min$2crash

Lucky dog.... its finally warmer here but rainin' like a MF (Messerschmitt Flyer).

russmhunt

ok guys i know this plane is old but I am gonna break down and buy it i just now got back into flying ive been over seas for the past year and i started out again with my trainer but what do you guys think about me thying to solo this baby i had planed on using spektrum high torgue servos with a airtronics 92777 receiver and 4.8 hitec battery any suggestions

FAST-J

Hey russmhunt, I'll sale you mine..

snomobila

My Feedback: (1)

anyone have any problems with the red strips lining up with the cowl? Mine is center but the stripes are off.

FAST-J

Yep!! Seen several like that..

cmoulder

Yes, a not-uncommon complaint.

One thing that might help is to trim about 2 inches off the back edge of the cowl, since the cowl is much longer than necessary. I don't know why they designed the cowl to have so much overhang, so I just trimmed it off with a Dremel cutting wheel.

jib

Deleted - Wrong thread.
Jack

cmoulder

Impossible to answer without knowing how well you are able to fly your trainer. The electronics will work, although most would prefer a 6v set-up for receiver and servos, but in some cases faster might not be better.

Despite some of the issues guys have had with this model, it is in my experience the best-flying Extra I have flown in the .60-.90 size range.

It is, however, very lightly built and cannot handle very many less-than-perfect landings. It is a rather advanced aerobatic model and responds instantly to stick inputs, and does exactly what the flier "tells" it to. So if the pilot gives it a bit of wrong aileron just before touching down, or indavertently hucks the elevator, it will likely be the end of the model.

RICKSTUBBZ

Fast-J

Do I detect a hint of a possible re-kitting exercise here????[]

FAST-J

No, not here!!...I have my eye on something different that a local has and wants to sell..

RICKSTUBBZ

With any luck this weekend will be the maiden voyage for my Son’s (Rich) Extra.

Here are a few pictures of things I did with the cowl on his plane.

I made a baffle out of some polyester I had laying around. I draped a piece of the clothe over a coke bottle and spread 30 minute epoxy over it. This created a “cone� shaped piece that I cut to fit and glued into the cowl. Because it is so thin it is still quite flexible like thin plastic. We’ll see if it last. Should help with keeping the ST90 cool.

Not only did the red stripes on the cowl not line up with the fuse. The cowl did not really fit well. In order to pull the top and sides of the cowl flat with the fuse……it caused the cowl to tilt up at the front. The prop shaft would have needed to be about ¼ higher to line up in the center of the cowl. So…..Using 1/16 square balsa I made a few stringer/standoffs to go between the cowl and fuse to simulate a vented cowl. The picture showing the three sticks on top of the fuse are for reference only. Glued them in the cowl with CA. Once in place the gap around the cowl is more or less even.

RICKSTUBBZ

As soon as I get caught up on the spring yard (and equipment) work, I’ll be able to start assembling mine. I have managed to refit mine with a different pilot figure. I did not want to remove the actual canopy so I went about things in a little different way. First I traced around the base of the “new� pilot to create a paper pattern of the exact shape. Then using a strait pin I carefully marked the edges of the original pilot. Then traced and cut out the balsa floor according to my pattern making sure the correct side of the pattern was up. Removed the original pilot from the wood (they are glued on with hot glue) and glued my pilot in place. Now, I understand my pilot is nothing special, but hey... there it is... adds a personal touch and it’s a little bigger so it does not look quite so out of place. By the way stock pilot 31 grams the painted Williams brothers pilot with the balsa base 25 grams. Almost a ¼ ounce difference.

cmoulder

Looks good, Rich!

You are more of a craftsman than I am, so I go about things different ways.

For the cowl, I just cut 2 inches off the rear edge and the stripes lined up well and I shaved off a lot of weight. I don't know how much, but I still have the scrap and can weigh it if anyone is interested.

For the pilot, yes the one that comes with the ARF is lame. I got one of the GP civilian pilot figures from Tower for $13 and it fits well and looks good. I Dremel-ed out the base and the back of the cockpit hatch and reduced the weight a bit there. Of course, you can see the innards of the fuse that way, but who notices that during flight?

With regards to the cowl air inlets, I simply covered the left one completely with a scrap of fiberglass, glued from the inside with some CA, then blacked it out with a black permanent marker.

richlstubbz

Here are some pics.

The plane flys very well. Landings are not as easy as some planes but nothing awful. There are some things to iron out to make it easy yet.

With a ST90 (not yet running at 100%) this plane has some go.

cmoulder

Just curious, what was difficult about landing the Extra?

Does the plane require significant down trim for level flight at mid throttle?

richlstubbz

Yes it seems the plane had difficulty sinking. It just would not go down w/o a little persuasion.

Though this could be due to engine idle still hopefully this weekend i will get more time on this one.

jib

Excellent! I have an ST90 waiting for mine too.

What prop are you swinging and what do you think you will end up with?

Jack

richlstubbz

Currently running a 14x6 conservative needled setting.

We have done some tests and found that APC 16x4W is pulling the most thrust (~10lbs about 9k RPM my dad –Rickstubbz has the data so he might correct me). That was the planed prop to use once the engine is ready for it. Though after some flying with the 14x6 I might stick with a 15x4W APC or another variety of 15x4.

These props won’t make the engine scream (9k-10k RPM static) by no means but they seem to work well for low end thrust.

cmoulder

OK, I know I have mentioned it a few times - and I don't want to beat it to death - but I have had two of these planes and both of them flew significantly better when the wing TE was raised 3/32".

It seems that, as designed, the AOA is just a tad too much and it flies with a nose-high attitude even though it is not tail-heavy. My CG is at 125mm.

As I mentioned to Jay earlier, I have no idea what the relative incidences are, but I tried this modification early on with the first plane and it worked out extremely well. Identical results with the second one as well.

RICKSTUBBZ

Bob,

I have a question for you...

When you rotated the wing, did you create a pin of some sort to lock the wing in place? I am assuming that you slotted the holes were the wing bolts go.

cmoulder

Rick, all I did was to elongate the hole and then made a new little lite ply plate for the rear wing retention bolt.

First thing to do is to install the wings in their current position, then use a piece of 3/32" ply laid on top of the TE to make a mark on the side of the fuse where the new position will be.

Then elongate the rear hole (upward) a bit. Make a couple of lite ply plates with holes to match the wing bolts.

Install the wings with the lite ply plates under the wing bolts, partially tighten, then use the marks on the fuse to get the TE position where you like it.

Use some medium CA to tack glue the lite ply plates in place, then remove the wings/wing bolts and run a little more CA under them to permanently stick them.

The shift is so small that it doesn't affect the front bolts, so no modification will be needed there.

RICKSTUBBZ

Bob,

Ah Yeah, Very straightforward on how to change the wing incidence. If we end up making that mod to our planes I will indeed use your method.

If you don't mind my asking, what type of flying do you perform with your Phoenix Extra? IMAC aerobatics, Pattern, 3D, or Sport?

Myself, I plan to fly IMAC aerobatics. I have no plans to take this plane to a contest but I still enjoy flying those maneuvers and trying to improve my skills.

russmhunt

you guys know alot more about electronics and setting up these birds I just know enough to get me by in some cases my take offs are the scariest how much runway will I need with a .91 os and when I land should I come in with throttle all the way down or just a little throttle I want the best advace as I am a budget flyer and want many flights out of this plane I have soloed my trainer and have a nexstar I have not flow yet. I fly better when noone is around when I got people watching me I feel like I got to impress them and usually do something wrong luckly I have had appx 3 succesful runs with my trainer so any advice for flying this plane is greatly appreciated and any recommendations on **** gear that come with it that I need to upgrade by the way i have a prop its is a k-series master airscrew it says k1460 k2615 will this work and what size does that represent if not what prop should I buy bty the engine is not broke in yet I had it on a ultra sport 1000 and never flew it

russmhunt

p.s. I want slow flying possible 3-d i do not want her to be fast by no means and what advantages of using a 6v instead of a 4.8 v

FAST-J

On take off's I need no more than 12 feet, I use the 4.8v 2500 mah packs..

After you guys finish moving the wing would you please post what the final incidence is..Thanks, Jay