New Giant GP Super Sportster!!!!!
06-01-2012, 05:26 AM
#1876
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RE: New Giant GP Super Sportster!!!!!
I did the flying wires and I sealed the hinge gaps. I did use the stock hardware and hinges and I am fully aware of everyones feelings on thatbut I took my time to make sure the installation was correct.Unfortunately money is a serious issue and even though each item is not much, it all adds up. I do plan on upgrading as time and budgetallows but my skills are limited to rolls, loops, some inverted flight and other very basic maneuvers. I never fly my planes at high speeds or put them into high G-loading situations as Iam basically still a novice. Based on flying reviews of the stock plane, I feel confident that she will be ok for what Iplan to do in the beginning. I will start with the pushrods when I can and then move to the hinges but in the meantime will keep an eye on the hinges after every outing. now I sure hope those servos arrive as Iam dying to fly. Looks like my MX track will be rained out so no flying and no riding makes for a very boring weekend indeed!!
06-01-2012, 09:28 AM
#1877
RE: New Giant GP Super Sportster!!!!!
ORIGINAL: Muttdog
Al, I am sorry but your post is a little hard to understand. First off you state ''You should be using metal gear servos'' but recommend karbonite gear servos. Second you state that the HS-5485HB servos have almost twice the torque but here are the specs for both from Tower:
HS-77BB
Speed: .18sec/60° @4.8V .14sec/60° @6.0V
Torque: 61.1 oz-in @4.8V, 76.3 oz-in @6.0V
and for the HS-5485HB
Speed: 0.20sec/60 degrees at 4.8V
Torque: 5.2 kg-cm (72 oz-in) at 4.8V
From these specs it appears that the difference is only 11 oz-in of torque. Certainly less torque but no where near half and a faster speed. Now I am running mine at 6.0 volts but even at the 4.8v specs it is well over the recommendations of the GSS plans. I definitely agree that the karbonite gears are better but the HS-77 does have one metal gear in it (I am assuming it is the gear with the most load on it but don't know) and when you look at both servos I am having a hard time understanding why I should simply throw away the HS-77's and label them as junk when it seems both are very similar. The one that failed on my plane was a used gift from my father in law as well as the other side of the elevator. I purchased 3 matching units for the ailerons and rudder as well just to keep things the same. IF there is a compelling argument to change them all out I will but these servos require a larger hole then a standard servo as they are wide so it will not be so simple to replace them. I have used JR digital servos before but to be honest I never noticed a difference from the standard Futaba S3004 servos that I have been using so not sure if digital is really necessary for me. I am still in the early stages of learning and do not require top of the line gear. I just want reliable and safe right now.
ORIGINAL: azalner
The HS-77BB is inappropriate for your application. You should be using metal gear servos.
In addition it appears that you have an intermittent connection to the feedback pot. Pitch the servo, it aint worth keeping!
I used Hitec HS-5485HB servos in a 30cc powered Edge 540. Flew it for two seasons before I re-kitted it. (Rolling harrier 10 ft off the ground - oops) I don't reuse servos after a bad crash. The HS-5485HB are digital with Karbonite gears and are very reasonably priced with almost twice the torque as the HS_77BB.
My advise - get rid of the HS-77's.
Al
The HS-77BB is inappropriate for your application. You should be using metal gear servos.
In addition it appears that you have an intermittent connection to the feedback pot. Pitch the servo, it aint worth keeping!
I used Hitec HS-5485HB servos in a 30cc powered Edge 540. Flew it for two seasons before I re-kitted it. (Rolling harrier 10 ft off the ground - oops) I don't reuse servos after a bad crash. The HS-5485HB are digital with Karbonite gears and are very reasonably priced with almost twice the torque as the HS_77BB.
My advise - get rid of the HS-77's.
Al
HS-77BB
Speed: .18sec/60° @4.8V .14sec/60° @6.0V
Torque: 61.1 oz-in @4.8V, 76.3 oz-in @6.0V
and for the HS-5485HB
Speed: 0.20sec/60 degrees at 4.8V
Torque: 5.2 kg-cm (72 oz-in) at 4.8V
From these specs it appears that the difference is only 11 oz-in of torque. Certainly less torque but no where near half and a faster speed. Now I am running mine at 6.0 volts but even at the 4.8v specs it is well over the recommendations of the GSS plans. I definitely agree that the karbonite gears are better but the HS-77 does have one metal gear in it (I am assuming it is the gear with the most load on it but don't know) and when you look at both servos I am having a hard time understanding why I should simply throw away the HS-77's and label them as junk when it seems both are very similar. The one that failed on my plane was a used gift from my father in law as well as the other side of the elevator. I purchased 3 matching units for the ailerons and rudder as well just to keep things the same. IF there is a compelling argument to change them all out I will but these servos require a larger hole then a standard servo as they are wide so it will not be so simple to replace them. I have used JR digital servos before but to be honest I never noticed a difference from the standard Futaba S3004 servos that I have been using so not sure if digital is really necessary for me. I am still in the early stages of learning and do not require top of the line gear. I just want reliable and safe right now.
Not so, doing the wrong comparison. You are comparing pears to apples. The numbers for one servo are for 6V, the numbers for the second one are for 4.8. Obviously the numbers will be slanted in favor of the one with 6V
Use these numbers, now the second servo is actually more powerful than the first AND faster, both with 6V:
Specifications
Size Category: Standard
Type: Analog
Application: Helis and Aircraft up to 72†or up to 12lbs when using just one servo per control surface
Torque: 72 oz-in (5.2kg-cm) @ 4.8V; 89 oz-in (6.4kg-cm) @ 6V
Speed: 0.20 sec/60 deg @ 4.8V; 0.17 sec/60 deg @ 6V, at no load
Bushing Or Bearing: Bearing
Bearing: Single
Motor Type: 3 Pole
Connector Type: Universal
Gear Material: Karbonite
Voltage: 4.8V to 6.0V
Gerry
06-01-2012, 09:44 AM
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RE: New Giant GP Super Sportster!!!!!
Gerry:
Tower did not publish info for 6V and Idid mention that fact. What I was comparing was Al's answer that the standard digital servos were double the torque of the HS-77 servos and no matter if you are comparing 6V or 4.8 Volt my comparison was correct. Also, even at the 4.8 volt stats, either servo isover the minimums required by the manufacuterer.
Tower did not publish info for 6V and Idid mention that fact. What I was comparing was Al's answer that the standard digital servos were double the torque of the HS-77 servos and no matter if you are comparing 6V or 4.8 Volt my comparison was correct. Also, even at the 4.8 volt stats, either servo isover the minimums required by the manufacuterer.
06-02-2012, 07:33 PM
#1880
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RE: New Giant GP Super Sportster!!!!!
So,
A couple days ago I received my order from Troy built including those titanium gear servos. The power hd 1501's came in great shap as expected, the 8309tg's however I was less impressed with.
I placed a call to Bill at Troy built and was very pleased, and explained that one servo looked like the spline was pulled through the rope plastic case with pliers. I sent him photos at his request to show him this, and I actually noticed that both servo's splines were canted forward on not a true 90* from the top of the servo. I initially wanted them replaced. When I hear back from him, I may just want to return them.
Today, I went to my local HS and picked up two Spektrum A6030's. 280 oz torque @ 6.0 volts, and also titanium gear. Hobby shop sold them to me for 70 a piece. Expensive, but I will never have an issue. I have four currently in a 71" AJ slick. I beat them up routinely (snap rolls, full throttle knife edge snap rolls, etc) and they literally laugh and ask of more. I am sure they have the holding power the elevators on the GSS need. They also only weigh 1.8 ounces, which when doubled comes to almost half an ounce less than the other servos.
My plan for the build,
Power Hd ds090mg on the rudder (133 ounces torque @ 6.0 volts, .10 sec transit time)
Spektrum a6030 on elevator (280 ounces 6.0 volts, .15 transit time)
Power hd 1501 mg analog on ailerons (240 ounces torque, .15 transit), may use rma'd PHD 8309TG instead
Futaba s3010 plastic gear analog on throttle ( 89 ounces torque @ 6.0 volts, .14 TT) unless I use the 8309tg on ailerons, I'll use the 1501 instead.
Jr 921 dsm2 rx.
Just ordered a jtec Pitts through my lhs. Yay!
Ill feel better with the nice ball links and dubro heavy duty linkage kits I'm going to use along with some nice torquey holding power with aluminum tail braces. Should be like a tank!
Chris
A couple days ago I received my order from Troy built including those titanium gear servos. The power hd 1501's came in great shap as expected, the 8309tg's however I was less impressed with.
I placed a call to Bill at Troy built and was very pleased, and explained that one servo looked like the spline was pulled through the rope plastic case with pliers. I sent him photos at his request to show him this, and I actually noticed that both servo's splines were canted forward on not a true 90* from the top of the servo. I initially wanted them replaced. When I hear back from him, I may just want to return them.
Today, I went to my local HS and picked up two Spektrum A6030's. 280 oz torque @ 6.0 volts, and also titanium gear. Hobby shop sold them to me for 70 a piece. Expensive, but I will never have an issue. I have four currently in a 71" AJ slick. I beat them up routinely (snap rolls, full throttle knife edge snap rolls, etc) and they literally laugh and ask of more. I am sure they have the holding power the elevators on the GSS need. They also only weigh 1.8 ounces, which when doubled comes to almost half an ounce less than the other servos.
My plan for the build,
Power Hd ds090mg on the rudder (133 ounces torque @ 6.0 volts, .10 sec transit time)
Spektrum a6030 on elevator (280 ounces 6.0 volts, .15 transit time)
Power hd 1501 mg analog on ailerons (240 ounces torque, .15 transit), may use rma'd PHD 8309TG instead
Futaba s3010 plastic gear analog on throttle ( 89 ounces torque @ 6.0 volts, .14 TT) unless I use the 8309tg on ailerons, I'll use the 1501 instead.
Jr 921 dsm2 rx.
Just ordered a jtec Pitts through my lhs. Yay!
Ill feel better with the nice ball links and dubro heavy duty linkage kits I'm going to use along with some nice torquey holding power with aluminum tail braces. Should be like a tank!
Chris
06-03-2012, 04:28 AM
#1881
RE: New Giant GP Super Sportster!!!!!
Chris, sounds like your plane will be almost bulletproof. Hope you enjoy flying it as much as I do mine.
My ball links have been showing signs of wear. The rudder is the worse, got about 2 degrees of slop in it right now. The ailerons are not too bad, less than 1 degree of slop, but will replace the links on all control surfaces just to be safe.
06-03-2012, 12:04 PM
#1882
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RE: New Giant GP Super Sportster!!!!!
ORIGINAL: Joystick TX
Chris, sounds like your plane will be almost bulletproof. Hope you enjoy flying it as much as I do mine.
My ball links have been showing signs of wear. The rudder is the worse, got about 2 degrees of slop in it right now. The ailerons are not too bad, less than 1 degree of slop, but will replace the links on all control surfaces just to be safe.
Chris, sounds like your plane will be almost bulletproof. Hope you enjoy flying it as much as I do mine.
My ball links have been showing signs of wear. The rudder is the worse, got about 2 degrees of slop in it right now. The ailerons are not too bad, less than 1 degree of slop, but will replace the links on all control surfaces just to be safe.
http://shop.dubro.com/products/produ...4.0.0.0?pp=12&
What do you think?
I also wanted to ask about spinners for the dle 30 - does the stock spinner that comes with the super sportster work, if drilled out or should I spring the 20 for the spinner pre cut/drilled for the dle?
Thanks!
Chris
06-03-2012, 03:05 PM
#1883
RE: New Giant GP Super Sportster!!!!!
They have not come free,butthey do have quite a bit of side play. The side playstarted early this year after around2 thousand flights, or about 500 hours of flying time. The rudder link is close to the point where it can come off the ball. The washers will prevent it from causing a complete control problem or failure. My big worry with this aircraft is flutter; that can destroy the tail section even with flying wires.
I noticed that once the side play developed, the wear rate has been pretty fast. I suspect that dirt has been able to get in there and grind away the nylon. Prior to that, they were rock solid.
I noticed that once the side play developed, the wear rate has been pretty fast. I suspect that dirt has been able to get in there and grind away the nylon. Prior to that, they were rock solid.
06-04-2012, 04:47 AM
#1884
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RE: New Giant GP Super Sportster!!!!!
First off, the stock spinner that comes with the GSS will work perfectly with the DLE 30. You will need one of the long bolts that comes with the GSSfuji engine mounts and that is all. The long bolt threads directly into the threads of the DLE shaft. Use a little blue loctite when doing final assembly
Now for the good news. I finally maidened my GSS and it was a total success. Only did 2 flights as my nerves were high as well as the wind but greased in a perfect 3 point landing on the last flight and called it a day. I think I need to lower the pitch on the prop as the engine was barely revving. I never took it over half throttle even for takeoff! She took 2 clicks of down elevator and 1 click of right aileron and that was it. because of the strong headwind I came up a little short of the runway on one landing attempt and really tested the new landing gear. It took the brunt as expected and even bent a little but Istill continued and took off. I was able to bend it back and will strengthen it a bit with some music wire but I feel it did everything Idesigned it to do. I think without that the plane would have nosed over with stock gear as the ground drops away right at the end of the runway so it was like hitting a ramp. A quick bend back and she looks good as new. Now I need to work on getting back into flying every week to learn back what I forgot over the last 6 months. Everyone at the field remarked about it and many were commenting on how good it looks. One of the guys said that he was looking at that plane and one other but after seeing it fly, is decision was made on the GSS. Of course I gave him the link to this thread. Big thanks to all of the posters here, this resource really helped me a lot in getting my new baby in the air. Soon I will mount the contour GPS camera to the landing gear and we should have some interesting video with speed and altidude data. I included some shots, nothing new to see but I just wanna share (last one is big blackfin Tuna we caught on Sat)- MD
(BTW final flying weight came it a 14.5 lbs and CGwas set just aft of recommended, kept rudder in high rate for ground handling but flights were all on low rates)
Now for the good news. I finally maidened my GSS and it was a total success. Only did 2 flights as my nerves were high as well as the wind but greased in a perfect 3 point landing on the last flight and called it a day. I think I need to lower the pitch on the prop as the engine was barely revving. I never took it over half throttle even for takeoff! She took 2 clicks of down elevator and 1 click of right aileron and that was it. because of the strong headwind I came up a little short of the runway on one landing attempt and really tested the new landing gear. It took the brunt as expected and even bent a little but Istill continued and took off. I was able to bend it back and will strengthen it a bit with some music wire but I feel it did everything Idesigned it to do. I think without that the plane would have nosed over with stock gear as the ground drops away right at the end of the runway so it was like hitting a ramp. A quick bend back and she looks good as new. Now I need to work on getting back into flying every week to learn back what I forgot over the last 6 months. Everyone at the field remarked about it and many were commenting on how good it looks. One of the guys said that he was looking at that plane and one other but after seeing it fly, is decision was made on the GSS. Of course I gave him the link to this thread. Big thanks to all of the posters here, this resource really helped me a lot in getting my new baby in the air. Soon I will mount the contour GPS camera to the landing gear and we should have some interesting video with speed and altidude data. I included some shots, nothing new to see but I just wanna share (last one is big blackfin Tuna we caught on Sat)- MD
(BTW final flying weight came it a 14.5 lbs and CGwas set just aft of recommended, kept rudder in high rate for ground handling but flights were all on low rates)
06-04-2012, 06:57 AM
#1885
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RE: New Giant GP Super Sportster!!!!!
Awesome! Congratulations! I flew mine again this past Thursday with High rates and had a ball doing slow speed high alpha maneuvers. As heavy as the plane is you wouldn't think it possible. I am using a 19x8 Xoar, but I think a 20x6 might be more appropriate. We'll see.
Nice fish by the way. I also went fishing Saturday on the Ohio river. Result: 1 crappie, 1 white bass, 1 walleye, 4 smallmouth.
I had a very good week.
Al
Nice fish by the way. I also went fishing Saturday on the Ohio river. Result: 1 crappie, 1 white bass, 1 walleye, 4 smallmouth.
I had a very good week.
Al
06-04-2012, 07:25 AM
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RE: New Giant GP Super Sportster!!!!!
Al, that's awesome. We also caught a few bonita and some remora but the dolphin we were hoping to eat eluded us. My firends went out again on Sunday (when Iwent flying)and bagged 3 sailfish and lost one more. Still no dinner though. - MD
06-04-2012, 07:57 AM
#1887
RE: New Giant GP Super Sportster!!!!!
Good work. It really is a great looking plane on the ground or in the air. I'm alsoflying 19 x 8 on my Fuji 34cc and it seems a good prop for my needs.
Say, what's the covering on that last image of your short-wingspan float plane? Doesn't look like fiberglass or iron-on. ;-)
Say, what's the covering on that last image of your short-wingspan float plane? Doesn't look like fiberglass or iron-on. ;-)
06-05-2012, 04:57 AM
#1888
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RE: New Giant GP Super Sportster!!!!!
I am going to start my build...what gear is everyone using? Does anyone have any detailed pics on the gear conversion?
06-05-2012, 05:07 AM
#1889
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RE: New Giant GP Super Sportster!!!!!
I used a carbon fiber gear from SDS
[link]http://www.sdshobby.net/landing-gear-for-extra300-50cc-p-1583.html[/link]
As far as pictures go, if you take the time to read through this thread you will find tons of pictures describing various gear modifications and installations.
Good luck!
[link]http://www.sdshobby.net/landing-gear-for-extra300-50cc-p-1583.html[/link]
As far as pictures go, if you take the time to read through this thread you will find tons of pictures describing various gear modifications and installations.
Good luck!
06-05-2012, 05:08 AM
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RE: New Giant GP Super Sportster!!!!!
ORIGINAL: Jyjkoz
I am going to start my build...what gear is everyone using? Does anyone have any detailed pics on the gear conversion?
I am going to start my build...what gear is everyone using? Does anyone have any detailed pics on the gear conversion?
06-05-2012, 05:39 AM
#1891
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RE: New Giant GP Super Sportster!!!!!
ORIGINAL: Jyjkoz
I am going to start my build...what gear is everyone using? Does anyone have any detailed pics on the gear conversion?
I am going to start my build...what gear is everyone using? Does anyone have any detailed pics on the gear conversion?
I used the landing gear from the Great Planes Super Stearman. http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXGDA6&P=7
If you look throughout this thread, you can find many different ways of doing the main gear.
Joe M.
06-05-2012, 05:58 AM
#1892
RE: New Giant GP Super Sportster!!!!!
ORIGINAL: Jyjkoz
I am going to start my build...what gear is everyone using? Does anyone have any detailed pics on the gear conversion?
I am going to start my build...what gear is everyone using? Does anyone have any detailed pics on the gear conversion?
06-05-2012, 06:06 AM
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RE: New Giant GP Super Sportster!!!!!
Jyjkoz:
I have sent you an email.If you do not get it please check the junk items folder of your email program. Let me know if you need anything else.
I have sent you an email.If you do not get it please check the junk items folder of your email program. Let me know if you need anything else.
06-05-2012, 09:45 AM
#1894
RE: New Giant GP Super Sportster!!!!!
ORIGINAL: Jyjkoz
I am going to start my build...what gear is everyone using?
I am going to start my build...what gear is everyone using?
I've been flying a Contender 60 with near identical wing struts for a l..o..n..g time and Ihave no problems with the arrangement. Gives a nice wide stance.
06-05-2012, 11:48 AM
#1895
RE: New Giant GP Super Sportster!!!!!
Some of the stock gear on the GSS is okay, but they do not have a good quality control. Some of the gear will flex and some is brittle and will break like glass.
I had both types. Brittle on the first set, flexable on the second. I switched to the fuselage mount for ease of transporting the wing and fuselage..
I had both types. Brittle on the first set, flexable on the second. I switched to the fuselage mount for ease of transporting the wing and fuselage..
06-05-2012, 12:57 PM
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RE: New Giant GP Super Sportster!!!!!
ORIGINAL: Muttdog
Besides, it looks so much better, especially Joe Mamma's, I like the way he faired the gear into the fuselage. Nice touch
Besides, it looks so much better, especially Joe Mamma's, I like the way he faired the gear into the fuselage. Nice touch
Thanks for the compliment,
but I got the idea from somone else after reading this thread.Joe M.
06-05-2012, 05:59 PM
#1899
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RE: New Giant GP Super Sportster!!!!!
Hi All!
I just figured that I would update everyone as to my first days' progress while home sick (can't work without a voice).
I used Great Planes pinned hinges for the ailerons - a lot of them
There are a total of 16 in the wing alone, glued with Gorilla Glue. The next step will be setting up the servo linkages for the wing, then moving on to the servos in the fuse and then mounting the tail.
Question -
Can or should Gorilla Glue be used on the tail as well? What are advantages/disadvantages? Let me know - thanks!
Best,
Chris
I just figured that I would update everyone as to my first days' progress while home sick (can't work without a voice).
I used Great Planes pinned hinges for the ailerons - a lot of them
There are a total of 16 in the wing alone, glued with Gorilla Glue. The next step will be setting up the servo linkages for the wing, then moving on to the servos in the fuse and then mounting the tail.
Question -
Can or should Gorilla Glue be used on the tail as well? What are advantages/disadvantages? Let me know - thanks!
Best,
Chris
06-05-2012, 06:55 PM
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RE: New Giant GP Super Sportster!!!!!
My personal choice on all giant scale planes are Robart hinges. But that's just me.
Tried gorilla glue. Didn't like it. Expands and oozes all over the place. Stick with epoxy.
Al
Tried gorilla glue. Didn't like it. Expands and oozes all over the place. Stick with epoxy.
Al