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New Radios and AMA

Old 02-26-2007, 08:31 PM
  #1  
Live Wire
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Default New Radios and AMA

What will the new system do to AMA membership , when you get out from under the proverbial thumb. Just thinking with my thumbs
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Old 02-26-2007, 08:50 PM
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Default RE: New Radios and AMA

Make many people happy and planes last longer

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Old 02-26-2007, 09:00 PM
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Default RE: New Radios and AMA

Since the "proverbial thumb" doesn't belong to the AMA in this case, worst case scenario is that it won't do anything to AMA membership.
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Old 02-26-2007, 09:28 PM
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Default RE: New Radios and AMA

Matt
Since most people think all AMA "Is" is and insurance why would they put up with the hastle with clubs, and flying field regulations and rules.
They really don't have the pressure on them to Join a club to have a field to fly at as they do with the old control method.
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Old 02-26-2007, 09:35 PM
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Default RE: New Radios and AMA

Because in some places there are no private fields or parks. The county will require some form of insurance and organization in order to use what public land is available. Regardless of what radio you use.
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Old 02-26-2007, 10:42 PM
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Default RE: New Radios and AMA

What do the new frequencies and the AMA have to do with each other anyway? The AMA has never been the one to "control" what frequencies we fly on. That's up to the FCC, the users and club members, along with various clubs and contest directors. All anyone really cares about is frequency conflict and the new 2.4 gig frequencies actually make this safer than it has ever been. The AMA does not even insist that people fly at a club site. Only that flying locations meet or exceed basic safety standards. As far as effect on the AMA, it might have a very slight positive effect on insurance claims since there will be less chance of a frequency jammed aircraft running into something or someone.

People, you really need to get to know what the AMA is actually about. It's not limited to insurance and club sites.
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Old 02-27-2007, 07:30 AM
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Default RE: New Radios and AMA

Right-On, Silversurfer, I looked at the original post and thought to myself; "Wha"!
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Old 02-27-2007, 11:35 AM
  #8  
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Default RE: New Radios and AMA


ORIGINAL: Silversurfer

What do the new frequencies and the AMA have to do with each other anyway? The AMA has never been the one to "control" what frequencies we fly on. That's up to the FCC, the users and club members, along with various clubs and contest directors. All anyone really cares about is frequency conflict and the new 2.4 gig frequencies actually make this safer than it has ever been. The AMA does not even insist that people fly at a club site. Only that flying locations meet or exceed basic safety standards.
Well, Ss, everything can be debated via symantics. AMA does in a way CONTROL the freqs. we fly on.

AMA Safety Code:
5. I will operate my model aircraft using only radio-control frequencies currently allowed by the Federal Communications Commission (FCC). Only individuals properly licensed by the FCC are authorized to operate equipment on Amateur Band frequencies.
6. I will not knowingly operate my model aircraft within three (3) miles of any preexisting flying site without a frequency-management agreement. A frequency-management agreement may be an allocation of frequencies for each site, a day-use agreement between sites, or testing which determines that no interference exists. A frequency-management agreement may exist between two or more AMA chartered clubs, AMA clubs and individual AMA members, or individual AMA members. Frequency-management agreements, including an interference test report if the agreement indicates no interference exists, will be signed by all parties and copies provided to AMA Headquarters.

FCC allocates the frequency spectrum allowed for our use, but AMA darn well controls HOW we use it in the field. Even the industry has followed AMA's lead. When FCC allocated the freqs. all 50 were available, the phase-in schedule was strictly AMA. The industry followed AMA's requests. The industry could have sold the other freqs. and probably made it big with non-AMA fliers. Again, CONTROL by leadership recognized by the industry.

People, you really need to get to know what the AMA is actually about. It's not limited to insurance and club sites.
With that I agree. In addition it's past time that AMA has a leader that will see to it that all levels of the media and governmental recreational functions well know what AMA and aeromodeling is about, plus a working EC and staff that focuses on promoting those things that AMA is about. Then and only then can your desire for people to get to know what AMA is really about happen. This is the year to make it happen.
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Old 02-27-2007, 11:55 AM
  #9  
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Default RE: New Radios and AMA

ORIGINAL: Hossfly

When FCC allocated the freqs. all 50 were available, the phase-in schedule was strictly AMA. The industry followed AMA's requests. The industry could have sold the other freqs. and probably made it big with non-AMA fliers. Again, CONTROL by leadership recognized by the industry.
Well, since we are arguing semantics here, technically the FCC owns the spectrum, not the RC companies. And in any case we are secondary users and as such it is very unlikely that even without the AMA being involved that any RC company would have the right to "sell" off any part of the radio spectrum we use.

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Old 02-27-2007, 12:26 PM
  #10  
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Default RE: New Radios and AMA

No, we don't need no stinkin self regulation and rules thru AMA. Why not dump 'em and let the uniformed and ignorant bureaucrats in our government figure out whatever rules their wisdom deems necessary to harness us. Then the nearest legal place to fly RC of course won't be in Mich. or Colo. or Fla. Saturday AM we can just load up and drive to Scotland or Australia to get our thumb time.
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Old 02-27-2007, 12:30 PM
  #11  
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Default RE: New Radios and AMA

At least we have some people that can still read a post , and yes I am still a AMA member 36417
But still wonder what we should do width" Muncie"
Lets waite till next year and see the count of members I will bet it is lower when 72 mhz radios prices drop and spectrum hits the big box stores.
Then Maybe the faze out of the old and in with the new!!!!!!!!!
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Old 02-27-2007, 12:56 PM
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Default RE: New Radios and AMA


ORIGINAL: Phaedrus-MMVI

"....it is very unlikely that even without the AMA being involved that any RC company would have the right to "sell" off any part of the radio spectrum we use."
Sorry, I did not use adequate verbiage to make it clear. I meant that with AMA's phase-in plan at first we used the even channels, then the odd channels were phased in. The RC industry COULD have by FCC legality early on sold radios on the odd channels and the non-AMA people would may have flocked to those freqs. as no AMA members could be using them on charter club facilities. On those facilities where AMA Charter Clubs share space with non-AMA members, the non-AMA member would have had a big advantage thus a market WAS available. The industry did follow AMA's lead.

Would they now? Well, AMA had no hand in developing the 2.4 GHz. AMA definitely did get the 72 MHz. spread. I helped.

Again, AMA through inner political problems and power plays with poor leadership has lost its once recognized position as the leader in the aeromodeling spectrum. Change can be at the ballot. YOUR CHOICE.

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Old 02-27-2007, 01:25 PM
  #13  
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Default RE: New Radios and AMA

ORIGINAL: RC Outlaw

What will the new system do to AMA membership , when you get out from under the proverbial thumb. Just thinking with my thumbs
I don't think it will have a significant impact on membership. People join flying clubs to fly with people of like mind and interest. It is more fun flying with other people. Whether it is RC clubs, photography clubs, gun clubs, hunting clubs, or any other kind of club people like to share and share in the fun.

Clubs generally make it easier to learn as you have instructors, or coaches, or just friendly guys who will help out. And when that plane gets broken, there are people to help you figure out how to fix it. Sometimes they will even help you fix it.

As the new 2.4 GHz systems phase in there will be less conflict for channels on 72 mhz. The 72 MHz radios will still be around for many years to come, but there will be fewer and fewer. Just as FM replaced AM, but AM is still available today. So 2.4 will replace 72, but 72 will be around for a long time to come. There will be less chance of shoot downs and, hopefully less chance of interference from outside sources.

While I occasionally fly off field, mostly slope soaring, I prefer to fly at the club field. Less chance of people wandering into harms way and people will behave in a fashion appropriate to an air field. And I am not likely to be in conflict with soccor, baseball or other uses of open spaces. And the best part is seeing my friends, shooting the breeze, comparing planes and just having a good time together.

Sunday, after flying, we called the wives and all went out to dinner. It was great! I would have never met these great people if it were not for the club.

There are economies that come with club memberships. Discounts at hobby stores, shared cost to maintain a field and the like. And clubs can more easily organize events than can individuals. Group insurance, required by many local governments, is much cheaper than buying it on your own. And, when you are a member of a national organizaiton, you have resources to draw upon when you need them.

People will form clubs, join clubs and enjoy clubs for all the reasons they have in the past, because they enjoy doing things with other people who also enjoy those same things.

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Old 02-27-2007, 05:12 PM
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Default RE: New Radios and AMA

ORIGINAL: Hossfly


ORIGINAL: Phaedrus-MMVI

"....it is very unlikely that even without the AMA being involved that any RC company would have the right to "sell" off any part of the radio spectrum we use."
Sorry, I did not use adequate verbiage to make it clear. I meant that with AMA's phase-in plan at first we used the even channels, then the odd channels were phased in. The RC industry COULD have by FCC legality early on sold radios on the odd channels and the non-AMA people would may have flocked to those freqs. as no AMA members could be using them on charter club facilities. On those facilities where AMA Charter Clubs share space with non-AMA members, the non-AMA member would have had a big advantage thus a market WAS available. The industry did follow AMA's lead.

Would they now? Well, AMA had no hand in developing the 2.4 GHz. AMA definitely did get the 72 MHz. spread. I helped.

Again, AMA through inner political problems and power plays with poor leadership has lost its once recognized position as the leader in the aeromodeling spectrum. Change can be at the ballot. YOUR CHOICE.

Got it, and I agree. Sorry for missing your point. I thought you were talking about selling parts of the band, not the odd/even thing which I now recall!!

And I also agree about change being needed. I did not vote for the current leadership that past couple of times, but to no avail. Perhaps this next time around we will be able to make a change that will hopefully have a positive consequence.
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Old 02-28-2007, 06:34 PM
  #15  
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Default RE: New Radios and AMA


ORIGINAL: aeajr

ORIGINAL: RC Outlaw

What will the new system do to AMA membership , when you get out from under the proverbial thumb. Just thinking with my thumbs
I don't think it will have a significant impact on membership. People join flying clubs to fly with people of like mind and interest. It is more fun flying with other people. Whether it is RC clubs, photography clubs, gun clubs, hunting clubs, or any other kind of club people like to share and share in the fun.

Clubs generally make it easier to learn as you have instructors, or coaches, or just friendly guys who will help out. And when that plane gets broken, there are people to help you figure out how to fix it. Sometimes they will even help you fix it.

As the new 2.4 GHz systems phase in there will be less conflict for channels on 72 mhz. The 72 MHz radios will still be around for many years to come, but there will be fewer and fewer. Just as FM replaced AM, but AM is still available today. So 2.4 will replace 72, but 72 will be around for a long time to come. There will be less chance of shoot downs and, hopefully less chance of interference from outside sources.

While I occasionally fly off field, mostly slope soaring, I prefer to fly at the club field. Less chance of people wandering into harms way and people will behave in a fashion appropriate to an air field. And I am not likely to be in conflict with soccor, baseball or other uses of open spaces. And the best part is seeing my friends, shooting the breeze, comparing planes and just having a good time together.

Sunday, after flying, we called the wives and all went out to dinner. It was great! I would have never met these great people if it were not for the club.

There are economies that come with club memberships. Discounts at hobby stores, shared cost to maintain a field and the like. And clubs can more easily organize events than can individuals. Group insurance, required by many local governments, is much cheaper than buying it on your own. And, when you are a member of a national organizaiton, you have resources to draw upon when you need them.

People will form clubs, join clubs and enjoy clubs for all the reasons they have in the past, because they enjoy doing things with other people who also enjoy those same things.

To bad that a lot of people in this hobby have not really got their feet wet in this hobby and been in the real world. There are to many looking for a free ride and could care less about the LHS Club or AMA.
When a LHS is operating on the bottom line club have membership problems and flying fields are being lost and harder to find you wonder where some people get their information.
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Old 03-04-2007, 06:51 PM
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Default RE: New Radios and AMA

I think there are close to 800,000 AMA menbers as of the 2007 year and probally half have back orders on some kind of 2.4 gh radio gear like myself. When are we going to get our radios? Warren AMA 788065
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Old 03-04-2007, 07:03 PM
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Default RE: New Radios and AMA


ORIGINAL: whulbert

I think there are close to 800,000 AMA menbers as of the 2007 year and probally half have back orders on some kind of 2.4 gh radio gear like myself. When are we going to get our radios? Warren AMA 788065
If you are talking about the American Medical Association, the American Motorcycle Association, The American Management Association, American Metallurgical Association combined you might make 800,000. But our Academy of Model Aeronautics stands at about 160,000. I seriously doubt any of the other AMAs are really fighting us for Spectra DX-7 radios. In our club in a fairly active modeling zone there are only about a half dozen at most, and no one else is going for them at this time.
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Old 03-04-2007, 08:33 PM
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Default RE: New Radios and AMA


ORIGINAL: Red Scholefield


ORIGINAL: whulbert

I think there are close to 800,000 AMA menbers as of the 2007 year and probally half have back orders on some kind of 2.4 gh radio gear like myself. When are we going to get our radios? Warren AMA 788065
If you are talking about the American Medical Association, the American Motorcycle Association, The American Management Association, American Metallurgical Association combined you might make 800,000. But our Academy of Model Aeronautics stands at about 160,000. I seriously doubt any of the other AMAs are really fighting us for Spectra DX-7 radios. In our club in a fairly active modeling zone there are only about a half dozen at most, and no one else is going for them at this time.
Without venturing at this time into the issue of whether it helps or hinders AMA, I do think it helps foster aeromodeling overall. For one thing, if park flyers widely embrace the technology (and it appears they are), it might cause the fears of the old established club denizens over RF interference from them to evaporate and lead to an improvement in relations. Also, in the major city park of a metropolis near where I maintain a domicile, an AMA chartered club threw in the towel and closed after a few years of operation due to RFI that made safe flying impossible. I expect it would still be around if SS R/C gear were available then.

Abel
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Old 03-09-2007, 10:24 PM
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Default RE: New Radios and AMA


ORIGINAL: Hossfly


Would they now? Well, AMA had no hand in developing the 2.4 GHz. AMA definitely did get the 72 MHz. spread. I helped.

Again, AMA through inner political problems and power plays with poor leadership has lost its once recognized position as the leader in the aeromodeling spectrum. Change can be at the ballot. YOUR CHOICE.

Hi Hossfly,

THanks for your work on this. One question I had was what the AMA plans to do with our present bands? Who would be the one to contact? My feeling is that we could have many of the features 2.4gHz has if there was something similar to the gold sticker program of years past. For example if the scan before transmiting feature as in Multiplex/Polk radios were mandated over say 10 years. Sure this would take time but would allow us to slowly phase out our current equipment, and insure that we don't lose our present frequencies should the need arise. I'm experimenting with 2.4gHz right now but wonder what will happen in the future as the band becomes even more crowed.
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Old 03-10-2007, 12:18 AM
  #20  
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Default RE: New Radios and AMA

Reference anything about AMA and the order of the frequency spectrums now, I suggest you contact what used to be the "Frequency Committee". That stuff is beyond me. My efforts stopped way back in Nov. '81.

Electronic Technology Committee: (4/06) (Formerly Frequency Committee) Mission Statement: To support the Academy by monitoring, maintaining, and developing electronic technology areas of modeling through liaison with government, industry, and membership groups. Bob Aberle (NY); Bill Hershberger (VA); Warren Plohr (MI); George Steiner (CA); Jack Albrecht (CA); Jeff Holsinger; Steve Kaluf, Coordinator (no vote); Tony Stillman (FL); Dan Williams; Pete Waters (MI); Bob Underwood, Advisor; Red Scholefield.

The RC industry, such as it was in the '70s in metamorphosis between US made and Japanese / Korean produced products, provided AMA practically NO support in AMA's work for the current channel freqs we use today. I have no clue where, how, when, what or IF the above committee was involved, or was even aware of J.R.'s efforts to bring the 2.4 GH to the market.

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Old 03-12-2007, 12:12 PM
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Will do, Thanks!
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Old 03-16-2007, 08:46 PM
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Default RE: New Radios and AMA

Is the USA .....FCC ...... controlling all of the worlds RC frequencies.
Or can they just go to what they want?
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Old 03-16-2007, 11:31 PM
  #23  
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Default RE: New Radios and AMA

If you guys recall the whole "1991" thing....(actually, the time leading up to it)

EVEN frequencies came into play first because the "new" frequencies had to be able to work alongside the old, 80khz spacing radios still in use at the time. There was NO market for "ODD" frequencies at that point because to do so would have likely been disastrous.

When the calendar said "1991"...the old 80khz spacing radios were no longer "approved' , and the ODD frequencies were then put into play.

Gold stickers....Silver stickers....etc, et al. It was easier to just suck it up and go buy a new radio. I needed one anyhow.

Overall, AMA did a pretty good job in managing that situation. It pays to understand however, that the AMA has little (if any) say in how the FCC allocates bandwidth. Mostly, they just try and manage that slice of the spectrum authorized for our purposes. The "narrow band" thing was just a method of allowing more people to use LESS bandwidth. (Yes, we lost 75mhz to surface only use)

FCC has no say outside of the US, but they do work with world bodies to establish global standards (such as with 2.4ghz).

Anybody need an old AM job on 72.320?

<GG>





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Old 03-17-2007, 07:23 AM
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Default RE: New Radios and AMA

Guys,

The Electronic Technology Committee has the power to push the FCC anywhere? Come on now. The FCC will do what they want. They gave us our channels due to it was the right thing for them to do. The AMA got us the channels? No, they asked for the channels. That was it. If the RC channels was needed by a state agency we would not have those channels.

I hate hearing I did this and I did that. Look at me guys. If it was not for me you could not fly. Please. Maybe you will let these folks pull your leg but not mine. I paid for my radio and I will fly even if the FCC tells me I can no longer use my radio. But they will not do that. Like the goverment man is wanting to take our hobby away. Get a life and go fly.

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Old 03-17-2007, 08:23 AM
  #25  
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Default RE: New Radios and AMA

Is posting accurate information pretty much just wasted space on R/CU?
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