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New Funtana 125

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Old 08-16-2010, 12:08 PM
  #901
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Default RE: New Funtana 125

Those are just the two that I know that have one and they are outstanding pilots, one of them has been flying for 30 years and is really pretty decent flying 3d. The thing for me is that I don't want to spent $300.00 on a plane and find that it doesn't work out for me.
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Old 08-16-2010, 12:12 PM
  #902
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Default RE: New Funtana 125

I put mine in over the weekend due to some kind of electrical failure near as I can figure. With the discoloration issue and the way MINE flew, I'm moving on to something else. Not getting another, prefering to try something else. Maybe I'll be back after that experience? It's a great looking plane, and it's fun to fly, but I think maybe there are planes that will fly with a little more precision. We'll see soon.

I had several issues with mine, but honestly, I don't consider myself to be in a position to be much of a judge. With that in mind, regarding rudder, mine, at 10.5 lbs, had enough rudder authority to climb, but once over the top, it would never have enough to continue beyond the 9 or 3 o'clock marks to complete a loop ... no way. It was also coupled pretty good towards the gear on knife edge.... enough to keep you on your toes. I don't think there's any excuse for that. I need that concentration for other things?
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Old 08-16-2010, 12:47 PM
  #903
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Default RE: New Funtana 125

One of the kids at the field (11 yr old) has a Funtana 50 that he practices on, but it will not hold knife edge with maxed throws. He's pretty good with it considering his main plane is a 35% Extra 330
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Old 08-16-2010, 12:53 PM
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Default RE: New Funtana 125

I understand why some people say the Funtana is lacking in rudder authority. It take a significant amount of speed and rudder to maintain knife edge, and doing a real slow knife edge is a little disconcerting. I would assume that this is due to the slightly inadequate fuselage side area. Correcting during a hover and steering during a harrier are a non-issue, though.

If y'all remember my video I posted, the engine was screaming during knife edge, but that was because I didn't really feel comfortable going slower. It took a ton of rudder and the tucking and coupling got worse and worse along with it. Just the nature of the beast.
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Old 08-16-2010, 01:34 PM
  #905
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Default RE: New Funtana 125


Quote:
ORIGINAL: OK2Fly
. It took a ton of rudder and the tucking and coupling got worse and worse along with it. Just the nature of the beast.

This is a design/Build/setup flaw, IMHO

Mine does the same thing and I'm trimming it out without adding mixes. I know the prescribed CG is far to aft and the wing incidence is off.

I'm going to set it up this week on the bench and find out how far
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Old 08-16-2010, 02:12 PM
  #906
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Default RE: New Funtana 125


Quote:
ORIGINAL: Mastertech


Quote:
ORIGINAL: OK2Fly
. It took a ton of rudder and the tucking and coupling got worse and worse along with it. Just the nature of the beast.

This is a design/Build/setup flaw, IMHO

Mine does the same thing and I'm trimming it out without adding mixes. I know the prescribed CG is far to aft and the wing incidence is off.

I'm going to set it up this week on the bench and find out how far
Good plan, but how would you know what incidence to use to fix it without doing a lot of experimenting?
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Old 08-16-2010, 02:28 PM
  #907
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Default RE: New Funtana 125

I intend to add wing adjusters to it. I suspect the wing should be about .4-.5 Positive with the stab at zero and the Eng -.5. We'll see where this one is. At this point mine has NEVER felt locked in on the elevator. It's always hunting.

This is where most really well trimmed pattern planes fly well at. Bryan Herbert has written many pieces about this method and it works.

I'll have to cut off the wing pins that are there now but that's cake, slot the wing hold down bolt for rotation and away we go.

I've noticed mine would go to the gear in a down line which I've never seen an airplane do, they most always go to the canopy.

On the covering yellowing, mine is doing it and it's only seen the light of day twice. I'm quite sure it's the method they used to do the painting of the graphics. I suspect if I took a bit of acetone to it the yellowing would wipe off.

I'd just as soon as they build them all white.
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Old 08-16-2010, 02:44 PM
  #908
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Default RE: New Funtana 125

If you have a good idea of where it needs to go, would it be easier to fill the existing index hole and put the new one where it needs to go? I'll bet you wouldn't need to slot the hold down bolt hole much...

If this plane would groove like a pattern plane, or even a good sport plane, this plane would move into a whole different league. I'm with you on the feeling this plane has never felt "locked in". I just assumed that was the deal with it, or thought it was just me or the combo I was using (airframe/servos/engine/prop). I just got back into RC 3 years ago and it didn't even occur to me to check the incedences! Prior, I wouldn't have even hesitated to do it during the assembly process. When I was building everything, the planes were checked several times during the building process - without giving it a second thought.....

But it still needs more rudder (or a longer fuse) to make it "right".
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Old 08-16-2010, 03:09 PM
  #909
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Default RE: New Funtana 125

If you try to get the yellow off with acetone, the acetone will remove the painted graphics. Just wipe all the graphics off and then create your own. I have 2 of these 125's and neither is turning yellow yet. When it does (if) I will just recover it in my own design.
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Old 08-16-2010, 04:23 PM
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Default RE: New Funtana 125


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ORIGINAL: JohnB96041

If you try to get the yellow off with acetone, the acetone will remove the painted graphics. Just wipe all the graphics off and then create your own. I have 2 of these 125's and neither is turning yellow yet. When it does (if) I will just recover it in my own design.
Correct, I believe this as well. Mine is just enough to tell the difference if you look very close.
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Old 08-16-2010, 04:48 PM
  #911
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Default RE: New Funtana 125

Has anyone ever flown a Funtana 125 that was balanced very nose heavy?
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Old 08-16-2010, 05:04 PM
  #912
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Default RE: New Funtana 125

More info. Why would anyone want to fly the Funtana really nose heavy. The manual states the balance point. Stick with that, plus or minus.
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Old 08-16-2010, 05:09 PM
  #913
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Default RE: New Funtana 125

I was wondering how the plane would handle at the opposite of what people were balancing their planes.

Obviously the flying characteristics of the Funtana are a little flawed at the recommended CG's. A little experimenting couldn't hurt... which is what some people are already doing. This isn't a perfect airplane.
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Old 08-16-2010, 05:15 PM
  #914
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Default RE: New Funtana 125

I guess I am one of the weird flyers or just plane lucky. All of my Funtanas are balanced within the limits set forth in the manuals and they all fly great. The only thing I had to get used to was the tail wanting to sink when landing. No problem, just feed in a little down elevator, otherwise the tail wheel will land first.
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Old 08-16-2010, 07:01 PM
  #915
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Default RE: New Funtana 125

I set my cg at the front of the range and it flew level inverted and upright, once trimmed. If you use alot of rudder in knife edge it will tuck to the gear. More rudder, more tuck. With the Syssa 30 gas engine and an 18 6 Vess it requires 2/3 throttle to do continuous knife edge and will climb at full throttle.
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Old 08-16-2010, 07:08 PM
  #916
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Default RE: New Funtana 125


Quote:
ORIGINAL: OK2Fly

I was wondering how the plane would handle at the opposite of what people were balancing their planes.

Obviously the flying characteristics of the Funtana are a little flawed at the recommended CG's. A little experimenting couldn't hurt... which is what some people are already doing. This isn't a perfect airplane.
I tried a little each way of center by just moving the batteries around. I didn't run into anything evil. Anyone interested should try it if interested, as long as you're comfortable flying the plane? I found too far back and the plane will stop mid air when you chop the throttle. Really wierd dragging the tail in on final like that. It'll do it, and it's controlable, but it's very obviously not right. Too far forward, and when (attempting to?) hover, not enough power to hold it results in the nose dropping rather than a tail slide? If that doesn't bother you, I didn't see anything else that was affected while a little nose heavy. After adjusting the CG, just watch what it's doing when you get slow. It can't bite when 3 mistakes high. FWIW
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Old 08-16-2010, 07:14 PM
  #917
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Default RE: New Funtana 125

Ok, I just came in from the shop doing some measurements. The wing, stab are set at 0-0 and my motor box had up thrust in it.

I set the motor to 1 degree down.

Tomorrow night I'll install the wing adjusters and bring the wing to .5 positive.

JohnB it's not "nose heavy" or "tail heavy" it's finding the CG and wing incidence for the airplane to fly correctly in as many attitudes as possible without any coupling. This allows the "Pilot Work Load" to be far less than most airplanes.

If you've never flown a properly trimmed airplane that can do this you're missing out on something very special.

If all you want to do is hover over the middle of the runway it really doesn't matter.

Maybe it's the pattern flier in me talking, I don't really know, but most "Sport" airplanes from 40 size through 40% fly horribly.

Set up or design I don't really know. Probably both.
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Old 08-16-2010, 07:18 PM
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Default RE: New Funtana 125

I set my cg at the front of the range and it flew level both inverted and upright, once trimmed. If you use alot of rudder in knife edge it will tuck to the gear. More rudder, more tuck. With the Syssa 30 gas engine and an 18 6 Vess it requires 1/2 to 2/3 throttle to do continuous knife edge and will climb at full throttle. With the huge aelerons I have to wonder if it can be made to fly with any precision. If you review Horizon's video, the plane is going pretty fast in knife edge with the Saito 20 gas engine, which is flown, as I recall with a 15 6 prop. I do not have alot of experience with this type of plane - oversized control surfaces - but have to wonder if this is going to excell at anything but hovers and harriers, unless you are a very skilled pilot. But then again hovers and harriers are skill levels I haven't reached. Just thinking out load.

Matertech,
It is my understanding that a plane's engine incidence is set to -05 in order to compensate for flat tail surfaces and the lack of negative lift. This plane has a foiled tail and may require zero engine incidence. You may won't to check around. I have also heard the tail incidence usually matches the engine incidence or thrust line. I look forward to hearing your flight results. This plane is alot of fun, but not as precise as some other planes I have owned, like my Aeroworks .61 Edge.
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Old 08-16-2010, 07:49 PM
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Default RE: New Funtana 125

Ever flown an airplane with a bit of down or up elevator yet the airplane flew dead straight? The tail will bring the wing to the correct flying incidence for any given speed. Now unload that wing in KE or Vertical and the stab/elevator now drives the airplane to the gear or canopy. No symmetrical wing flies at 0 incidence, it can't, it has to fly positive to generate lift.

The worst wing for pitch changes is the flat bottom air foil, the faster it goes the more lift it generates the more down elevator it needs.
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Old 08-16-2010, 08:07 PM
  #920
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Default RE: New Funtana 125

Matertech,

I will be the last to say I'm an expert, but it is my understanding that the cg has to be neutral to fly level both inverted and upright. If the cg is aft you have to use down elevator when upright to counteract the imbalance. If nose heavy, you use uptrim, which causes a dive when inverted. It is the foiled surface that provides good lift and it is my understanding that a flat tail has less lift, but is cheaper to produce and substituted with down engine thrust. I just get the feeling the lack of precision this plane seams to have lends itsellf to the large control surfaces, specifically, elevator and aeleron. They don't normally perform surgery with a cleaver - a little off point, I will admit? Don't most pattern planes, which excel at precision have small control surfaces? All I can say is I hate fooling with incidence, while you are encouraged and I look forward to your results. Nothing venture, nothing gained; and you may be right.

S & S
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Old 08-16-2010, 09:03 PM
  #921
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Default RE: New Funtana 125

And maybe I'm wrong, we'll see.
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Old 08-17-2010, 10:31 AM
  #922
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Default RE: New Funtana 125

Quote:
ORIGINAL: Slow and Steady

Matertech,

Don't most pattern planes, which excel at precision have small control surfaces? All I can say is I hate fooling with incidence, while you are encouraged and I look forward to your results. Nothing venture, nothing gained; and you may be right.

S & S
At one time true. But not any more. Pattern planes are flying some extremely demanding schedules and need lots of control authority. Increased throws just add drag in unwanted places. Our control surfaces have grown quite large.

Mastertech is right on the mark regarding CG, wing incidence, and engine thrust angles. Except, this plane may be a turd just like the Funtana 90 was...unfixable. Dean Pappas and I have played with the 90 for a long time and this has got to be one of the worst planes for precision ever conceived. I've long since "retired" mine from precision stuff. I hoped that they fixed the flaws in the 125 and make that plane a bit more precision like (moments are a bit better for example). Sounds like "not exactly"
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Old 08-17-2010, 11:18 AM
  #923
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Default RE: New Funtana 125

MTK, Thanks for weighing in, it will be interesting to see the end results. Take care, S & S
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Old 08-17-2010, 11:25 AM
  #924
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Default RE: New Funtana 125

Right Matt,

This might be an exercise in futility. But I'm married with children, I have time. [8D]

This is my first try at a larger Elect plane before I step into a 2x2 for next year.

I just hate flying airplanes that are not at least somewhat honest.

Looking at the Sebart 2m for next year.
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Old 08-17-2010, 03:00 PM
  #925
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Default RE: New Funtana 125

Just got off the phone with Chris Brown at Horizon Product Support.
The shipping tag is on its way to me.
They do want the whole plane. So i guess I will start to take everything out of it while I wait for the shipping tag to arrive.
Once the product development team does their thing with it, they will contact me with the outcome and decision.
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