Luftwaffe Oberst

Understood, just stinks that many of us can't afford one. Buy the time I'd get a KMP together with engine, RX, battery, servo's, Robart Retracts etc I would have spent over a $1,000. That's just nuts for a price for a ARF to risk crashing it. JMHO

rcmorrow

The SBD Dauntless is approximately 1/7th scale based on the measurements of the kit and the full size SBD-5 that it is based on.

Squadron Publications Walk Around of the SBD Dauntless (I think it is Number 33 http://www.squadron.com/ItemDetails.asp?item=SS5533 ) has information and color plates showing an artists rendition of the SBD-5 modeled by KMP. There are various other books and reference materials that give a variety of information regarding the Dauntless and the varients along with the specifics about the model that was on the USS Lexington in VB-16.

Just a note if anyone is interested. There is a builder running a build thread on the model in the UK I think. The following should take you to the thread to see his work as it progresses.

http://www.rcmf.co.uk/4um/index.php/topic,48316.0.html

My kit arrived yesterday and looks wonderful. Just wanted to say thanks to Andrew and KMP for getting these out as quickly as you have. Really looking forward to starting the project here and planning on using electric power for my kit.

LDM

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Great info , thank you for posting . I am awaiting my birthday haha coming soon , have two planes on my list , one I am saving for (this one-SBD) and one is a Top Flight P40 ARf

LDM

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Interesting , very nice pics from the UK cant tell from the pics if the canopy has enought extra in the frame so it can be cut and made to slide .

longdan

That is a nice looking plane. I used to have a grandfather who was a gunner on a SBD-5 in the pacific during WW2. I've always thought about building one as a tribute to him.
Maybe the ARF would be easier. Keep us posted.

Zippi

My Feedback: (10)

The link that rcmorrow gave is in very good detail and I've been watching that forum as well. Are all those issues with the wrong size parts and the rear stab issue going to be taken care of on the next run?

rcmorrow

I think that the issue of parts fit and hardware difficulties is unfortunate, but can be resolved relatively easily.

I would suggest that many people who are building models at this level have personal preferences as to the hardware and work-arounds for difficulties that may be encountered. The sharing of these solutions is one of the great things about the forums and the threads that are placed here and on other related model sites. Additionally I would suggest that many enjoy the challenge of solving the difficulties that might be encountered in the project.

It may be of interest that this model is originally manufactured and produced in China by ESM Producing Co. of China. The website for them is:

www.esmmodel.com

They have a variety of models available and also have links for the instruction manuals downloadable as PDF documents. I have downloaded the instructions for the SBD prior to mine arriving. Note that it took some time for the download to complete even on a high speed internet access line.

As far as my particular concerns at this point I would share that I ordered the model and the retractable landing gear set that is available as an extra. My comments are in reference to the retractable landing gear at this point.

The retractable gear set from KMP (ESM Model) appears to be well made and have a properly machined finish, very similar in appearance to the designs seen from the majority of manufacturers of pneumatic systems such as Robart, Century Jet Models, and Sierra, etc.

Please note: I do realize that all the companies I am mentioning produce very high quality products that are carefully engineered and tested prior to release to consumer markets. Also note that all companies producing retractable landing gear systems have their own advantages and disadvantages to their systems that must be determined by the individual modeler. I do not venture to suggest or recommend any one company's product over another with my discussion, but rather give information about the system that I have decided to purchase for this model project.

In choosing a set of retractable gear there are many considerations taken into account. The set from KMP (ESM Model) is very reasonably priced and in the combination of the model kit with the optional retracts there is a discount given by KMP in the pricing of the gear set that is generous. Also note the gear set includes a set of main wheels with alloy rims/hubs that are manufactured well and have a very high quality machined finish. (The rims/hubs are not scale for the SBD as they are spoked/drilled, but they can easily be given scale coverplates to match documentation available on the SBD-5).

The gear set includes all the needed parts and hardware to be fully usable in the model. This includes the pneumatic mechanism (the actual retract mechanism), the struts (which are nicely machined in appearance and have spring shock absorption internally), and all the air lines, air tank, and air control system. It should be noted that KMP (ESM Model) has done a very nice job in creating this retract system to appear scale for the Dauntless and also be functional.

The retractable gear set seems to work very well from a brief look at them on my workbench and some close examination of all the parts. It is important to look at the set screws (larger black cap screws) used for attaching the struts to the retract unit and make sure they are screwed in enough so they do not hit the sides of the retract unit. I found this out as I started to make my first examination and had not attached the struts yet. The hardware with the retract set is very complete and includes allen wrenchs for all adjustments. Note that when you install the struts and tighten these set screws they will not interfere with the unit or its operation in any way.

I plan on checking the assembly of each component with care to compare the tolerances and verify the final assembly is identical for similar components. I should be able to make very minor adjustments as needed to have all parts working extremely well.

Based on my above comments I think the set will work very well, but it should be checked carefully for all adjustments prior to being installed in the model. I would also suggest carefully checking all fasteners and screws throughout the gear set and determining which screws should be set with locktite to prevent accidental loosing while in use. Also check for appropriate use of light oil or grease on components that should move such as bearing surfaces or pivot axles/pivot points. The shock absorbing struts should be checked also and should operate smoothly.

I will be unpacking the rest of the model components over the next few days and post images of the kit and retract system if others would be interested. More to follow as I start the actual build.

Jimmy Bananas

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rcmorrow:

Thanx for the info...have been reading about the boys across the pond and how they are doing to thier Dauntless model....Going to do some checking around as for the items mention in the website over their...Very interested on the Cylinder heads unit you can put in the front of the cowl,also the machine gun and most of all, the bomb...it looks great...Suppose to be shipping my model today...should get it next week...looking forward to a great model.....BTW, if anyone finds an info on the items I mention ( Bomb, Machine gun, Cylinder heads) and the availablity of these items, please share with the rest of us.....thanx and have a nice one..................

rcmorrow

There are a number of companies that produce scales parts and accesories for r/c models. As far as the dummy engine goes you can look at Top Flite models accesories. They have a 1/7th scale radial engine that is plastic styrene. Very lightweight and with a little work looks very scale like. Another option is from Frank Tiano Enterprises. I think he has a couple different sizes for his resin radials. I was at his site the other day looking at them and the smaller of his two sounds like it is just about the right size.

http://www.top-flite.com/

http://www.franktiano.com/

As far as the various other scale parts go you might have to scratch them yourself. i am not sure about 1/7th scale machine guns and mounts, but they could very well be out there. Some use of aluminum tubing or brass tubing can workl very welll for this application while using various documentation sources to create the guns and their mounts. The aluminum tubing would probably be the best bet as it will be somewhat easier to work with and also very light weight. Another product to use is plastic styrene material, if I remember correctly it is available from PlasTruct (have to check the spelling on that one and fdo a bit of searching on google to verify it.

http://www.plastruct.com/

Many other scale details and features can be added by the simple use of Flite Metal for access hatches and various other cover plates.

http://www.flitemetal.com/

Pro Mark Graphics is a very high quality group that makes markings for many applications with r/c models. they have a wide range of types available that are both dry transfer and also vinyl transfer sets.

http://www.pro-mark.com/

On the previous message I wrote I was discussing the wheels and landing gear set for the model. There are several possibilities for wheels that would work very well for this aircraft, from a variety of manufacturers, depending on how scale like and the pricing that is best for your project budget. Robart has a variety of tread and wheel designs available with both plastic and aluminum hubs. Many other companies are also out there, one I would mention that is producing very high end wheels and brake systems is Glennis Aircraft.

http://www.robart.com/

http://www.glennis.com/

There are many other websites and companies that produce a wide range of very high quality scale parts and accesories that would be wonderful for this kit. I hope that others will share any sources they have also.

Hope this might be helpful to anyone interested or working on the SBD-5, it is a wonderful kit and also has the ability to have many scale additions to it at the preference of the individual builder, pending on his or her ability and desire.

I'll post pictures of the actual kit and parts this weekend as time permits.

rcmorrow

Here are some pictures of the landing gear set. My apologies it has taken a while to get them for the discussion. Hope they are of help to anyone who might be interested.

As I had shared earlier, the gear set is very well made with an excellent finish and also include very scale struts that will compliment the Dauntless in scale appearance. I included a ruler in the photographs to help with size and scale of the parts, but it may be difficult to read due to the size of the images.

I will try to post images of the Dauntless kit and parts later this evening.

rcmorrow

Here are the photographs of the kit and its parts.

I have tried to photograph alll the parts that would be of most interest. There are informational points that I will give related to to specific photos.

The first set is the kit in general and packaging. The kit itself is a rather large box, understandable based on the size of the model. It arrived inside an outer cardboard box that protects the contents and packaging. Inside all parts are wrapped with foam and then sealed inside plastic bags. the overall packaging is excellent and showed no signs of possible damage due to shipping and handling. ESM/KMP has done a very good job with this.

rcmorrow

The second set of photographs show the individual parts after unwrapping from packaging materials. The overall quality is excellnt and the finsh is a uniform flat on all components.

The fuselage and cowl are fiberglass and show good detail with panel lines. All panel lines appear to be scale in placement, but possibly slightly wider or deeper than scale so to make them more visible. Rivet detail is not seen on any of the parts or components, but can easily be added using your own methods or preferences.

The wing, horizontal stab, elevators and rudder are all conventionally built up parts using light ply/balsa construction and then covered with a film and finally painted. The parts do not have any panel lines or rivet detail, but as with other parts it can easily be added.

One of the most notable features of this aiircraft are the dive brakes and landing flaps. On the model they are lightweight solid material with all the scale lightening holes drilled very well. In looking at various documentation photographs a structure is seen on the full scale flaps and dive brakes. Making your own set of dive brakes and flaps for those that are wishing to make the model as scale as possible would be answer. Personally I feel that the construction of these is very well done for the standoff scale model.

The flaps, dive brakes, ailerons, elevators, and rudder are all pre-slotted for flit pin hinges similar to what Dubro and others produce. The hinges are included with the kit. I have seen other modelers using Hinge Points and other more scale-like hinging systems on the model. Again, this would be personal preference.

The canopy and other miscellaneous parts are made from vacuformed plastic that appears to be of a good thickness for working with. these parts have also been painted to match the model accurately.

Overall I am very impressed with this kit and the quality of the workmanship and construction. As a simple build with little or no modifications it looks like it can produce a very good standoff scale Dauntless SBD-5 that would be enjoyed. Based on my impressions of the kit and also some of the other work that is being completed by other modelers, it is a kit that can be modified by adding scale details and features and will produce a wonderful model. The extent of the scale detail will depend on personal preferences and abilities of the individual modeler.

I was able to email with KMP Models regarding the paint on the model. Andrew let me know that paint will be available very soon in 1 oz. and 2 oz. size bottles. The paint should be an exact match for the model and can be used for touch up or also used if you choose to add details such as panel lines and rivit detailing, the paint the detailing for the final finish.

I am personally planning on building the model with an electric motor system for power (most probably an Eflite Power 160 or Axi 5330/18 with a Castle Craetions 110HV controller, and use a 10s battery system, this will have to be finalized after some work on calculations of model weight and motor power and performance) and do plan on adding some scale detail to the model, within reason so that I don't add too much additional weight to the model. The build will be put onto a separate thread, but I don't know when I will actually start, as I have a few projects to complete before I begin this particular model. I would guess within the early part of May will be when I start the thread

I hope my comments and photographs are helpful to anyone who is interested in the model. Please contact me if there are any questions. More important is to contact Andrew at Kondor Models. He has been extremely helpful with all my questions regarding this kit and is very friendly to talk with as well as quick to respond and help in any way. I would recommend this kit and KMP to anyone who might be interested in a standoff scale model. i think they are doing a great job with their models.

rcmorrow

There are many various sources for scale parts and accessories that I have been looking at, one of them is Dynamic Balsa. They have many scale interiors and cockpits for various KMP kits. I would hope they might produce a scale interior and cockpit set for the Dauntless if there is enough interest. Their website is below:

http://dbalsa.com/

Another company that has scale parts and accessories is Bob Dively Models. they have cockpit kits and also vacuformed radilal engines of various diameters:

http://www.bobdivelymodels.com/

Century Jet Model Products has 1/7 scale full figure piots for WWII along with many other parts and accessories:

http://www.centuryjet.com/

I hope if anyone has other sources or sites you will also post them here. It would be great to get as many resources as possible for all of us to use.

One last thing to add: there are some pictures from the Toledo show and KMP had a booth with their Dauntless on display. Thought I would post a quick link in case anyone would like to see the pic.

http://www.zerorc.com/toledo-show-2009-report-part-one

Bryan McLarty

RCM:

Could you provide the cowl dimensions, especially width &height. I want to see just how much room there is to work with.

The Pics from Toledo showed a really nice rear gun andsome barrels out of the nose. Any thoughts on where these came from?

PLEASE keep up you excellent documentation and narrative on this wonderful subject.

BMc

rcmorrow

Hi Bryan,

Sorry it has taken a few days to reply to your request.

I have the kit stored for the momment while I wait for additional parts to arrive for the project. I am also completing a project in my shop right now which doesn't leave much space for starting the Dauntless quite yet, but should be out in the next week.

I will have to get the model and parts out to check the cowl measurements for you. Should be able to do that sometime today or tomorrow.

I'll try to post the measurments for you by Monday night. Also, check the rest of the thread, I seem to remember Andrew giving some of the specs to another modeller who was interested in fitting a twin cylinder engine for this plane.

Best,

Bob

Bryan McLarty

Bob:

I'm not that ready to acquire one yet, but am interested. Don't you worry about getting it out for my sake, you do what you have to do and when you get around to it, take the measurements and post them here. This is one beautiful airplane! What are you planning to power yours with?

Thank you!

BMc

rcmorrow

My current plan is to go electric. I have both and Axi 5330/18 as well as an Eflite Power 160. I think either of these could be viable powerplants for the model using a 10s lipo pack system, probably in the range of 3700 mAh to 5000 mAh 5s packs in series. I'll use a Castle Creations HV110 speed control and then also have 2 separate 2s 4000 mAh lipo packs as the overall power supply for the radio equipment. I keep the power for the radio systems separate from the power for the motor systes for planes of any size larger than park flyers, just in the case of a battery failure.

I use JR equipment for controlling all my modles (airplanes, sailplanes, and helicopters). I am currnetly using the new 12x system and I am very impressed with it, to say the least ! I'll use one of the 1222 12 channel receivers that can have twin power supplies fed into it, both packs will have a Castle Creations progarmable BEC to step down the power from 7.4v to 6.0v for the servos being used.

I am just waiing to clear the shop now and also waiting for a few more pieces to arrive that are part of the build. Shouldn't take long to put together, but it will take some time for the detailing, pending on how far I want to go with it.

Bryan McLarty

Bob:

I am mainly an e-flyer myself. I do have a 26cc gas engine in a CMP 1.20 sized Zero that could find a new home in this airframe someday. The Zero weighs in around 14lbs. and flies pretty scale-like without being over powered as some tend to get these warbirds. It really isn't a bad combination and I could see it doing well with this SDB. It is, afterall, a dive bomber and not a true fighter.

Your set up seems impressive and I think will be more than adequate for your project (especailly the eFlight motor!). I have had some tell me to be careful of weight and CG issues when going with a full fiberglass fuselage like this airframe on e-conversions. You can do it, but I think you will have to be sure to get enough batteries far enough forward to make it. The A123 cells could also work on this project. A radial engine sound system would also be really something.

Best of luck on your build!

Bryan

LDM

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In RC groups there is a guy who just converted a Yellow P47 , probably much heavier then the KMP , however I think he is useing the Axi 160 he is under the Giant Eletric warbirds section .

Jimmy Bananas

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Just installed a G-26 in mine....good fit....going to change the servos in the wing..using HD-2213 mg for the outboard flaps and a HD-9150 mg for the center flap..........now just to get all 3 flaps to come down equal...fun time...............

BsSmith

I just got most of mine a few days ago, the fuselage is getting an interior installed so I will get that when it's done. I will add a few changes to the plane, first, I will set each wing flap to it's own servo (instead of 3 flap servos there will be 5) so I can have a flap/dive brake option, the actual Dautless used only the lower flaps for landings and the upper ones were used with the lower ones for dives. Next, I will chane the stationary dummy bomb to a droppable dummy bomb, and make a scale pivot arm for it. I will try to make a dummy radial engine and scale exaust points, but I will have to wait for the engine (probably a 20-25cc) and fuselage to see if I'll have room in the cowl. I will also change out the CA hinges for Robart ones.

aerowoof

has anyone poost a flight report on how the dauntlass flies?

HIGHSTRUT

Would a OS 1.60 2 stroke fit in the cowl and would it be too much power for this model?

LDM

My Feedback: (15)

I am useing the the OS 200 4 stroke in the Corsair , I dont think the 160 2 stroke would be over kill

ProScaleRc

OMG, I'm building a TF GS P-51B that's getting dangerously close to $5,000; I also have a CARF Extra 300L that cost close to $4,000 and a 1/4 scale 304CZ glider that has cost over $4,000 and the list goes on.

I wish ARF's came in under $1,000. Even my new Great Planes 50 size Matt Chapman Eagle has broken the $1,000 mark. Geeze it only takes 4 good servos such as JR DS6301's to break the $1,000 mark.

I wouldn't get too stressed about the price; just stick to the theory that quality is better than quantity.
And don't worry about the risk of crashing; I'm sure you drive a $30,000 car to work each day, but do you wake up each morning stressing about crashing it?