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  1. #2451

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    RE: Why the AMA is not growing...........

    This is a really old thread, I was wondering if anybody has real membership numbers like of the last 4 years that prove the AMA is growing or shrinking.

    This would also show how serious this reduction/growth really is to our hobby... This is a big country, events here are growing in attendance, well, will go to WOD on Friday and find out

    Gerry


  2. #2452

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    RE: Why the AMA is not growing...........

    ORIGINAL: GerKonig

    This is a really old thread, I was wondering if anybody has real membership numbers like of the last 4 years that prove the AMA is growing or shrinking.

    This would also show how serious this reduction/growth really is to our hobby... This is a big country, events here are growing in attendance, well, will go to WOD on Friday and find out

    Gerry

    Gerry,

    Really old, and exhaustive enough to have touched on every thing topical re AMA.

    LOOK HERE

    Data was reposted, original from Hoss. Maybe he has updated info for '10 - '12 (2013 tally will not be done til mid Sept)

  3. #2453

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    RE: Why the AMA is not growing...........

    When I raced motocross, you had to be an AMA member... (I realize it is a dif. AMA)

    The Magazine... It is circulated to AMA members mainly due to tradition, and a source of income to AMA, from those that have advertisement in the magazine...

    In the last one, I found a Harbor Freight ad in it...
    I may go with a Ryobi table sander instead...as parts are available..
    If you can\'\'\'\'t dazzle em with brilliance,baffle em with BS

  4. #2454
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    RE: Why the AMA is not growing...........

    I can’t see the problem no one is forcing anyone to join the AMA or a club just go off by yourself and find your own place to fly from. Most fields I am aware of take a lot of work and effort to keep and maintain why you would think you would be welcome if you had no intention of joining and doing your share. The pissing and moaning between all the different factions drive new flyers to other places like school yards and sports fields. If and when their planes become too big for these fields they might look for a club and the AMA.

    Many new members complain the club didn’t kiss their backside when they showed up at the field. Well the old members you have bumped into have seen newbie’s come and go and after observing for 20 years that many new members don’t have time to do anything for the club they just want to pay to fly and that is just a fact clubs have to live with. Many new members have a hard time following the rules thinking many of them shouldn’t apply to them. It takes a while to truly understand and develop a loyalty to the club. Many new members have learned to fly on their own with the park flyers where no formal structure has been followed. Because you can yank the thing into the sky, tear around the patch and flop it somewhere near at hand may not qualify you as a pilot at the local club. Don’t expect back flips and high fives because you express an interest in the club. Join and prove your worth through your actions not because you expect something.

    Hobby shops have AMA and club info plastered all over the place. I have heard few sales pitches that include a strong suggestion to join the AMA and a club. It usually takes an inquiry from the new customer to get exacting information. When I asked why this was I was not surprised at the answer but more disappointed than anything. Sales do not want to tell a customer that on top of the money he is going to spend to get in the hobby it is recommended he pay to join not only the AMA but a club as well. They perceive this extra expense just might be the tipping point that ends the sale.

    I started flying many years ago. No introductory flights or try before you buy. You bought and built your own plane including the setting up of the engine and electronics over the winter then proceeded to the local club to learn to fly your creation. In my case I had no local club so I taught myself how to fly. I became a better builder/repairer long before I became a good pilot.

    Perhaps it’s the generation of instant gratification requiring no buy in just throw money until it fly’s.

    I wish someone had the answer I’ve read a lot of these threads and still no clear view of what is needed. Someday perhaps.

    Dennis

  5. #2455

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    RE: Why the AMA is not growing...........


    ORIGINAL: cj_rumley

    ORIGINAL: GerKonig

    This is a really old thread, I was wondering if anybody has real membership numbers like of the last 4 years that prove the AMA is growing or shrinking.

    This would also show how serious this reduction/growth really is to our hobby... This is a big country, events here are growing in attendance, well, will go to WOD on Friday and find out

    Gerry

    Gerry,

    Really old, and exhaustive enough to have touched on every thing topical re AMA.

    LOOK HERE

    Data was reposted, original from Hoss. Maybe he has updated info for '10 - '12 (2013 tally will not be done til mid Sept)
    Thank you, precisely, would be nice to know if we are still shrinking or expanding (membership wise, most of us are expanding):-)

    Gerry



  6. #2456
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    RE: Why the AMA is not growing...........

    for the most part, paid full members are shrinking, the free non adult AMA memberships and the reduced senior citizens ama memberships are expanding. the frre kids are causing a slight uptick in overall memberships. however, it is not real, as they do not pay anything, and are not allowed to vote.

    2009 142,231
    2010 139,515
    2011 143,201 new free junior membership off set and added to an over all loss of 2170 full dues open members.
    2012 154598 10,400 new free youth members plus 2000 new senior members offset loss of 720 full members.
    Bottom Feeder Brother #13
    when they outlaw R/C, only outlaws will have R/C
    13 of 27

  7. #2457

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    RE: Why the AMA is not growing...........

    Here Here LCS. Stand together brethren and be strong lest the undesirable model airplane flying renegades would stain our holy fields with there cursed rebel ways. May the very air blessed by the AMA refuse to cross their 10 oz foamy wings........... That wasn't over the top was it?Â*Â*

    James

    undesirable model airplane flying renegade

  8. #2458

    RE: Why the AMA is not growing...........


    ORIGINAL: JW0311
    That wasn't over the top was it?Â*
    Nah LOL...just about sizes up the mainstream mindset of the devout AMAish.
    Wow! Another epiphany…that is why the suckups suckup. Super sucking protection power. Yea baby.

  9. #2459

    RE: Why the AMA is not growing...........

    Guys,

    I finally cracked it...I know how to get them AMA numbers up by 150% almost instantly. Just let Mr.oneaew@msn.com head up the membership drive...


    http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=11561373

    "20 members strong":

    ORIGINAL: oneaew@msn.com

    my club does not want anything to do with the public we are 20 strong alll [ama] menbers hae our own field we lease>> 800 ft long blact top run way very nice at least a mile of wide open country on all 4 sides>> we are all in our 60 to 90 any given day of the week there ar only maybe 6 flyers per day
    and overnight 50 members:

    ORIGINAL: oneaew@msn.com

    its really something our club does not want to do anything for fun at our place>>> no swap meets>>> no shopping plaza model shows>> we have 50 members>> may be any day of the week you will find onld only 3 to 6 flyers>>> everyone seems happy about that i go fly 3 days a week>> 800ft blacktop runway flat groud on all 4 sides for a mile around>>most flyers are 60 to 81 yrs old me iam 81 but it is nice to fly there>>
    Wheww...I didn't think we would ever find a solution...but we kept at it!
    Wow! Another epiphany…that is why the suckups suckup. Super sucking protection power. Yea baby.

  10. #2460

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    RE: Why the AMA is not growing...........

    This thread was posted in 2004 that's 9 years ago.before the electric and arf boom..what are we reviving the dead?

  11. #2461

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    RE: Why the AMA is not growing...........


    ORIGINAL: mongo

    for the most part, paid full members are shrinking, the free non adult AMA memberships and the reduced senior citizens ama memberships are expanding. the frre kids are causing a slight uptick in overall memberships. however, it is not real, as they do not pay anything, and are not allowed to vote.

    2009 142,231
    2010 139,515
    2011 143,201 new free junior membership off set and added to an over all loss of 2170 full dues open members.
    2012 154598 10,400 new free youth members plus 2000 new senior members offset loss of 720 full members.

    Thank you for the information. So membership numbers have grown for the last 2 years where it is more important. The younger crowd. When I paid junior membership for my son, it was $1 per year, so not much changed since then...

    As far as us, the older crowd, since I remember this hobby had a high component of older folks. We lost a lot of members in our small club due to the fact that they moved underground (forever). I was among the youngest when I joined the club about 20 years plus ago. Unfortunately, time passes for me too, but now that I think about it, I am still working, not retired. This puts me in the minority group in my club:-)

    Gerry


  12. #2462

    RE: Why the AMA is not growing...........


    ORIGINAL: blhollo2

    This thread was posted in 2004 that's 9 years ago.before the electric and arf boom...
    Good point.
    Had it not been for the advent of arfs,3D, FPV, and electrics that has brought in the youger crowd, I think our losses would have been much much greater.

    Now we should start thinking about that "boom" and what it will be like when it starts to fade.
    Wow! Another epiphany…that is why the suckups suckup. Super sucking protection power. Yea baby.

  13. #2463

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    RE: Why the AMA is not growing...........

    LCS, I enjoy it when you make post that would require folks attempt to find their brain cells

  14. #2464

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    RE: Why the AMA is not growing...........


    ORIGINAL: littlecrankshaf


    ORIGINAL: blhollo2

    This thread was posted in 2004 that's 9 years ago.before the electric and arf boom...
    Good point.
    Had it not been for the advent of arfs,3D, FPV, and electrics that has brought in the youger crowd, I think our losses would have been much much greater.

    Now we should start thinking about that ''boom'' and what it will be like when it starts to fade.
    You reminded me a university professor friend of mine: We get a batch of students and we get a semester to teach them as much as possible. The beauty of the job is that even if we screw up, next semester we get another new batch, and get a new shot at it.

    In other words, it is easier for the young crowd to enter into the hobby. But each year you will have more kids getting to the age where they might be attracted. And the population is growing, so the new batches will be bigger.

    We know we have ARFs, 3D, FPV and electrics, and they will not go away any time soon. What else lies ahead, who knows? Technology changes very fast.

    Gerry

  15. #2465

    RE: Why the AMA is not growing...........


    ORIGINAL: GerKonig


    ORIGINAL: littlecrankshaf


    ORIGINAL: blhollo2

    This thread was posted in 2004 that's 9 years ago.before the electric and arf boom...
    Good point.
    Had it not been for the advent of arfs,3D, FPV, and electrics that has brought in the youger crowd, I think our losses would have been much much greater.

    Now we should start thinking about that ''boom'' and what it will be like when it starts to fade.
    You reminded me a university professor friend of mine: We get a batch of students and we get a semester to teach them as much as possible. The beauty of the job is that even if we screw up, next semester we get another new batch, and get a new shot at it.

    In other words, it is easier for the young crowd to enter into the hobby. But each year you will have more kids getting to the age where they might be attracted. And the population is growing, so the new batches will be bigger.

    We know we have ARFs, 3D, FPV and electrics, and they will not go away any time soon. What else lies ahead, who knows? Technology changes very fast.

    Gerry
    I hope you are right. Watching as some of the clubs wither and die all the while the remander lament how they don't want to "build" another ARF has me thinking otherwise.
    Wow! Another epiphany…that is why the suckups suckup. Super sucking protection power. Yea baby.

  16. #2466

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    RE: Why the AMA is not growing...........


    ORIGINAL: kochj

    When I raced motocross, you had to be an AMA member... (I realize it is a dif. AMA)

    I did the same whem I raced flat track, and the R c a when I did rodeo. (Neither were among my brighter career choices)

  17. #2467

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    RE: Why the AMA is not growing...........

    ORIGINAL: littlecrankshaf

    AMA has enjoyed a very long perceived (perception is everything) standing benefit of member enrollment based on the ideology that ''we must make people financially responsible for themselves'' that clubs also use to great effect for requiring membership with them as well. It has been a (once again, perceived) symbiotic relationship for much too long IMO...Yes, my opinion... The actual results are quite different in practice in my opinion...and any other opinion is just that...and cannot be substantiated since comparative histories are not available. But I can say this; Since our club has made the effort to change the typical mindset previously installed by some other club's previous tactics, overall hobby enthusiasm has grown and more people than ever have entered the modeling community and AMA membership has also grown....

    Now, if that old formula, most here embrace so religiously, is so effective why haven't those clubs that use that typical technique (AMA or the hi-way) grown likewise...since all the other variables are the same?
    My opinion is that requiring AMA is not the single dominant effect on a clubs overall growth (or decline) and life cycle. It is more about the dynamics of the club and whether or not the club truly wants to grow.

    My local AMA chartered club had a fairly stable membership for a number of years. We had to move our 40 year old flying site from one part of the US Army Corps of Engineers park we were in to another area in the same park for safety reasons (overflight of other park visitors as models grew in size and speed).

    Many, many people worked extremely hard to make this happen and to help get the funding for the field and the result is that we have one of the best flying sites in AMA district VIII.
    The top notch quality of the new field and facilities and the welcoming fellowship of the club members is creating growth in our club, despite requring AMA membership. In fact, I was at the field for 4 hours last Sunday and they signed up two new members on the spot.

    Some clubs do not feel a need to look to the future and recruit new members and those are the ones that will wither and die over time. Sad, like you said. Even sadder that some of these clubs would rather function as a private country club for a very few members so they do not have to share the flying site airspace with anyone but their chosen few.

    That is their right, of course, but as I have said before, it has precisely nothing to do with the AMA.

    To me, and many that I know, the decision to join a club or not is far more complex than the sole AMA issue. It is a function of the fliers needs and interests, location, site and facilities, expense, people, club resources and similar factors.

    With the current state of our hobby/sport, and the ability of so many modelers to fly at undeveloped sites close to home, a club that wants to grow needs to put their best foot forward, offer tangible benefits, do some outreach and work hard to recruit new members.



    Electric Coolhunter

  18. #2468

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    RE: Why the AMA is not growing...........

    Might as well say " why the AMA is GROWING". LOL!
    There isn't any real discussion, just a visual Que on the " most active threads list" and talking about the AMA...
    Perhaps there should be a new post that is "All AMA RELATED".
    Speculate and the form a concrete opinion I always say..

    The reason why one would think he could get away with flying a noisy 2 stroke plane around some homes or in a ballpark while children played soccer with there tightly griped parents and "privileged" community persons, stand close by is beyond me. Everyone is up in everyone's business and can't stand the sight or thought of ANYONE
    Using a facility for something other than what it is designed for. People could not wait to run out and practically tackle me off my dirt bike when my friend's and I road around on some undeveloped land that was months away from total destruction and homes to be built on it.... Of course you will be Lucky to fly anything but an electric plane at a nearby park....

    That is where FLYING fields come in play. I for one HATE dealing with those no hobby freaks sticking there self inflicted large heads into my play time. They belong out in there driveway washing the caravan and mowing the lawn, picking weeds and watching what all the neighbors are up to so they can spread it around to all there friends VIA the phone or bus stop.

    A dedicated flying field and club, absorbs all the trash and spits it out through a carbon filter, giving one clean air to berThs and water to drink.

    Peace I'm outA here
    If you can\'\'\'\'t dazzle em with brilliance,baffle em with BS

  19. #2469
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    RE: Why the AMA is not growing...........

    I think it would be great to have a reality TV show made at a club or maybe a group of nearby clubs. A successful TV show like that would send the hobby into a higher orbit.
    ME: \"I need a good rate down to one three thousand\". EXPRESS: \"Roger, we\'\'re coming down like a Bonanza full of doctors\".

  20. #2470

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    RE: Why the AMA is not growing...........


    ORIGINAL: TexasAirBoss

    I think it would be great to have a reality TV show made at a club or maybe a group of nearby clubs. A successful TV show like that would send the hobby into a higher orbit.
    This spurred a thought. Can you imagine what it would be like when the old guns at the field start their usual fighting? Kidding, yet thought this was sort of humorous. [X(]

  21. #2471
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    RE: Why the AMA is not growing...........


    [quote]ORIGINAL: TexasAirBoss

    I think it would be great to have a reality TV show made at a club or maybe a group of nearby clubs. A successful TV show like that would send the hobby into a higher orbit.


    You know Boss a month ago I asked if anyone on RCU recalled a story involving things you are speaking of. I saved the story and had it on my wall shop. I have lost the story. it was a funny but all so true. It was in one of the model publications. It started out with a description of those at the flying site on a week end. The guy that has everything perfect, truck, planes, filed box, and the clothes he was wearing. The dude that takes thirty minutes to unload his plane, thirty minute to get the thing ready, thirty minutes to check everything out and does not fly. The guy that has everything held together with duck tape and never stops flying. The guy that never ever has what he needs. The club expert that knows everything about everything and knows anyone that has been anything in the world of model aviation. How about the hero flyer. The truth is this guy that put the story together did a very good job. Love to see it again. Lost the story in a hurricane, heck I lost the wall it was on.
    Anyway, a very good point Boss.

  22. #2472
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    RE: Why the AMA is not growing...........

    You people want to see how the real hobby works Check out WING's ACROSS AMERICA 2008 That is the real way to promote the hobby. Yes I was 1 of the pilots This project covered the 48 states, not just one area
    Larry K
    And still going On the home stretch!
    Larry K
    Sig Brotherhood # 1 Sig Kadet Brotherhood # 4 WACO Brotherhood #34 Cub Brotherhood 14

  23. #2473
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    RE: Why the AMA is not growing...........


    ORIGINAL: Luchnia


    This spurred a thought. Can you imagine what it would be like when the old guns at the field start their usual fighting? Kidding, yet thought this was sort of humorous. [X(]
    Actually, at my club, the older gang is the most laid back and the most fun to fly with. And most of them have a great sense of humor. I think they would project a very positive image of the hobby. And they have a very broad range of interest, (so the show with be more entertaining). And believe it or not, they are very tech-savvy. Its a very hip group. I feel lucky to have such a great bunch of guys to fly with.
    ME: \"I need a good rate down to one three thousand\". EXPRESS: \"Roger, we\'\'re coming down like a Bonanza full of doctors\".

  24. #2474
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    RE: Why the AMA is not growing...........

    The boys of 1960 dreamed of the chance to fly a model airplane.
    The boys of today..?
    Many of this form of male hominidae did not exist 50 years ago and did not start showing up in any serious numbers until around 20 years ago.
    Now they are plentiful.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

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    WHO GUNNA FEED MAW KEEEIDS..???

  25. #2475

    RE: Why the AMA is not growing...........


    ORIGINAL: combatpigg

    The boys of 1960 dreamed of the chance to fly a model airplane.
    The boys of today..?
    Many of this form of male hominidae did not exist 50 years ago and did not start showing up in any serious numbers until around 20 years ago.
    Now they are plentiful.
    LOL... I love that term "form of male hominidae"...AKA "Monkey see, monkey do"... and I could post some cool images from the day... as well...just pick the day...LOL

    But to be fair it's been apart of every society ever since there was society. Just matters what is "seen"... Thankfully now we have model fields hidden away and unseen with and an army of "gate keepers" to insure the kids don't copy us...because we all know how dangerous model aviation is...so dangerous if fact we now require millions of dollars of liability insurance and a license for those few we do allow to fly with us...
    Wow! Another epiphany…that is why the suckups suckup. Super sucking protection power. Yea baby.


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