Sport_Pilot

Seems to me the selection and options for their glow ARF's has gone downhill. Especially the sport planes. Some of the scale planes look interesting, but seems too many scale ARF's have no retract option. IMO scale planes with wire RC gear hanging down looks kinda dumb. Unless a simi scale sport scale, but many ot theirs look to be serious scale planes but with no retracts and plain wire gear.

Oberst

I thought I was the only one noticing that. I agree with you 100%! I noticed it seems that manufactures are trying to force everyone to go electric because all I see new now are electric planes. I guess because electric planes are cheaper to produce and they sell more of them because all we need is a small field to fly them, and we can get away from joining any club or have the planes insured by the AMA.

I suspect people like me are getting hit hard by the economy so people are switching to electric or parkflyer because it's over all cheaper. But I'm a hard head and refuse to either switch to 2.4 radio's or electric planes. That's just me and I enjoy having that choice.

I left electric planes and moved up to glow/gas after my first year in flying. If they don't start making scale glow ARF aircraft soon, it looks like I'm going to ditch the whole ARF thing and go back to kit building.

I've pestered GP and Hanger 9 about it already and they don't seem to care. It's more about making money to them than making the consumer (Us) happy. What angers me a little is these manufactures like discontinuing good ARF models right after around the 3 year mark and parts are almost impossible to come by.

Did it ever occur to GP or Horizon that if they continued making parts for discontinued planes that they could make a better investment? Ask Fiberglass Specialties, they'll tell you they make a killing off of discontinued Kit/ARF cowls and wheel pants if you guys don't believe me.


Ohhh you got me started now.lol


Pete

TLH101

My Feedback: (90)

Most manufactures are in it for the money. It is a business after all, so they produce what sells.

Oberst

True, I guess the days of people in the business enjoying our hobby on the side of running the business is over. That's why it's the way it is now- all business.


Very sad.


Pete

gmeyer-RCU

My Feedback: (9)

I have noticed this too, I have a BH models sprinter that they used to sell I found it to be a good flying plane and a good quality ARF.
Greg

ira d

You'r correct it's the same when you go into their stores also.

ThunderbirdJunkie

My Feedback: (3)

Why would you continue making things that don't sell?

Then you have a business that goes under, and more unemployed people...then they don't make anything anybody wants. Then the people that work for Great Planes, Horizon, etc, that do enjoy the hobby no longer have a job to support it, or their family.

There are more choices for glow powered ARFs now than there were 15 years ago...what's the problem?

As electric options get bigger, your glow options get bigger, too. In case you haven't noticed, E-flite has a metric crap ton of .15 size models that could be converted for glow (oh no, there's work involved? Darn!), so you, too, can get away with flying at a smaller field. OS does still make .10, .15 and up glow engines. An OS FS30 in a .25 size E-flite SuperCub would be awesome! Or what about an E-flite .15 size Pitts Model 12 with a .25AX?

The only options getting smaller for glow powered aircraft now is peoples' willingness to convert or ability to come up with something with thinking that goes outside the box.

Oberst

I only fly .46ts to 150FS glow aircraft and planning on going gas in a few years. A dinky little electric toy plane doesn't cut it with me. And I'm sure most of us who fly large aircraft feel the same way. Sure it's OK for Park Flying, but I'm not into that. How about making more Gas/Glow ARF's than just electric? So far all I've been seeing coming out new is electric and a good number of us don't fly electric and not planning to switch or buy dinky glow motors to convert small semi scale electric planes, just because some company wants to get cheap.

Time to go back building Kits again, they seemed to survive the ARF invasion and now since the ARF Glow/Gas market is going down hill, the Kits are doing well again and beginning to thrive from what BUSA said. GT and Proctors is doing well from what I read from the build threads, I talked to the owner of Proctors and he told me over the phone that he's is having fun trying to keep up with the orders when I ordered some hardware from him.

Also another issue that GP, Hanger 9 and Topflite miss the mark is how many P-51's, P-47's, Spitfires, Yaks, Edges, Extra's and Cubs are on the market, not to mention other manufacturers has their own version of the same planes. How about selling a ARF no one else has? It was Dumb for GP to get rid of the 60 Fokker, Geebee, Seawind and Spirit of St.Louis Ryan and Hanger 9 to get rid of the .60 Fokker DVII and Camel. The Fokker DVII was only on the market for 4 years and Camel for 5. That's Terrible! At least GP keeps their models in production a little longer.

ESM is doing well because they sell good quality ARF aircraft and they come out with stuff that no one else sells, like the Do-335, Focke Wulf 190D-9, BF-110, Val etc.

It seems that the scale glow/gas ARF fans are left out in the cold in this bad recession. Like I said, time to build kits again. Besides, I build better than the Chinese so maybe that's a good thing that I go back to the old ways.

Another reason why GP, Hanger 9 isn't doing well is they have no parts for discontinued ARF or Kits. Call up Fiberglass Specialties and ask how they are doing? I did, they are making a killing selling cowls and wheel pants for discontinued Kits/ARF aircraft and their quality is fantastic! I run into old planes and enjoy rebuilding them, it's a headache trying to find parts.

These companies have to start telling the Chinese what we want, not the other way around at the meetings or the ARF market will continue to go down hill.

Oh by the way, all those discontinued Kits and ARF airplanes on the market? They all eventually sell. Try to find a new 60 Great Planes Fokker Dr1 or Ryan still in the box- almost impossible and because it's discontinued, people don't sell them at a low price. They are considered a collectors item.

That's my take on it.


Pete

F4U Corsair

My Feedback: (22)

Pete, I agree with you on a lot of your points. I wish GP would also bring the 1/4 scale Pitts back. A bud has one using 50cc gas and it's so nice to fly and pretty aerobatic as well. Looks good in the air too. The DR1 is an outstanding airplane as you well know and we are both lucky to have one from GP. The GP Ryan in the military scheme is one of the best looking airplanes around. Wish they would bring them all back. BH makes some nice ARFs. Kits are great, but big kits from BUSA take so long to complete. That's where the beauty of an ARF comes in, especially when someone like you takes it and revives it as his own creation. Your work is outstanding!

I fly airplanes from 32" foamy electrics up to 1/4 scale gassers and for me everything has it's time and place. The little electrics (especially EPP foamies) are great 3d trainers. Companys like 3dhs, extreme flight, and PA all sell both e, glow, and gas airplanes. Their electrics fly as good as lots of glow airplanes I've flown/owned. I've got a few electrics up to 68" WS, glow up to 60 size, and gas on anything bigger (hate the cost of glow fuel).

Oberst

I agree and yes glow does cost a bit don't it? The big electric scale planes are OK, and I like some of the ducted fans. I'm just waiting for a scale Me-262 ducted fan ARF that's about 1/6 scale. That I would assemble or build depending on how detailed and scale it was. I guess foamies are great for beating on, I'm just not a big fan of owning any electric plane other than maybe a large scale ducted fan Me-262.

I guess I'll be one of those if the wind starts acting up, I'll be the one watching you fly while I sit on the picnic table.


Pete

ThunderbirdJunkie

My Feedback: (3)

Horizon and Great Planes are not suffering because they're selling stuff everybody else wants. Remember that numbers that look huge to a small mom'n'pop outfit are too small to interest Horizon and GP, and your ideals are not mirrored by everybody else in the buying public. That's why some of your discontinued kits and ARFs go for a pretty penny; there are a few who want them, but not enough to interest Horizon and GP; otherwise they'd be making them.

If everybody else wanted big glow/gas ARFs, you bet your panties GP and Horizon would be catering to that; but they don't want them.

flycatch

My Feedback: (26)

Hobby People sell the BH and VQ line of scale ARFs. Some come with retracts but most don't. I have both the Pitts and AT-6 BH models and they are worth the costs for their scale outline and flyability.

opjose

BH's offerings have been curtailed greatly and Hobby-People's items reflect this....

Just when I wanted to buy a new 1.20+ Ryan STA from them too... sweet flying plane.

flycatch

My Feedback: (26)

It appears that cost is everything when in business and your right about Hobby People curtailing their BH line. Yesterday I paid them a visit and all that was on display were the VQ line of ARFs. Most modelers in todays market are not willing or able to afford the high price tag that BH has on their larger ARFs.

Sport_Pilot

So the crappy one sell better than the good ones? Nothing at Hobby People that interest me. Wasn't the case when they had Global and ModelTech. The VQ models don't look appealing on their site. Even the electrics don't look near as good as Horizon and Tower.

Sport_Pilot

The problem is that the above is incorrect, same for kits, not as many and quality is poor.

Sport_Pilot

Most into glow want .40 size and larger. 

Sport_Pilot

Glow fuel isn't that expensive.  Methanol is less than gasoline, its only the oil that costs money, still you can mix fuel for less than $7.  No nitro, but still cheap if you keep it at 10% or less.

captinjohn

Moki engines run great with no nitro .Methanol is about $3.50 a gallon. Add the correct lube and your good to go. Capt,n

K-Bob

My Feedback: (1)

In the case of Horizon, they offer more and better large scale AFRs than ever before. Add to that is that they consistently sell out. In general there have never been as many top end, quality built large scale ARFs available at any time in history. I would put the quality and craftsmanship of my Hangar 9 3.1M Su26 up against 95% of the builders out there. Maybe some should expand their horizons past the "Hobby People" web site.

ThunderbirdJunkie

My Feedback: (3)

You're absolutely right, there was some very unclear thinking going on with that post[&:]

That Pawnee is absolute pure sex.

LDM

My Feedback: (15)

In my humble opinion I cant get a read on Horison and Hobbico and the health of there business.This is my take (again opinion )
1)Hobby Lobby is hurting most of what they use to sell as there own is now avaiable at a much lower price via so many online outlets
2)Hobbico well all i know is that the more i advoid them , the more offers I get to buy , to me discount offers are not a sign of demand, as fact quite the opposite. I will give them cudos on the new Top Flight ARFs from the P40 to the Corsair ect , but oustide of that much of there intro are regeratated offers that have been imported into the USA already .
They just launched a small eflight Fw190 and its been in the states for 9 months via another online vender , yet they launched it as there own.
3)Horsion they seem to dance to there own beat , they have pulse on eletric but again they are getting knocked off by bad vendors that they must partner with in China ..Example , they probably did a ton of R & D on the new small eflight P47 , only to be knocked off by Hobby King . To me that means that the factory making the P47 , allowed another vendor (Hobby King ) to see and copy the design .Now we all know this is common in China but usually if a vender is doing high dollars , the factory trys to stay exclusive
4)Hobby People , I give them credit for there BH line , it was going strong but now seems to be very conservative with little news on NEW .
As Pere stated many trends are in eletric , I have been flying a lot of eflight and you can not believe the demand and threads on "whats new" "whats Next" ect .
Presales on planes that have not left the factory , pre orders , demand that exceed belief and common sence .
There is a new P40 coming at 78" in EPO with retracts and full house features , a corsair with Folding wings , ect ect , are they selling -beyond anything I see in fuel .
So as some have asked "why inventory things that are not selling" .
It difficult to tell but , a container of planes is expensive and if your not selling planes exclsuively then you have major competitors to deal with and if you are selling exclusive then you have major MOQs(minimum Order quantities ) to meet with the factory. Its all about the numbers .
I know when converting to eletric , I sold off my glow engines , many new in box 4 strokes , great deals ect , most were sold to oversea ebay buyers because I had zero interest from the USA rc community .
It seems interest is in Gas and Eletric as a trend .
Also as far as retracts , interesting trend as seen in some of the other post eletric is booming in retracts , small formats seem to really proving field equity , so its leaving more room for larger scale development .
In closing and on the original post , I know many will turn there heads up to this , but if you have ever flown a full house loaded warbird with fuel , heavy wing loading ect , its takes talent and skill , now you can fly something that looks the same (reall does ) and in some case better and mde from epo , and you can breath much easier and have higher chances of great success because the wing loading is nothing in comparision to a real RC warbird. However at the end of day , your chances of going home with your plane are much greater and this is definitly a trend that is sparking major demands and continued development in EPO Warbirds