not like a rule a CD has to enforce it is not the CD's fault.
However, if more rules and guidlines and suggestions are thrown down clubs collective throats, like the field marshall and safety officer, it takes time away from the officer's ability to do the more fun things. I believe that a safety officer is a generally good idea as I feel the same about a field marshall. But try filling those positions beyond a name only function. Noone wants those jobs, nor do I blame them neccesarily. It was thiongs like this I was refering to. I f I have to use my time to discuss things like this with the club and spend time in executive board meetings tryuing to find people to fill these positions, I have less time to get donations and set up contests and fun flys.
Despite a bad or good leader it is my job as an officer to enforce and administer any new rule or guidline the AMA tells me I have to. Beyond that I and the club are responsible for the amount of fun we have.
I am an officer because I want to be involved, I want tomake it fun for everyone, I want to do so many positive things. I f I did not, I would just pay my dues and fly.

the-plumber

Interesting.

I plan to _continue_ keeping my body parts out of the prop's arc. My 'body parts' will be on the handles of the Megatron. I didn't notice Mr. Brown having any good ideas about starting large gas engines, except of course that he'd as soon we stopped buildng models that need such engines.

Dave Brown is only some four years or so late jumping on the fail safe settings bandwagon, because a very important lesson was learned when the young boy was killed in the UK because a modeler didn't know what his fail safe settings _were_.

As to 'fewer rules are better', Dave Brown was the AMA leader during the period when the EC couldn't make rules fast enough. Have a look at the utter mess that uninformed pack of folks made with respect to turbine engines.

Most recently, Dave Brown hit panic button with his malformed opinion about LiPo batteries 'exploding', and refused to allow a Visitor's Soapbox article from Fred Marks (who does know a thing or two about batteries and chargers) to be published in MA without heavy censorship.

_fewer_ rules from Dave Brown ?

He wants to re-write the AMA By-Laws and Standing Rules on the premise that they are out of date, and for example do not provide any means of replacing deceased EC members and do not contain any means of disciplining members, both of which are nonsense arguments : those provisions do indeed exist, but they would require Dave Brown to exhibit a bit of leadership and he cannot do that.

Dave Brown can't even get the replacement of an EC member down pat, and we've had at least three EC members replaced in mid-term in the last four years; Dave Brown did it differently every time. The most recent example was the death of McNeill, wherein Brown twisted the interpretation of the By-Laws every which way to suit his need to continue the tradition of having a 'yes-man' vote from District V. Jim McNeill died seven months before his normal end of term, but Brown rammed the appointment of Ms. Dunlap two months after McNeill died, and four months before the regular election. The By-Laws define the period for appointment of an interim replacement as _three months_ before the end of term, not SEVEN months, not four months. The By-Laws also clearly state " an election shall be held".

Mr. Brown very neatly disenfranchised the members of District V.

We had to wait SEVEN MONTHS AFTER MCNEILL DIED to regain use of our sole tangible AMA benefit, the ballot.

We'll see fewer rules coming from Mr. Brown when pigs grow wings.

8178

My Feedback: (17)

I found Dave Brown’s December column interesting, in that he could have made a bigger deal out of the Ohio accident and the fact that more people are getting body parts in props, but he didn’t. It was the perfect opportunity to mandate some safety regulations for the giants but he sounded like he wasn’t sure what happened and suggested checking fail safe settings and hand starting! He sounds pretty weak to me. I think he could be stronger on these issues, don’t you?

8178

My Feedback: (17)

I forgot to mention, I voted for Dave Brown and like many modelers I thought he could have done a lot better in his last term. But I wasn’t one of the mindless sheep; I gave it a lot of thought. I believe he needs our support to keep things on track with all of the challenges we face and he will do better in his next term now that he has enormous political capital from the AMA membership. I didn’t think it was a good idea to change AMA leaders when our hobby is under attack like it is now. Stability with leadership is important and Dave Brown needs to stay strong and hold the course even if we don’t like him. It’s hard work, really hard, but Dave can do it. I’m sure he will do his best to unite the apposing AMA groups by reaching out to those members and groups that share his goals and ideas. As an example, I thought he could have been much stronger on solving the problems with the giants and 3Ds by mandating some good safety regulations but I think the weak approach is his way reaching out to those groups. After all he is our President and R/C champion!

Flyfalcons

No, a single accident doesn't have to be cause for additional regulations. We have enough of those as it is.

Red Scholefield

My Feedback: (9)

S

the-plumber

Anyone who advocates hand-propping a gas engine simply hasn't experienced the wrath of a G-62, or they fancy themselves an indestructible hero.

I think we have a safety committee in AMA, not a safety czar.

I think we should develop our safety rules based on experience and knowledge, not knee-jerk reactions, half-baked notions, and scare tactics.

I do NOT think Dave Brown should be formulating safety policies and rules without consulting known experts in the field of concern.

I think it's laughable that Dave Brown defended his anti-LiPo article by claiming to have researched the subject on the internet, the very venue he has for years dismissed as nothing but a pack of malcontents and rabble rousers.

I think it's ludicrous that Dave Brown would tout setting fail safes when AMA has no guidelines on what those settings should be.

I think it's sad that an acknowledged expert in the field, Fred Marks, was not allowed to present an unbiased article on LiPo technology because it is considered politically incorrect to contradict Dave Brown. What's worse, you won't see any future articles which might contradict Dave Brown on the care and feeding of LiPo packs.

I think it's damn near criminal that political correctness is more important than providing the membership with technically correct SAFETY information.

Dave Brown is probably still competent in .60 pattern models. Too bad he's leading AMA forward into the mid-1970s.