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termination thread pulled?

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Old 02-02-2007, 05:21 PM
  #1  
John Casey
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Default termination thread pulled?

So why was the Termination and expulsions guidline thread pulled from this website?

Sam guys did not like the truth getting out, wait till it hits the Sacramento bee.

for anyone interested this hidden of information

Type in "Sacramento area modelers" in the search forums section and read on .

Somebody "could not handle the truth"
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Old 02-02-2007, 06:22 PM
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Default RE: termination thread pulled?

The "TRUTH", you can't handle the TRUTH!
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Old 02-02-2007, 06:24 PM
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Default RE: termination thread pulled?

You are only allowed to discuss what some moderator deems fit to be discussed. Did you miss it when 1984 went by? Fortunately, the web is a very large space, and damned little of it is within the control of wannabe thought police.
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Old 02-02-2007, 07:07 PM
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Default RE: termination thread pulled?

One guy was so full of insults and personal attacks that the mods just shut it down. When you've got someone calling people out on their orientation and race, it's impossible to have a civil discussion.

The fact this particular thread is still here proves that it wasn't the subject matter that got the other thread pulled. The "truth" wasn't the problem. It was one guy that couldn't act like a grownup.

If you're so worried about the truth, pick up the discussion here. It will probably go well until Mr. Insult shows up again, and then tis thread will get wrecked too.
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Old 02-02-2007, 07:28 PM
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Default RE: termination thread pulled?


ORIGINAL: Doc Austin

One guy was so full of insults and personal attacks that the mods just shut it down. When you've got someone calling people out on their orientation and race, it's impossible to have a civil discussion.

The fact this particular thread is still here proves that it wasn't the subject matter that got the other thread pulled. The "truth" wasn't the problem. It was one guy that couldn't act like a grownup.

If you're so worried about the truth, pick up the discussion here. It will probably go well until Mr. Insult shows up again, and then tis thread will get wrecked too.
That's BS...the mods can delete particular posts and admonish or ban offensive posters...I should know!

There was a lot of content removed that was actually great lesson material for others tuned in despite posts considered by some to be over the line…actually those posts were probably the greatest proof of the needs highlighted by John Casey in the original thread.

Too bad…that is why you can’t believe even half of what you read here…it is rendered to allow the wishes of a few after the haircuts. Snip, Snip, Snip….
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Old 02-02-2007, 08:41 PM
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Default RE: termination thread pulled?

ORIGINAL: littlecrankshaf


That's BS...the mods can delete particular posts................
Then why is this thread still here? If they really wanted to shut everyone up about it, this thread would be gone too.

Why did the other thread go well into it's 13th page if the mods didn't want the supposed "truth' to come out? If that really was the "truth," it had already come out.


There was a lot of content removed that was actually great lesson material for others tuned in despite posts considered by some to be over the line…
Yep. If one guy would have acted a little more like an adult, maybe the thread would have stayed, but he had to have the final insult in reply to every post. Since he wasn't going to grow up, the thread was removed.

actually those posts were probably the greatest proof of the needs highlighted by John Casey in the original thread.
John Casey presented his case in a civil and rational tone (for which he receives my applause). His case could still be there for everyone to see, but one of his supporters couldn't resist calling people's orientation into question, other insults, and just generally acting like a monkey with a new spank toy.

You can say the mods are biased or whatever you like about it, but this thread is still here, and the other went well into 13 pages. I seriously doubt they were afraid of the "truth." They probably just got fed up at looking at all the cr*p and flushed it.
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Old 02-02-2007, 09:21 PM
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Default RE: termination thread pulled?


ORIGINAL: Doc Austin


Then why is this thread still here?

Good point... thanks for pointing that out!
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Old 02-02-2007, 11:01 PM
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Default RE: termination thread pulled?

ORIGINAL: littlecrankshaf

Good point... thanks for pointing that out!
Honestly................ If the mods were wanting to cover the story up, they would just squash all the threads that deal with it. The problem wasn't the story itself. The problem was that the civility level had gone so far downhill. John Casey can thank that guy for getting his story pulled. Casey put a lot of effort into being civil and articulate, and it was all wasted because one guy had to act like a moron.

Casey did a nice time defending himself, but then the other guy turned Casey's efforts into a complete waste because he made sure that it's no longer there. I'm sure Casey can do without that kind of "support."
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Old 02-02-2007, 11:41 PM
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Default RE: termination thread pulled?

So is this becoming the thing about that thing or the thing about the other thing?
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Old 02-03-2007, 05:00 AM
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Default RE: termination thread pulled?









ORIGINAL: Doc Austin

ORIGINAL: littlecrankshaf

Good point... thanks for pointing that out!
John Casey can thank that guy for getting his story pulled. Casey put a lot of effort into being civil and articulate, and it was all wasted because one guy had to act like a moron.


Come on Doc, The mods could or can redact the thread and remove just offensive parts and reinstall the thread if they wish. The problem started with post #3 of that thread when you started making allegations and paralleling an issue your club had/has. Of course, that led to that person, which you were hanging out to dry, to attempt a defense for himself thereby derailing the thread.

Again, in this thread you reference the fellow as moronic but your post still stands.
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Old 02-03-2007, 08:29 AM
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Default RE: termination thread pulled?

ORIGINAL: littlecrankshaf

Come on Doc, The mods could or can redact the thread and remove just offensive parts and reinstall the thread if they wish.
Certainlly, but this thread is still here, and the other one went to 13 pages. I don't think the mods were trying to squash the thread's subject matter or they would have acted a lot quicker. You will have to ask the mods why they didn't edit out the insults. Maybe they felt the level of discourse had sunk so badly that it couldn't be saved, so they drug out the nukes. Maybe they felt that if they pulled the thread someone would start new one and it would stay civil.

So, this is that thread, isn't it?

This one has stayed civil in spite of us disagreeing from the beginning, hasn't it? You haven't insulted me, and I haven't insulted you. I'm sure as long as the discussion can stay at this rational level, the thread will stay.

As long as the other guy doesn't poke his nose in here and start slinging around insults, there's a good chance there won't be a problem.

Here's an idea: Everyone stay civil and let's see how long this thread lasts. It's stayed here overnight, so I suspect the subject matter wasn't the problem on the other thread. The level of discourse was.

How about we start over and someone explain Casey's problem? We can't access the old thread and if Casey really does have a good case, he deserves for it to be told............and on a thread that stays.

The problem started with post #3 of that thread when you started making allegations and paralleling an issue your club had/has........
I believe you may have me confused with another poster. I don't believe I commented on my club. Maybe I did, but we don't have any problems like this, so I don't know what you're referring to. Everyone gets along in my club, but then again, we're all adults. Most of the guys are older and pretty mellow. We've got a few young guys, but they are respectful.

There, now I've commented on my club.


Of course, that led to that person, which you were hanging out to dry, to attempt a defense for himself thereby derailing the thread.
The guy didn't make an attempt to defend himself. He merely insulted almost everyone else. And, I merely took exception to it, whereupon he began insulting me. At that point, I just led him down the path to self emplosion. Verbal Akido, if you will. A little common sense and rational discourse is just too much for some peole to take.

If guy was making a defense attempt, it was pretty lame. Oh................ and he hung himself.

Again, in this thread you reference the fellow as moronic but your post still stands.
No, I said he was acting like a moron. I didn't call him a moron. I merely commented on his behavior.

Only on my last post did I offer the opinion that he was deeply disturbed, but after his remarks about other's orientation (among other slurrs) that was just a matter of stating fact.

I also pointed out that intelligent people can debate without reaching for the personal insult on every post. John Casey managed to do it quite eloquently. Some of his supporters weren't quite so smooth.
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Old 02-03-2007, 09:16 AM
  #12  
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Default RE: termination thread pulled?

Doc Austin


You know what? I think you are right...After thinking about it some more I believe I may have confused you with another Doc (maybe Yates ??? Who knows) I regret my mistake. Please accept my apologies.

That is just one of the problems with the record now...no way for any of us to verify what transpired or who said what…when.
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Old 02-03-2007, 09:51 AM
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Default RE: termination thread pulled?

that free speech section in our constitution does not apply here. there are rules and we must abide by them. could you imagine if rc universe
had no rules on posting. it would be an all out cussing forum.
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Old 02-03-2007, 09:53 AM
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Default RE: termination thread pulled?


ORIGINAL: littlecrankshaf

Please accept my apologies.
Apologies not necesary.

You've been completely civil with me, even though we've agreed on very little. I appreciate that enough that if you're ever in Florida, look me up and we'll go out and give our planes a good thrashing together.




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Old 02-03-2007, 10:04 AM
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Default RE: termination thread pulled?


ORIGINAL: LANNYBOB

..................could you imagine if rc universe had no rules on posting. it would be an all out cussing forum.
We aren't going to convince parents to get their kids involved in model aviation with conduct like that, are we?

Mostly, though, we're here to share our passions for model aviation. There isn't any room for (for example) calling people out on their sexuality (which I personally don't even care about) or other slurrs. There is just no room for that sort of thing......and amoung rational adults, there's never even the slightest need to come anywhere close to that kind of exchange.

The forums have to have rules. I don't see why discussing what happend to Joh Casey would be off limits because he personally was civil and articultate about it. There just wasn't any need for that one guy to degerate the whole thread into a cesspool, though I take my share of responsibility for leading him down the merry path to revealing himself.

There are, however, forums that are there strictly for insulting each other, and that's the way the game is played there. This isn't that forum, though. As long as we can stay away from that sort of unseemly conduct, i guess this thread will run it's course until everyone merely loses interest in it.


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Old 02-03-2007, 10:27 AM
  #16  
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Default RE: termination thread pulled?

I have saved 98% of it to my hard drive if you wish I can e-mail it to you. However, I would suggest to let that thread die and let it never return.
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Old 02-03-2007, 11:24 AM
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Default RE: termination thread pulled?


ORIGINAL: Doc Austin

One guy was so full of insults and personal attacks that the mods just shut it down. When you've got someone calling people out on their orientation and race, it's impossible to have a civil discussion.

The fact this particular thread is still here proves that it wasn't the subject matter that got the other thread pulled. The "truth" wasn't the problem. It was one guy that couldn't act like a grownup.

If you're so worried about the truth, pick up the discussion here. It will probably go well until Mr. Insult shows up again, and then tis thread will get wrecked too.

The thread was pulled because my personal information was posted in the thread. By nick saban. He has been removed. Doctor, when did i make mention of your ethnicity?
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Old 02-03-2007, 02:00 PM
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Default RE: termination thread pulled?

One guy was so full of insults and personal attacks that the mods just shut it down. When you've got someone calling people out on their orientation and race, it's impossible to have a civil discussion. quote doc austin

Lie #1.

Casey put a lot of effort into being civil and articulate, and it was all wasted because one guy had to act like a moron. quote docaustin

No, I said he was acting like a moron. I didn't call him a moron. I merely commented on his behavior.
quote doc auston.

#2. Semantics. Why dont you go argue with yourself doc.


The guy didn't make an attempt to defend himself. He merely insulted almost everyone else. And, I merely took exception to it, whereupon he began insulting me. At that point, I just led him down the path to self emplosion. Verbal Akido, if you will. A little common sense and rational discourse is just too much for some peole to take.

If guy was making a defense attempt, it was pretty lame. Oh................ and he hung himself. .quote doc austin

#3.You got your arrogant tail kicked.


John Casey presented his case in a civil and rational tone (for which he receives my applause). His case could still be there for everyone to see, but one of his supporters couldn't resist calling people's orientation into question, other insults, and just generally acting like a monkey with a new spank toy. quote doc austin

#4 That is a racist slur!!! I demand an apology!!!!! Maybe you are racist and homophobic.
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Old 02-03-2007, 02:16 PM
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Default RE: termination thread pulled?

I think it is time for me to respond to the unfounded allegations that have been put out here. I am the one who pulled the thread so I am the one who knows why it was pulled.

If anyone could see the thread, they would see that I deleted a lot of the posts in an attempt to salvage some good discussion and debate. As has been said, the thread was eleven (11) pages long. The bashing started on page three (3). In order to salvage the thread, most of the last eight (8) pages of posts would have had to be deleted due to rules infractions, primarily bashing other members. This would have taken literally hours to try to salvage probably not more than 30% of the thread. I am simply not willing to do that because adults lose sight of the rules. This is a volunteer position and nothing requires us to give up our free time for the sake of saving 30% of a thread.

We are often accused of having an agenda to silence a particular group or a particular view or a particular brand when we remove a post or remove or close a thread. We have been accused most often of being anit-HPI (a brand of car). I don't own an R/C car and don't know one from the other. I know airplanes and I know what I like. I have never and will never delete a thread because it involves a particular brand of radio, engine, or airplane. As moderators, we cannot afford to have a biased agenda and remain as moderators. There have been some who have done this and only remained as moderators a short period of time. Our agenda is and will remain to see that the rules are applied evenly, although this is not always the case because of differences of opinions of moderators. It is the goal of the administrators to keep RCUniverse the number one source of R/C related information on the world wide web. They cannot achieve that goal by allowing moderators to run amok.

It is not the topic of the thread that got it removed. That should be obvious by how long it was allowed to continue. On the other hand, it should have been cleaned up and shut down when the bashing started. The originator was notified that the thread was being removed and the reason. That is the only requirement that I must meet. If I were required to notify everyone who posted in the thread about the removal, this would have taken hours to accomplish. If someone wants to start another discussion on this same topic, you are free to do that but once again, if the bashing begins it will be shut down immediately and the topic will not be allowed to be brought up again. I don't think it is too much to ask that members follow the rules and act like adults.

I will be glad to answer any questions that I have not covered here. You are free to post your questions here if you feel that the answer will benefit other members or to send me a PM if you have a more specific question.



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Old 02-03-2007, 02:38 PM
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Default RE: termination thread pulled?

Thank you Howard. You have a thankless task. Thankyou for responding to my e=mail. Maybe this will stop the bashing OF ME.
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Old 02-03-2007, 03:40 PM
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Default RE: termination thread pulled?

ORIGINAL: JUGFLIER

Doctor, when did i make mention of your ethnicity?
I didn't say it was you, specifically, that mentioned that, but you threw out so many insults at so many people it's litte wonder you're confused.
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Old 02-03-2007, 04:31 PM
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Default RE: termination thread pulled?


ORIGINAL: Lightfoot


I will be glad to answer any questions that I have not covered here. You are free to post your questions here if you feel that the answer will benefit other members...



Lightfoot

I wonder about how the moderation process works. Do you mods always confer and make a cohesive judgment or can you guys independently and subjectively make a call and delete a thread or a post?

Thanks
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Old 02-03-2007, 04:56 PM
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Default RE: termination thread pulled?

Marc and Nathan impart a philosophy when we start moderating along with specific guidelines. Most of us have been around a while so we know how things work. There's cut and dried stuff like for sale ads and such and there are grey areas. Cut and dried stuff we handle, grey areas we discuss. Its a learn as you go process. If its a grey area most of the time its a consenus and if needed we just ask Marc or Nathan as they have the final word. The mods are a team and like any team we work towards a common goal, in this case making RCU a pleasant place for everyone to discuss and learn our favorite area of the hobby. There's times we hash things out in private but in the end everyone is pulling the same direction and all the mods I know are more than open to discuss things with members.

Andy
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Old 02-03-2007, 05:55 PM
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Default RE: termination thread pulled?

I will also add to what BarracudaHockey has said and tell you that the AMA forum is allowed alot more leway than any other forum on RCU when it comes to moderating. Having said this, the basic rules are still applied when a thread is being looked at and if mud slinging is occuring, then the thread will be removed. Talking about AMA subjects can be done without insulting one another and that is the intent of this forum. Any questions, please feel free to contact any moderator. Thanks Dave
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Old 02-03-2007, 07:53 PM
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Default RE: termination thread pulled?

I want to thank all that did discuss things in this forum,

The good that came out it was that lots of people got to read
what had happened and hopefully will do what is
needed by adopting the "2/3 members rule"
to terminate a members membership per the AMA pdf file 535 -A

The thread should not have been pulled but locked.

It is probably very true that in an organization
run by the rules (instead of hatred and jelousy) non
of the terminations would have happened.

Before the original tread was pulled I had mentioned the following,

Are any of the terminations really valid if they violate the AMA guidelines?

I say they are not valid.

All the clubs are "Chartered" by the same "mother" organization.

I have been in several clubs accross the USA, they all were pretty much the same.

So to continue this discussion........

What is an offense worthy of termination in an AMA club?

(Please leave out the name's and try to stick to the issues.)

The bad guys will know it them without saying a name(just like in the first post)
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