grampi

Has anyone ever noticed the "attitude" at flying clubs? I'm talking about when you first show up at a flying field and you meet some of the members there. Yes, they're generally firendly and all, but still they kind of look down at you as if they're somehow superior to you because they are there with their planes and you aren't. Or, have you been a club member who is constantly pressured into doing things you don't want to like being an officer in the club, or organizing fun-flys, etc. Do you ever wish you could just go fly and aviod all the BS?

I don't want to give R/Cers a bad name or anything because the vast majority of them are good, helpful, and friendly people. But there are some who aren't.

A friend of mine and I were in the Air Force and we briefly belonged to the base flying club. Most of the members were good people, but there were a couple of guys who were just a-holes, and they just happened to be the club's pres and vp. Our flying field was on Air Force base property, so the club couldn't force us to be members in order to use the field. We did have to have AMA though. It used to burn these guys up when we'd fly at the field, because we weren't members. It was their fault we were no longer members because they constantly harrassed us about being more active in club activities. I don't have a problem if club members want to have fund raisers, and meetings, and all the politcal garbage that goes along with this stuff, but when they constantly pressure you into doing this stuff when you've made it crystal clear that you don't want to, I have a problem with it.

Clubs are a good thing, but there are certain people who like being in certain positions like pres, vp, sec and so forth, and there are those who'd rahter spend their time flying, building, or talking about it online, like me. Sometimes I just want to fly. Sometimes I want to fly with my friends. Anyone else ever feel like this?

scottrc

YES, YES, and YES!!!! The politics is what is screwing our hobby up. More members what to be politicians than flyers. This is why I think there is a growing number of "rougue" flyers. We had two clubs fold and the mebers either quit or fly "rogue" because they were fed up with all the political "rules" and infighting among members.

grampi

I don't know how it is in your club, but our club officials were poor to mediocre pilots at best and it burned them up to know I was a much better pilot. I could fly circles around them, and in fact I literally did this several times. I don't suppose that helped relations any.

Roby

Funny this thread should come up.

Actually me and several other members of our club have formed our own club
within our AMA club. We call ourselves the "wash our hands of the club club".
Of course, we will continue to be members of the base club and go to the
monthly meetings ,etc,etc

BUT the 2nd Wed of every month we will meet in my shop ,share ideas, talk R/C
perhaps plan a few events, build,,drink coffee and eat a few donuts. Ya know the fun
stuff. This is by invitation only and all EGOS and ATTITUDES are checked at the door.

We only have 5 members at this point , we'll see what happens. Our first meeting is
the day after tomorrow. It should be interesting , I expect that it will be enjoyable
because we all have the same attitude for the hobby , all fun and who needs or wants
the BS anyway

I will point out this this is how my work shop operates anyway , it just means that now
I have a few more people showing up and we are now "semi-formal" ( because now we have a name)

If anyone really cares I'll keep you posted on the out come.

Regards
Roby

Jim Branaum

My Feedback: (3)

I have been a club treasurer for almost 10 years as an attempt to protect our funds. I really don't like the politics (frequently being on the wrong side of those who want to rule), but I still tend to agree with you. Too many at all levels would rather play power games than fly. I was with you right up until that last bit. I think it was probably out of order if you are being literal since you put people at risk. Unless you feel the SC is just a piece of paper to make the other boys happy.

grampi

Sorry, I guess I didn't explain that one very well. I meant that I literally flew circles around their planes while we were both flying. I would never do anything deliberately to put someone in danger.

yard-dart

My Feedback: (35)

Being an officer of a club doesn't mean squat! How'd he get there? He was voted in (supposedly anyway). He can be voted out the same way! Officers can't make rules, or decisions on their own. Everything should be voted on by the club. That's how ours operates anyway.

The next time someone acts an ass, stop him, get his attention, and ask him why he acts that way. Let him know really quickly just because he's an officer, that doesn't entitle him to walk around like he's got a crown on his head.

Too much of someone acting like that around here will result in a one-way ticket out of the club, and possibly a kicked ass.

Jim Branaum

My Feedback: (3)

BINGO!

Grampi,

Thanks for the clarification. Lots of folks fly better and worse than I do, but it does not bother me any more than the fact that there are folks with more and less money than I. However I do agree there are idjiots who are offended by being shown as not the greatest at whatever.

Good club officers are always looking for spark plugs to keep the organization alive. Unfortunatley, some are anal about their approach and need to be educated because they do more damage than good. Some cannot be educated and we all really hate it when they take action. Then there are the ones that create spark plugs without even trying. Sorry you have had interaction with the wrong bunch.

Red Scholefield

My Feedback: (9)

Ever wish you could belong to a club where all the members pulled their fair share rather than free loading off the efforts of a few and then ***** about how THEY run the club?

yard-dart

My Feedback: (35)

The problem I'm seeing with everyone's reply is that you all seem to accept these kind of people. When I say this, I say it with seriousness, "we don't put up with that kind of behavior here!" If you join the local club here, and act like an ass, or a jerk, YOU WILL LEAVE AND NOT COME BACK.

If your club, or site, accepts this kind of behavior, it's each members fault (including yours) if nothing gets done about it.

Hossfly

I haven't noticed that so much as I have the attitude of those that come into the club's facility, want free training, or if already a flier, free membership or such. I notice those that never want to show up for work-days, never assist with events, never want to help the other newbies, but they JUST WANT TO FLY, and let others build, maintain, promote, and whatever it takes to keep the club viable, functioning and keep the field in operation. I've been told that if a person pays dues, it's the CLUB's responsibility to provide him with a mowed and usable facility. I am very good at informing these individuals just WHO the CLUB is.[>:]

Definitely agreed, but so are all walks in life. It can be very depressing at times, however life goes on.

Like you say -- YOU have a problem. If, for illustration, you had 10 members and only a couple (2) "a-holes" then the a-holes are definitely in the minority.
I, too, was in the USAF. At one base I was responsible for getting a fenced and paved CL circle with bleachers, plus a grass area for RC, as RC was in those days, however I didn't do it by "just wanting to fly". Politics were involved.

Do whatever you like. There will always be opposition to anyway you choose. As life goes there are those that make things happen, those that watch things happen, those that wonder just what happened, and a number that never knew anything did happen. Pick your class.
Don't blame the Club and/or its Officers unless you are in there making things happen. Without the clubs darn little would ever happen. Whether it's a recreational unit or a nation, as Thomas Jefferson said, "The price of freedom is eternal vigilance." [>:]

grampi

I think you're a bit off base here. The ONLY reason I've ever been a club member is to have use of the flying field. I've always offered to do my part to help maintain the field (sometimes even when I wasn't a member) or anything else that NEEDED to be done in order to keep the flying field usable. Where I draw the line is when club members/officers constantly pressure you into the political aspect of being a member. I personally don't care about organizing fun flys, discussing club minutes, or voting in club officers. That stuff is just a waste of time to me. I'd rather spend my time talking about planes, flying, or something else having to do with the hobby. The majority of our club meeting time was spent discussing club matters rather than about planes or flying and it was extremely boring. It's been my experience that there's always been no shortage of people who do like doing these things. That's fine. Clubs obviously need people to do these things, but I'm just not one of them.

grampi

I think you may have missed my point. I don't complain about what goes on with any particular club. All I care about is that I have a field where I can fly. I will offer my help in doing what's necessary to maintain the field, but I'm not interested in participating in other club functions, i.e., being a club official, organizing fun flys, attending club meetings (unless the majority of the time is spent addressing interesting things like talking about building or flying, rather than just talking about boring club matters).

proline8000

My Feedback: (12)

You know I have been in this hobby since 1971. The club my father and I had belonged to had over 250 members and about 40 to 50 of them would be at the field on Saturday and Sundays. We would fly year round and everyone helped . We only had 6 frequencies and never had any trouble but now we have over 50 freq's and there is no end to the amount of fighting or political BS. The club officers treat the land owner like a second class citizen and a small group of members (4) took is upon ourselves to change that, We are now outcasts in the club. This hobby should be fun to all we fly as much as possable, We usally fly out our battery's everytime we go out. This weekend we had a member who hasn't flown with me very much but after the end of the weekend he stated the he had the best time ever since he started the hobby a few years ago, He should have a great time every time he goes out. We can't afford to turn people off , we need to help people enjoy this hobby as much as we can or it will keep dieing a slow deth.

Frost_

My Feedback: (1)

Reading this thread has helped me to finalize my 'club decision'. Before I begin, I have been seriously into ground-based RC for quite some time, so this is a natural progression I have put off as long as I could... Also I am not one of the teenage twits form the other side of the forums. I am an adult, and an engineer. I have been flying for only about 2 months now. I have the somewhat unique oppurtunity to live within 1/2 hour or so form an abandoned air-field where there are a few guys that have been flying there for about 20 years. This is private property and VERY large. 3 or 4 of the guys have the key to get in and are free to invite as many as they wish, as long as the grounds are not torn up/littered, etc. I have a buddy that is also new. These guys are great, my friend and I take off, practice our flight, and then hand over the radio for the landing. If something bad happens, we would hand over the radio mid-flight to one of the 'pros'.

This place is a bit far for my friend to drive, so I began to talk to members of 2 of the local clubs that I knew of. The members I spoke with all pretty much say the same things. They just want to fly. If club maintainence is going to be an issue, I would gladly pay extra to have the grounds upkeep done by an outside group, which was also in-line with what the club members I spoke to were thinking. The members also informed me that due to the high membership counts that it was frequently 2 hours between flights (!!!!). The only reason I was told (we are talking about almost 10 people here from 2 clubs) that they retained membership was that they had no place else to fly (this is a city about 1 to 1.5 hrs. north of our old airfield). They HATED the constant bickering, infighting, and the politics that they are repeatedly pulled into. They also tell me that the structure of rules designed around safety is great, and neccessary, but that the rules are frequently used for selective bullying of people. They also have a meeting requirement for members to attend meetings (obviously you aren't required to attend all meetings, but there is a set number) that have NOTHING to do with flying, and everything to do with club structure, etc etc. I just do not have the time with my busy work schedule for the BS... and if it's BS in my free time, well that's just time wasted that I could be flying. Hossfly you may snub me as you did the other for not wanting to 'help out', but I just do not have the time. I will gladly even pay for the ENTIRE THING to be mowed and picked up at least once a year (with others helping out the rest of the time... these clubs have a large membership base) but not everyone has the luxury of so much time.

That said, I beleive that I will stick to the unreg'd field that I have been going to so far. I don't want this thing (flying) made into something that's bigger than it is to me. I got the plane to fly and enjoy, not to go to meetings, argue administrative issues/jockeying, mow grass (except for the first crash, which may be just around the corner), possibly be bullied, or to constantly have to wait extended periods to 'go up'. The social aspect of the club is nice, but that is secondary to what I would be going for.

I went back and forth over AMA membership if not joining a club, but once I am comfortable with the trainer I have, I hope to get an E-flyer for the fields that are close to and around the house. As this does not offer the same level of 'insulation' that is afforded at the airfield, I feel insurance is the only responsible route.

Many of you may read and say "so-what".... I just wanted the guys that "just want to fly" to know that there are LOTS of guys out there like you. In fact, outside of reading posts by some on RCU, everyone I have met here in the real world "just wants to fly".

Peace guys.

Woody218

My Feedback: (24)

We all "just want to fly". I am the president of our local club. Out of 40 members, there are perhaps 8 of us that do any actual work, and help work at events, mow grass, and the other things that go along with running an organization. If nobody wants to mow grass, and we all just want to fly, I can guarantee that very soon there would be *****ing. Nobody would volunteer to mow the field, they'd just complain about it. However, that said, we are pretty laid back, and the political crap is kept to a minimum. In our club, the officers don't just "have their way" and exclude anyone else's opinion. But, it is frustrating when we want every member to come to meetings and voice their views, then only 1/2 at most show up, and then the rest complain about things that are done.

I read a statistic that said in every organization, 10% of the people do 90% of the work. It's been my observation that is probably true.

Frost_

My Feedback: (1)

... a full response to everything you have just said can be found in my above post.

Some people just don't have the time.

grampi

Frost

I am just now getting back into flying after a long layoff. I will be getting a 3D plane, not just because I think the manuvers you can do with it are impressive, but because you can fly it just about anywhere. I will do my darnest to avoid having to join a club and assume all the headaches that go with it. I will have AMA though.

BTW, you may want to consider using a buddy cord during your training sessions. I've spent a good number of years as an instructor and I can tell you it's a much superior method of switching control of the plane compared to passing the transmitter back and forth. I've lost a number of planes using the passing method, but never lost one using a buddy cord.

Frost_

My Feedback: (1)

I'm down with the AMA... I need insurance, and if a few of the dollars go towards supporting the hobby's bigger picture, I think that it is a great and quite minor investment.

This will most likely garner me further scorn (as I have seen directed toward others in the past) but as far as the training, I am one of those stubborn individuals who wish to discipline themselves. I only have about 12-14 flights so far, but I have taken off and flown solo each flight and handed it over to our 'pro' for landing. The last 2 flights were spent circling and lining up with the runway. Perhaps in another 2-6 flights when I am comfortable I will be able to solo. I seriously respect everyone's opinion on the situation but I want the satisfaction of doing it myself.

50+AirYears

Woody218, how the heck do you get 1/2 of the members to show up for a meeting? We ended last year with something like 138 members, and the biggest attendance at a meeting, probably because of the refreshments, was the December Christmas party meeting, and still didn't get 60 people including wives, kids, and/or significant others.
Seems club memberships reflect today's standards, as well as the two different types of our sport participants: The builders, who work at a project to get something worthwhile, and the ARFers who want something handed to them. Of course, some of the builders aren't too interested in contributing effort to keeping the club site operational, and there are also some ARFers who contribute as much as any body else. Like some philosopher once said, it takes all kinds.

About 16 years ago, I put out a challenge to start participating to some of the guys who ******* about the politics and about the officers railroading things through. These people usually wouldn't speak up at business meetings and rarely voted. Most stopped ******* to me, and a couple even quit. One quit after I responded to his throwing the challenge back to me . My acceptance of the challenge put me in as treasurer for 13 of the last 16 years. I have also been on work parties, I've been an instructor when my work gave me the flexibility, I've participated as flyer and as spectator contact at shows we've put on at the field and at local gatherings and at mall shows.

By the way, our business meetings rarely run as much as an hour. Sometimes the gab sessions after run longer than the meetings.

I figure that the less you contribute, the less right you have to *****. I feel I've earned the right, myself, to do so as much as I want. There are several members who have contributed more than I have. Most of us have few if any gripes about the officers or the way the club is run. Our gripes run to 2 basic subjects. The gripes of the free-riders, and the problem of trying to control the "too many rules" types who if not watched will endanger people at the field and who have even jeopardized our field use by things as stupid as getting into name calling arguements with the property owners and neighbors

aaron2874

Man I'm glad I have a place to fly with no b/s. This is why I have been hesitant to join th local club. It's right down the street, but I would rather drive an hour to get to my personal field, then have to deal with a bunch of sillyness from some r/c premadonna. Most ppl are decent and good, but there always has to be one or two jerks to ruin your day.

Woody218

My Feedback: (24)

That's fine, but if everyone had your opinion, nothing would get done. My hobby is important to me, having a nice field to fly off is important to me, the fellowship with my flying buddies is important to me, so I MAKE time to do things that need doing.

It has been my experience that the people who do nothing to help mow grass or contribute anything to the club are the ones who pi$$ and moan the loudest about everything. They never come to meetings, never help with anything, they just show up and complain.

ifixairplanes

My Feedback: (9)

This past summer I was part of a club. I did not like it all because of all the idiots who think they are better than you. Because I am young, and have an aggresive flying style they didnt like me. They said I was an unsafe pilot, blah blah blah.... Let me tell you though, I am in no way an unsafe pilot. No matter how outa control my plane looks, what angle it is in, speed, altitude, whatever, I am in total control of my plane at all times. There was one member who always loved to watch me fly and always gave me good comments on my flying style. He even remarked that I am the only person in that club he feels safe standing with while flying. Other then me, he never flew with other people. The problem in that club lied with the old timers. They sat on the sidelines all day, maybe flying once or twice for the whole day. They watch everything. The double standard in that club was definately apparent. I saw a guy fly over the pits and almost hit a guy. No one said a word to him. I do something as simple as make a pass down the runway and they are all up in arms about me breaking a rule. If you werent part of thier little "cliche" then they didnt like you. They talk about you behind your back to other pilots, make frivolous claims and make a grievance which only THEY sign. No one else outside their little group signed the grienvance..or was shown it for a matter of fact. Needless to say, Me and my buddy arn't going to be with them or any "sanctioned" club. Right now me and 3 other guys all fly at a local temp. field. Come summer we will have a permanent property for us to fly at. Even though we arnt in a club though, I will still carry AMA, thank god you dont need to be at a sanctioned field for it to be effective.

Sean

Woody218

My Feedback: (24)

I'm not talking about that kind of crap, behavior like you described from the "old farts" has no place in any club. That would NOT be tolerated here. I suppose I might qualify as an "old fart", I am 49 years old, and have been modeling since I was 6 years old. [X(] Not all "old farts" are that way, I fly helis, I fly 3D stuff with planes, etc, etc.

Where I have a beef is with people who never help with anything, yet they are the first in line to complain when this or that isn't done to their liking. They like to fly off the nicely mowed field, yet they are never available to help make it so. They like to attend the funflys, but when asked to help out running the transmitter impound, they have something else to do.

Frost_

My Feedback: (1)

Dude, what is it with you? "That's fine, but if everyone had your opinion,"I work full-time for one of the world's top semi-conductor companies, and do contract work currently for 2 others (other industries... have to say that, ya never know who is watching), and my free time is sporadic at best. This isn't AN OPINION, this is my life and you have made an assumption based on nothing. I have no kids because I have no time. I guess if I took it your way, I should just quit before I get invested so that some self-righteous person cannot moan and try to make me feel selfish for wanting to expand my hobby past the ground. You are the reason, if I keep flying, that I have no desire to join a club. I need this side of the forums for support so I hope this doesn't sour things, but if so, then so be it. My time is just too precious, and you cannot speak for me and what I should be doing.