dglick10

Guys - I rarely post (maybe I should keep my mouth shut now) but it seems the majority of you feel like it's already been implemented.... It hasn't.

Secondly - It also appears that the majority of you already have it figured out.....you don't.

Third - If you all have such great ideas about how the AMA should be ran....run for office and try to implement your ideas. Best of luck - too many old people afraid of change in this organization - period -

Fourth - If you can't stand the AMA - group together and create a competing organization ran the way you want to see it ran.

(Whatever happens - it's majority rule)

Oh - and yes I've always taken the no-nonsense approach in our club as President. No BS tolerated...just the facts and move on in our club. Guess it's the Army in me.

Montague

No reaon to not express your opionion. That's what makes this country what it is. It applies to the government and it applies to our organizatoins. Being silent when something is wrong, that's the "wrong" approach. Standing up for what you think, even if you're out-numbered, that's what freedom of speach is all about.

No, I don't think anyone here thinks it's already a done deal. The point is that DB brings it up once in a while. Many of us think it's a bad idea, so we say so. And if enough voices say so, then our elected represetitives will know we think it's a bad idea, and together we might actually prevent it from happening. It's far eaiser to stop a bad idea before it's implemented than undo it afterwards. So, that's what is going on here. Trying to stop a bad idea before we have to work to undo it. Nothing wrong with that. Sure, arguments here get a bit hot. That's the nature of online forums. But it's better to argue here than be silent and meekly accpet whatever is imposed from above.


Bit assertion there. Prove it. Back it up. Otherwise, I call that line "BS". I'm listening to your arguement, but you better have one after a statement like that.

You're making two points here. First, that we aren't entitled to raise our voices to our leaders unless we run for office. That's like saying we can't object to something W does because we didn't run for president. It's a bogus statement. Many of the people who have been speaking up in this forum DO walk the walk, DO or HAVE put in their time in whatever way they are able.

The second point, that there are too many "old" people to change anything, well, I'd object to the comment about "old people" (though I'm in my mid-30's), but agree that the majority of members don't know about the issues and don't care. That's a job for education, for people to inform the membership. You're the president of your club? How many times have you mentioned issues to your membership? How many times have you done anything beyond your local area? You don't have to, but when you talk about the mass of uninformed, resistant to change masses, what have you done about it? Things COULD be done to get the word out.

"America, love it or leave it"?? Nope. Far better to change it from the inside. Fix what is broken. Keep what works. This idea that we have to blindly follow the "leaders" and not object when something bad is being proposed is just wrong. Creating a new organization has been tried, and there are major reasons it hasn't worked yet. The AMA does a lot of things "right", and it just wouldn't make sense to try to duplicate all that. It makes far more sense to speak up about one bad policy idea than to toss out the baby with the bath water over one issue.

J_R

First, I don’t want to discourage you from posting. Having said that, you may want to read this thread: http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/The_...2714464/tm.htm

It was started 3/1 and is old news to the members of this forum, although you may have only seen the information in the last few days, if you don’t read this forum.

Stick around and you may become more current on AMA issues.

dglick10

Montague - thanks for the straightforward reply !! That's the way I like to eat my crow.....should I have to.

I'm bowing out of this thread now - doesn't appear that the whole thing has much support anyways - and in agreement with your earlier post...It would be a nightmare of paperwork and very easily open to abuse/neglect.

Guess the only statement I had that made any sense was "whatever happens - majority rules" and I'll abide by whatever happens pro/con. Take care guys - I'll be watching from the sidelines as usual.

BTW - I'm down in the bay area in 2 weeks. (Thanks god for vacation)

Hossfly

Have you checked out the thread, "Does AMA have a real future?"

All "OLD GUYS" are not limited to current politically-correct garbage. Are YOU?

bdavison

My Feedback: (1)

Sometimes I wonder if any of the higher up's even listen to anyone.

That tiered program is in essence INSURANCE COMPANIES DICTATING AMA POLICY. Plain and simple. The insurance companies own the AMA now.

The AMA guys say "our members want cheaper rates". The insurance guys say ok, well here's how we can structure the pricing.

Its business, not a organization.

The AMA has lost the organization and turned into an insurance company puppet. Im just curious...when the AMA fails, are they going to refund all the lifetime members, or are they going to play like every other insurance company....no refunds.

Perhaps they should rename the AMA to the "Academy of Model Insurance Agents"

sebo

This is for everyone.
I e-mailed this letter to Dave Brown:

Hi, Dave!

I’ve been reading “President’s Perspective� in the April 2005 issue of Model Aviation.

I’m taking to heart the thought of the possibility of changing the dues to accommodate people who fly different kinds of aircraft.

I can see where this is going to be like our income tax system. Don’t do it, Dave.

I fly park flyers, arfs, kits, scratch built, and giant scale. My AMA number is 12856. I’ve been around a week or two.

If someone wants to fly, they must bite the bullet and pay the price. Just because someone buys a $200 park flyer doesn’t mean that that person’s membership should be less. That person is, more than likely, new to the sport and (without guidance) may be a greater potential hazard than someone who is flying giant scale. Little planes can do an awful lot of damage too.

I got chopped up by an 049 before I joined AMA. I then went to the local field and talked to the guys. Shortly thereafter, I became an Academy Member. I wasn’t allowed to fly at the field until I was a member. After that, everyone was eager to help me.

I wanted to fly. Since I wanted to fly, I had to pay the fee.

Just because I fly giant scale I shouldn’t be penalized and have to pay more. Besides, I may prefer to fly only park flyers this season, then again maybe only arfs. Should I be pro-rated for each kind?

You said, “Membership is decreasing�. Is this a trend? There’s a lot to this but I don’t think variable rates is the answer.

Maybe I should get a good flier discount. I do get a good driver discount…..yea, there’s an idea!

RChobby53

The AMA is in a change or die situation, it seems to me. There is no way to attract the 5 ounce foamy crowd unless dues come way down. Those are the younger guys that are going to be around in 20 years. How to attract those people to the AMA? I'm not sure, but at the present rates its not going to happen. Either the AMA makes a reduced tier for such aircraft or it will become a much smaller organization.

sebo

Yes, but what about those of us who enjoy all facets and may only fly the big ones a few weekends a year. I fly electric too..the back yard fliers. How am I going to be treated. Those guys that will be around in 20 years had better accept the rising cost of things. When I was a kid, gasoline was 13 cents a gallon. When I was 16 I drove an 8 cylinder auto. Now I'm driving a 6 cylinder. I haven't noticed a decrease in what I have to pay for gas for a smaller car. Costs go up.
People have to bite the bullet.
I've been paying (AMA) since the mid 1970's. I'm not complaining if costs go up. But I don't want to carry the burdon of paying for the newbee. That person may be in for only a year or two; what has AMA gained?
If I understand correctly, our homeowner insurance is the primary insurance in case of an accident. Maybe AMA should lower the amount they are insuring us for. Let the homeowner insurace cover it. If the person doesn't have homeowners insurance, let him carry the burdon of potentially being sued. That's what happens if he doesn't have car insurance.

jonkoppisch

My Feedback: (162)

I still don't think that a reduced tier will draw in the park fliers. 95% of the park fliers that i know are already ama members. Like me, they just want to be able to go and get a quick flight in without loading everything up and going to the field. Because i like to do that doesn't mean that I'm ready to sell my nitro and gas planes and dump the ama though!!!! Probably the biggest way to get members back into the ama is to quit making the crazy rules, ie rule #9 etc etc etc!!!

RChobby53

You'll not notice the tier problem unless you file a claim for your 30 lb model, and your in the sub-10 ounce tier. :-)

Depends on who you hang out with. The guys I hang out with are not AMA members and won't be at these costs.

sebo

That's ok. If I only flew back yard fliers or small fomies I wouldn't buy AMA insurance if it was as low as 10 dollars a year. My homeowners would cover me.
There has to be common sense somewhere.
AMA must be spending money somewhere that it is not needed...like the government. Maybe there is some fat that can be cut.

jonkoppisch

My Feedback: (162)

Must be that ski resort in Florida, no, no, I think it's the flying site way up north

Couldn't resist, lol

sebo

It sounds funny, but some companies pay the way for politicians to come to Florida's Disney World or go to an Alpine lodge to influence politicians so that company can get what they want passed in congress. I'm not saying that AMA does that sort of thing. We all know that there is fat somewhere (all I have to do is look in the mirror) that should be gotten rid of.
AMA does a lot of good things for us. We just aren't always aware of what they are trying to do to make our hobby better for us. I'm thankful that they exist and even with all my complaining, I'll continue to pay my dues so that I can fly at my club's field.
I feel that we do need the AMA to protect our hobby.

gow589

My Feedback: (1)

That's a myth. There are becoming a lot more foamies. It makes the core look smaller but there will always be a certain number of people who want to build and fly regular r/c's. The biggest threat from the foamies is doing stuff to damage the view of the hobby. They are a lot more likely to do something crazy that will stop the rest of us.

Jim Branaum

My Feedback: (3)

You are right, but that is a risk we MUST face and try to find an answer to. That also is a good reason to at least try to get some of this group into our organization because that means we will have expended a little effort educating them. That contributes to the possibility that the worst thing will not happen or that there will be a corrective counter action we can take. However, I am NOT holding my breath.

joey_d1119

Its clubs fault not the AMA'sWho cares who flies what. It's about heli's, jets, RTF, ARF's, Foamies, prototypes, the basic trainers, Young and Old. A lot of you guys are so emotional when it comes to different kinds of aircraft other then yours. The AMA only cost 58 dollars a year. You guys ***** about the cost keeping people away? Any kid that has the money to buy a parkflyer or any RTF has parents that gave that money to him to buy it. The people that are holding people back from joining are the old guys who hang at the field and ***** and complain about other pilots..the guys who act like they know it all but they don't. Its these guys that are running the clubs that are responsible for the decline in membership. Why would a 22 year old college student like me want to go to a club with a bunch of old men who only want a certain type of aircraft in their club? I don't. I want to hang out with guys that don't care who flys what. For some reason the leaders of RC flying clubs are old men who have a huge ego when it comes to the hobby. Don't blame the AMA. Go out and create a club that accepts anyone with any kind of aircraft. People don't say "oh, the AMA is 58 dollars a year...thats too much" they say "Man, whats up with these guys, I don't want to join the club....Im going to go fly on my own with a few buddies." Its the clubs responsibility to make sure people feel welcome and comfortable. If they do that people wouldnt have a problem joining the AMA. It's time people care more about the sport then their own personal narrow viewpoint on flying.

Hossfly

Whose fault will it be when ol' ART catches you double posting? Wanna' see my slashed wrists?

joey_d1119

Im new to this and I do apologize if I broke the rules. I was not aware double posting was not allowed. I will not do it again.
With much respect,
Joe

gow589

My Feedback: (1)

If you read back there were a lot of good sugestions such as AMA starting Park Flier groups. They could do this with lower rates PROVIDING they do not get full acces to full AMA fields people pay full price for. There were some other good ides too.

I was at the flying field this weekend. The flight line always had some one on a small electric. It is making it difficult to fly because they keep the thing over the runway the entire time.

Montague

fwiw, I fly a mix of airplanes as well, including some park fliers. When I fly them, I either fly when the bigger planes aren't up, or I get out beyond the runway, since floating around over the runway is disruptive, weither you are a slow-moving electric or an acrobatic plane or heli hovering.

Anyway, not all clubs are as described. Some are, some aren't.

If the club closest to you is like that, then you can actually fix it. Join, get your friends to join, hang out together and attract more guys like you. Works here. Heck, once there are a few of you, take over one or more positions running the club. It's usually easier than you think.

gow589

My Feedback: (1)

It's just a part of change. Each club will have to address it to an extent. The problem is when they work with the AMA, they dealing with it as if everone is flying the same thing. There are solutions such as a seperate flight line, such as one on the end for helecopters like we used to have. They told us the helecopters have to fly from the same line. Were not upset with the helecopters, we interfer with them as much as they interfer with us. It's just that the AMA needs to address it in a more modern way.