gboulton

My Feedback: (15)

As a relative newbie to the RC Plane hobby, I'm trying to read the bulk of the forums, to get a general feel for what interests me, common themes that emerge regarding proper aircraft maintenance and preparation techniques, etc etc.

One of the "themes" that seems to pop up about twuce a month is the whole "park flyer" issue.

Now, honestly...I'm REALLY not trying to start another thread to air greivances and such all over again. I'm simply seeking honest, objective input, and wanting to give some of my own.

Now..why would I be so stupid as to do this? Simple...I own one of both, and plan to obtain more of each over time. Currently, I have a foamy that I fly at a local park or in the back yard, and a telemaster that I've flown (invited) in a private field owned by a non-local club flyer, and will be flying at a local club sponsored airfield.

I plan, very soon, to purchase another small electric park flyer, followed shortly by something in the 4* range.

As a pilot of both types of aircraft, I find definite benefits to each. The larger planes are certainly more "realistic" (they look and act like planes, not toys), more stable (in terms of wind impact, etc) and a real joy to fly. Of course, the foamy/park flyers are easier to take out and fly if I have an hour to kill, can be flown in more locations, and are less risky, financially (both in terms of airplane cost and potential damage)

Now...as an owner of both types, I genuinely want to act in a manner that promotes the hobby as a WHOLE, and furthers the chances that I'll be able to continue enjoying both aspects of it. So...

From each side of the fence...what are some behaviours/standards/actions you'd like to see from the other side that would allow you to respect their enjoyment of the hobby, and what are some things you'd like to see done on YOUR side to allow them to respect you.

My own comments are these:

As a park flyer, i'd like to see some of the "big plane" hobbyists consider things that would make it more enjoyable/practical for me to join them. For example...club air strips spend tens of thousands of dollars on their airfields...could they perhaps consider a small metal warehouse type building, to encourage folks with a foamy to come out and join them? Could clubs perhaps rent a building once a year (say, a gym) and hold a foamy only contest of some sort? Perhaps events targeted specifically at small slowflyers/parkflyers? The alure of park flyers is that they are CHEAPER AND EASIER than your big birds...and, in my case at least, make a GREAT "starting point" to learn some basic skills without risking thousands of dollars...perhaps if local clubs made us more welcome, or made us feel more like we were accepted as "real RC'ers", we'd be more inclined to hear some of your concerns. Bottom line...please don't judge all of us by the actions of some...I know that's hard, but I suspect that if you'll welcome those of us who genuinely care about the HOBBY, and more importantly, the joy and beauty of flight, we'll wind up policing "our own kind" for you.

On the flip side...

I've seen some of the videos, watched some of the kids in the local park, read some of the threads, etc etc. Bottom line...there are a significant number of park flyers who are downright disrespectful and/or dangerous. A while back, someone linked to another thread about "FLYING IS NOT A CRIME"...the author told how a police officer questioned his activities in a local park, and then mentioned that he even tapped the rudder of the plane on the officer's car. Ya know, at some point, as a "big plane flyer" i HAVE to think "Gee...if your idea of a good response to a police officer is to tap his vehicle with your model, I must question your judgement and attention to safety." Videos of kids flying planes in trafficed streets, close to large crowds, etc, don't help this image. Quite frankly, the excuse "it's not much money" simply doesn't wash. Respect for the safety and personal property of others is not a matter of capital value...it's a matter of simple human behaviour. If I cause you a small wound requiring 2 stiches with my park flyer, I am no less responsible for my actions than if I lop off your head with a Funtana. Certainly there are different DEGREES of damage there, but the RESPONSIBILITY remains the same. Bluntly, if you are unwilling to concern yourself with the safety and personal property of those standing NEAR you, I have no reason to think you will have thought to wonder about your possible impacts on my activities up to 3 miles away. Bottom line...if you want us "big plane rc'ers" to "get off your back", please stop to consider that while your plane may be less lethal and less costly, you still have an OBLIGATION to the hobby as a whole to act in a manner benefitting everyone involved.

=================

Mods/Admins...if I have stirred up a hornets nest that is best left alone, please mod me down as you see fit. I honestly don';t want a big fight...I truly just want to know (and share) what participants on both sides of the issue would like to see from the other side.

AGR413

My Feedback: (1)

gboulton,
I feel your pain, I have been involved in AMA/parkflyer/electric/IC discussion on two forums now, and think I am still confused. I started in parkflyers, moved into a little bit larger electrics and then added in IC now I fly all the above. There seem to be two main schools of thought in the GP of modelers the first is that there is no problem, who needs safety period or the AMA, I can fly my foamie or my .40 sized 6 pound electric where ever I want and I don't care if I get the hobby banned from a park city or county. (we can all see this is foolish, selfish and flat out anti-social behavior) The second seems to be that parkfliers and or electrics are toys and need their 'own' space to fly or 'special' treatment. To cap all of this off disguised under alot of fluff and froth many traditional IC modelers refuse to recognize electric flight as a legitimate equal to IC flight (This is also non-sense). This much I think I understand and can see the underlying human emotions/ego/reasoning for.

People are entitled to their opinions, this I understand but it makes me want to bang my head against the wall. The one thing that separates us from any other group of animals on this planet is our reasoning skills and the ability to override our emotions or urges and make cognitive forward thinking decisions. I.E. we can watch another human get burned on a hot stove and realize the 'stove is hot we should not touch that'. Too many of us allow ego, pride and or perceived Independence get in the way of this basic human ability and cannot resist the temptation to touch the stove thinking that 'well it burned him but, I am am smarter, faster, stronger and it won't burn me'.

So on the one hand 'traditional' modeling continues to perceive electric or parkflyers as a threat that needs to be stuffed into the background and it will eventually get put in its place or go away.

Electric guys continue to fly everything from little foamies to 6 lb electric planes in places they do not belong (I was guilty of this at one time) and the argument continues back and forth.

Well anyone with any intelligence can see the lacking thing here is regulation, IC flying in heavily populated areas has been regulated for years now, however, electric/parkflyers have slipped under the radar (for the most part) until now.

Neither side is willing to budge, electric/parkfliers want to be independent, they want to be legitimized and they want the 'traditionals' to stop calling the planes they fly toys because they burn electrons instead of fuel when in reality, they are all toys. The 'traditionals' don't want to be bothered with the hassle of putting up with electrics at there clubs and refuse to give them the password and the secret hand shake.

We all know that when the pendulum swings it always swings too far one direction or the other. MARK MY WORDS: the day is coming when the differences we would like to draw in our hobby will become a breaking point when a large electric flying somewhere it should not kills or maims someone we will all pay the price for our independence, inflexibility, and exclusionary behavior.

This is not a popular view but I guarantee you it is scarily close to what the eventuality of the current situation will be. (read as flame suit on)

There will be several folks jump on this thread and symptoms will be talked about the subject will be talked 'around' and in the end it will be left as an 'unfix able' problem.

Now, just to make record clear, I am not saying the sky is falling but there will be a price to be paid one day, like it or not if we all look at the problem objectively it is a truth that is self evident.

The question I want to ask is how long are we going to remember other humans getting their hand burned on the proverbial stoves, where many privileges have been lost because of the carelessness or inflexibility of a few. And stop arguing over whether there is a problem or not and work toward a mutually agreeable solution.

Anyway, rant off, as you can see I am very frustrated, the unfortunate thing is; there are many, many folks out there that see things for what they are but they aren't the type to argue about it on a public forum. I wish they would speak up and be heard.

gboulton

My Feedback: (15)

Excellent points, AGR, all.

I had a big fat response all typed up, but then realized it really wasn't what I wanted to say. So let me digest this for a bit...

Paternguy

My Feedback: (1)

I don't think the big problem, we IC guys have with park flyer's isn't the type of plane or the source of propulsion, its the fact that some of the park flyer's will set up and fly right down the street from our flying sites , with little or no regard to the damage that they may cause to someone else's aircraft or property, by not adhering to the frequency controls in place at the organized field. Bring your foamy to the field follow the frequency control and we will have no problems with what you fly or how you power it.

AGR413

My Feedback: (1)

Paternguy,
I agree, although there are those that discriminate based on source of power and size of model, as a fellow IC flyer, and AMA member I have the same concern that you do. The problem as I see it, is that there is nothing binding upon them to do so (the parkflyers) short of membership in a club and AMA, with the advantage of admission to AMA contests/functions/fellowship with other modelers and the insurance. The only clear solution I can see is to bring those people into the fold, and some barriers are going need to be knocked down to do so: 1) Some perceptions or mis-conceptions are going to need to be moderated on both sides of the fence so that common ground can be built. 2) There is going to need to be some outreach on behalf of the 'traditionalist' whether they think they need to presently or not in order to achieve the larger goal. 3) There has to be a real, tangible benefit for people to join a club and or AMA and they must be made to feel wanted, respected and appreciated for the purposes of recruitment and retention.

The established folks must realize that they need the parkflyers more than the parkflyers need them and adjust their course of action appropriately or, suffer under the restrictions when they come and they will. With homeland security, municipal and other establishments already taking a hard look at remote controlled hobbies we can't afford to turn a blind eye. This is what is so frustrating to me, I have been and still am on both sides of the fence I can see it both ways.

I guess my diatribe is more a plead for folks to try and see the larger picture and start projecting a picture of commonality and unity, and instead of drawing more lines work at erasing them. However, I realize I am probably wasting my breath because people will be people and people like their lines and distinctions right up to the point where they are required to pay something for them, either monetarily or loss of freedom.

gboulton

My Feedback: (15)

Well, here I spent the day composing my thoughts, and now suddenly my recent dealings with the AMA as a new member have gone and shuffled them all up again. *heh*

Patternguy,

You're absolutely right...ANYONE that goes and operates an RC vehicle (I don't care if it's a plane, boat, car, or remote controlled slug) without considering the safety and functionality of other devices nearby is, quite simply, a disrespectful idiot. Of course, as RC Flyers, we get a BIT more upset (and rightfully so) than most RC hobbyists, because poor freq discipline can 9and does) result in the loss of our model FAR more often than it would if we were operating cars or boats (or slugs). Of course, for this reason, the "renegae" hobbyist should be EXTRA careful about freq conflicts in this regard.

However....I think patternguy raises a good point. It's a point that became even MORE clear to me about 15 minutes ago (as evidenced in my other thread in this forum) Let's face it...there's NO TANGIBLE REASON to join the AMA and/or a local club. All either offer is, bluntly, a few 'events' that I could likely organize amongst my friends, and a whole bunch of rules, restrictions, and regulations. Honestly...what 16 year old is going to see that as an attractive offer?

The problem, of course, is that the AMA, local clubs, etc, are PRECISELY the organizations that CAN, if run well, encourage the sort of respect and admiration for the efforts, property, artistry, and safety of other hobbyists that would PREVENT the sort of behaviour you describe, patternguy.

In short, those groups absolutely HAVE to, imo, bring park flyers and their owners into their folds. But...simply put, they AREN'T going to do it in their current mindsets.

Already, in my very first dealings with the AMA, I'm frustrated with their lack of service and efficiency. In my visits to the airfield I'll be flying at, I've noticed absolutely NO concessions or consideration of those of us who enjoy park flyers or foamies. Ya know...to be honest, if it weren't for wanting to fly my telemaster, I would, at this point, tell the AMA and local clubs what they could do with themselves.

Now, certainly, I would maintain a healthy respect for the hobby, and behave in a safe and responsible manner. But that's not the point...the point is, the AMA would have lost not only an opportunity to educate and reward me, but likely I'll be telling folks there's no real reason to get involved with them.

That's dangerous...for the entire hobby.

Thus, like AGR, I'd like to see some barriers and preconceived notions fall by the wayside. Parkflyers SHOULD be the IDEAL stepping stone into this hobby that has so long been missing. Why haven't I been into this hobby before? Simple...no money, no space, no instructors. The advent of the inexpensive, small, slow park flyer has changed all that. IC and 'traditional' flyers and organizations should, imo, welcome that change, and use it as an opportunity to expend the ranks of their hobby.

Of course, there's a flip side to this as well.

EVERY hobby demands, imo, respect. The hobbyist absolutely must pay heed to the experience, wisdom, and teachings of experienced hobbyists, and absolute must respect the activity or item at its core. For example...I am, and have been for some time, a very serious aquarist. I have over 1,000 gallons of various aquariums and ponds, from a simple guppy tank for my daughter to a several thousand dollar full blown reef aquarium. You MUST, in that hobby, respect the animals you keep, and their natural habitat. The only other 'choice' is to, through disrespect, contribute to their (and, as a result, the hobby's) destruction.

RC Flying is no different. Ultimately, the hobbyist MUST respect other hobbyists, and planes and flight in general. To do otherwise threatens (in a far more direct and immediate fashion in some cases) the hobby and its followers.

Those of us who fly PF absolutely must understand this. If we want the 'traditional' organizations and hobbyists to welcome us into their folds, we MUST acknowledge that decades of experience have taught them certain things...among those things are the right and safe way to handle our aircraft and manage organized events.

Is it any wonder that traditional RC clubs look down on me and my foamy? I haven't put in the time, effort, or money they have. I don't have a fraction of their experience or knowledge. I haven't, in short, paid my dues. Yet I expect them to accept the fact that I can pretty much flaunt any and all common sense and safety, and just bloody well go fly where I want, without regard for their safety or airplanes. Chyeah, right. That'll go over well.

AGR, I WOULD take exception to one statement you made. You said "The established folks must realize that they need the parkflyers more than the parkflyers need them..."

I disagree. I think both sides desperately need each other.

Absolutely i think the 'traditional' RC'ers need parkflyers terribly. Those parkflyers are the future of your hobby, in large part. Let's face it...I would be "just a parkflyer" if it weren't for a kind gift of a Telemaster 40 from my uncle. If the traditionalist didn't welcome me and my parkflyer, then I sure as heck wouldn't see any reason to join their club, pay their dues, or, for that matter, drop $500+ on a "big plane" when I could have a fine time at the local park.

On the flip side however, parkflyers will, very soon I think, desperately need the support of the AMA and local clubs. As so many have pointed out, it won't be long before SOMEONE flying a seemingly 'harmless' park flyer causes significant harm to someone or their property. We all hear how some little 12 ounce foamy isn't going to hurt anyone...and we'll keep hearing it until a prop snaps and decides to blind some nearby kid. Eventually (it's already happening in many towns) park flyers will simply be BANNED from the local park. When that time comes, an established organization, such as the AMA or a local club with a good reputation, can step up and say "These models CAN be enjoyed safely and responsibly. Allow us to provide the education and organization, such that we can resolve these issues." Without such a response, that easy and inexpensive introduction to the hobby will die...and with it, down the road, the hobby itself imo.

A final thought...

Whose is the responsibility for informing the brand new hobbyist who JUST bought his park flyer from his LHS about some of the basic safety and responsible flight guidelines, as well as about the existance of various organizations who can educate him further? I mean, it's significant that I had NEVER HEARD OF THE AMA until I jumped on this forum. I'd flown my foamy for a couple of weeks at that point. (thankfully, as an old Army commo guy, I'm pretty in touch with frequency mangement, and thus had checked around)

How easy is it to immagine that Dad takes daughter to LHS, buys a $50 'everything you need to fly' set, and heads out to the park, completely ignoring every rule of safety and ettiquette, not through disrepect but through simple ignorance. Nobody told him about the AMA, of 72 MHz, or safety, or anything else.

Should the LHS owner be responsible for doing so?

Is it the hobbyist's responsibility to thoroughly research the hobby before he buys?

Is it the local club's responsibility to post signs at the hobby store?

Is it the AMA's responsibility to include warnings with every set?

All of the above?

Ah well...I'm done rambling. I don't know that I made any real significant points, but i feel better anyway.

AGR413

My Feedback: (1)

Its amazing I basically agree with you 100%, just view it a little different on some aspects. I think the respect you are talking about from PF's is going to need to be earned by the 'traditionalists' the reason why is they have no measuring stick with which to garner said respect, if they don't make it out to the club field and get a feel for that side of the hobby they have no way to make an individual judgement as to deserved respect or what it takes to have a club, put on an event, etc. etc. is this fair...no way but it is what it is and we can cry about it or do something about it. I still feel firmly that the responsibility is ulitimately going to end up with the 'traditionalists' to make the primary concessions and the reap the rewards on the back side of the deal.

I have witnessed many park flyers say that if they hobby is outlawed 'so what, I'll quit flying' or 'I'll just move to another park'. This is why I say the 'traditional' side of the hobby needs the park flyers more than the park flyers need it. And, look at the deal who has more to lose....pretty self evident.

Again, I say, is it fair....no way, but after a great deal of discussion here and on RC groups that's the way I see it, we can grip about it or people like you and me start banding together to do something to change it.

gboulton

My Feedback: (15)

Wow, ordinarily it takes people weeks to find out it's amazing when anyone agrees with me.


I wonder, AGR, if you're not more right than you realize. You said "...people like you and me start banding together to do something to change it." Perhaps at least part of the answer lies with, as you say, "people like you and me" who fly both types of aircraft, and thus might have an impact on one group or another. *shrug* I wonder, though, how many 'people like you and me' there are who A) fly both types of aircraft and B) have the expertise, experience, and reputation necessary to be listened to by their peers. Certainly if I were to walk up to a member of the local club, as the complete newbie, and say 'we ought to do this to accomodate park flyers" I'd be laughed off the flight line. Heck, I probably am simply for starting this thread.

Ah well...as I said above...not sure if I made any real points, but I feel better. *heh*

AGR413

My Feedback: (1)

Well whatever the case it has to start somewhere, u r a good egg in my book, good discussion.

gboulton

My Feedback: (15)

Thanks. Feeling's mutual. This has certainly been more thought provoking than a couple of the other similar threads I've browsed through.

JNorton

My Feedback: (2)

At my field you fly what your bring. We fly everything from foamies to 1/3 scale gassers. No problems.

My only concern with Park Flyers is being shot down. I really wish PF's would be sold with at least a sticker with the AMA's web address and a warning about shared frequencies. Better yet would be a pamplet detailing safety and frequency information.

Just my 2 cents,

John

RCJake-rcu

My Feedback: (7)

Well guys, I have been flying rc for almost three decades and now fly everything from small electrics to giant scale. I love them all. But, many of the electric flyers are uncomfortable flying at the large fields with glow & gas powered planes because most of the electrics are slower and if the glow/gas powered flyers are not using a spotter, they may have a mid-air. So, they go to local parks, schools, soccer fields, etc., until the park rangers or police ask them to leave. It seems that local glow/gas guys don't have a problem with the electrics at the club field, but are interested by them and many have gotten involved with electrics, themselves.

I know that sometimes there is friction between electric flyers and the glow/gas guys, but do not understand why some get so upset. We need to work together and work out the problems so we can all do what we all want to do...fly model airplanes and have fun!


***ANNOUNCEMENT***

A group of my friends and I have started a new all-electric rc club that is dedicated to educating both adults and children (through schools, scouts, adult education, etc) the proper way to build, maintain, repair and fly electric rc airplanes. We have an AMA charter and are incorporated. Currently, we are meeting with four communities in the area that are very interested in providing a site for us. They see the need for a flying site that has liability insurance for the landowner, safety rules and instruction available for the new rc'ers. We also have companies that have commited to donate money to us for the runway, pit area, shade, etc.

The name of the club is the Knight Flyers Electric RC Club and we will be having a general meeting for all interested parties within the next two weeks. The club field will be located on the western side of the Phoenix, AZ If anyone would like more information, you can contact us at: [email protected]


(Sorry for the plug, but there is great interest in our all-electric rc club and other electric flyers may also want to form a club of their own!)

gboulton

My Feedback: (15)

John,

Excellent idea, imo...precisely as a friend and I were saying earlier today...what will educate the random dad who decided to take his kid flying this weekend, and just grabs random $GO_FLY_TODAY_SET at the local hobby store?? While it's clear that SOME PF's simply don't CARE about proper ettiquette and behaviour, I suspect a majority of them simply don't KNOW.

Jake,

That's an awesome idea...a PERFECT opportunity to welcome new hobbyists in at a significantly reduced cost (in terms of equipment and aircraft), but educate them in the traditional guidelines of safe and responsible flying. Kudos to you, sir.

d_bodary

My Feedback: (85)

I wish i could offer some input on this. but you have all covered it way better than i ever could. this is without a doubt the best thread i have ever read on the ama forum. bravo bravo. just keep it up sounds like everyone on this thread has their head on straight.
Dennis

Matt Kirsch

My Feedback: (21)

Okay, what "concessions" could a club offer to a park flyer? We've talked about this in several meetings, and many a great mind has been puzzled by this issue.

I mean, the primary purpose of a club is to obtain and maintain a safe, appropriate place to fly. That's generally enough for glow fliers, and has been for DECADES. Why do the proverbial "park fliers" seem to need more than that, and what do they need?

TexasAirBoss

My Feedback: (22)

Well Matt,

As someone that flys both PF'ers and corn burners, I feel I can answer that question. The answer is "nothing". I need "nothing" additional from my clubs to fly my PF'ers . Absolutely "nothing". And may I add that you are a good egg for asking. If more people like you and I worked together on this issue, maybe people would realize that this isn't an issue at all.

tonystro

My Feedback: (1)

I have been flying glow powered r/c models since 1971, and elctric park/slower flyer for more than two years. in both stables I have RTFs, ARFs, kit builds and my designs. Soemtimes I fly my PFs in the five acre pasture-type field just across the road because it's quick and easy. Usually I take my glow- and electric-powered planes to the Club field, becasue I prefer to be 'hanging out with the guys.'

kingwoodbarney - I agree with you in that I need nothing 'additional' from my fellow club members. I belong to the Club because I enjoy sharing common interests with other people with similar interests. I don't fly 3D and I don't build competitive scale models, but I enjoy observing the skills of those who do! The only difficulties we've experienced at our Club is learning to compensate for the vast difference in closing speeds when glow and electrics are airborne at the same time. For the most part, common courtesy has prevailed and there have been very few conflicts. We even have some 'lectric flying 'hot shots' seeking the advice of one of our 3D and aerobatic experts (72 years young), who purchased a 3D foamy so he could, 'speak from experience.' One of local hobby shop owner's makes a point of informing everyone who buys planes that experienced information is freely available at the Club field, and we have many PF newbies coming out. Frequency control and safety are the first two things covered, and then 2-5 Club members will answer there questions, assist them with pre-flight, and a trim flight (at the newbies option). They are encouraged to attend a meetting and to join us. In other words, we try to treat them as beginning r/c modelers, and to assist them over the early bumps. Seems to work well for our club.... 50 members, 5 purely PF types.

<edited to correct grammar>

tonystro

My Feedback: (1)

gboulton,

I feel the need to praise your point regarding people, with similar interests banding together to resolve an issue, and to gain support for their common interests(model aviation??). After all, isn't that what led to AMA in the beginning???


<edited for spelling>

AGR413

My Feedback: (1)

The problem here is you have opinions from folks who are experienced flyers, of course they will feel "what concessions" we have everything anyone could want.

1) Members of clubs need to be sure they don't run newbie park flyers off with stupid comments and banter.

2) Make an effort to clear the field once or twice for a few minutes when electrics are flying, many IC pilots don't realize that you need to be able to hear the motor on electrics 'some' in order to gauge battery capacity and when you need to land. You can't hear that with IC planes buzzing you.

3) Encourage those that are willing in the club to beef up on electrics so that when you attract some there is actually a benefit for them because there is someone who can help them.

That's why its so frustrating everyone is in denial that there is a problem and at many clubs there probably isn't but at many there is the witnesses are everywhere.

Its not that hard, a little respect, a little space, and some help and encouragement to increase the draw that's all it would take.

JNorton

My Feedback: (2)

At my club everyone is subjected to stupid comments and banter.

This is the only comment I'll take issue with. Use a timer. If there are four planes in the sky and I make no differentiation as to their power sources, chances are everyone took off at a staggered time, most people won't want to land together just so someone else can hear their motor.

We have about 4 guys who are flying electric who can help, but even if the typical club member has no electric experience he can still help the neewbee with balance, control throws and trim issues.

I agree "Respect" is needed, anyone who shows up at my club and shows an interest in flying is accorded that respect. I also realize that all clubs are not alike, we are a small club with only 18 members out in the country.

I believe that some of the problem comes from the fact that some beginning park flyers treat their airplanes as toys. They expect immediate results - as in it's just a toy - it can't be that hard to fly, so when your try to explain to them about the training needed, the proper setup etc. they take their toy elsewhere and complain about how they were treated. The other side of the coin is the guy at the field who has lots 'o bucks in his plane and looks down on the guy who brings a $100 RTF to the field and can't be bothered because compared to his plane that ones just a toy. What is needed is the realization that everything that flys utilizes the same physics and to me it's still magic no matter what the size or propulsion source.

Just my 2 cents,
John

Jim Branaum

My Feedback: (3)

Respect? It is hard to get what one is unwilling to give. This seems to be a show stopper with some AMA elected officials. In my club the only question asked is "How does it fly?" followed by "What frequency are you on?" But we are addicted to the hobby and aviation so it is clear that we are pond scum in the eyes of the AMA “leadership”

Hossfly

Then why not do something progressive to change that leadership? Guess that wouldn't "FLY" or be on a good "channel" with you? Does continuous P&Ming with lots of *frequency* FLY well for you, JB?

Jim Branaum

My Feedback: (3)

Horrace,
Do you want some cheese with that whine?

cwrr5

My Feedback: (32)

"club air strips spend tens of thousands of dollars on their airfields" - ??!?!?! I wannna fly there!

Anyone got a set of plans for the gb r/c slug? Now THAT would be different!


Seriously, as a glo, electric, AND pf type myself, I think this topic is pretty good, and brings up many good points on both sides. Well worth the reading! Bravo!
Not really sure what happened in the last few posts though... Someone having a bad day? []

MikeMc

Funny that 2 posts above this one you were just talking about respect.

Different note: Sometimes in the past when flying my 1/2a with bigger planes I felt like an old lady trying to cross the freeway. Why would I want to do that?