the "other" AMA
07-12-2006, 09:57 AM
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the "other" AMA
I was watching a quick little news segment about the model jet airshow in Gross Ille, MI before work and the Spokesman for the model show was asked a question about whether a person needs a license to fly one of these models. He answered yes - You get this by joining the AMA which stands for American Model Association. I told my wife this guy is as full as s--- as a Christmas Turkey. Was I too quick to pass judgement, I googled AMA and came up with several references to American Model Association -
07-12-2006, 10:15 AM
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RE: the "other" AMA
I'm sure he just didn't remember what the AMA's acronym stood for, that's all.
Sort of like one of them bloopers of someone singing our national anthem.
Sort of like one of them bloopers of someone singing our national anthem.
07-12-2006, 10:18 AM
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RE: the "other" AMA
Wow...once in the past, I made that acronym error in a post once as well. Got what I deserved for it, too. 
I guess it just flows better. As far as I know, many RC clubs will use those words with their name, but there is no "other" AMA of that title. The pilot simply fired from the hip and missed. I imagine he'll be pretty unsettled when somebody points out his error.
I guess it just flows better. As far as I know, many RC clubs will use those words with their name, but there is no "other" AMA of that title. The pilot simply fired from the hip and missed. I imagine he'll be pretty unsettled when somebody points out his error.
07-12-2006, 10:32 AM
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RE: the "other" AMA
I once heard a newsman describing an airliner. He explained, in detail, about the ailerons, wings, horiz. stab., and elevators; then referred to the V. stab. and rudder as "That big tall thing in the back."
Find the website for the channel, news show, and that segment (if there is one) and inform them of the error. You might also inform them that you DO NOT need a "license" to fly an R/C aircraft. You WILL need an AMA membership if you fly at most organized clubs. And when you open THAT can of worms, remind them that the Academy of Model Aeronautics does NOT license fields (or anything else), it sanctions clubs.
American Model Association is a misnomer I've heard a lot.
Dr.1
Find the website for the channel, news show, and that segment (if there is one) and inform them of the error. You might also inform them that you DO NOT need a "license" to fly an R/C aircraft. You WILL need an AMA membership if you fly at most organized clubs. And when you open THAT can of worms, remind them that the Academy of Model Aeronautics does NOT license fields (or anything else), it sanctions clubs.
American Model Association is a misnomer I've heard a lot.
Dr.1
07-12-2006, 04:07 PM
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RE: the "other" AMA
A nice man pointed out a couple of misnomers in my post as well...let me try to correct them:
You're absolutely right. I knew "sanctions clubs" wasn't right, but I couldn't think of the right word. The AMA charters clubs.
As far as "license" goes, you must have an AMA membership to participate in an AMA sanctioned contest. I guess to that point, they DO "license." The AMA DOES use the word "license" in their documents.
It seems the AMA's own wording is nebulous at best, and possibly doesn't clarify the situation.
Did I get it right this time?
Dr.1
You're absolutely right. I knew "sanctions clubs" wasn't right, but I couldn't think of the right word. The AMA charters clubs.
As far as "license" goes, you must have an AMA membership to participate in an AMA sanctioned contest. I guess to that point, they DO "license." The AMA DOES use the word "license" in their documents.
It seems the AMA's own wording is nebulous at best, and possibly doesn't clarify the situation.
Did I get it right this time?
Dr.1
07-12-2006, 05:01 PM
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RE: the "other" AMA
ORIGINAL: Dr1Driver
Did I get it right this time?
Dr.1
Did I get it right this time?
Dr.1
Anyway, this thread illuminates one of the worst problems of the AMA and the subsequent damage to the hobby as a whole. Simply put, it seems that many potential hobbyists shy away from the hobby as a whole because they believe they will be forced to apply themselves to another overbearing bureaucratic governing authority. It is a shame that all too often AMAers perpetuate such erroneous perceptions with a statement like that ding-dong made when he was being interviewed.
One thing the AMA could do is to remove references connotative to license and install “membership card†or some such wording instead. Hmmm… the little guy… big truck analogy is appropriate in this case.
Me gotta license to fly dangerous, complicated, radio control aeroplane. Ar Arg ar…
07-24-2006, 07:15 AM
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RE: the "other" AMA
In the first post here, Brzys saya they were covering a Model JET Airshow. If that was true and it was a turbine Model Jet Airshow, yes he was right when he said you do need a License. It is called a "Turbine Waiver". ManytimesI have heard other people and myself,calling the Turbine Waiver a license.
Mark
Mark
07-24-2006, 07:23 AM
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RE: the "other" AMA
If that was true and it was a turbine Model Jet Airshow, yes he was right when he said you do need a License.
Plus you need a jet certification for flying turbines
That's for AMA members and AMA sanctioned events. Do you mean to tell me the AMA can tell a non-member what they can and can't fly? I don't think so...Homey don't play that.
Dr.1
Plus you need a jet certification for flying turbines
That's for AMA members and AMA sanctioned events. Do you mean to tell me the AMA can tell a non-member what they can and can't fly? I don't think so...Homey don't play that.
Dr.1
07-24-2006, 08:47 AM
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RE: the "other" AMA
The AMA has never called me or sent me some stuff in the mail telling me what I could & couln't fly when I was a renegade/Streetflyer.
It was the memebers of the AMA that were constantly telling me what I could not do, even though I wasn't a member. The membership are the ones spouting clubrules as Law, as seen recently in the threads about 50lb / 400' & the Fed Laws.... to the point of bringing in international treaties suposedly backing the clubrules.
It was the memebers of the AMA that were constantly telling me what I could not do, even though I wasn't a member. The membership are the ones spouting clubrules as Law, as seen recently in the threads about 50lb / 400' & the Fed Laws.... to the point of bringing in international treaties suposedly backing the clubrules.
07-24-2006, 01:56 PM
#12
RE: the "other" AMA
I just recently visited an AMA flying field. I inquired about getting into the hobby, and one of the modelers there told me that I would need a license. Apparently, the AMA now refers to their membership card as a license. Also, I was told that a potential "pilot" has to go through a certification process to fly a model, even if it's a foamer, on their field. So, they would need a license and a certificate both, just to fly on their field.
They made it very clear to me that if I can't afford the membership and a .40 sized (at least) model, then I shouldn't even be involved with the hobby. The members at the field didn't seem very talkative, and one of their instructors lacked humor of any type. They demonstrated an air of seriousness, in that they were always placing an emphasis on safety, and what a model could do to someone should it get out of control. Whether they investigate crashes or not, I'm not sure but they seem like they would be all over an accident like the National Transportation Safety Board. One member told me that the group is selective on who they want to teach flying to. He said that if the group perceives any psychiatric condition, they would not allow that person to fly, even with an instructor. It just looks to me like they view their models as if they were full-scale aircraft.
NorfolkSouthern
They made it very clear to me that if I can't afford the membership and a .40 sized (at least) model, then I shouldn't even be involved with the hobby. The members at the field didn't seem very talkative, and one of their instructors lacked humor of any type. They demonstrated an air of seriousness, in that they were always placing an emphasis on safety, and what a model could do to someone should it get out of control. Whether they investigate crashes or not, I'm not sure but they seem like they would be all over an accident like the National Transportation Safety Board. One member told me that the group is selective on who they want to teach flying to. He said that if the group perceives any psychiatric condition, they would not allow that person to fly, even with an instructor. It just looks to me like they view their models as if they were full-scale aircraft.
NorfolkSouthern
07-24-2006, 02:15 PM
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RE: the "other" AMA
Also, I was told that a potential "pilot" has to go through a certification process to fly a model, even if it's a foamer, on their field.
The "certification process" is a local club rule, not AMA.
They made it very clear to me that if I can't afford the membership and a .40 sized (at least) model, then I shouldn't even be involved with the hobby.
Sounds more like a country club than a model club.
The members at the field didn't seem very talkative, and one of their instructors lacked humor of any type.
Like I once told a local club member who was a little too "formal", "You might be a nice guy if you'd pull that ramrod outta your butt!"
They demonstrated an air of seriousness, He said that if the group perceives any psychiatric condition, they would not allow that person to fly,
Sounds a little self-exclusive to me.
Someone needs to tell them, "Don't take yourself too seriously. No one else does."
Find another club or a friendly farmer with flat land.
Dr.1
The "certification process" is a local club rule, not AMA.
They made it very clear to me that if I can't afford the membership and a .40 sized (at least) model, then I shouldn't even be involved with the hobby.
Sounds more like a country club than a model club.
The members at the field didn't seem very talkative, and one of their instructors lacked humor of any type.
Like I once told a local club member who was a little too "formal", "You might be a nice guy if you'd pull that ramrod outta your butt!"
They demonstrated an air of seriousness, He said that if the group perceives any psychiatric condition, they would not allow that person to fly,
Sounds a little self-exclusive to me.
Someone needs to tell them, "Don't take yourself too seriously. No one else does."
Find another club or a friendly farmer with flat land.
Dr.1
07-24-2006, 05:39 PM
#14
RE: the "other" AMA
ORIGINAL: NorfolkSouthern
I just recently visited an AMA flying field. I inquired about getting into the hobby, and one of the modelers there told me that I would need a license. Apparently, the AMA now refers to their membership card as a license. Also, I was told that a potential "pilot" has to go through a certification process to fly a model, even if it's a foamer, on their field. So, they would need a license and a certificate both, just to fly on their field.
I just recently visited an AMA flying field. I inquired about getting into the hobby, and one of the modelers there told me that I would need a license. Apparently, the AMA now refers to their membership card as a license. Also, I was told that a potential "pilot" has to go through a certification process to fly a model, even if it's a foamer, on their field. So, they would need a license and a certificate both, just to fly on their field.
Edited to add: RCU doesn't even accept the word.Using the term license is within the AMA Bylaws "Article II, (m) To license model aircraft and fliers thereof for competition."
If you belong to an AMA Chartered Club, that club -- also a Bylaws requirement -- must require 100% of the flying members to be AMA members. Take it or leave it -- free country and YOUR free choice.
They made it very clear to me that if I can't afford the membership and a .40 sized (at least) model, then I shouldn't even be involved with the hobby. The members at the field didn't seem very talkative, and one of their instructors lacked humor of any type. They demonstrated an air of seriousness, in that they were always placing an emphasis on safety, and what a model could do to someone should it get out of control. Whether they investigate crashes or not, I'm not sure but they seem like they would be all over an accident like the National Transportation Safety Board.
I expect my students to be well aware of the safety part of the business. If they can't hack that, then let 'em go elsewhere.
In addition, we have too many experienced fliers join our club and many are well endowed with OLD BAD HABITS which are very difficult to correct. If you learn good habits at first, then you will be well ahead of the game and be a pilot that GOOD pilots will respect.
One member told me that the group is selective on who they want to teach flying to. He said that if the group perceives any psychiatric condition, they would not allow that person to fly, even with an instructor. It just looks to me like they view their models as if they were full-scale aircraft.
NorfolkSouthern
NorfolkSouthern
When I went through USAF Pilot Training, 28 started, but only 14 received those silver wings some 13 months later. How does a company select those to hire when they have a 100 to 1 applications, for which probably only a dozen or so will even get an interview?
If you do join that club, then think just how proud YOU will be because YOU made the grade. [X(]
07-24-2006, 06:06 PM
#15
RE: the "other" AMA
ORIGINAL: Hossfly
Up until about 2004, the AMA membership card had "license" printed on it. The 2006 does not. Another one of those subtle little changes that no AMA management ever mentions. For those that have been in AMA for a significant time, the use of AMA license is a common term. Like the word "_AY" DOESN'T MEAN BEING JUST HAPPY AND GO-LUCKY as it once did. Edited to add: RCU doesn't even accept the word.
Using the term license is within the AMA Bylaws "Article II, (m) To license model aircraft and fliers thereof for competition."
If you belong to an AMA Chartered Club, that club -- also a Bylaws requirement -- must require 100% of the flying members to be AMA members. Take it or leave it -- free country and YOUR free choice.
They made it very clear to me that if I can't afford the membership and a .40 sized (at least) model, then I shouldn't even be involved with the hobby. The members at the field didn't seem very talkative, and one of their instructors lacked humor of any type. They demonstrated an air of seriousness, in that they were always placing an emphasis on safety, and what a model could do to someone should it get out of control. Whether they investigate crashes or not, I'm not sure but they seem like they would be all over an accident like the National Transportation Safety Board.
Sounds like an excellent club managed as the business it is. Go to the airport and tell the FBO you want to be a pilot. Would you expect to have him say, "There is an airplane sitting on the ramp. Go 'fer it!"
I expect my students to be well aware of the safety part of the business. If they can't hack that, then let 'em go elsewhere.
In addition, we have too many experienced fliers join our club and many are well endowed with OLD BAD HABITS which are very difficult to correct. If you learn good habits at first, then you will be well ahead of the game and be a pilot that GOOD pilots will respect.
And that, young fellow, is one da_n good view. Why should the Club subject themselves to the liability of allowing people that the club feels unqualified or unwilling to follow simple safety standards as established by the club?
When I went through USAF Pilot Training, 28 started, but only 14 received those silver wings some 13 months later. How does a company select those to hire when they have a 100 to 1 applications, for which probably only a dozen or so will even get an interview?
If you do join that club, then think just how proud YOU will be because YOU made the grade. [X(]
ORIGINAL: NorfolkSouthern
I just recently visited an AMA flying field. I inquired about getting into the hobby, and one of the modelers there told me that I would need a license. Apparently, the AMA now refers to their membership card as a license. Also, I was told that a potential "pilot" has to go through a certification process to fly a model, even if it's a foamer, on their field. So, they would need a license and a certificate both, just to fly on their field.
I just recently visited an AMA flying field. I inquired about getting into the hobby, and one of the modelers there told me that I would need a license. Apparently, the AMA now refers to their membership card as a license. Also, I was told that a potential "pilot" has to go through a certification process to fly a model, even if it's a foamer, on their field. So, they would need a license and a certificate both, just to fly on their field.
Edited to add: RCU doesn't even accept the word.Using the term license is within the AMA Bylaws "Article II, (m) To license model aircraft and fliers thereof for competition."
If you belong to an AMA Chartered Club, that club -- also a Bylaws requirement -- must require 100% of the flying members to be AMA members. Take it or leave it -- free country and YOUR free choice.
They made it very clear to me that if I can't afford the membership and a .40 sized (at least) model, then I shouldn't even be involved with the hobby. The members at the field didn't seem very talkative, and one of their instructors lacked humor of any type. They demonstrated an air of seriousness, in that they were always placing an emphasis on safety, and what a model could do to someone should it get out of control. Whether they investigate crashes or not, I'm not sure but they seem like they would be all over an accident like the National Transportation Safety Board.
I expect my students to be well aware of the safety part of the business. If they can't hack that, then let 'em go elsewhere.
In addition, we have too many experienced fliers join our club and many are well endowed with OLD BAD HABITS which are very difficult to correct. If you learn good habits at first, then you will be well ahead of the game and be a pilot that GOOD pilots will respect.
One member told me that the group is selective on who they want to teach flying to. He said that if the group perceives any psychiatric condition, they would not allow that person to fly, even with an instructor. It just looks to me like they view their models as if they were full-scale aircraft.
NorfolkSouthern
NorfolkSouthern
When I went through USAF Pilot Training, 28 started, but only 14 received those silver wings some 13 months later. How does a company select those to hire when they have a 100 to 1 applications, for which probably only a dozen or so will even get an interview?
If you do join that club, then think just how proud YOU will be because YOU made the grade. [X(]
NorfolkSouthern
07-24-2006, 08:36 PM
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RE: the "other" AMA
"There is a certain pride in being able to do things that the general public is usually not allowed to do"
The general public is allowed to fly RC, even folks with depression, CoDependant Enabler, or a TypeA techie personality.... even folks with a .15, or even .049 Cox
That club is the one limitting folks flying. Sure they only limit within the bounds of their club, require certification etc, and in general snobbishness of plane size, to hold power over who gets to fly.
Forget that club of snobs, find a fun group of guys that want to fly, and chat at the pits over coffe about stuff.
The general public is allowed to fly RC, even folks with depression, CoDependant Enabler, or a TypeA techie personality.... even folks with a .15, or even .049 Cox
That club is the one limitting folks flying. Sure they only limit within the bounds of their club, require certification etc, and in general snobbishness of plane size, to hold power over who gets to fly.
Forget that club of snobs, find a fun group of guys that want to fly, and chat at the pits over coffe about stuff.
07-25-2006, 12:18 AM
#17
RE: the "other" AMA
I really would like to see more .049 Cox planes flying. I know I enjoyed watching some of the plastic control-line models at the local school yard during my childhood. People would fly these little models at parks too. It's too bad that's not seen any more. I have never came across anybody with a park flyer either, although I wouldn't mind seeing one of those.
NorfolkSouthern
NorfolkSouthern
07-25-2006, 08:42 AM
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RE: the "other" AMA
If you really wanted to see more Cox planes flying, would that happen if you went into that .40+ snopb club? Everyone already has everything you need to buy & fly Cox 049, and you would see more if folks weren't so organized against them.
Imagine if you joined that club, and flew with their training and dogma.... soon you too would start looking down on the 049s as a waste of runway time or tie up a freq the 'real' planes wanted.
If you cant afford $12 for wood and a $7 engine, dont look at 049 planes. Never built a plane from sticks? No problem, the 049 have very few stick to deal with, easy! You can scratch build a 049 in same time those guys take to put an ARF together. There is your feling of accomplishment: You can proudly say "I Scratch Built It, and It Flys" to all them arf checkbook flyers.
Imagine if you joined that club, and flew with their training and dogma.... soon you too would start looking down on the 049s as a waste of runway time or tie up a freq the 'real' planes wanted.
If you cant afford $12 for wood and a $7 engine, dont look at 049 planes. Never built a plane from sticks? No problem, the 049 have very few stick to deal with, easy! You can scratch build a 049 in same time those guys take to put an ARF together. There is your feling of accomplishment: You can proudly say "I Scratch Built It, and It Flys" to all them arf checkbook flyers.
07-25-2006, 01:14 PM
#19
RE: the "other" AMA
To be honest, KidEpoxy, I don't consider the larger models to be very attractive. The big 3-D profile models especially. And, they are far too common. I will agree that chain saw motors on R/C models get old after a while. There are just too many people doing it. What I read here almost convinces me to get a park flyer instead, which I should be able to fly in just about any open space. The parts are inexpensive and easily replaced too. I will check with other clubs in the area about the glow engines, and opt for a .25 sized model or smaller. I suppose it's easy to overlook space limitations when you have a 2,000 square foot home and garage worth more than a quarter million dollars. But I live in an apartment.
NorfolkSouthern
NorfolkSouthern
07-25-2006, 01:32 PM
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RE: the "other" AMA
NS,
I had a Littlest Stik (18" span) that I modified for two channel (rudder and elevator) operation. I put a Cox .049 on it. It was a blast to fly and a real handful!
Dr.1
I had a Littlest Stik (18" span) that I modified for two channel (rudder and elevator) operation. I put a Cox .049 on it. It was a blast to fly and a real handful!
Dr.1
08-17-2006, 06:09 AM
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RE: the "other" AMA
ORIGINAL: trioval00
In the first post here, Brzys saya they were covering a Model JET Airshow. If that was true and it was a turbine Model Jet Airshow, yes he was right when he said you do need a License. It is called a "Turbine Waiver". ManytimesI have heard other people and myself,calling the Turbine Waiver a license.
Mark
In the first post here, Brzys saya they were covering a Model JET Airshow. If that was true and it was a turbine Model Jet Airshow, yes he was right when he said you do need a License. It is called a "Turbine Waiver". ManytimesI have heard other people and myself,calling the Turbine Waiver a license.
Mark
08-17-2006, 03:28 PM
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RE: the "other" AMA
Although a waiver from the AMA, does not make it a license.
Very true. If I am not an AMA member, the lack of a waiver does not prohibit me from flying a turbine model at a private field, i.e., one that is not part of an AMA chartered club.
Dr.1
Very true. If I am not an AMA member, the lack of a waiver does not prohibit me from flying a turbine model at a private field, i.e., one that is not part of an AMA chartered club.
Dr.1
