LETS JUST JABBER ABOUT WHATEVER AMA TOPIC IS ON OUR MIND
#51
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Anderson,
MO
Posts: 1,084
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: LETS JUST JABBER ABOUT WHATEVER AMA TOPIC IS ON OUR MIND
No organization, manufacturer or government will ever accomplish anything without trial and error. Same for AMA. If those who thinks the National flying site isn't worth the effort, or perhaps the e-ticket, tiered membership and other programs are a waste of time, I ask how do you KNOW for SURE unless someone tries.
As long as they don't trade real property for the stocks, I'm cool with it. I would have to be a fool to sell my $400k house and shop just to invest it in the market, but if you want to...go ahead. Don't try to say stocks will give a cash return year after year, the market is only good for long term. I have W-M stock which isn't worth squat right now but some of my other stock has tripled. I also know people who have lost everything in the market because of a quack financial advisor. IT IS A RISK! Don't put all your eggs in one basket, as you would like the AMA to do.
BTW, the AMA already invests some funds. Better drop that membership bhole!
#52
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Anderson,
MO
Posts: 1,084
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: LETS JUST JABBER ABOUT WHATEVER AMA TOPIC IS ON OUR MIND
Yes, bhole, you would have time. It's all-volunteer right now, you're just moving the location.
#53
My Feedback: (15)
RE: LETS JUST JABBER ABOUT WHATEVER AMA TOPIC IS ON OUR MIND
ORIGINAL: bhole74
Numbers speak for themselves, personally I think the reason for the decline is more old guys passing on without younger people taking their places.
Do you ever go to a flyin and pay a landing fee? Hmm....
The numbers won't increase until the AMA figures out what the parkflyer crowd and non-AMA members want. Last I checked, the loudest anti-AMA voices still don't know what they want so how is the AMA ever going to know? Trial and error, unless you have the answers already. If so, please inform Muncie, not RCU.
The AMA is declining. Any argument?
I don't care to finance their events, thank you.
The numbers won't increase until the AMA figures out what the parkflyer crowd and non-AMA members want. Last I checked, the loudest anti-AMA voices still don't know what they want so how is the AMA ever going to know? Trial and error, unless you have the answers already. If so, please inform Muncie, not RCU.
#54
RE: LETS JUST JABBER ABOUT WHATEVER AMA TOPIC IS ON OUR MIND
ORIGINAL: STLPilot
So what your saying is to sell off Muncie. OK, now lets put that into actual perspective, instead of just a pipe dream.
So they sell the field for a ridiculous amount. Say $1M. Minus capital gain leaves you with about $850k. That comes to a savings of about $5 per member for only 1 year. WOW!!!
Not to mention you just tossed out their largest chunk of actual equity, no more emergency bank loans if needed. Plus the fact now you have to relocate the AMA into a new home. This means you have to come up with a 6-12 month lease cash. And now since your going to lease instead of investing in actual property your just throwing money out the window.
So tell me again, how is selling off Muncie going to actually save the AMA? I could see if the AMA was located in the middle of Manhattan or waterfront property in Malibu, but your talking about Muncie Indiana.
Cost savings huh????
So what your saying is to sell off Muncie. OK, now lets put that into actual perspective, instead of just a pipe dream.
So they sell the field for a ridiculous amount. Say $1M. Minus capital gain leaves you with about $850k. That comes to a savings of about $5 per member for only 1 year. WOW!!!
Not to mention you just tossed out their largest chunk of actual equity, no more emergency bank loans if needed. Plus the fact now you have to relocate the AMA into a new home. This means you have to come up with a 6-12 month lease cash. And now since your going to lease instead of investing in actual property your just throwing money out the window.
So tell me again, how is selling off Muncie going to actually save the AMA? I could see if the AMA was located in the middle of Manhattan or waterfront property in Malibu, but your talking about Muncie Indiana.
Cost savings huh????
Bill, AMA 4720
#55
Senior Member
My Feedback: (21)
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Manhattan,
NY
Posts: 9,227
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: LETS JUST JABBER ABOUT WHATEVER AMA TOPIC IS ON OUR MIND
No, what Ulmer wants to do is sell off most of the AMA's equity and trade it in for a few dollars in savings for each of it's members for a single year. Even if it were 3 million dollars trade in, a ridiculous amount, that equates to $16 per member, for only 1 year AND all of your equity is now GONE!!! No more loans, no more backing, no more tax shelters.
I mean what an intelligent move that is!!! He's not even talking about trading the equity in for stock, because he wants to just wants absorb all that money into lower prices AMA memberships instead.
How do you convert AMA equity into ruduced savings for members AND stock at the same time? You can't have both Ulmer.
I mean what an intelligent move that is!!! He's not even talking about trading the equity in for stock, because he wants to just wants absorb all that money into lower prices AMA memberships instead.
How do you convert AMA equity into ruduced savings for members AND stock at the same time? You can't have both Ulmer.
#56
RE: LETS JUST JABBER ABOUT WHATEVER AMA TOPIC IS ON OUR MIND
ORIGINAL: ptulmer
Well, I must be arguing with a complete dolt
Well, I must be arguing with a complete dolt
Bill, AMA 4720
#57
Senior Member
My Feedback: (21)
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Manhattan,
NY
Posts: 9,227
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: LETS JUST JABBER ABOUT WHATEVER AMA TOPIC IS ON OUR MIND
Stick I'm really surprised in you. You'd be the last person I would think whom wanted to see the AMA sold off so that we can all save a few dollars for a single year.
Very surprised.
Very surprised.
#58
Senior Member
My Feedback: (5)
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Brunswick,
GA
Posts: 4,867
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: LETS JUST JABBER ABOUT WHATEVER AMA TOPIC IS ON OUR MIND
ORIGINAL: STLPilot
No, what Ulmer wants to do is sell off most of the AMA's equity and trade it in for a few dollars in savings for each of it's members for a single year.
No, what Ulmer wants to do is sell off most of the AMA's equity and trade it in for a few dollars in savings for each of it's members for a single year.
Just to reiterate, I'm looking to discuss real options that we can communicate to your leaders if necessary. If the AMA membership continues to shrink, I don't want to see it disappear. I'd much rather see it become an effective, efficient organization. (it could stand a little more of that, anyway) That's our job as members. To vote in good leaders, and change them when they're not doing what we want. Thankfully, you have to be a member to vote. (to bad, huh, STL?) And you should know what you're voting about.
Stickbuilder, you're right. I've got to remember what I'm dealing with. The evidence is clear! He ain't got a mind to change![&:]
#59
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Anderson,
MO
Posts: 1,084
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: LETS JUST JABBER ABOUT WHATEVER AMA TOPIC IS ON OUR MIND
ORIGINAL: mongo
i can't remember ever having to pay a landing fee for an event i did not attend, unless, of course, you count the membership percentage that i pay to support thr NFC so other clubs can have their events there.
ORIGINAL: bhole74
Numbers speak for themselves, personally I think the reason for the decline is more old guys passing on without younger people taking their places.
Do you ever go to a flyin and pay a landing fee? Hmm....
The numbers won't increase until the AMA figures out what the parkflyer crowd and non-AMA members want. Last I checked, the loudest anti-AMA voices still don't know what they want so how is the AMA ever going to know? Trial and error, unless you have the answers already. If so, please inform Muncie, not RCU.
The AMA is declining. Any argument?
I don't care to finance their events, thank you.
The numbers won't increase until the AMA figures out what the parkflyer crowd and non-AMA members want. Last I checked, the loudest anti-AMA voices still don't know what they want so how is the AMA ever going to know? Trial and error, unless you have the answers already. If so, please inform Muncie, not RCU.
You don't pay for the event's held there by other clubs, just the grounds/ facilities.
BTW, the event I plan to attend this year still requires a landing fee which I gladly paid in advance.
#60
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (51)
RE: LETS JUST JABBER ABOUT WHATEVER AMA TOPIC IS ON OUR MIND
ptulmer
stickbuilder is right, and you are only feeding the troll! If you say yellow, he will say blue! If you say up, he will say down. He is obviously trying to get some needed attention, and I am beginning to wonder if he even has any business working around children? We want good role models for our child, and some of the comments he has made have shown that a role model he is not! I would also not want him spewing his nonsense into my childrens head. He is obviously all talker and no listener! Children like to be listened to, and I can only invision there words falling on his deaf ears just like his ears work here in discussions amongst other adults!
stickbuilder is right, and you are only feeding the troll! If you say yellow, he will say blue! If you say up, he will say down. He is obviously trying to get some needed attention, and I am beginning to wonder if he even has any business working around children? We want good role models for our child, and some of the comments he has made have shown that a role model he is not! I would also not want him spewing his nonsense into my childrens head. He is obviously all talker and no listener! Children like to be listened to, and I can only invision there words falling on his deaf ears just like his ears work here in discussions amongst other adults!
#62
RE: LETS JUST JABBER ABOUT WHATEVER AMA TOPIC IS ON OUR MIND
ORIGINAL: STLPilot
Stick I'm really surprised in you. You'd be the last person I would think whom wanted to see the AMA sold off so that we can all save a few dollars for a single year.
Very surprised.
Stick I'm really surprised in you. You'd be the last person I would think whom wanted to see the AMA sold off so that we can all save a few dollars for a single year.
Very surprised.
Bill, AMA 4720
#63
RE: LETS JUST JABBER ABOUT WHATEVER AMA TOPIC IS ON OUR MIND
Dion,
Go back and read my post (#27) You replied to me in post 28. You attributed some things to me that I didn't say. I think you need to get your doo-doo in one sock. You ain't got it together, man. This is not the first time that you have done that. Go meet your pal E.T. and have a stiff drink. ptulmer and the rest are not going anywhere. We'll still be here when you get back. [8D]
Bill, AMA 4720
Go back and read my post (#27) You replied to me in post 28. You attributed some things to me that I didn't say. I think you need to get your doo-doo in one sock. You ain't got it together, man. This is not the first time that you have done that. Go meet your pal E.T. and have a stiff drink. ptulmer and the rest are not going anywhere. We'll still be here when you get back. [8D]
Bill, AMA 4720
#64
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Anderson,
MO
Posts: 1,084
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: LETS JUST JABBER ABOUT WHATEVER AMA TOPIC IS ON OUR MIND
Mongo, why do you say it was a cesspool? Looks like a pretty nice site to me, but...........just curious.
#66
Banned
My Feedback: (119)
RE: LETS JUST JABBER ABOUT WHATEVER AMA TOPIC IS ON OUR MIND
ORIGINAL: Stickbuilder
Dion,
Go back and read my post (#27) You replied to me in post 28. You attributed some things to me that I didn't say. I think you need to get your doo-doo in one sock. You ain't got it together, man. This is not the first time that you have done that. Go meet your pal E.T. and have a stiff drink. ptulmer and the rest are not going anywhere. We'll still be here when you get back. [8D]
Bill, AMA 4720
Dion,
Go back and read my post (#27) You replied to me in post 28. You attributed some things to me that I didn't say. I think you need to get your doo-doo in one sock. You ain't got it together, man. This is not the first time that you have done that. Go meet your pal E.T. and have a stiff drink. ptulmer and the rest are not going anywhere. We'll still be here when you get back. [8D]
Bill, AMA 4720
I'll have a nice strawberry milkshake with Dave Brown down at the Malt Shop instead, and we can talk about the new fountains we plan to put in on the front lawn at Muncie! It's gonna be GREAT! Colored lights and everything, a giant bronze cherub in the center, spitting water from his mouth. Tasteful, yet it shouts "mooolah! We are an organization to be RESPECTED!"
#67
Senior Member
My Feedback: (5)
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Brunswick,
GA
Posts: 4,867
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: LETS JUST JABBER ABOUT WHATEVER AMA TOPIC IS ON OUR MIND
[sm=lol.gif] Easytiger, every once in awhile, you make it hard to dislike you. That's the funniest thing I've read lately.
#68
RE: LETS JUST JABBER ABOUT WHATEVER AMA TOPIC IS ON OUR MIND
ORIGINAL: EASYTIGER
Yeah, I want to hear this guy slurring "eee-ticked...ya gottahava eeeeeticket" after five drinks...thanks, I'll pass!
I'll have a nice strawberry milkshake with Dave Brown down at the Malt Shop instead, and we can talk about the new fountains we plan to put in on the front lawn at Muncie! It's gonna be GREAT! Colored lights and everything, a giant bronze cherub in the center, spitting water from his mouth. Tasteful, yet it shouts "mooolah! We are an organization to be RESPECTED!"
Yeah, I want to hear this guy slurring "eee-ticked...ya gottahava eeeeeticket" after five drinks...thanks, I'll pass!
I'll have a nice strawberry milkshake with Dave Brown down at the Malt Shop instead, and we can talk about the new fountains we plan to put in on the front lawn at Muncie! It's gonna be GREAT! Colored lights and everything, a giant bronze cherub in the center, spitting water from his mouth. Tasteful, yet it shouts "mooolah! We are an organization to be RESPECTED!"
Bill, AMA 4720
#69
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: San Antonio,
TX
Posts: 6,681
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: LETS JUST JABBER ABOUT WHATEVER AMA TOPIC IS ON OUR MIND
Does this mean we arent gonna get the big year-round flying campus outside of San Diego?
If we are just making up quotes for PTulmer, can I cite him as saying Bad is Good? Or any other insane gibberish to atribute to him even if it is contrary to what he actually said? PT made it very clear he wanted a returning investment, yet the Fact Impaired had to spin lies...
Seems a healthy lot of us are standoffish to having Muncie cashhole
If we are just making up quotes for PTulmer, can I cite him as saying Bad is Good? Or any other insane gibberish to atribute to him even if it is contrary to what he actually said? PT made it very clear he wanted a returning investment, yet the Fact Impaired had to spin lies...
Seems a healthy lot of us are standoffish to having Muncie cashhole
#70
Senior Member
My Feedback: (21)
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Manhattan,
NY
Posts: 9,227
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: LETS JUST JABBER ABOUT WHATEVER AMA TOPIC IS ON OUR MIND
Stop misquoting me in order to make your argument. IF you have an argument make it. You don't have one, so you lie.
Selling off all that property would eliminate some ongoing costs and open up funds for investments that return cash.
I said investments that have cash returns. Lowers the yearly dues, not just once. Now, you've also fired the mowers, saving another hefty sum, you're not paying property taxes, etc, either. More savings. How many employees could now be laid off because their responsibilities have been eliminated.
I said investments that have cash returns. Lowers the yearly dues, not just once. Now, you've also fired the mowers, saving another hefty sum, you're not paying property taxes, etc, either. More savings. How many employees could now be laid off because their responsibilities have been eliminated.
Not even mentioning the fact that just "laying off" employees will only increase costs as well. Are you going to pay others overtime to support the workers? Outsource? Whose going to support "the AMA's mission", you know those parts that don't have anything to do with you.
Stocks are not even close as strong in equity as is property. Don't forget you have to pay a good amount of money in taxes from profits on investments, you cannot just take that profit and put it back into the AMA as cash to reduce the savings to the members. If you do you'll lose 30%+ of that money in taxes alone. So if you are going to have interest bearing investements and use that money as "fuel" for the AMA tell us how you do that without getting hammered in taxes?? You cannot, the only thing you can do is keep investing, just like owning property which has just as good rate of growth and a lot more protection, ESPECIALLY when you need to call the bank, or call on investors.
Best thing about property is that the capital gain and taxes is FIXED at only 15% if/when you have to cash out. In many cases there is $0 capital gain!! Cash out on your stocks and just see how much money you lose, it won't be anywhere close to 0-15%. Don't you know that property is also and "interest bearing" investment, especially right now. Just because you had stocks that doubled in two years, doesn't mean that the AMA wouldn't buy in on some stocks that double in loss in 2 years.
There is your arguement.
Listen guys, I'm not here to make best friends, I do that in my personal life, off the Internet. Sometimes on the RC flying field, the free flight fields and moreso on the full scale flying field. I'm here on THIS SPECIFIC FORUM to SUPPORT the AMA, not to help break it up in pieces. Also to support the GREAT ideas of the AMA. For the last time, I didn't come up with the e-ticket idea. I just support the AMA's vision because it makes a lot of sense. You guys make it look like it was my proposal or something. Also go back and look how many threads were started about the e-ticket on the last 3 or so pages or the AMA forums, like 15+ of them. How many did I start, 0 ???
Roo, your comments are ridiculous. You don't know what kind of person I am, not by a longshot.
#71
Senior Member
My Feedback: (1)
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Austin,
TX
Posts: 346
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: LETS JUST JABBER ABOUT WHATEVER AMA TOPIC IS ON OUR MIND
Oh great now dion is a friggin tax expert and financial advisor. as usual with this forum garbage in and garbage out
All hail dion he is the only one that knows anything
All hail dion he is the only one that knows anything
#72
Banned
My Feedback: (119)
RE: LETS JUST JABBER ABOUT WHATEVER AMA TOPIC IS ON OUR MIND
ORIGINAL: LeeL
Oh great now dion is a friggin tax expert and financial advisor. as usual with this forum garbage in and garbage out
All hail dion he is the only one that knows anything
Oh great now dion is a friggin tax expert and financial advisor. as usual with this forum garbage in and garbage out
All hail dion he is the only one that knows anything
You don't keep everything in stocks and RENT a house to live in, it's really, really stupid.
Dion may be wrong about some things, but not about all.
#73
Senior Member
My Feedback: (5)
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: An Iceburg in, ANTARCTICA
Posts: 6,747
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: LETS JUST JABBER ABOUT WHATEVER AMA TOPIC IS ON OUR MIND
The simple solution is for the AMA to establish multiple "National Flying Sites." They could start with one in each district, eventually expand to two. Later, there could be one in each state and so on and son on and so on.
Let's jabber about who should take Dave Brown's place in the next "election."
Let's jabber about who should take Dave Brown's place in the next "election."
#74
Senior Member
My Feedback: (5)
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Brunswick,
GA
Posts: 4,867
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: LETS JUST JABBER ABOUT WHATEVER AMA TOPIC IS ON OUR MIND
Well, a change of subject is welcome, just one last parting question. Since anybody that invests knows that Dion and ET are just plain wrong, my question to you Dion is this. How does getting rid of unproductive employees raise costs? They weren't doing anything in the first place! I'm not accusing anybody in particular. But there needs to be oversight to make sure everybody has work or no job. Any large business tends to get fat, that's why large corporations can lay off twenty thousand people at a clip and stay in business. Your math would put them out of business.[sm=bananahead.gif]
P-51B, who do you want?
P-51B, who do you want?
#75
Senior Member
My Feedback: (21)
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Manhattan,
NY
Posts: 9,227
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: LETS JUST JABBER ABOUT WHATEVER AMA TOPIC IS ON OUR MIND
Since anybody that invests knows that Dion and ET are just plain wrong, my question to you Dion is this.
How does getting rid of unproductive employees raise costs? They weren't doing anything in the first place! I'm not accusing anybody in particular. But there needs to be oversight to make sure everybody has work or no job. Any large business tends to get fat, that's why large corporations can lay off twenty thousand people at a clip and stay in business. Your math would put them out of business.
So until the AMA starts slashing it's services, one by one, getting rid of employees will INCREASE costs by having to either pay overtime or outsourcing to fill the voids of the lost employee support. Not to mention the fact that the AMA will goto crap if it cannot handle the demand of it's service to the members.
But most importantly who are you to say that the AMA is not doing their job? Where did you come up with this information?