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AMA advertise on TV?

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Old 11-30-2004, 08:30 AM
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fliers1
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Default AMA advertise on TV?

It is well known that AMA has spent millions on buildings and property. If they are truly intersted in increasing membership, they most surely can afford to pay for TV ads somewhere. That way, even if it's only local ads in Muncie, they would reach millions of people. I know that it will be said that TV ads are exhorbantly expensive, even so, they should'nt have any propblems getting financial help from members of the RC industry, which is represented by organizations like NRHSA and RCHTA.

CCR
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Old 11-30-2004, 09:14 AM
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Default RE: AMA advertise on TV?

The issue of expense is a relative one. I am a small business owner and I advertise on radio, t.v. and print media. Most newspapers are not independant, but part of a larger conglomerate, this holds true with radio and television as well. Therefore making advertising more affordable. If I buy an ad package, my ad will be broadcast on certain stations ina given geographic.
The expense is greatly offset by the increase in business. Advertising works,excuses do not.
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Old 11-30-2004, 10:43 AM
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Default RE: AMA advertise on TV?

Advertising may be workable. Notice how many times there has been an R/C plane featured in a commercial on TV and it is invariably mentioned online.

But, being a "nonprofit" organization may prevent AMA from doing ads.

--Bill
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Old 11-30-2004, 11:00 AM
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Default RE: AMA advertise on TV?

WHAT?!!!! how many non-profit ads do you see? Red Cross, Salvation Army, and all the rest advertise soliciting money as a non-profit donation. Prevents them from advertising? No WAY!!!!! Probably a great revenue source, but certainley not a hinderance.

The fact they are non-profit is more of a reason to advertise, each television and radio station has to have a certain percentage of non-profit or community service ads by federal law as a requirement for their liscence.
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Old 11-30-2004, 11:01 AM
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Default RE: AMA advertise on TV?

I don't think advertising works in our hobby. AMA has nothing to sell unless you live in Muncie. Now if the AMA sponsored ads in specific regions on the behalf of specific club or clubs then I think it would be of benefit.
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Old 11-30-2004, 11:07 AM
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Default RE: AMA advertise on TV?

Well.... The AMA hasn't any competitors in their "industry"… so...not any need IMO. Anyone at all that is interested in the hobby knows about the AMA. Of course public service messages or publicity could educate them further but I really doubt any big changes.

It really boils down to painting by the numbers or not...and there are many artists out there that will never have the need or desire to paint by the numbers.
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Old 11-30-2004, 12:43 PM
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Default RE: AMA advertise on TV?

While watching boating events on TV, there are always spots from MAMBA and APBA. Shooting events on tv have spots from the NRA. Drag racing has spots for the NHRA. And while watching the special on the high powdered rockets on Discovery both NRA and Tripoli had spots selling their organization.

Now, correct me if I'm wrong, but there now is a 1/2 hr program on the Outdoor channel, and 95% of that airtime is taken up with advertising. I would think the AMA would pay to throw in their 2 cents. Hey, DB likes to play a celebrity, heres his big chance to be on national TV.

They need to recruit all these park flying urban dwellers.
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Old 11-30-2004, 08:48 PM
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Default RE: AMA advertise on TV?

ORIGINAL: littlecrankshaf

Well.... The AMA hasn't any competitors in their "industry"… so...not any need IMO. Anyone at all that is interested in the hobby knows about the AMA. Of course public service messages or publicity could educate them further but I really doubt any big changes.

It really boils down to painting by the numbers or not...and there are many artists out there that will never have the need or desire to paint by the numbers.

You've just got to be saying this "Anyone at all that is interested in the hobby knows about the AMA." with tongue-in-cheek. There are eons of people that do modeling explicitly for their own entertainment that have no concept of organized modeling. As a rather hard-core contest flier from my teen-days, when in my '30s I owned a H/S for some 7 years, I was totally mystified by the people that came into the store to buy models and wanted to know where they could fly them as they had no idea about clubs and/or AMA.
My Club buys booth space in an annual city-show, and does a couple exhibitions each year for other organizations. To the majority, model aviation, if even known about, is still thought of as the kid with a razor blade cutting small sticks to be joined together with that evil smelling cellulose cement. Many are really taken back by what we show. Many walk on by. A few have joined our club and learned or involved in learning the sport. Of that few, some are returning to their previous interests and a some are brand new. OUR ADVERTISING HAS BROUGHT THOSE FEW OUT.

So what is the significance and what determines "big changes"? I look at it this way: If I sell 10,000 items per year at .01 profit each I ain't got much. Sell 100,000 at same profit, I'm still starving. Sell 1,000,000 and things are looking up, but much more is needed. Sell 10,000,000 and the annual income is definitely livable. If advertising before 10 million people could produce that 100,000 new members then I think it might pay for itself, ESPECIALLY IF THAT ADVERTISING IS FREE.

There is so much free media advertising available. Unfortunately the current membership will never allow it to come into play. They sit on their duffs, let the world go by, do nothing to place real lovers of the sport/hobby into the NATIONAL offices of AMA Directorships, so what good does it do regardless if its free. The current incumbents have no desire to move in that direction as evidenced by their works.

A mag. that is only for the choir doesn't help. RCM, FRC, and FM are about the only magazines bringing the sport to the public. MA certainly does not. Whose fault? None other than one DB or his predecessor that refuses to take MA on the public news-stands. I've written a book about that within this very forum.

As it is written: "None is so blind as he that will not see." Therefore lcs, surely you jest.

edit: correct word usage.
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Old 11-30-2004, 08:57 PM
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Default RE: AMA advertise on TV?

I just thought of something....Isn't DB affiliated with Dubro products? If so then he surely understands the value in advertising.

I am sure he has a good reason for not doing more..........(you can laugh now)
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Old 11-30-2004, 09:21 PM
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Default RE: AMA advertise on TV?

ORIGINAL: SSRCCPREZ

I just thought of something....Isn't DB affiliated with Dubro products? If so then he surely understands the value in advertising.

I am sure he has a good reason for not doing more..........(you can laugh now)

Only if he has bought into it within the past 10 years or so. DuBro is owned by Dewy Broberg. DB owns Dave Brown products. I use to live near DuBro and the shop foreman there was my RC Mentor back in early '70s. I knew of DB early on when he worked for World Engines. I have known him personally since we were DVPs in'79.

I am not aware of any connections between the companies. However stuff happens!
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Old 11-30-2004, 09:41 PM
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Default RE: AMA advertise on TV?

ORIGINAL: Hossfly

Sell 10,000,000 and the annual income is definitely livable. If advertising before 10 million people could produce that 100,000 new members then I think it mightpay for itself, ESPECIALLY IF THAT ADVERTISING IS FREE.



As it is written: "None is so blind as he that will not see." Therefore lcs, surely you jest.

edit: correct word usage.
Question: Just why do we really want 100,000 more members? It seems to me things are about as good as they can get right now.

Observation: I help out at our local hobby store two or three days a week, most weeks, and I can tell you first hand that the biggest segment of the hobby here despise the AMA and many that are in the "organization" feel it is just a necessary evil for them. I fully realize that my perspective is different than other locals through out the country, since here in Texas we have many more alternatives.

I personally feel AMA has real benefits for some but for many it is just another attempt to make cookie cutter hobbyists. In our local hobby store we have the AMA application highly visible and we routinely invite all hobbyists, new and old to join the AMA and our club but few accept. Since I offer free instructions for the newbie we do get some participation from that segment BUT it is the more knowledgeable that resist. For every ten new pilots I train about one stays active in the AMA and even less stay with the club.

I think AMA should concentrate on promoting the hobby, NOT itself, and all things will come out in the wash just fine. Bottom line...include others because of your desire to share something special with others or wither away. It is time for the AMA to make a choice!


SO… NO, NO, NO to advertising the AMA but YES to sharing the experience. That is REAL the answer IMO

As it is written: "None is so blind as he that will not see." NO I am not joking... I hope YOU can see that.
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Old 12-01-2004, 05:49 PM
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Default RE: AMA advertise on TV?

Spending millions to advertise AMA on TV and radio is a huge waste of money! Your cost to aquire each member that way is huge. A very small number of your target audience would watch tv at that specific time per the number watching. Most people don't give a rip about AMA unless they are modelers. It would be a gross waste of money. There are cheaper ways of advertising AMA to reach the target market. Those would more likely include model mags and web sites like the AMA already does. The problem it the percieved value of what you get to belong to AMA. They can try to sell their muncie site as a value, but to many, I would bet most, it is more of a liability.

Advertising works in some markets, but advertising the AMA on national TV would be a huge waste of money. They would be better to quit trying to aquire assets like airports and muncies and cut the price we are paying or show us some real value instead of thin promises of how a Centrally located site, that isn't centrally located will get us members.
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Old 12-01-2004, 08:27 PM
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Default RE: AMA advertise on TV?

ORIGINAL: littlecrankshaf

<snip>
I think AMA should concentrate on promoting the hobby, NOT itself, and all things will come out in the wash just fine. Bottom line...include others because of your desire to share something special with others or wither away. It is time for the AMA to make a choice!


SO… NO, NO, NO to advertising the AMA but YES to sharing the experience. That is REAL the answer IMO
LC-
I'm tending toward vehement agreement with you on this issue. Promoting the hobby is what AMA promises in the mission statement and charter, and in the filing with IRS for exemption as a non-profit org acting in the public interest. Promoting itself by claiming domain over model aviation and excluding those that haven't paid tribute is the reality. The segment of model aviation within AMA's sphere of influence is shrinking, while model aviation in general is growing and thriving. Something is clearly wrong with this picture, and it's getting progressively harder to ignore. Yesterday's plan isn't working anymore. The untried plan is in what you said, let AMA promote the hobby and reap the benefit of what comes out in the wash. Will it work? Like you I think so, but can't provide proof. OTOH it hasn't been proven not to work like the current plan has.
Advertise AMA, No. Promote the hobby, including taking part in production of programs like those we've seen on Outdoor Channel, Yes. Mention and give credit for AMA's role in the production of such programs, have actors wear AMA jackets and ball caps, a banner with AMA logo in the backdrop, why not?

Abel

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Old 12-01-2004, 09:05 PM
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Default RE: AMA advertise on TV?

ORIGINAL: abel_pranger
Promote the hobby, including taking part in production of programs like those we've seen on Outdoor Channel, Yes. Mention and give credit for AMA's role in the production of such programs, have actors wear AMA jackets and ball caps, a banner with AMA logo in the backdrop, why not?
There are two R/C shows of which I am aware on DishNetwork. "Inside R/C" on Saturday morning, and "R/C Hobbies" in late evenings.

"Inside R/C" is heavy duty advertising hosted by an apparent air-head (or the script writers manage to turn her into an air-head). I've watched a half-dozen episodes, and the only one featuring model airplanes was the one on Top Gun. All their eposodes are of the "5 second sound byte" mentality, and I can't see how anyone not already involved in r/c hobbies of some sort could make sense of the programs. Dunno how AMA could manage to horn in on DuBro's time, either.

"R/C Hobbies" is IMHO hosted by a gent who can't figure out how to comb his hair. At least that's the image he presents.

While AMA might reap some benefit from participating in the shows, their very commercial nature probably precludes any such involvement unless it's packaged as a PSA.

Can't say I'd much care for the notion of AMA winding up looking like a pack of air-heads that can't find a comb.

BTW - I grew up in Abilene, so I know what you're talking about when you say that AMA doesn't have much to offer Texicans. It's an entirely different matter over toward The Right Coast where land ain't so easily had. Not that AMA has a very good track record in that department, but they do try to help clubs acquire flying sites when they can.
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Old 12-01-2004, 09:34 PM
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Default RE: AMA advertise on TV?

Hi Horrace

Perhaps one of the reasons the EC hired Don Koranda as ED is his experience in promoting organizations. If you do a web search, you will find pictures of him with some of the most famous Americans involved in aviation. Could it be that the AMA will do as you have urged and start issuing press releases on a much more frequent basis?

The likes of Burt Rutan, Paul McCready, Neil Armstrong, and John Glenn were all modelers. Koranda knows them all, along with a heck of a lot of others. Imagine the potential.

Spending money on TV is probably not in the cards, however, as you have pointed out, there are many other ways to promote the hobby and the organization that are virtually free. Perhaps the people behind Koranda's hiring are more astute then many have given them credit for.

JR
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Old 12-01-2004, 10:04 PM
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Default RE: AMA advertise on TV?


.....Could it be that the AMA will do as you have urged and start issuing press releases on a much more frequent basis?

The likes of Burt Rutan, Paul McCready, Neil Armstrong, and John Glenn were all modelers. Koranda knows them all, along with a heck of a lot of others. Imagine the potential.

Spending money on TV is probably not in the cards, however, as you have pointed out, there are many other ways to promote the hobby and the organization that are virtually free. Perhaps the people behind Koranda's hiring are more astute then many have given them credit for.

JR
Thanks for the recognition, JR, however for the last 3 years I have broadcast these things all around AMA. While there is no indication in the ballot box that my ideas have any merit what-so-ever, I have noticed some turn-arounds here in this forum and that makes me smile a bit. Perhaps it's as Coolidge said, "Persistence and Determination alone are omnipotent." those words keep me going.

However if the current AMA national officers are astute, it's, IMO, mostly in hiding their tracks, and disguising their intended course. Experienced professionals are like that.
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Old 12-01-2004, 10:45 PM
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Default RE: AMA advertise on TV?

Hi Horrace

I am having a hard time understanding your reasoning. The last year has produced votes that are a matter or record in the EC. The hiring of Koranda was only one. There were the votes on rule 9, the turbine regulations, and the release of the right for first refusal on Reese Airport, that come quickly to mind, where the votes show clear opposition to the positions Dave Brown was promoting. In my opinion, those that blindly support any issue put forth by anyone have been reduced to negligible force on the EC. It’s very difficult to hide your intentions when the votes are a matter of record.

It is time for Dave Brown to return to steering the boat (his oft used analogy) and to release his apparent obsession with risk management. He must return to steering the boat in the direction the folks rowing it (the EC) are willing to go. He can make minor corrections, but, if he insists on trying to steer in direct opposition, the boat will go in circles and accomplish nothing. He may very well be aware that his clams of support of the EC are nice for public consumption, but not based on fact. It’s time for him to solicit the advice of his closest friends and give that advice careful consideration.

In the past, he and I have discussed two scenarios. The first is the CIAM presidency, and the second was a re-write of the by-laws eliminating the position of president, and requiring a president who is willing to step down (since there would be no position for him). In the second, DB proposed that the EC elect one of it’s own as CEO each year. The plan has been posted in this forum previously. Either scenario would necessitate his relinquishing office. Since I have not talked to him since shortly after the Nominating Committee Meeting, I have no idea what his current intentions are. I understand he is on his way to a scheduled CIAM meeting now. Hopefully, his intentions will become more apparent upon his return.

In any case, the intentions of the balance of the EC appear, to me, to be quite clear.

JR
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Old 12-01-2004, 11:41 PM
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Default RE: AMA advertise on TV?

How about this for free advertising of our r/c hobby and what it all about ?
The TV station did an outstanding job what do you think?

[link=http://wm.gannett.speedera.net/wm.gannett/ksdk//cs_cool_jets_111904.wmv]Ozark Mountain Jets on NBC[/link]
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Old 12-03-2004, 08:42 AM
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Default RE: AMA advertise on TV?

ORIGINAL: the-plumber

Can't say I'd much care for the notion of AMA winding up looking like a pack of air-heads that can't find a comb.

After My experience as club secretary with the AMA over the past four years, IMO, they may not look like airheads, but they sure are doing a good job acting like airheads.

Maybe until they get their operations under better management, they shouldn't try to get more members through advertising, since they cannot handle the paperwork for the ones they have now.

Scott
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Old 12-20-2004, 12:38 AM
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Old 12-20-2004, 08:30 AM
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Default RE: AMA advertise on TV?

Why can't the powers that be do a program like Tripoli, High Power Rocketry Assoc., did a few years back. Discovery Channel has loved playing that show over and over. Surely some person in the AMA must have a contact with Discovery or Travel Channel. They could cover Florida Jets or Top Gun. It would have to be a program with general appeal for the audience. The possibilities are unlimited if we all start thinking outside the box. It doesn't matter how the mule got into the ditch, but how do we get it out. IMHO yes AMA needs to do more, whether it is locally or nationaly. Why can't they get a think tank together from different areas of interest and locals via internet and try to brainstorm this issue out. I attended a very good seminar recently in my business. The speaker said if you have done it the same for the last fifty years and won't change, you have been doing wrong for atleast the last thirty. As for as MA going public, the magazine hasn't changed a lot for a long time. The magazine isn't glitzy enough for somebody without any R/C interest to pickup off the shelf. This my two cents worth, in these days of inflation that ain't much.

Jimmy P.[:-]
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