rsallen13

My Feedback: (1)

If I remember correctly there is a spot on the ballot for a write in candidate. If so and one gathered enough write ins to win could that person be invalidated if he/she did not meet the criteria set forth (ie Leader Member)?

If not or if the person did meet the qualifications then a write in campaign is one way to circumvent the EC in an election.

The EC would be hard pressed not to allow the person to serve if they in fact did win by write in.

Thoughts?

J_R

A write-in has been done before, successfully. The member must still meet the requirements of the office as defined in the by-laws and standing rules.

JR

Hossfly

>>>>>>>>>
The EC would be hard pressed not to allow the person to serve if they in fact did win by write in.

Thoughts?

Jim Branaum

My Feedback: (3)

If the individual won the vote but did not meet the previously printed requirements I can already smell the piranha swimming around. At least it would be interesting!

Bet you get a new name for that fine idea. Meanie! LOL

I know of at least one election by write in, but that WAS a "qualified" candidate who did not get on the ballot for some strange reason.

That is one of the reasons we need to get the nomination process cleaned up as it currently appears to encourage shenanigans as could be seen in the recent EVP contest. That was really funny! They didn't even need to do it, but they just couldn't help themselves.

A thumping on the membership they go, a thumping . . . .

mvigod

Is my memory of history correct or are the only requirements to become the POTUS is that you must be a US born citizen and xx years old (can't remember exact number now...). So it is harder to become prez of ama than prez of usa? or is this what they call "florida" voting style?

GrnBrt

My Feedback: (5)

It's 35 years of age Marc. Yes it does sound like it would be harder to qualify for AMA president then the president of the USA.

J_R

Judging from the mood of the constituents, it may be harder to satisfy those of the AMA than the US

JR

rsallen13

My Feedback: (1)

So..........................


We Have a little time to get organized. Do we have a Leader Member who would like to be AMA Prez or a District VP?

25000 RCUniverse Member and I would estimate that probably 1/2 are AMA members. Put together a write in campaign for the next election. With the cross over to (forgive me) and help from the other rc web sites we could get a couple of people elected an away we go!

Lets start with the next district elections. Then we use what we organized to work on the next Presidential Election.

They say that the Web is a powerful tool.

J_R

First you had best tell 'em what is expected of a VP by the membership.

Then IF>>> IF you can then find someone to step up to run, you probably will NOT have to run a write-in campaign.

Let's see.... what is it that we expect? hmmm...


Go to Muncie 4 times a year for EC meetings

Be prepared for each and every agenda item presented.

Never, never, never make a mistake when voting on a motion

Attend every model show within 1500 miles of home

Attend two organized events each weekend so you can take pictures of your District members to put in your MA column

Take a day or two each month to write that MA column

Attend a club meeting each and every night of the week

Answer each and every e-mail you get from any member of your District the same day it is received

Take every call from members of your District and return those that you miss, every day

Stay in touch with the rest of the EC constantly and be available to HQ at all hours of the night and day to answer questions

Serve on, or Chair, two or three standing committees and stay in touch with your committee members constantly

Prepare reports from the committee to the EC

Participate as a member of the Nominating Committee in Muncie once a year

Appoint AVP's, Frequency Coordinators etc, as necessary

Review and Approve/Disapprove CD applications

Review and Approve/Disapprove LM applications

Resolve conflicts in the District as they arise

Be prepared to make presentations to City Council or County Supervisors as needed to try to save fields on a moments notice


And... for this you are paid the princely amount of.... What? Whatdaya mean we dont pay em? Oh... well... OK, we don't pay you nothin, but you get $8800 per year for T&E. How about that, pretty neat, huh?

And, when you don't have anything else to do, build, fly and have fun. Oh yeah... if your married... kiss the wife on the way out the door.

(Just a quick, partial list of what we expect)

Now.... How many of you LM's are interested?.... Step right up.... No line.... no waiting.... Step right up

BillHarris

If you are a maginally competent aermodeller, retired and on an ego trip, this is dang good compensation, especially since you get to visit a lot of prime vacation spots _gratis_.

--Bill
<grumble>

rsallen13

My Feedback: (1)

Any Leader Members interested? I'll help run the campaign via the Internet. I can put together a small website for interested candidates whether a write in or on the ballot. Incumbent or otherwise. Allow you free reign to post your qualifications and agenda. Set up a small forum so people can post questions to you directly and everyone can see the answers.

I'm would not deny any qualified candidate nor am I looking to support any one candidate. If you feel that there is a need to change this is and opportunity to do so.

Open dialog with the masses sort of a Internet town hall, back of the train, bus stop campaign all in one.

ANYONE?

J_R

I am serious now. Do you really think you could pay airfare, gasoline, hotel bills, food bills and telephone bills, etc on what I described and have money left? I have never been to Muncie, but, I don't envision it as one one of the great vacation spots in the country, do you?

JR

mvigod

JR,

The demands and requirements would change once we had enough people on the council and a president elected. That list would be cut in half as doing away with some of the things I outlined makes them obsolete. Writing the column, taking pictures, traveling to every show. Also, the VP's would get paid an annual salary of some kind commensurate with the time they need to put in to play their part. In reality as the AMA moves from this organization to more of a buyers club for insurance and perhaps a lobbying effort for FCC the need for district vp's and so on would be eliminated. Keep in mind those vp's are all involved in meets and contests yet they rarely do more than show up and attend it. It is the responsibility of each club to handle it's meets and contests. They can have their own CD's and what is the only requirement normally you ask? AMA insurance coverage...

The need and requirements of VP's under my plan is reduced and perhaps eventually eliminated. While many of you want the AMA to continue to deal with making contest rules and the nats the bottom line is that only a handful of the 178,000 AMA members use those services and the MAJORITY I believe could just as well live happily ever after without them.

So right now the attractiveness of the job doesn't look great but if we have enough people on the council these rules and requirements would be changed.

I know my club/field is average. Why? Because I've been through about a half dozen of them in my life in different locations and they are all about the same. Bunch of sport flyers who just want to fly and have fun and must have AMA to fly at the fields. Average guy is 52 years old and retired but there are quite a few younger flyers mixed in. An extremely small percentage of any of them ever participated in a contest or went to one. Their main goal is this. And this is the important one if you read nothing else. Build, go to the field, talk a bit, fly a bit, talk some more, go home... If your local club/field varies from this it is by far the exception and not the rule.

I'm sure if members could pay half of what they pay now in dues for insurance and FCC lobby services only they would vote quite strongly in favor. With every dollar going to good and fair use the AMA would achieve what I believe it's biggest goal is "to service the wants and needs of the membership".

Phil Cole

Marc,

It seems your club's requirements are met by the UMA.
Why not get your club to drop their AMA charter and go with the UMA. This seems a lot less effort than changing the AMA.

rsallen13

My Feedback: (1)

Phil,

What I think a lot of people miss it the that there are people who "like" AMA but would like to see it change. I'm one of them, Marc is another, and there are more. To say love it or leave it does nothing to address the issues that have been brought up in the context of about 4 threads going on in this forum. And I do not limit to those of use who would like to see somethings change. Look at some of the "Pro" AMA posts, a lot of them have made comments that do not toe the AMA EC line.

Should they go to UMA also? No!

The AMA is suppose to be a democracy! Even thought the EC has more power than Castro and only they can to decide who should run for office and who shouldn't. That SHOULD Change.

The fact that they have drifted away from there original charter and are now mainly and insurance company. That SHOULD Change. Such asDirectly from the AMA Website)

"(j)To guide and assist in the acquisition and retention of flying sites officially sanctioned competitions and records which are conducted by AMA Contest Directors."

When has AMA done anything recently to "...assist in the acquisition and retention of flying sites..."? Other than a column in MA I have yet to hear where AMA itself actually took the lead in acquiring a flying site or took the lead in retaining a site? There are a lot of clubs who have lost sites without so much as an offer of help from AMA even when AMA was asked for assistance. Conversely when is the last time you heard that AMA went out and found a new site for a club that lost it's field? You don't but you SHOULD!

There are quite a few of us who are NOT Leader Members who HAVE the business experience and the vision to help advance the AMA, but unless we can effect change from the inside the powers that be will continue to ignore the issues that will be critical to the long term health of the organization.

I think that in the future a lot of us will look back and see that this time on the internet was when the winds began to shift and the changes in AMA started. I can only hope!

The orginal question of this post still stands anyone looking to run for office?

Jim Branaum

My Feedback: (3)

These are unwritten candidate requirements. Oddly enough out of curiosity I have been asking around of what members EXPECT for the last 2 or 3 years since I have heard lots of grumbling. What I found out has astounded me! JR's list is RIGHT ON TARGET!

The PEOPLE are the ones who require the travel, not the AMA. This is one of the biggest complaints I hear about my current DVP, he is never seen around. Recently he seems to be making a strong effort to get a few places, but that probably won't help change the minds of those who never seen him. Until recently I have protected him as I realize what is being asked for.

District VIII is H*U*G*E. Texas is in the middle and other states on the rim of Texas. So from central Texas to a meet in central N.M takes 12 hours EACH of driving (BTW, I HAVE done that and the time is if you are in a HURRY) which means two nights in a hotel for a one day visit. That trip cost almost $300, but I got to fly O*N*E day. Similar times and costs are seen for other states in the district.

The required travel (time and money) is one of the biggest list of reasons *I* am not interested! I already HAVE a wife and kids and do not wish another and like to fly. Spending all my time traveling would be a real pain and make the hobby not fun real fast.

mvigod

Jim,

there is no reason ama vp's need to go to meets or contests...they just hang around like every other contestant from what I understand. Under my ideas the travel is gone and possibly the position itself. Contests would be managed by a yet to be formed company that those who participate in contests/meets would fund. If my club had a fun fly or contest does the ama foot the bill for it? Would they show up? Why would I need them to show up?

Who requires them to travel to every meet? Is it their choice because they want to? Do the clubs require their presence. Help me to understand???

J_R

Take a look at what the members said they wanted in this poll

http://www.rcuniverse.com/showthread...29&forumid=211

JRR

mvigod

This poll assumes there will still be a column to write though. It supposed that given the fact that there is a column and something has to be written in it what should it be. 22 votes so far. I don't believe that the majority of members need VP's if the AMA turns into an entity primarily geared towards providing the benefit of insurance. They serve no purpose. I've never seen VP's at any of my fields or contests that I can recall. What is it that they do again? Other than go to muncie and vote on stuff that should never need to be voted on in the first place what is their function if the AMA became insurance only as it seems 2/3 at least would prefer? No longer is an EC council needed and no need now or later to have them traveling to contests (never understood what that was for anyway).

AMA could be setup like a real corporation without the weight on it of a non profit org status and all its quirky requirements which in the end cost us all more as the AMA tries to meet these requirements.

How many insurance companies out there are non profit? If AMA was a for profit company you could can the magazine and save money, can the VP's, sell the building, land and museum and run it as a service oriented insurance company geared to the true needs of the majority. End result would be lower cost to each member and every dollar being used effectively for all members rather than the majority paying for the desires of the few. Bring in a Harvard or Yale MBA (or seasoned CEO) and pay him/her a nice 6 figure salary to put the ship on course and run it properly. This isn't rocket science. Just common sense at this point..

J_R

Marc

For two days I have been trying to put this into words. I am going to cross post it a couple of places and it is my last attempt to make you, and everyone else understand what the AMA is and what it is not. Please consider it carefully.

If the AMA is not an insurance company, what is it?
The AMA is a non-profit, fraternal, service organization. It's guiding principle is: "Of, By, and For the Model Airplane Enthusiast".

It would appear that many do not understand what that means.

It means that the AMA is not chasing money as a primary function. Most businesses have the primary goal of making a profit. It means that the
organization is for a group of people with a common interest, a fraternal group. It provides services. Simply put, that means that you can not see
"things" that it does for you. You can not taste insurance. You can not touch the privilege of using a frequency. You can not smell the rules (well
maybe in some cases you can ). You can not hear the chartering of a club. Many of you are not even aware of the services that the AMA is constantly providing for you.

What you have joined is more closely akin to the Moose Lodge than Mutual of Omaha. We do, what we do, for each other, and for the good of our modeling community. The actual purposes of the AMA are set forth in Article II of the AMA bylaws. NOT mentioned in those purposes is insurance.

One of the services provided by the AMA is insurance. It is only one service. It also happens to have become the financial engine that drives
AMA. If what you wanted was to join an insurance company, you made a mistake. If your only question is "what is in it For me?", you missed the guiding principle of the AMA. Just as many Moose are surprised what is expected of them, after they join, many of you did not understand what you got into.

As a member, it is part of your responsibility to give OF yourself to others in the organization. The entire organization is run BY modelers. They give their time freely.

The "things" that the AMA owns are all to provide services for the membership. The HQ building, the Museum, the National Flying Site, and the
IMS show are examples. All provide service, nothing tangible. If you are looking to get "things" your looking in the wrong place.

If your outlook is "what can the organization do for me?", you are not going to be happy. If you are willing to share of yourself and give to the membership of yourself, you may find a great deal of pleasure in it.

JR

Jim Branaum

My Feedback: (3)

Marc,
The above is the reason that among informed members (I assume people here are informed) the second biggest choice in that poll was STILL highlight people and events in the district!

While your ideas might be good for another organization, this is a fraternal organization and that means PEOPLE. People like to be stroked. Putting their names and pictures in MA is a big stroke. Getting their names and pictures to the DVP cannot happen unless he is there.

NONE of the events anywhere need an AMA DVP. He adds nothing to the quality, integrity, or value of the event. His presence gives those who are prone to fawning the opportunity to fawn and those who prefer to complain someone to complain to. That is why folks complain when he does not come around. There are a few who want to discuss issues, but most DVP trips probably don't spend more than 30 minutes on issues.

That is why *I* don't want to run for the job. The voters have already said they wanted in several different venues, and I still choose my family and hobby. If I were to run it would irritate my kids, wife, and modeling friends because I would not be able to play with any of them as much as I do now. Not only that, but it would become a one term deal because I wouldn't stroke enough folks. I am not sure how good that is for me, my family, my friends, or the organization.

Now if we were talking of a non fraternal organization, that is a different ball of wax. Check into NASCAR and how it is organized for an alternative approach to the sport. I am NOT saying that is a good model, but the AMA is a terrible model for a non-fraternal organization. Doing the non profit thing is not that difficult, most of the criteria is met by volunteers in public schools trying to infect, er recruit students.

BillHarris

Municie may or may not be a vacation spot, but documented examples of questionable behavior involve a "official" trip to the Gulf Coast, a brief run-through
visit to a fly-in where a couple of snaps were taken but with little or no interaction with the members, and then an extended visit to antique shops in the area.

Sure, it doesn't pay much but we are getting even less...

--Bill Harris
AMA 607983 and proud of it.
District 5 and embarrassed. Let's change that.

No more in '04.

J_R

Bill

You do have a ... unique VP. I would say you guys elected him and he is your problem, but, I don't want to ailenate everyone in Dist V, or my friend Red, in particular. I will just repeat that your VP is unique. Most of the EC members bust their butt's for the membership and probably have to add a substantial amount out of pocket to serve the members in thier district. McNeill needs to go, in my opinion, but.... don't paint them all with the same brush. As a matter of fact, I am sure that is your real complaint. If you had a VP that cared as much as the others, there would be no complaints.

JR

BillHarris

Absolutely, JR. AMA has some great VPs, and I don't think that all are bad apples. I am concerned for my District and want only the best.