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Old 03-11-2005, 03:43 PM
  #1  
wreck_em_all
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Someone needs to explain to me why I belong to AMA. With the reelection of Dave Brown, the DVD fiasco, MA loosing almost $1M per year, the LiPo safty alert, "new and improved" EC, and other "in the interest of the membership" actions why I am paying almost $60 per year. That's the cost of a BL motor. What am I getting for it? Liability insurance isn't a good enough answer. From everything I see, AMA's actions indicate the organization's interest is for a select group, not the over all membership. I am very close to telling the AMA to take this card and .......
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Old 03-11-2005, 04:09 PM
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ORIGINAL: wreck_em_all

Someone needs to explain to me why I belong to AMA. With the reelection of Dave Brown, the DVD fiasco, MA loosing almost $1M per year, the LiPo safty alert, "new and improved" EC, and other "in the interest of the membership" actions why I am paying almost $60 per year. That's the cost of a BL motor. What am I getting for it? Liability insurance isn't a good enough answer. From everything I see, AMA's actions indicate the organization's interest is for a select group, not the over all membership. I am very close to telling the AMA to take this card and .......
Wow. Quite a laundry list . . .

Dave Brown - did you vote last Fall ? If you did, and you voted against Brown, two other folks voted for him. He'll stay in office likely until he retires, unless something untoward happens to get the vote out three years hence.

DVD _fiasco_ ? Hasn't cost AMA one cent for that program, and if you don't like the DVD send it back in the prepaid envelope - maybe someone will like it. Still - didn't cost AMA anything, but AMA gets a slice of the proceeds. 'nother way your dues are being held down.

LiPo safety alert - refer to Dave Brown above. Same problem.

"new and improved" EC ? It _is_ new and improved. Three new District Vice Presidents were elected last Fall. Major change in the makeup of the EC. for the better IMHO.

'dunno what "in the interest of the membership" means . . .

But, if you don't stick around you won't be able to help unseat Brown next time he comes up for election. The change in the makeup of the EC portends the end of rubber-stamped edicts from On High. Things are changing already, but we're not done yet.

I also dunno why you're in AMA, but I know why I am in AMA - 'cuz I like airplanes and can't afford a real one, so I make do with the next best thing. AMA is the only game in town, from the perspective of a National organization dedicated to the preservation and improvement of model aviating in the U.S. Be nice if "they" did a better job of it, but things are improving overall.
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Old 03-11-2005, 04:25 PM
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ORIGINAL: the-plumber
Wow. Quite a laundry list . . .

Dave Brown - did you vote last Fall ? If you did, and you voted against Brown, two other folks voted for him. He'll stay in office likely until he retires, unless something untoward happens to get the vote out three years hence.
Yes, I did vote and not for Dave.

DVD _fiasco_ ? Hasn't cost AMA one cent for that program, and if you don't like the DVD send it back in the prepaid envelope - maybe someone will like it. Still - didn't cost AMA anything, but AMA gets a slice of the proceeds. 'nother way your dues are being held down.
From what I saw on the DVD, it is not worth the plastic it's printed on. The claim is it didn't cost AMA anything. If you believe the membership isn't going to take a hit on that one, I have a bridge for sale.

LiPo safety alert - refer to Dave Brown above. Same problem.
My point exactly.

"new and improved" EC ? It _is_ new and improved. Three new District Vice Presidents were elected last Fall. Major change in the makeup of the EC. for the better IMHO.
How is this change for the better? AMA is still a good-old-boys club.

'dunno what "in the interest of the membership" means . . .
Yeah, what does "in the interest of the membership" mean?

But, if you don't stick around you won't be able to help unseat Brown next time he comes up for election. The change in the makeup of the EC portends the end of rubber-stamped edicts from On High. Things are changing already, but we're not done yet.
You said I was outnumbered 2 to 1. I will be taking a dirt nap before things get better.

I also dunno why you're in AMA, but I know why I am in AMA - 'cuz I like airplanes and can't afford a real one, so I make do with the next best thing. AMA is the only game in town, from the perspective of a National organization dedicated to the preservation and improvement of model aviating in the U.S. Be nice if "they" did a better job of it, but things are improving overall.
AMA is not the only game in town. Heard of park flying? The AMA's supposed to be dedicated to the improvement of model aviation. All I see is their dedication to the select few. Oh yeah, I forgot to mention the AMA credit card. That really helps.
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Old 03-11-2005, 07:33 PM
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There are people that can take care of all your CREDIT cards for you and you will be out of debt[&o]
Edit
I do not believe in all that AMA does but for gods sake don't get caught with out it!!!!!!!!!
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Old 03-11-2005, 07:45 PM
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PS
It is not the little guy you have to worry about its the high dollar looking for a buck[>:]
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Old 03-11-2005, 08:50 PM
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Default RE: Take this card and ......

Many people have found that if you want to fly rc planes in the USA
you must join the AMA because 98% of the clubs and sites are
insured by the AMA and are told not let non AMA members fly.
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Old 03-12-2005, 12:14 AM
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ORIGINAL: ira d

Many people have found that if you want to fly rc planes in the USA
you must join the AMA because 98% of the clubs and sites are
insured by the AMA and are told not let non AMA members fly.
Ira,

There are 4 LHS within reasonable driving distance from where I live. I visit them all frequently (a habit I developed at an early age). They all are selling Firebirds and Parkzone planes by the truck load. Do you honestly think all those people are joining the AMA so they can fly? I haven't flown at an AMA sanctioned field in years.
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Old 03-12-2005, 02:45 AM
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ira d
 
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Default RE: Take this card and ......

When it comes to parkflyers you are right, but when you get into
larger planes with gas and glo engines it is a different story.
the so called bootleg sites come and go it use to be one a few
min from my house but they built new homes there.

some of the guys that used that site it was the only place they flew
they had no AMA when it closed the guys i still have contact with
all had to join AMA to fly at the other sites in the area currently
i know of no site in the local area that you can fly without AMA.
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Old 03-12-2005, 07:38 AM
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We all know our homeowners is our primary coverage. Our club is on private property so we could really do as we wish. We needed the AMA site coverage for our landowner. All I can say about the AMA is NOBODY VOTED you can't change and progress if you wait for the "other guy to do it" This is 2005 not 1950 things are changing faster than most think. The AMA neds to change also. Get your thoughts together and let Dave and th EC know how you feel. Don't wait for the other guy.-Mike
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Old 03-14-2005, 09:21 AM
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ORIGINAL: wreck_em_all

What am I getting for it?
Herein lies part of the problem with the AMA. As an organization to promote model aviation you get what YOU put into it.
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Old 03-14-2005, 10:45 AM
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Default RE: Take this card and ......

AMA may be as politically messed up as any other larger organization but it seves a less obviouse roll. Most of us suport it for insurance and because it is the organization behind our clubs and flying sites.

It is largly the only major organization overseeing model aviation. It allows us to "self regulate" to some degree. It assumes a lot of responsibility the government would if it were not here. I suport it too help keep government off our backs. If AMA were to dissapear it wouldn't be long before the government would step in and start regulating us; and not in a good way. With my discussions with the FAA, our model airplanes are "Airplanes" and the only reason why they don't regulate is is because they don't "Need" to. If we create a need, the will.
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Old 03-22-2005, 12:25 AM
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So don't renew your membership, who cares. Next.
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Old 03-22-2005, 08:07 AM
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Default RE: Take this card and ......

Who are "the select few" anyways?
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Old 03-22-2005, 08:10 AM
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ORIGINAL: Matt Kirsch

Who are "the select few" anyways?
Does this answer your question?
ORIGINAL: BasinBum

So don't renew your membership, who cares. Next.
Thank you BasinBum for making my point.
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Old 03-22-2005, 08:22 AM
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Default RE: Take this card and ......

I'm flattered that I'm one of the "select few" even though I don't know what that means. I don't have to have AMA to fly at our public field but I do anyway. I don't have to belong to one of the local clubs to fly but I do anyway. I have some tangible reasons why I pony up the money for these organizations but more intangible reasons that I can't but a dollar value on. I don't agree with everything they do but I don't think I have a right to complain if I am not a member.

So you can complain all you want, it's your right in a democracy and while some will disagree AMA is a Democratic organization. Threaten to quit in a public forum and you just sound like a crybaby.
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Old 03-22-2005, 11:05 AM
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Default RE: Take this card and ......

If you really hate what they are doing, well, they have a telephone, call them. Tell Mr. Dave personally how you feel. Call your VP. Call the ED. Tell them where your going to stick you card and that you'll even rub some Vaseline on it.

Your a card-carrying, due-paying member boy, so it's your right to take it to them.

However, you also may get the ol pat on the head and a warm glass of milk while being tucked into bed routine. Then again, they still have means for you to complain.

Scott
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Old 03-22-2005, 11:37 AM
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Default RE: Take this card and ......

First, I sell the park flyers so I am all for them.. With that being said. I push AMA on everyone I sell to. I fly responsibly at local schools, parks, lakes and AMA club fields, but what about the guy that gets a new plane off the shelf, takes it down to the local park and tags some kid that was playing frisbee in the head. It may not kill the kid, but you can bet his hysteric mom will give him a trip to the hospital to check it out. Are you going to pay for the ER vistit ?? Are you renting a place and dont even have renters insurance ?? That one trip to the ER is going to run you 4-5 years worth of dues. In the real frigged up world we live in, people are sueing if you look at them crosseyed so are you willing to take the chance without insurance of some sort ?

As far as the good ole boys club, this has been beat to death. I am helping to pay for the field at HQ that I am sure I will never fly at...I could go on and on about things the AMA does that I dont think do me any good... But then there are a few things that do work for me. We recently lost our main flying field due to an over zealous local FAA jerk, but withthe HELP of the guys at AMA, we put his argument to bed and proved that we were in the right. This is going a long way towards getting our field back and I hope to be flying there soon. Without the help from AMA I would have never got this guys ruling overturned. This one instance has made it worth while to me to have been paying dues for the last 25 years.
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Old 03-22-2005, 11:42 AM
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Old 03-22-2005, 04:05 PM
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ORIGINAL: MathmanAHS

Takes one to know one. Since you have taken to a personal attack you must be unable to intellectually discuss the issue.
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Old 03-22-2005, 04:06 PM
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ORIGINAL: BasinBum

I'm flattered that I'm one of the "select few" even though I don't know what that means. I don't have to have AMA to fly at our public field but I do anyway. I don't have to belong to one of the local clubs to fly but I do anyway. I have some tangible reasons why I pony up the money for these organizations but more intangible reasons that I can't but a dollar value on. I don't agree with everything they do but I don't think I have a right to complain if I am not a member.

So you can complain all you want, it's your right in a democracy and while some will disagree AMA is a Democratic organization. Threaten to quit in a public forum and you just sound like a crybaby.
Since when is stating fact complaining? Dropping my AMA membership is the ultimate form of communicating my displeasure with the organization.
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Old 03-22-2005, 04:43 PM
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Wrecked em,
Dropping your membership and threatening to are two differant things. Dave Brown being reelected and the Lipo editorial are facts but the rest are just opinions.
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Old 03-22-2005, 06:19 PM
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OK great drop the AMA or stay. One question, have you let the powers to be know how you feel , do you have any ideas on how the AMA could better serve us? If we spent as much time emailing and calling Dave and the District V.P.'s as we do on *****en at one another maybe things would change. Ahh there lies the problem most people do not take the time to vote or try to change the system within the system. For the record I think the AMA is not the "godsend" of Model Avaition but its all we got right now. We need to make our AMA again. Thanks-MIke
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Old 03-22-2005, 07:51 PM
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ORIGINAL: rcmiket

OK great drop the AMA or stay. One question, have you let the powers to be know how you feel , do you have any ideas on how the AMA could better serve us? If we spent as much time emailing and calling Dave and the District V.P.'s as we do on *****en at one another maybe things would change. Ahh there lies the problem most people do not take the time to vote or try to change the system within the system. For the record I think the AMA is not the "godsend" of Model Avaition but its all we got right now. We need to make our AMA again. Thanks-MIke
I have written and voted (BTW - I got the "milk and pablam" treatment). Why is AMA "all we got right now?" The AMA could better serve us by serving us. I am not "*****en" and these discussions are a form of communicating with the membership.
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Old 03-22-2005, 08:49 PM
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Default RE: Take this card and ......

why does this same stuff always come up? You do not need AMA to fly! I do it at a local park for 20 years. Large scale gassers and zagis and everything in between. I have permission to be there! AMA clubs are snobby I went through three in my area and you always were told what to do and when to do it by people who were frustrated ex full scale lost my medical pilots.
You can kill someone at a AMA field with several aircraft in the air or go somewhere alone with only one plane in the air. I will take the second choice. I have not renewed AMA since homeowners is primary and they would find a reason not to pay. All they want is their fancy field at Muncie that we cant all use!
You have the idiots who try to fly a P_40 as their first plane and hurt someone but if you have 20 plus years experience it isnt a problem. Safety is common sense
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Old 03-22-2005, 09:13 PM
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Default RE: Take this card and ......

>>but what about the guy that gets a new plane off the shelf, takes it down to the local park and tags some kid that was playing frisbee in the head.<<

What if I'm out there with a Park Flyer and some kid tags me in the head with his frisbee? Or some kid's kite pokes my eye out? Or what if the Cleavers are out there with Scooby Do and ol' Scoob decides to take a chunk out of my arse?

As far as I know frisbee flyers don't have an organization that provides insurance, nor do I as a dog owner spend an extra $58 a year for liability coverage for my dog.

I've been involved in shooting sports my whole life. I've never bought any special liabilty insurance that might cover my negligence if I injured persons or property. I've belonged to several shooting clubs. The clubs carried insurance that was paid for out of the dues. I don't think it would provide coverage for me personally, but I would think that if a stray round left the range area and caused damage, the club's insurance would cover that. However, if I had an AD and someone was injured, that would be my responsibility.

I'm not anti-AMA, but the more I read and think about it, the statement "You gotta have AMA for the insurance." sounds less and less convincing. And if the situation dictates, I'll have no qualms about flying at an "outlaw site".

jon
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