Outlaw flyers
01-18-2008, 06:55 PM
#376
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RE: Outlaw flyers
I feel if someone started an all ELEC. Club that the AMA might lose 1/2, to 1/3 there membership. For the most part ELEC. is becoming the wave of the future. Surprised the EPA has not gotten into the AMA 0ver fuel spillage and crashes. Don't know if the fuel is biogradable or not but just surprised there are not conflicts about fuel. Then i suppose the same could be said for battery disposal. Just wish I knew HOW to go about starting a club such as the AMA and how to go about recruting members. But i am clueless. OFF
Outlaw Fyers Forever that could be a name lol.
Outlaw Fyers Forever that could be a name lol.
01-20-2008, 03:55 AM
#377
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RE: Outlaw flyers
Look back this thread, (post206?)
and you will see folks discuss their opinions on how to fairly have folks pop up next to a club & want to use some RC freqs. Some say the club should allocate a handfull to the newguys, some folks say the new guys are out of luck and get no sharing with existing clubs.
Just saw this in another thread, and figured it very much belonged here too,
seeing the relationship of PPP & Outlaw flyers that may occur when asking existing clubs for freqs.
Would what he propose be fair?
A few new guys show up at an 'established' field and want all the odd freqs?
Does it matter if they are ama-PPP or if they are the 37thStreet Renegades flying FFF in the park up the street from the established club.
Do all 3 groups end up with 17 freqs if it was your club that got new neighbors?
<note: the term 'established' is bandied about by the folks that dont want to share with newcomers... established AMA clubs shouldnt have to share with newcomer outlaws ( & PPP ?) >
and you will see folks discuss their opinions on how to fairly have folks pop up next to a club & want to use some RC freqs. Some say the club should allocate a handfull to the newguys, some folks say the new guys are out of luck and get no sharing with existing clubs.
Just saw this in another thread, and figured it very much belonged here too,
seeing the relationship of PPP & Outlaw flyers that may occur when asking existing clubs for freqs.
Why would they limit to 3 pins? There are 50 channels and you can do the math on how it could be split. Odds/Even, Top 3 middle 3 bottom 3. There would have to be 17 clubs in a 3 mile radius to give them 3 channels each. Sharing plans are not that difficuly to figure out, you have 11-60 ... so how many ways can you slice it and keep things fair, plenty.
A few new guys show up at an 'established' field and want all the odd freqs?
Does it matter if they are ama-PPP or if they are the 37thStreet Renegades flying FFF in the park up the street from the established club.
Do all 3 groups end up with 17 freqs if it was your club that got new neighbors?
<note: the term 'established' is bandied about by the folks that dont want to share with newcomers... established AMA clubs shouldnt have to share with newcomer outlaws ( & PPP ?) >
01-20-2008, 01:05 PM
#380
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RE: Outlaw flyers
PPP = Park Pilot Program from the AMA.
They pay $29 to fly <2lb quiet planes.... ie parkfliers/PF.
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ok, posting to this thread Take 2: this time I'll write using only this thread info.
In respect to this threads discussion on folks outside the AMA club, and the current chat in other threads on PPP, I very much see the PPP members of AMA getting the shaft by 'established' clubs foisted unto Outlaws in this thread's mid pages.
[link=http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_3712442/mpage_9/key_/tm.htm#]Page 9[/link], posts 203 & up
So you have dibs on all channels & I have to drive away from your use of free public freqs. Or can I call your club & let them know I will be on channel 23 from 9:30 to 10:45 next saturday so they wont interfere with my use of the freq. Somehow I feel the club will be less than obliging, but that is just unsupported conjecture as to their response
Simply put in PPP guy in there calling to share freqs in stead of some Outlaw, does that change it?
Or Abel's ponderings on clubs giving up freqs to locals:
>[link=http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_1486678/mpage_2/key_frequencies/tm.htm]http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_1486678/mpage_2/key_frequencies/tm.htm [/link]
>Post #49
I read Abel's link,
Y'all have to read that thread if you have a good amount of free time, kinda lengthly. Notice the comon use of 'taking our freq' attitude of the club guys in that thread. Also note the times the Parkies have derogative lables hurled by the clubbers.
Let me see if I got this right- Pack of Parkies & the AMA Club
AMA Club guy orders Parkies to stop flying
Parkies respond with an attempt to share 5/45 with Parkies getting the short end
AMA Club finds this attempt at usurping 5 of THEIR 50 freqs totally unreasonable
(usurp was the actual word used by pro-club guy) AMA Club claims Dibs and imunity to FCC: Have To Share because they claimed dibs first
Club solution is to have the Parkies pay them to join, else take court actions to forcibly not share
which evolved into:
Again, I see where the PPP members will now be the ones that will be asking clubs for freq sharing. Will the clubs that dont negotiate with Parkerists change their tune when it is fellow AMAers that come calling & writing request letters?
Folks in this thread said they wouldnt consider sharing freqs in a 45-5 split with Outlaws... recently I made a comment about 2 clubs sharing 47-3 and got a guy saying the established club getting 3 of its freqs usurped would be a 'worst case' scenario for the non-established club guys to get... so far as to sugest Odd-Even or 2 new groups getting 17 each. When I said 5 I get "Even 1 is too many", when I say 3 I'm told that is too low. How accepted is the idea of established clubs giving up freqs today, to PPP instead of outlaw... and why does that make a difference? Is it a matter of safety, or a matter of paying to use public freq
We've had pages 9-14 of this thread dealing with newcomers(outlaws,now I say &PPP) wanting to use some freqs next to a club using all freqs. Talking details about splitting freqs with newcomers (outlaw/ppp) shouldnt be in that PPP&ClubEffect, since we already covered so many of those bases here in pages 9-14.
--- If we tried to move this to the Parkflier Frequencies thread,
--- we'd have to quote in about 5 pages of discussion on the books here in this thread.[/i]
They pay $29 to fly <2lb quiet planes.... ie parkfliers/PF.
--------------------------------------------------------------------
ok, posting to this thread Take 2: this time I'll write using only this thread info.
In respect to this threads discussion on folks outside the AMA club, and the current chat in other threads on PPP, I very much see the PPP members of AMA getting the shaft by 'established' clubs foisted unto Outlaws in this thread's mid pages.
[link=http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_3712442/mpage_9/key_/tm.htm#]Page 9[/link], posts 203 & up
b.bixel :
easy to locate flying site, I do expect those who rather not belong to the AMA / Club to stay radio range away from our flying sites.
easy to locate flying site, I do expect those who rather not belong to the AMA / Club to stay radio range away from our flying sites.
Or Abel's ponderings on clubs giving up freqs to locals:
>[link=http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_1486678/mpage_2/key_frequencies/tm.htm]http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_1486678/mpage_2/key_frequencies/tm.htm [/link]
>Post #49
I read Abel's link,
Y'all have to read that thread if you have a good amount of free time, kinda lengthly. Notice the comon use of 'taking our freq' attitude of the club guys in that thread. Also note the times the Parkies have derogative lables hurled by the clubbers.
Let me see if I got this right- Pack of Parkies & the AMA Club
AMA Club guy orders Parkies to stop flying
Parkies respond with an attempt to share 5/45 with Parkies getting the short end
AMA Club finds this attempt at usurping 5 of THEIR 50 freqs totally unreasonable
(usurp was the actual word used by pro-club guy) AMA Club claims Dibs and imunity to FCC: Have To Share because they claimed dibs first
Club solution is to have the Parkies pay them to join, else take court actions to forcibly not share
which evolved into:
reading post 220 & 221 I see the common theme of
It is just plain rude, unsafe and disrespectful for someone, AMA or not, club member or not, to fly at a seperate site within radio range of a known existing airfield without attempting to work out an agreement
If you know their is a problem are you going to make a reasonable effort to be safe
which I dont get:
from reading post 206 & 208 it seem very clear that the Parkies DID attempt to work something out, and it was the pro-AMAClub guys posting how they dont have to share, and the pro-club posters were the ones wanting to flying unsafe rather than share
the Parkies letter stated the Club Member came to them with the initial demand---- the club knew of the other site and opted not to share. Making whom the rude ones? In response, the Parkies attemped a very oneside 5/45 split in the clubs favor (gee, how rude) .
It is just plain rude, unsafe and disrespectful for someone, AMA or not, club member or not, to fly at a seperate site within radio range of a known existing airfield without attempting to work out an agreement
If you know their is a problem are you going to make a reasonable effort to be safe
which I dont get:
from reading post 206 & 208 it seem very clear that the Parkies DID attempt to work something out, and it was the pro-AMAClub guys posting how they dont have to share, and the pro-club posters were the ones wanting to flying unsafe rather than share
the Parkies letter stated the Club Member came to them with the initial demand---- the club knew of the other site and opted not to share. Making whom the rude ones? In response, the Parkies attemped a very oneside 5/45 split in the clubs favor (gee, how rude) .
Folks in this thread said they wouldnt consider sharing freqs in a 45-5 split with Outlaws... recently I made a comment about 2 clubs sharing 47-3 and got a guy saying the established club getting 3 of its freqs usurped would be a 'worst case' scenario for the non-established club guys to get... so far as to sugest Odd-Even or 2 new groups getting 17 each. When I said 5 I get "Even 1 is too many", when I say 3 I'm told that is too low. How accepted is the idea of established clubs giving up freqs today, to PPP instead of outlaw... and why does that make a difference? Is it a matter of safety, or a matter of paying to use public freq
We've had pages 9-14 of this thread dealing with newcomers(outlaws,now I say &PPP) wanting to use some freqs next to a club using all freqs. Talking details about splitting freqs with newcomers (outlaw/ppp) shouldnt be in that PPP&ClubEffect, since we already covered so many of those bases here in pages 9-14.
--- If we tried to move this to the Parkflier Frequencies thread,
--- we'd have to quote in about 5 pages of discussion on the books here in this thread.[/i]
01-20-2008, 01:40 PM
#381
RE: Outlaw flyers
I see no reason for this 2 year old thread to be resurrected now. I'm seeing that some members are trying to get the same discussions going in several threads at the same time. I have no reason why they are trying to do it, but I can say that it's not going to happen. I've had to remove posts twice from this thread as some members tried to move the discussion from another thread here. Because of this I'm going to lock this thread to stop this from happening again.
Ken
Ken
