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Solutions for AMA's membership decline

Old 09-10-2010, 07:02 AM
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fliers1
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Default Solutions for AMA's membership decline

Quite a lot has been said about the decline in AMA's membership and the possible cause, but maybe it's about time to discuss real workable solutions.

Fliers1
Old 09-10-2010, 09:33 AM
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KidEpoxy
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Default RE: Solutions for AMA's membership decline

Well, I dont have any particulars...
but we know the AMA figured it was worth a shot
to offer a membership tier with a cheap magazine to replace MA and sell the tier for almost HALF what Open pay.

While that tier had a bunch of problems,
the concept they(muncie) fronted, that you can have a $26 cheaper membership without MA,
is worth considering in a different, less restrictive application to appeal to all aeromodelers... details TBD

Worth a shot, right?
Old 09-10-2010, 09:46 AM
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fliers1
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Default RE: Solutions for AMA's membership decline

Yep. Whatever works. I wonder if it's the money. AMA has had the Sign 3 Fly Free Ambassador program going on 10 years and so far, that hasn't worked very well. Some complain about paying $58 and were given the opportunity for free membership, yet didn't take advantage of it. Could it be that difficult to sign up 3 people? I find it very easy to do so.

Fliers
Old 09-10-2010, 09:47 AM
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Default RE: Solutions for AMA's membership decline

My 2 cents worth....

Any time sales are down, a lot of sellers reduce the price to make the goods more attractive. How about a dues reduction?

(Not trying to stir up trouble. Just the opinion of an old sales manager.)
Old 09-10-2010, 09:56 AM
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KidEpoxy
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Default RE: Solutions for AMA's membership decline

Fliers
You are hitting on what I referred to as Restrictive appeal.
What if a guy really wanted to use the Sign3 program, and got 2 guys... but couldnt find a 3rd.
Was the program popular? To him it really was but to AMA he didnt take advantage of it.

Thats why I suggested having a less restrictive program
that folks can just check one box or another to take advantage of. Just offer
_ $58 Open with MA monthly mag
_ $32 Open with ParkPilot quarterly mag (from ppp withMA figures)
then publish how many folks are taking advantage of the program, and if it is staying above the Exit Cutoff levels
Old 09-10-2010, 10:01 AM
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Default RE: Solutions for AMA's membership decline


ORIGINAL: fliers1

Quite a lot has been said about the decline in AMA's membership and the possible cause, but maybe it's about time to discuss real workable solutions.

Fliers1
I have pressed this one for years, fliers1, just as you have your instruction methods. In this day and age, the message needs to be out there where people see it without having to go HUNT for it, like web sites, etc., and especially depending on kit and engine importers.

TAKE Model Aviation PUBLIC. GET MA ON THE NEWSSTANDS. There could be a special issue for newsstands such as eliminating the DVP reports but have a page advertising that such reports are available if one joins AMA and receives the full magazine including events in their area, along with club information.

There is just too much in today's world for a person to go hunting clubs and facilities. They go hunting for models on line and find what they want very easily. Now just who - without any prior knowledge - have any idea to look for "Academy"??? of Model Aeronautics" They are not looking for a school just one of those toy remote control airplanes with a "controller" GAG! [sm=tongue_smile.gif]
Old 09-10-2010, 10:24 AM
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Arbo
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Default RE: Solutions for AMA's membership decline

I do not often agree with Horrace, but he is correct. It is about visibility... and quite frankly that seems to be one of the areas the organization is not doing a good job. It is a waste of time and money for them to preach to the choir...
Old 09-10-2010, 01:10 PM
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Jim Thomerson
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Default RE: Solutions for AMA's membership decline

Friend told me they have fantastic jumprope shows at halftime in basketball games. From videos I have seen, it should not be too hard to put together an indoor RC aerobatic team which could do the same function. Also the AMA might try TV coverage of National and World Championship events. Other non professional sports do it, so why not model aviation?
Old 09-10-2010, 03:07 PM
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Default RE: Solutions for AMA's membership decline

Jim, I fully believe that such could be accomplished. In addition why does AMA NOT have a news team waiting for our FAI International Teams when they come home from the FAI World-Wide events? This is especially so when a teen ager comes home as a World Champion, FF a couple years ago, and other young fellows that do well.

The news people won't come without notices, however the AMA could invite and if properly motivated then they will come and attention to our excelling in foreign relations would go public. It can be done, if the membership really wanted it.

Now the AMA has hired more folks to do this email newsletter, [email protected], which I am sure you have recently received. A few minutes ago for me. AGAIN, simply preaching to the choir.

While the Peter Principle and Parkinson's Law appear to me to be rampant within the AMA Bureaucracy, I think it is past the time for the EC to demand other forms of contact than to see how many letters, etc., etc. can be funneled to the same people and continue to ignore the thousands of would-be members within the aeromodeling spectrum.
I think the PPP was a feeble attempt at such, but, IMO, the individuals were far too few to be of consequence.
Old 09-10-2010, 09:01 PM
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Default RE: Solutions for AMA's membership decline

I would have to add a vote of support for what Hoss has been sayingespecially the part about putting MA on the news stands. The majority of the cost of publication is already being borne by the membership issues.
Old 09-10-2010, 09:27 PM
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Default RE: Solutions for AMA's membership decline

Put MA in general circulation like a real magazine.
Get media coverage of events.
Contact PBS, History Channel etc. to do a documentary on the museum and history of model aviation.
Embrace the full spectrum of model aviation, not just the flying aspect.
Work with schools to establish indoor flying and building clubs.
Work with park and recreational services to open more public lands to park fliers without AMA membership requirements.
Give to the public more, and take less.
"Cast thy loaves upon the waters and they shall be returned manyfold."
Old 09-10-2010, 09:41 PM
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K-Bob
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Default RE: Solutions for AMA's membership decline


ORIGINAL: dbcisco

Put MA in general circulation like a real magazine.
Get media coverage of events.
Contact PBS, History Channel etc. to do a documentary on the museum and history of model aviation.
Embrace the full spectrum of model aviation, not just the flying aspect.
Work with schools to establish indoor flying and building clubs.
Work with park and recreational services to open more public lands to park fliers without AMA membership requirements.
Give to the public more, and take less.
"Cast thy loaves upon the waters and they shall be returned manyfold."
Note the bolded line in the quote. Could you possibly elaborate? What aspects of the aeromodeling experience do you feel the AMAdoes not address?
Old 09-10-2010, 10:47 PM
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Default RE: Solutions for AMA's membership decline


ORIGINAL: K-Bob


ORIGINAL: dbcisco

Put MA in general circulation like a real magazine.
Get media coverage of events.
Contact PBS, History Channel etc. to do a documentary on the museum and history of model aviation.
Embrace the full spectrum of model aviation, not just the flying aspect.
Work with schools to establish indoor flying and building clubs.
Work with park and recreational services to open more public lands to park fliers without AMA membership requirements.
Give to the public more, and take less.
''Cast thy loaves upon the waters and they shall be returned manyfold.''
Note the bolded line in the quote. Could you possibly elaborate? What aspects of the aeromodeling experience do you feel the AMA does not address?
Not answering for dbcisco but check this:

Marketing Committee (P) (4/05):
Chair: Mark Smith
Mission Statement: “Will advise the president and Executive Council on programs to attract and retain AMA Members.â€Committee Members: Don Anderson, Eric Meyers, Mark Cleveland

Just which disciplines will this group adhere to? Do you even know who they are?
Old 09-10-2010, 11:11 PM
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dbcisco
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Default RE: Solutions for AMA's membership decline

ORIGINAL: K-Bob
Note the bolded line in the quote. Could you possibly elaborate? What aspects of the aeromodeling experience do you feel the AMA does not address?
Engineering, Electronics, Structural design, Drafting, Aerodynamics, Craftsmanship, on and on.
Focusing on driving a car does not address much in the way of mechanics, body repair and automotive engineering.
To wit:
The major function of the AMA has become arranging flying competition and establishing flying clubs. That is missing all the work that goes into designing and making a model, let alone getting it to fly.
My favorite suggestion was a plank to plane completion. Similar to the sheep to shawl competitions at our county fairs. Contestants get identical plans and materials and have a given amount of time to complete the aircraft.
Easiest way to do it would be contestants buy their own Guillows kit and tools (identical kits for everyone and a list of allowed tools) then they are judged at the end on completeness, quality of workmanship etc.
AMA sponsored workshops and demos on the drafting, electronics and other engineering principles behind the design and fabrication of a flying model.
For electronics the FAA allows homemade 27Mhz radios and building one would be very educational and fully legal to use according to the FAA.
As much as RC sims are bemoaned by many, it is a valid and important aspect of this hobby that is much overlooked and maligned. Using the 3D modeling packages for them (I use Reflex in my class) is an excellent way to teach a valuable drafting concept as well as modeling.
I have yet to see the AMA do much toward any of this. Almost all I see, read and hear is "fly".
Old 09-11-2010, 01:08 AM
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Default RE: Solutions for AMA's membership decline

It's very simple. Convince the guys who would rather spend their free time and money on everything else except for model planes [those large enough to need a AMA type facility] and get them to drop one or all of their other leisure time pursuits so they can free up the extra time and money to get into our hobby.

Simple as pie. Convince all those aimless, misguided souls who would rather hunt, fish, snowboard, jet ski, camp, golf, garden, play video games, 4 wheel, dirt bike, ski, travel, gym rat, watch and attend sports events, drink alcohol and take drugs, fly full scale, drag race, road race, street rod, bet on horses, go to casinos, play with RC cars, devote themselves to their children's activities, etc., etc., convince them all to set aside $500 to $1000 to just get started with a basic plane and outfit, plus the associated dues and fees that go along with it. Don't forget to explain the "crashing part", while you're at it.

This hobby has more competition than ever before PLUS it just isn't as exciting to see a plane guided via the miracle of electronic wizardry as it once was, once upon a time.
The novelty has largely worn off, believe it or not.
Old 09-11-2010, 02:30 AM
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Default RE: Solutions for AMA's membership decline

One way is to make the AMA more attractive by making the insurance primary, I think their old method of using the clubs to recruit is not working as well as
before because people finding moreways to fly without joining a club.
Old 09-11-2010, 05:33 AM
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Default RE: Solutions for AMA's membership decline


ORIGINAL: fliers1

Yep. Whatever works. I wonder if it's the money. AMA has had the Sign 3 Fly Free Ambassador program going on 10 years and so far, that hasn't worked very well. Some complain about paying $58 and were given the opportunity for free membership, yet didn't take advantage of it. Could it be that difficult to sign up 3 people? I find it very easy to do so.

Fliers
I can state exactly why this program does not work for me. It may work for others, just not feasible for me. I would expend way more than 58$ attempting to get three people to sign up. Just that simple.

I just pay the 58$ and save the 10 plus hours (who knows how many hours it would take) hunting down folks and trying to explain why the AMA is for them! Soliciting for the AMA is extremely difficult in the rural area in which I live.
Old 09-11-2010, 05:36 AM
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Default RE: Solutions for AMA's membership decline

ORIGINAL: dbcisco

Put MA in general circulation like a real magazine.
Get media coverage of events.
Contact PBS, History Channel etc. to do a documentary on the museum and history of model aviation.
Embrace the full spectrum of model aviation, not just the flying aspect.
Work with schools to establish indoor flying and building clubs.
Work with park and recreational services to open more public lands to park fliers without AMA membership requirements.
Give to the public more, and take less.
''Cast thy loaves upon the waters and they shall be returned manyfold.''
DB, you need to cease and decist because you are making way too much sense and you know no one really likes you because of that [X(]

Luchnia-busy trying to make an axehead float
Old 09-11-2010, 05:36 AM
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fliers1
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Default RE: Solutions for AMA's membership decline

If you want something done right...do it yourself.

How about everyone doing the Johnny Appleseed thing? What I mean is, why wait for AMA to do something that I think they will never do, like everyone leaving MA and old or new related magazines everywhere you go. Every place that has a waiting room for example. For that matter, dropping magazines anywhere, instead of just throwing them away where no one will ever read them. Pehaps clubs could leave their contact information in these magazines.

I have spoken to Mark Cleveland concerning already in the works and very successful marketing methods. I would like to contact Don Anderson, but have no idea how to reach him.

Fliers1
Old 09-11-2010, 06:36 AM
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Default RE: Solutions for AMA's membership decline

For what it's worth, what if we look at it from the perspective of a different business, for example, health clubs? Why do people spend money to join a health club? To gain access to facilities and equipment they can't duplicate easily at home. I think the key to membership then becomes a combinations of facilities (flying fields) and equipment (planes to fly). I spent a long time working public policy issues as the deputy commander at a large military installation. If I learned anything, it's that you have to create an incentive for people to behave as you would like. In this case, we need an incentive for new people to join AMA and thus join the hobby.

So, what if we create a structure where those who sign up for AMA via a chartered club would then have access to facilities (the field) and equipment (trainer & radio) to learn on for only 58 bucks (plus fuel). AMA and industry partners would really help by subsidizing (if not providing) equipment for clubs to use for this purpose, with some sort of accountability of course. It would be easy enough to design procedures so that the equipment stays at the club, is maintained by the club, and all flying is done at the club under supervision. Additional benefits would include: soften the sticker shock of jumping into the hobby, and putting them on a path to success (solo). At the end of solo phase, they'd be expected to get their own equipment. Perhaps then a further incentive would be that a renewal of membership would enable a new flyer to purchase one sport airplane package at cost from vendor partners.

Any thoughts?
Frank
Old 09-11-2010, 06:48 AM
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Chris P. Bacon
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Default RE: Solutions for AMA's membership decline

The way I see it, the membership decline has very little to do with the AMA and has a lot to do with the AMA membership itself. We are our own worst enemy!

I've been a member of several clubs (some big and some small) over the years and there is no bigger single turnoff to this hobby than the beacuracy, lack of creativity, lack of innovation, and "can't do" attitude that emanates in many clubs today. Clubs are the lifeblood of the AMA and if members (especially newcomers) aren't happy then they either find another club (which is not always easy or convenient depending on their location) or leave the hobby altogether and find another hobby.

Don't get me wrong, there are some great clubs out there, but I think they are the excpetion rather than the rule.

If you think the decline in AMA membership is because of the AMA, that very thought is the problem.





Old 09-11-2010, 07:11 AM
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Default RE: Solutions for AMA's membership decline

ORIGINAL: franklin_m

For what it's worth, what if we look at it from the perspective of a different business, for example, health clubs? Why do people spend money to join a health club? To gain access to facilities and equipment they can't duplicate easily at home. I think the key to membership then becomes a combinations of facilities (flying fields) and equipment (planes to fly). I spent a long time working public policy issues as the deputy commander at a large military installation. If I learned anything, it's that you have to create an incentive for people to behave as you would like. In this case, we need an incentive for new people to join AMA and thus join the hobby.

So, what if we create a structure where those who sign up for AMA via a chartered club would then have access to facilities (the field) and equipment (trainer & radio) to learn on for only 58 bucks (plus fuel). AMA and industry partners would really help by subsidizing (if not providing) equipment for clubs to use for this purpose, with some sort of accountability of course. It would be easy enough to design procedures so that the equipment stays at the club, is maintained by the club, and all flying is done at the club under supervision. Additional benefits would include: soften the sticker shock of jumping into the hobby, and putting them on a path to success (solo). At the end of solo phase, they'd be expected to get their own equipment. Perhaps then a further incentive would be that a renewal of membership would enable a new flyer to purchase one sport airplane package at cost from vendor partners.

Any thoughts?
Frank
It has been said, we are the AMA, but those at AMA headquarters are fully aware of a readily available solution but refuse to investigate this solution. Why? Who knows? Meanwhile, the problem still exists.

We don't know of just how many clubs, whose members have a problem with growth in their ranks.
Fear of overcrowded flight lines, what could turn out to be a endless number of beginners showing up to burden an already insufficent number of club instructors. Once they burn out and quit, those who thought they might like to "give back" and volunteer, will have second thoughts.

No instructors, no new members, no new fliers, no new instructors. Logic 101.

Fliers1

Old 09-11-2010, 08:31 AM
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Default RE: Solutions for AMA's membership decline

Not much of a flier but have dabbled, more of a boater. This hobby has changed a lot over the last 10+ years, It used to be if you wanted to play with rc you had to build from a kit, buy from a local shop or one of the few mail order places. Now people can buy a ready to run model from China for a couple hundred bucks, so buddy buys his toy and goes to run it only to be told he has to join a local club for x$, and shell out 60$ for an AMA membership, all of a sudden this guy finds out he has to spend over half the cost of his model just for the honor of being able to run it!?
I think the club should be the AMA member and hold the insurance for all club members, you are covered when you join the club. Lots of activities are run this way. This would cut down on paper work and overhead as dealing with a couple hundred clubs would be much easier than thousands of individual members. Would remove another layer for the new guy who just wants to play with his new toy.
Put the mag on line only, why waste the paper time and money to publish and mail out something that is archaic.
I don't know what but something has to be done to bring younger people into more aspects of the hobby, when I was a kid almost everyone on the "block" had a cox .049 c/l plane, and flew in the field at the school, now the cops would be there in less than 5 minutes! They actually passed a law in the town I live in now in Canada banning ball hockey from the city streets!
As soon a people need insurance they immediately think this must be dangerous then, if the insurance was "hidden" by the club it would help to do away with the image of a burning plane plummeting into a crowd! The kid with the plane might not think that but the mom who doesn't actually understand the hobby is the one we need to convince.
Our club is fully insured is a much more comforting idea than you need this insurance incase you crash your plane into something and your not allowed to fly without it!
In these current financial times it is hard enough trying to find enough money for any pastime, but hitting a new guy with multiple layers of added expences is a sure way to make somebody decide this is too expensive.
A club membership that included a small percentage off at a LHS, insurance and help learning to fly is a much better way of packaging I think.
Junior beginner flyer incentives through the club, most improved young flyer as voted by the club gets a kit that he can put all his ARF stuff into say not another ARF but something he/she has to build a portion of at least. As adults I really don't think we need programs like this to keep us focused but to kids a bit of incentive can go a long way.
I got hooked on this hobby as a kid and have gotten 30+ years of enjoyment so far out of all the various forms of RC modeling from control line to sailboats.
Like it or not they are the future of this hobby and we NEED to hook more of them! Gotta show them there is more to life than a video game!
I know AMA does much more than just insurance but to most people thats about where it ends, they don't care about competition, think about the frequencies they are using etc, they just want to play for a few hours relax and have some fun.
As I've been into RC forever it seems I don't mind paying the "little club" dues and the "big club" dues I know what they do behind the scenes trying to keep the government off out backs etc. But to the new guy it must just seem like somebody wanting money a "fun tax"
There is no simple solution the problem is on too many levels.
Old 09-11-2010, 08:46 AM
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Default RE: Solutions for AMA's membership decline

ok this don't happen but i, i, i agree with hossfly on some of his points ..................... must be the CA !
i hate to say this but as long as i have been doing the RC airplane thing i had forgottin' all about the AMA till i moved to florida (it could have been all the CA) it was only when i started looking for a place to fly when i started seeing "you need to be a AMA member to fly here" that i remembered the organization.

it was after that and i know alot of you hate me for this is that i started seeing all these clubs and some charge a little and some charge alot and some take it to the extreme and i'll say it again (do to the CA is my new excuse) the AMA needs to get some kind of structure into the charging that clubs have there needs to be a high and low just in the name of fairness, believe me i understand taxs, rent and all that but come on the best excuse can't be "we charge depending on what we want to do" that makes no sense .

i don't know maybe i'm the only one but it is my main reason for not joining as of yet . and most use words such as sanctioned and charter to explain there clubs .

the best numb minded answer to that question to date for me was .............."if the AMA was to do something like that we'd drop the AMA" now hearing someone say something like that really makes you wonder were is there loyalty .

ok i won't harp on this, this time i need my CA fix !!!!!!!
Old 09-11-2010, 11:40 AM
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Default RE: Solutions for AMA's membership decline


ORIGINAL: combatpigg

It's very simple. Convince the guys who would rather spend their free time and money on everything else except for model planes [those large enough to need a AMA type facility] and get them to drop one or all of their other leisure time pursuits so they can free up the extra time and money to get into our hobby.

Simple as pie. Convince all those aimless, misguided souls who would rather hunt, fish, snowboard, jet ski, camp, golf, garden, play video games, 4 wheel, dirt bike, ski, travel, gym rat, watch and attend sports events, drink alcohol and take drugs, fly full scale, drag race, road race, street rod, bet on horses, go to casinos, play with RC cars, devote themselves to their children's activities, etc., etc., convince them all to set aside $500 to $1000 to just get started with a basic plane and outfit, plus the associated dues and fees that go along with it. Don't forget to explain the ''crashing part'', while you're at it.

This hobby has more competition than ever before PLUS it just isn't as exciting to see a plane guided via the miracle of electronic wizardry as it once was, once upon a time.
The novelty has largely worn off, believe it or not.
By Jove I think you nailed it.

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