Gremlin Castle

My Feedback: (14)

I was reading part of an AMA status report and found this buried in the text.

Expenses are up in all areas: services, supplies, salaries. The HQ staff has been expanded to give better services to clubs and Junior programs. The magazine cost has increased. New office equipment has been purchased. Hopefully continued membership growth will produce enough new income from dues this year to pay for the extra costs.

But we really need a bigger margin between income and expenses. with expenses always creeping up we're constantly dependent upon expanding membership. So we have not been able to get ahead, as we might if new income were to go into new services,greater efficiency,and added membership benefits. Instead of merely holding our own we need a breakthrough.

The obvious solution to this is a dues increase. But it's certainly not a popular one, even though many people recognize that it's normal in any organization-due to ordinary rises in the cost of living-for dues increases to be applied about every five years.

And so it continues on for several more paragraphs. Does this sound like a viable plan for organizational growth?

Hossfly

IIRC, that is from a report some years ago prior to the last dues increase.

It is how all government and bureaucracies operate. MORE TAXES, either in plain view or hidden. While federal income taxes may be dropping a bit, TRUE inflation, not just governmental hype and redefinitions, but actual inflation and cost of living expense is gobbling any gain there of.
Property taxes are on an unbelievable rampage. One property was hiked 42% this year. Others are up 10-14% across the board. Michigan real estate taxes for non-residents go up faster than a rocket.
Regardless of the tax and price increases, the area continues to expand at a significant increase. [:-]

Yet with all these gross inflations of living costs, while the great number of retirees in this country have to sell off estate or continue to tighten the ropes more and more, the growth of organizations continues, especially in the pseudo-management elite areas. Therefore I don't think AMA will not grow because of a dues increase. The killing death of AMA is simply shouldering the cancer called Model Aviation which could be at worst case, a break-even non-related business entity, and the refusal of AMA to accept its mission reality as the promoter of a recreational sport much more than just providing the competition base for competition.

However, like in the real world, the AMA voters go and vote in the same old same old election after election, while the majority of the membership sits around either wondering what happened [:'(] or totally unaware that something did happen. [&o]

Gremlin Castle

My Feedback: (14)

Horrace you are partially correct. It was a little further back than the last dues increase. Try the third column on page 44 of the July 1968 American Aircraft Modeler.

One thing that our illustrious AMA has in common with our Federal, state, and local government is that none of them remember their own history when it comes to bettering the current situation.

It also points out that the howling masses get what they deserve because they will not act in concert to vote in major change. What change there is comes mostly by chance or accident rather than the majority exerting their collective will by voting.

Despite all of the blundering the AMA still has managed to grow from around 22,000 in 1967 to above a 170,000 today. Imagine what better planning over the last 38 years could have accomplished.

KidEpoxy

"Imagine what better planning over the last 38 years could have accomplished"

hmm, Internet, Arfs, & Brushless...

Imagine what better planning over the last 10 years could have accomplished

SoCal GliderGuider

Actually the AMA has shrunk from it's largest membership to around 150,000. Think that is over a 100,000 less but would have to check my saved text. The full time staff has tripled in the same time frame. You get what you don't vote for.

Silent-AV8R

ANd I assume you have the sources for these assertions?? I can never recall AMA membership exceeding +/- 175,000. Also, what is your source fr stating that AMA staff has tripled?? Over what time frame??

SoCal GliderGuider

Geesh. Since you are joined at the hip with the AMA you should have home numbers you can call and ask other than be a pain.

Here are cuts from my savings:

-----------------------------------------

On Thu, 12 Sep 1996, Wm F Archibald wrote:
>
> I wish I knew how many paying members AMA has so I could figure out
> exactly what they are talking about. Also, remember this is a
> non-profit org., they don't got shareholders to answer to.
>
> As Sgt. Friday said, "Give me the facts, m'am, just the facts".

Bill, seems like I heard the number 250,000 somewhere, vs 5000 for SFA. I
think once we all see the financial breakdown promised for next month that
we can make some constructive suggestions where we can make some cost
reductions that we all agree on. We have a President now that is in business
for profit (tough call in the hobby business) as opposed to being a
government employee. No offense meant to past Presidents but I think you
will agree that the mindset in the private sector is somewhat different than
in government.


Red S.
AMA 951 IMAA 18939
Flying Gators MAC
Gainesville, FL

-----------------------------------------------------------

On Thu, 12 Dec 1996 [email protected] wrote:

> Robert Barkus wrote:
>
> > No flame, but if the two policies are comparable, why bother with
> > switching? You are right, SFA will not waste profits on flying sites.
> > They will just waste it on homes, swimming pools, cars and vacations
> > (grin).
> >
> > Robert
>
> And you don't think the exec's at AMA aren't doing the same thing, check
> out their salaries. (no grin)
> Vince
> AMA 266036

You can, from the latest expense report (posted here a month ago) the
Salaries and Benefits were $1,619,720. Allowing 30% of that for "benefits"
this leaves $1,133,804 spred over the employees at headquartes and some in
other areas. From the e-mail directory their are 20 people at headquarters.
I don't think this lists the janitors, grounds people and lower level
clerks. Let's for argument sake say there are another 15 people on the
payroll. This comes out to an average of $32,000/yr.

[snip] SFA arguments.

Red S. - AMA 951-IMAA 18939

Silent-AV8R

So you quote where Red "heard". Very factual.

Gremlin Castle

My Feedback: (14)

I don't think that the AMA had anything to do with the internet, brushless, or ARFs. These are just things that have been embraced by people whether connected to the AMA or not.

SoCal GliderGuider

Well Red has had his good days and his bad days. Guess that one back in September of 96 was one of the bad days. Another thread actually quotes from the web site for October of 96 and indicates 170,000.

As to the number of employees I will stand firmly by the number increase from 15 to over 50 in the last ten to twelve years.

Hossfly

The official AMA End-of Year counts supplied to me from AMA during my candidacy for AMA Ex. Vice President last year, 2005.


ACADEMY OF MODEL AERONAUTICS
MEMBERSHIP COUNTS


Year End Total

1987 122,880
1988 136,044
1989 153,103
1990 165,359
1991 168,190
1992 165,350
1993 168,074
1994 158,927
1995 154,322
1996 153,675
1997 149,700
1998 152,565
1999 157,331
2000 165,365
2001 170,754
2002 173,420
2003 168,075
2004 163,709

EDIT: Attempted to edit column format to a reasonable read, however RCU formats screw them out of proportion, so you have to make it out on your own.

Gremlin Castle

My Feedback: (14)

That looks like good information on membership numbers. It also gives some small insight as to whether some of the members consider the AMA to be of benefit to them. There is no accurate way to know year by year how many left the hobby versus those that left the AMA and remained in the hobby. The hobby industry should be a source for some level of information on that matter.

For me it would seem that if the AMA wanted to make a gain on cutting operating expenses that they should try a bi-monthly publication. It would save not only publication and mailing costs it would also cut in half any subsidy afforded advertisers. It would save a lot of paper and ink reprinting the same ads over and over each month.
Also new products are now more likely to be found first on internet advertising rather than a magazine regardless of the publication. Internet will reach world wide to those that are neither a member of AMA or a subscriber to other publications.
Bi-monthly publication would also give the AMA staff more time to address membership issues without increasing the overhead with additional people. The remainder of the money could be put toward some of the often touted but never implemented projects.

If they did not want to try a bi-monthly publication then the advertising rates should equal any other magazine of equivalent distribution. This would at least narrow the gap between loss and profit where the magazine is concerned.

STLPilot

My Feedback: (21)

Wasn't 2002 the year that parkflyers really took off? I think same year Shocky's came into the circuit. I bet one of the biggest reasons for the AMA's decline. Hopefully the ED will not let the opportunity pass by. Sure is funny and also amazing seeing helicopters in a Radio Shack and Flying Boats in Target and Wallyworld .... whoda thought that would have ever happen.

littlecrankshaf

My Feedback: (58)

ACADEMY OF MODEL AERONAUTICS
MEMBERSHIP COUNTS


Year End Total

1987 122,880
1988 136,044
1989 153,103
1990 165,359
1991 168,190
1992 165,350
1993 168,074
1994 158,927
1995 154,322
1996 153,675
1997 149,700
1998 152,565
1999 157,331
2000 165,365
2001 170,754
2002 173,420
2003 168,075
2004 163,709




Thanks Hoss for the facts.

BTW Mode One did you see this? Now do you believe the AMA is not growing?

STLPilot

My Feedback: (21)

From DB's biography: In 1995, I was elected as AMA president, and I remain in that post. When I complete this term of office, I will have been on the AMA Executive Council for 25 years, and in that time I have witnessed and been a part of the growth of the organization from an organization with few assets, living in rented quarters in Washington, D.C., to the multi-million dollar organization it is today.

Would have been neat to hear how he was responsible for the growth in memberships and likewise achievements, something along the lines of multi-million membership instead of the multi-million dollars he helped raise and been part of. But then again it's sounds very capitalistic of him. He'd do well in the private sector with that kind of attitude.

Gremlin Castle

My Feedback: (14)

I certainly hope that DB is a capitalist since he is very much a part of the private sector as is AMA.

I want him and those around him to be better capitalists so that the dollars taken into the AMA generate maximum value to the membership in advancing model aviation.

The AMA mission has changed over the years as litigation has become an industry rather than a tool of law.
The internet has given demagogues and naysayers an equal voice adding to the difficulty of advancing anything without spending additional time overiding their noise.

At this juncture it is becoming more difficult to determine whether the growth in the AMA is because of or in spite of those at the helm.

One thing for certain is the postings on this forum have no influence on the AMA leadership one way or the other.

We are about like the child that has the fake steering wheel attached to the dashboard on the passenger side. We can sit over there twisting the wheel and making our noises while dad continues steering down the path that he has chosen.

Silent-AV8R

Well, now that my coffee has stopped coming out of my nose I can tell you this is the funniest thing I have ever seen. AND it is absolutely true.

It is one reason I will usually implore many of the more strident keyboard pilots to go to the source rather than waste their time here.

Tell the AMA. Go to the FAA. Nail the FCC. Get after that City Council. Share you wisdom with THEM. Why keep it here in our little forum where nothing can really be changed??

Beep-Beep!! Varoom-Varoom. Look Daddy, I'm driving just like you!!!! [&:]

ptulmer

My Feedback: (5)

I happen to know for a fact that statement is untrue.

Gremlin Castle

My Feedback: (14)

And would you like the column or the floor shift for your steering wheel?

model.flyer

Fresh, good ideas, along with constructive criticism are read and often acted on. However, misinformation from the “experts” and incorrect information are posted it leads to less interest in this forum. Some of the threads are so far off base that they can only be read for humor.

As an example of the latter, a unfounded charge was made that the employees at Model Aviation Magazine published a 13th issue a couple of years ago. Had it been true, the employees should have been rewarded since they were able to mail it at no charge to the AMA. Looking at postage charges for the prior year, the year in question, and the following year along with the number of AMA members each year showed that all the postage charges were in line for 12 mailings. No one noticed or called the “expert” on his faulty count. Made for a lot of chuckles on the EC.

KidEpoxy

see, now why cant they do that with a few more issues besides the BakersDozen Bonus Issue?
That would probably be the first thing the MA guys did that I approve of.



-Open Adressed-
yeah, YOU! the MA guy reading this in his attic when the wife is out of town so you have no witnesses to your Forum Rantings under some psudopersona, whomever you are, whermever you are. We all know you take out posts to heart but have to conceal your obsessions with us while on the clock.





yup, I said Whomever & Whermever, I just like the way they sound together- I make no claim to their existance prior to this post in english or other laguages...although I wouldnt put them past Ebonics

Gremlin Castle

My Feedback: (14)

Pseudo persona would equal a sham assumed character if Webster can be used as a reference. Considering most of the posts I guess that makes sense kind sorta not really.

model.flyer

Pretty well describes most of KidEpoxy's posts: "makes sense kind sorta not really"

What the heck does "Open Adressed" mean? Kid needs to return to school, maybe?

KidEpoxy

oh, sorry, I'll define it for you. I guess granted more decifer ability to readers than I should have.

'Open Adressed' is Cauconics for openly addressed in as much that aks is Ebonics for ask.
There is no one particular RCU recipient intended, nor targeted, by that part of the post. I didnt want some person or persons to gripe about it refering to them by inference directly. A to whom it may concern, but with far less typing


Perhaps I should make a Cauconics Wiki for terms like Whermever & OpenAdressed since some folks cant figure it out without help... but hey, I'm a helpful guy- Just ask me about what you cant grasp on your own

SoCal GliderGuider

"Cauconics" or "Begorahonics".